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Hi can you please settle an argument?

when you are playing from the tee on a par 4 and there is a hazard in front of you where. You would have to carry 200 yds to reach the fairway, if you are not capable of hitting over the hazard is it a rule of Golf that there must be a bale out area ?

regerds,

jim murphy

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Sadly, no.

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No, it's just poor course design or tee placement.  If it's intended to be played by average golfers then it should be set up so that average players can play it.

Having said that, players should ensure they play off tees appropriate to their abilities.  If I were faced with a 200 yard carry to clear the water, with no option to play out to one side, I'm playing off the wrong tee and should move forward.

Edited by Pandaman
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20 minutes ago, Pandaman said:

If I were faced with a 200 yard carry to clear the water, with no option to play out to one side, I'm playing off the wrong tee and should move forward.

Agree completely, I've seen a very few courses where someone playing the appropriate tees has an un-manageable carry.  But to the original question, there's no rule of golf.

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1 hour ago, Pandaman said:

No, it's just poor course design or tee placement.  If it's intended to be played by average golfers then it should be set up so that average players can play it.

Having said that, players should ensure they play off tees appropriate to their abilities.  If I were faced with a 200 yard carry to clear the water, with no option to play out to one side, I'm playing off the wrong tee and should move forward.

Perfect answer. Can't believe how many guys I play with who complain about the design of the course but refuse to move up to shorter tees. If you have to hit woods into most part 4s, you are on the wrong set of tees.

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You are on the wrong tees and no there shouldn’t be a place to bail out. 
 

 

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Try playing that one hole up a tee.

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That is an option. If you keep a handicap, how does that figure in?

The other option is to play the hole from the same tee, but play it to your skill/distance level... stay short of the hazard and play your second shot from there?

My home course has a hole that requires a 200 yd. carry over a pond off the tee. Lots of guys just lay up to the pond and play from there.

I guess I don't understand the dilemma?

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23 minutes ago, silver & black said:

That is an option. If you keep a handicap, how does that figure in?

The other option is to play the hole from the same tee, but play it to your skill/distance level... stay short of the hazard and play your second shot from there?

My home course has a hole that requires a 200 yd. carry over a pond off the tee. Lots of guys just lay up to the pond and play from there.

I guess I don't understand the dilemma?

You are assuming there is a place to lay up. Could be water all the way, or maybe marshlands or other unplayable area. Playing up a tee on that hole certainly wouldn't hurt anyone. It might lower your handicap by a small amount, but that would only hurt you in a tournament. Since most golfers don't keep a handicap anyway, may not be relevant here. 

The bigger issue here is that golfers are way too reluctant to move up. I cringe every time I see an obvious double digit player hitting from the tips on a tough course or an old guy who can't hit it 180 still playing from over 6000 yards. Move up for God's sake. You'll have more fun AND speed up play for the rest of us. 

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2 hours ago, silver & black said:

Are you on the wrong tees if there is only one hole on the course that poses this situation and all the rest are manageable?

Would have to see the score card to be certain but if you can’t carry the ball 200 yards the chances are very high you are playing the wrong tees.

I play a course where there is forced carry over water as well as yellow stakes in the marsh on the other side of the water from the tips and one tee box in front of those. Depending on which teeing ground they use the carry is anywhere from 160-220.

The two forward tees are both on the opposite side of water and and they water plays down the right side of the hole from there. Playing the third tee box on that course makes the course play long on almost all the par 4s and several of the par 5s

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There is a course close to me where the first tee shot requires a carry of a ditch. The lay up area puts you on a downhill lie going into an up hill landing zone. If a new golfer or less skilled or not confident in their game will completely freak out. This is one of 4-5 holes on the course like this. For me it issue, but my wife hates that course and we never go there. 

The course has tried to change the design some but it is still a dumb design. 

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1 hour ago, JFish350 said:

There is a course close to me where the first tee shot requires a carry of a ditch. The lay up area puts you on a downhill lie going into an up hill landing zone. If a new golfer or less skilled or not confident in their game will completely freak out. This is one of 4-5 holes on the course like this. For me it issue, but my wife hates that course and we never go there. 

The course has tried to change the design some but it is still a dumb design. 

There is a course near us that is similar. There are 6 holes where creeks cross the fairway between 210 and 240 off the tee. Forcing a layup or forced carry is fine once or twice, but 6 times? I'll spend my money elsewhere. 

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On 11/4/2021 at 5:19 PM, Jim f murphy said:

Hi can you please settle an argument?

when you are playing from the tee on a par 4 and there is a hazard in front of you where. You would have to carry 200 yds to reach the fairway, if you are not capable of hitting over the hazard is it a rule of Golf that there must be a bale out area ?

regerds,

jim murphy

Why would you have an area with bundles of hay?

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10 hours ago, Dokex said:

Why would you have an area with bundles of hay?

If you are going to start  criticizing spelling online, you had better have a lot of time on your hands. 

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Nope there is no rule that there should be a "Bail" out area unless the hazard is a "Bale" of hay. Moving up to a closer tee should make the carry area shorter and some tees will avoid the hazard all together. Welcome to MGS from the resident sarcastic golfer!😉

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1 hour ago, Headhammer said:

Nope there is no rule that there should be a "Bail" out area unless the hazard is a "Bale" of hay. Moving up to a closer tee should make the carry area shorter and some tees will avoid the hazard all together. Welcome to MGS from the resident sarcastic golfer!😉

Since we are doing this, I believe you meant altogether, not all together. 

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Perhaps we could agree, all together, that it's altogether silly to focus on spelling and grammar on a forum like this? Just trying to bail out the bale speller.

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SW LW: Mizuno MP T5

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25 minutes ago, Riverboat said:

Perhaps we could agree, all together, that it's altogether silly to focus on spelling and grammar on a forum like this? Just trying to bail out the bale speller.

You were right to point out my mistake and I'll agree to disagree with you!

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Courses I hate are ones that force you to lay up with dog legs, water and other hazards and leave you 200yds into a par 4.

Courses I like are risk reward where you can take a carry on and make the hole appreciably shorter or bail out and leave a long iron.

OK question you carry the ball 220 yds with your driver  and you have a dog leg par 4 that has a large deep links bunker at the dog leg at 220 yds carry. Bail out left leaves 150yds in, if you carry the bunker it is about 270yds to the green and you have a chance of reaching. Grip it and ripped it a dolly 5i to the bail out?

 

 

 

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