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How would you play this hole?


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May be in the wrong forum but could be considered mental game.

Dlow’s post in random thread reminded me of this hole. The course is Blue Mash which is a sister course of @Golfspy_CG2 old hole course Waverly Woods.

The front and back nine play complexity different and the back nine is usually pretty windy compared to the front. It also has shorter holes.

The first 3 holes play long from both white and blue tee boxes. This is hole 3. A par 4 and per scorecard white tees are 426 and blue 453. Red are 359 and green just slightly behind them. The course has a combo tee option and this one plays from the whites of using that option. The black circle is roughly where the 150 marker is. Tees are usually in the middle box where the tree on the left is. When I play there whites are anywhere from 400-430. Many times it’s into the wind which adds distance and difficulty.

What strategy would you use to play this hole?

For me I play a fade off the left side of the fairway to try and avoid the bunkers. My typical drive is short of the cart path that splits the fairway to about 20 yards behind it. Usually have anywhere from a 5i to my 4/5 wood depending on what bag setup I have into the green. It’s a hole that I don’t par often and play it to make no worse than bogey.

Edit: #1 hdcp hole. The green is surrounded by a hill on the back and sides with thick rough.

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Driver all the time.   I'd shift aim line a little left to avoid the bunkers on the right so I'd target the rough line on the left side and since I play a fade think it would come back to the fairway.   If I pull I am in the left rough or for a really bad pull in the other fairway.    Seems pretty straightforward in my mind. 

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into the wind makes my club selections for me here.  since my driver has a tendency to balloon, id play a 3w off the tee, lined up with the cart path as my target and playing a cut.

if i keep it low, which i usually do with the 3w,  i should end up with a PW in to the green

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3 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Driver all the time.   I'd shift aim line a little left to avoid the bunkers on the right so I'd target the rough line on the left side and since I play a fade think it would come back to the fairway.   If I pull I am in the left rough or for a really bad pull in the other fairway.    Seems pretty straightforward in my mind. 

For the most part. The difficulty of the hole is the second shot in. Bunker on the left comes into play and what’s hard to tell is on the right side is pretty thick rough and it’s a hill.

2 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

into the wind makes my club selections for me here.  since my driver has a tendency to balloon, id play a 3w off the tee, lined up with the cart path as my target and playing a cut.

if i keep it low, which i usually do with the 3w,  i should end up with a PW in to the green

Into the wind really change the dynamics of the hole IMO. Second shot becomes about club selection and where to play into the green. I rarely see the pin in the front. It’s usually middle/middle, middle left or back left or middle.

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1 minute ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Into the wind really change the dynamics of the hole IMO. Second shot becomes about club selection and where to play into the green. I rarely see the pin in the front. It’s usually middle/middle, middle left or back left or middle.

assuming a good tee shot, distance wise i'd have a PW in, but into the wind with my high ball flight i could be playing 9 or even 8i depending on the pin location

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10 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

For the most part. The difficulty of the hole is the second shot in. Bunker on the left comes into play and what’s hard to tell is on the right side is pretty thick rough and it’s a hill.

You are coming in from 180+ so green target is Basically a strip down the green center about 12 yards on to about 12 yards from the back of the green since you indicated you want to avoid the bunker and the hill beyond. 

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3 minutes ago, cnosil said:

You are coming in from 180+ so green target is Basically a strip down the green center about 12 yards on to about 12 yards from the back of the green since you indicated you want to avoid the bunker and the hill beyond. 

Yeah. For me I’m typically middle to right side of fairway unless I block it them I’m in one of the bunkers which then turns into a layup shot.

But yeah from the fw I’m usually going right edge of bunker and trying to get middle of the green. Avoiding left side as much as possible since it’s almost a guarantee of not getting good lie or stance. 

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I would aim a little further left and rip driver. There's a lot of fat fairway out there. I hit 270 avg, so on a 400+ yard hole that isn't tight off the tee, there's no question that I'm hitting driver over those traps.

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Yea definitely driver for me, I am a slight fade with it most of the time. Would be able to keep it low enough to cut the wind. Besides the green having a hill behind it, how does the green slope? False front or anything? I dont see to many issues as long as would be able to get that driver to fade and leave a good view into the green.

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I like this idea of "how would you play this hole", I feel like this is going to be one of those long term threads.

I am tossing one out there, I have talked about this hole in the past, it is one of my favorite holes around and its a beast:

This is hole 9 @ Highfields country club in Grafton, MA. Total yardage is carded at 622/570/550/490 from Black/Gold/White/Red. It plays a little less from each about 20 yards less.

The first circle is 300 out from the green, and 200 from the 2nd circle. 2nd circle is 100 out from the green roughly. The window is very tight off the tee no matter where you tee it from (see below) the widest point is about 35 yards and tightest about 20. Left side is completely OB with the houses and the fairway funnels right into the woods. The green is well protected in the front with 2 traps and if you lay up you will have to fly the green on your 3rd as you most likely will not be able to run up the front of the green as the fairway cuts back left and then back up into the green. The 3rd shot has the green below you, but the green IS raised and runs down the hill around the entire green from trap to trap.

I typically play from the Golds on this course. I have never reached in 2. Par is a huge positive. So what say you?!

image.png.e61a89da8b416a7c1e39514c61cbf6f1.png

There are a lot more trees now on the left side and this was before the houses there as well but this is the view from the tee box.

hole9-1.jpg

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45 minutes ago, Lacassem said:

Yea definitely driver for me, I am a slight fade with it most of the time. Would be able to keep it low enough to cut the wind. Besides the green having a hill behind it, how does the green slope? False front or anything? I dont see to many issues as long as would be able to get that driver to fade and leave a good view into the green.

There are two tiers on the green. Not really a false front. The greens play hard and fast pretty much all year. 

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Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

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this is a fun thread.  i dig it. 

@Lacassem that's a scary tee shot for me, since i'd literally be lining up OB.  i'm hitting driver and if the ball cuts like i want it, i'll be good in good shape with a shot to reach in 2 with either 5 or 3w, assuming a clean fairway lie.  with my luck, though, this would be the first tee shot of the round that stays straight and itll end up in someone's pool.  

if i end up in the rough off the tee, it's a 3 shot hole and i'd lay up to about 120 and hit gap wedge in

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19 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

this is a fun thread.  i dig it. 

@Lacassem that's a scary tee shot for me, since i'd literally be lining up OB.  i'm hitting driver and if the ball cuts like i want it, i'll be good in good shape with a shot to reach in 2 with either 5 or 3w, assuming a clean fairway lie.  with my luck, though, this would be the first tee shot of the round that stays straight and itll end up in someone's pool.  

if i end up in the rough off the tee, it's a 3 shot hole and i'd lay up to about 120 and hit gap wedge in

Its a beast man, I love playing it and I line up left line and its scary because it can very easily go straight OB.  on the opposite end to much left to right its woods and good luck finding it. I have birdied this once and it was an amazing day. If ya come out well have to hit the track, its one of my favorite courses around.

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Just now, Lacassem said:

If ya come out well have to hit the track, its one of my favorite courses around.

looking forward to it.  i've got a good entry for this thread once yours gets a few more replies.

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1 hour ago, Lacassem said:

I like this idea of "how would you play this hole", I feel like this is going to be one of those long term threads.

The first circle is 300 out from the green, and 200 from the 2nd circle. 2nd circle is 100 out from the green roughly. The window is very tight off the tee no matter where you tee it from (see below) the widest point is about 35 yards and tightest about 20.

image.png.e61a89da8b416a7c1e39514c61cbf6f1.png

I’m playing whatever club gets me to the wide part of the fairway off the tee.  I am assuming that if I am outside of the 35 yards I am OB or deep woods.  Hard to tell on the right but in the tee shot picture it looks somewhat open on the right.   Second shot is to the wide spot short of your second circle.  Don’t know green width and depth but based on plan I should have short iron in which should setup for par. Difficulty on this hole seems to be the tee shot.  

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7 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I’m playing whatever club gets me to the wide part of the fairway off the tee.  I am assuming that if I am outside of the 35 yards I am OB or deep woods.  Hard to tell on the right but in the tee shot picture it looks somewhat open on the right.   Second shot is to the wide spot short of your second circle.  Don’t know green width and depth but based on plan I should have short iron in which should setup for par. Difficulty on this hole seems to be the tee shot.  

Yea If I am having a bad tee day, accuracy wise anyway I am not hitting driver on this hole but by hole 9 I usually have worked out those issues.

Picture doesnt do the tee shot justice, its a lot tighter now. That was at original construction the houses were not even in yet.

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1 hour ago, Lacassem said:

I like this idea of "how would you play this hole", I feel like this is going to be one of those long term threads.

I am tossing one out there, I have talked about this hole in the past, it is one of my favorite holes around and its a beast:

This is hole 9 @ Highfields country club in Grafton, MA. Total yardage is carded at 622/570/550/490 from Black/Gold/White/Red. It plays a little less from each about 20 yards less.

The first circle is 300 out from the green, and 200 from the 2nd circle. 2nd circle is 100 out from the green roughly. The window is very tight off the tee no matter where you tee it from (see below) the widest point is about 35 yards and tightest about 20. Left side is completely OB with the houses and the fairway funnels right into the woods. The green is well protected in the front with 2 traps and if you lay up you will have to fly the green on your 3rd as you most likely will not be able to run up the front of the green as the fairway cuts back left and then back up into the green. The 3rd shot has the green below you, but the green IS raised and runs down the hill around the entire green from trap to trap.

I typically play from the Golds on this course. I have never reached in 2. Par is a huge positive. So what say you?!

image.png.e61a89da8b416a7c1e39514c61cbf6f1.png

There are a lot more trees now on the left side and this was before the houses there as well but this is the view from the tee box.

hole9-1.jpg

Going to line up on the right side of the tee box and hit fade off the trees on the left. Unless I pull the shot anything left isn’t in play. As long as the slope isn’t too severe that forces the ball all the way to the woods then I’ll be fine.  I’ve played a few courses that have similar slope and trouble on both sides. Always a fun time standing on the tee and figuring out what to do. 

 

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3 minutes ago, Lacassem said:

Yea If I am having a bad tee day, accuracy wise anyway I am not hitting driver on this hole but by hole 9 I usually have worked out those issues.

Picture doesnt do the tee shot justice, its a lot tighter now. That was at original construction the houses were not even in yet.

Squeezing a driver into a spot that narrow is tough even if hitting  it well. As long as laying back to the widest spot takes away some of the danger it is the smart play. Something like a 3w or hybrid won’t be that much more accurate you just have more space especially since both left and right are dead and those misses result in a penalty.  If the trees on the right were something that allowed you to advance down the fairway then maybe take the driver and just accept that you will be right sometimes.  

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Love this thread. 
 

@RickyBobby_PRits a driver all day. That landing area is ripe. 

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here’s my entry. whitney farms golf course #6. par 5, 562 from the blue tees. 

471D663C-04FE-4B61-A571-51EB70092361.png.bae963f67dec690739341bb0660ae125.png

the tee box is elevated and tight. you’re hitting into a small landing area about 230-240 straight out. cutting the corner is out because the trees overhang the tee box.  this picture was taken from their flyover and the camera is probably about 20 yards in front of the blue tees.  that tall tree in the top right of the frame is very much in play from the tee box.

438DD811-DF84-4ECA-B5D2-0DE7DABD699F.png.4bca6a4616aceb6e72d461627a5b72d0.png 

3F17B64E-B016-4CD0-BE29-2ED0577CD047.png.572102784ce024d0d5bc9e8062c3a5f5.png

FE77EBE0-B611-4B24-9987-FD6831E67843.png.16ecc3fb6c760e14957c164ff1549069.png

from that landing area you’re about 310-320 out facing a blind second shot as the fairway goes up, then back down to the hole. long on your approach is dead because behind the green falls off to narnia. ive never gotten off this hole with better than bogey. 

whatcha got?!

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4 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

here’s my entry. whitney farms golf course #6. par 5, 562 from the blue tees. 

471D663C-04FE-4B61-A571-51EB70092361.png.bae963f67dec690739341bb0660ae125.png

the tee box is elevated and tight. you’re hitting into a small landing area about 230-240 straight out. cutting the corner is out because the trees overhang the tee box. 

3F17B64E-B016-4CD0-BE29-2ED0577CD047.png.572102784ce024d0d5bc9e8062c3a5f5.png

FE77EBE0-B611-4B24-9987-FD6831E67843.png.16ecc3fb6c760e14957c164ff1549069.png

from that landing area you’re about 310-320 out facing a blind second shot as the fairway goes up, then back down to the hole. long on your approach is dead because behind the green falls off to narnia. ive never gotten off this hole with better than bogey. 

whatcha got?!

If you truly cannot cut the driver out there I would go 4H and then 4H again, very accurate club for me. That would leave me about 100 in which would be an easy gap that would hold the green well. 

Can you bring an extended trimmer and give ya a little more room 🤣

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1 minute ago, Lacassem said:

Can you bring an extended trimmer and give ya a little more room 

id like to bring an excavator.  i hate this hole.  i actually feel claustrophobic on the tee box.  can't go left, can't go right, can't go long.  and i absolutely hate blind shots. 

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Just now, Chip Strokes said:

id like to bring an excavator.  i hate this hole.  i actually feel claustrophobic on the tee box.  can't go left, can't go right, can't go long.  and i absolutely hate blind shots. 

Snag a picture of the tee box view next time you are there, that aerial view does not do it justice sounds like.

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31 minutes ago, Chip Strokes said:

here’s my entry. whitney farms golf course #6. par 5, 562 from the blue tees. 

471D663C-04FE-4B61-A571-51EB70092361.png.bae963f67dec690739341bb0660ae125.png

the tee box is elevated and tight. you’re hitting into a small landing area about 230-240 straight out. cutting the corner is out because the trees overhang the tee box.  this picture was taken from their flyover and the camera is probably about 20 yards in front of the blue tees.  that tall tree in the top right of the frame is very much in play from the tee box.

438DD811-DF84-4ECA-B5D2-0DE7DABD699F.png.4bca6a4616aceb6e72d461627a5b72d0.png 

3F17B64E-B016-4CD0-BE29-2ED0577CD047.png.572102784ce024d0d5bc9e8062c3a5f5.png

FE77EBE0-B611-4B24-9987-FD6831E67843.png.16ecc3fb6c760e14957c164ff1549069.png

from that landing area you’re about 310-320 out facing a blind second shot as the fairway goes up, then back down to the hole. long on your approach is dead because behind the green falls off to narnia. ive never gotten off this hole with better than bogey. 

whatcha got?!

I like holes like this. There’s some goo aiming points and also layout that makes you think about options. At that distance it’s a 3 shot hole and depending on ones confidence club choice off the tee will vary especially with how tight it is all the way to green second shots are just as important. Since it’s #6 I’ve already hit the range played several holes and know what my driver is doing and if I’m going to have to worry about the pull or pull hook. The mark you have at 236 is right around my aim point and playing the fade a driver will move to the right some for me so I can squeeze that in there and not have to worry about cutting the corner but rather use hole layout to my advantage.

If I’m not feeling confident then I’m playing fw off the tee and landing short of the 236 mark

32 minutes ago, bens197 said:

Love this thread. 
 

@RickyBobby_PRits a driver all day. That landing area is ripe. 

Thanks. The landing area leaves lots of room. The first 3 holes on this course have some room off the tee but they are all long holes especially from the blues. They all play from the whites if using the combo tees. But they are also well protected with bunkers, elevated tees and hills and thick rough. I’ve gone anywhere from +1 to +5 on those holes 

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Along with Dlows post in random thread this hole but also this course came mind along with some previous threads about course management and people looking at their shot dispersion. Once you get to hole 5 things start to tighten up a bight off the tee depending on shot shape and really start to change on hole 7 & 8. The par 5s from 9 thru the back are open for drivers but second shots have some decisions to make. 
 

Theres holes where I hit driver now that I didn’t in the past in an effort to leave certain distances or because of hole layout. I’m a little more aggressive on some of the holes 

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4 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

May be in the wrong forum but could be considered mental game.

Dlow’s post in random thread reminded me of this hole. The course is Blue Mash which is a sister course of @Golfspy_CG2 old hole course Waverly Woods.

The front and back nine play complexity different and the back nine is usually pretty windy compared to the front. It also has shorter holes.

The first 3 holes play long from both white and blue tee boxes. This is hole 3. A par 4 and per scorecard white tees are 426 and blue 453. Red are 359 and green just slightly behind them. The course has a combo tee option and this one plays from the whites of using that option. The black circle is roughly where the 150 marker is. Tees are usually in the middle box where the tree on the left is. When I play there whites are anywhere from 400-430. Many times it’s into the wind which adds distance and difficulty.

What strategy would you use to play this hole?

For me I play a fade off the left side of the fairway to try and avoid the bunkers. My typical drive is short of the cart path that splits the fairway to about 20 yards behind it. Usually have anywhere from a 5i to my 4/5 wood depending on what bag setup I have into the green. It’s a hole that I don’t par often and play it to make no worse than bogey.

Edit: #1 hdcp hole. The green is surrounded by a hill on the back and sides with thick rough.

594284E1-3B48-4192-8ADF-50B4737287A4.jpeg

Looks like pick a bunker in the middle that you can carry and rip driver. If you can't carry them it still looks like you just aim right at them and then adjust from there. 

3 hours ago, Lacassem said:

I like this idea of "how would you play this hole", I feel like this is going to be one of those long term threads.

I am tossing one out there, I have talked about this hole in the past, it is one of my favorite holes around and its a beast:

This is hole 9 @ Highfields country club in Grafton, MA. Total yardage is carded at 622/570/550/490 from Black/Gold/White/Red. It plays a little less from each about 20 yards less.

The first circle is 300 out from the green, and 200 from the 2nd circle. 2nd circle is 100 out from the green roughly. The window is very tight off the tee no matter where you tee it from (see below) the widest point is about 35 yards and tightest about 20. Left side is completely OB with the houses and the fairway funnels right into the woods. The green is well protected in the front with 2 traps and if you lay up you will have to fly the green on your 3rd as you most likely will not be able to run up the front of the green as the fairway cuts back left and then back up into the green. The 3rd shot has the green below you, but the green IS raised and runs down the hill around the entire green from trap to trap.

I typically play from the Golds on this course. I have never reached in 2. Par is a huge positive. So what say you?!

image.png.e61a89da8b416a7c1e39514c61cbf6f1.png

There are a lot more trees now on the left side and this was before the houses there as well but this is the view from the tee box.

hole9-1.jpg

This just looks like a fun motha.... at the widths you provided there are really no options. Hit something that allows you to keep it in play and reach green in reg. 

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Widest part of the fairway appears to be at 215 yds (40 yd landing zone between trees) off the tee playing about 10 ft downhill. Fairway does look like it tilts about 5 feet left to right. Since I also couldn't reach this in my wildest dreams, it would be easy 3W/hard 4hyb trying to keep it in play off the tee. 

image.png.d1d0c34ac1377ad0663ebc9d4264e32f.png

For the second shot, assuming I am safely in the fairway, it looks like the trees on the right open up a bit if I can carry it 190+. Also the second shot looks to play about 15-20 ft downhill. Landing zone that is 210 yds away is 53 yds wide. Fairway tilt is now more like 8 ft left to right. 

image.png.94aeca9838e087a4ee72b32093b69c8e.png

Finally, the reward for pulling off 2 smooth 3Ws would hopefully be about 120-130 left into a green that is not huge by any means (23 yd deep x 24 yd wide) that looks like it tilts left to right and drops off about 4-5 feet if you are long. Does not look fun! But I see no reward to hitting a driver here unless you just hate your 3W or lowest hybrid for some reason. If I somehow managed to thread a driver in there I would still have about 90 yds as an approach shot (3rd shot, no way I am reaching this) and I don't think I am demonstrably closer to the hole with a soft GW vs a PW but I am demonstrably more accurate with a 3W vs a Driver off the tee. 

image.png.6050b7ade9c4c25cd54795080a628d32.png

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Agree with hitting driver, as that should land in the widest part of the fairway.

If scoring a sure bogey is acceptable, I would use the 5i and land short of the narrowing; in front of trap;

avoiding rough to the right and trouble behind the green.

then short 30 yard pitch and hopefully easy two putt.   there seems to be a lot of green to work with.

who knows, your pitch might place you within 10 ft of the hole and you sink a par saver 🙂

======================

Of course, if you feel like gambling for a par, then hit whatever you need to land on the green and two putt.

But the above suggestion is answer for a sure bogey, with a 25% chance for a par.

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Here's my entry: Hole 13 at The Ridge Golf Club in West Valley, Utah.

Flyover View of the Hole

Details: Hole 13 is a Par 5 that is fairly short but offers some interesting risk-reward challenges. It's a very easy par hole if you want to play it that way. The reason I'm proposing it is because the more aggressive you play it, the more you have swings between birdie/eagle and bogey/double. 

Tee Shot & fairway: from the Tips it is 538 yards, from the Blues 507, from the Whites 474. However, it's a blind uphill tee shot, and the further back you play, the more uphill your tee shot is and the further down the hole you go, the tighter it gets. There's water on the right starting about 250 yards down from the blues that extends all the way up to the green, and there are bunkers right in front of the green. The entire hole slopes left to right, and the left side of the hole is hill that slopes down into the fairway. 

Greens: There's maybe 2 to 3 yards of cut between the water and the front right of the green. The right side of the green funnels down and out. Otherwise, the green slopes mostly back to front. You have about 25 yards from bunker side to back and about 30 yards from the water side to back. The pin tends to be tucked towards the front. 

Screenshot_2021-10-21-09-52-54.jpg.71e34a82615fe60a1e4dd617e381c324.jpg

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2 hours ago, MNUte said:

Here's my entry: Hole 13 at The Ridge Golf Club in West Valley, Utah.

Flyover View of the Hole

Details: Hole 13 is a Par 5 that is fairly short but offers some interesting risk-reward challenges. It's a very easy par hole if you want to play it that way. The reason I'm proposing it is because the more aggressive you play it, the more you have swings between birdie/eagle and bogey/double. 

Tee Shot & fairway: from the Tips it is 538 yards, from the Blues 507, from the Whites 474. However, it's a blind uphill tee shot, and the further back you play, the more uphill your tee shot is and the further down the hole you go, the tighter it gets. There's water on the right starting about 250 yards down from the blues that extends all the way up to the green, and there are bunkers right in front of the green. The entire hole slopes left to right, and the left side of the hole is hill that slopes down into the fairway. 

Greens: There's maybe 2 to 3 yards of cut between the water and the front right of the green. The right side of the green funnels down and out. Otherwise, the green slopes mostly back to front. You have about 25 yards from bunker side to back and about 30 yards from the water side to back. The pin tends to be tucked towards the front. 

Screenshot_2021-10-21-09-52-54.jpg.71e34a82615fe60a1e4dd617e381c324.jpg

This hole looks like an architects attempt to pull you into the water. It looks like there is roughly 70 yards from the green dot to the cart path. If that is the case the water shouldn't be in play off the tee. Also 2nd shot looks like hit it at the bunkers and make sure you have enough club to carry the water. I can't tell but it looks like there is plenty of room behind and left of the green. 

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