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Anyone playing a 6 degree gap between pitching wedge and gap wedge?


Hook DeLoft

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28 minutes ago, chisag said:

I began learning to control my wedge trajectory and that produced a big leap in my scoring.

Curious, how did you approach that learning curve.  I try to control my flight by using 1/2 and 3/4 swings with lower lofted wedges to get the same distance as a full swing with a higher lofted wedge - but also concentrate keeping the swing equally aggressive (just shorter) to produce the spin.  But I may be approaching it incorrectly... 

To the thread question, I have wondered if my gaps are too tight in my wedges - and I carry a larger gap between my set PW and Vokeys (43 to 50).  I have considered bridging the gap by expanding the separation to 6*... something like 43(set PW)-48-54-60.  But my 58 may be my favorite club in the bag... so it would be hard to part with it.   If Vokey made a whole set of irons... I would probably get them.  haha.  Love those wedges.

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32 minutes ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

The CBX is a 56 /12 and the JB wedge is a 56/12 bent to 55 degrees

On regular shots (not in a bunker) I am a between a sweeper to very small divot taker.

The JB is effectively 11 now due to the reduction in loft. There a 1:1 ratio for bounce change to loft change. 

Also forgot to mention earlier just changing from 56/60 setup to a 54/58 won’t automatically fix thing of the bounce is still wrong.

Since you are good out of the sand with the 56 you can either learn how to hit it better from the fairway or learn to play different shor with your gap wedge. Or use the JB wedge out of the fairway and find a 58 or 60* that works in the bunker. What is the bounce on the 60*.

But before we get into that type of discussion and decision. Explain your sand game technique including how you setup, how you lay the club and how you swing. Then do the same for how your fairway shots? Also what is the grass and ground like on the fairway?

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3 hours ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

To qualify a bit more, the bunker sand at my course for the most part is very firm. You couldn't get a fried egg if you were standing on the ball (except for two bunkers that they just re-did).

I have a similar issue at my course... though it takes more course knowledge to know which bunkers have hard pan just underneath the thin layer of sand, and which ones will give for a nice splash shot.  I can't count how many times I have guessed wrong and bladed a shot over the green (including yesterday).  If I am confident in my sand firmness assessment, I will opt for my 54 with more bounce in softer sand, playing the traditional splash shot.  If I am confident in the firmness... I go with the the lower bounce 58 and square it up more... making a "punch" swing... short back, short through, and play for the roll out.  But that is just me as I continue to try and find a sand game that works.

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3 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

Curious, how did you approach that learning curve.  I try to control my flight by using 1/2 and 3/4 swings with lower lofted wedges to get the same distance as a full swing with a higher lofted wedge - but also concentrate keeping the swing equally aggressive (just shorter) to produce the spin.  But I may be approaching it incorrectly... 

To the thread question, I have wondered if my gaps are too tight in my wedges - and I carry a larger gap between my set PW and Vokeys (43 to 50).  I have considered bridging the gap by expanding the separation to 6*... something like 43(set PW)-48-54-60.  But my 58 may be my favorite club in the bag... so it would be hard to part with it.   If Vokey made a whole set of irons... I would probably get them.  haha.  Love those wedges.

For me I go off of instinct and feel--- But Chisag can give you a better and more detailed answer since is is an instructor. I have never been an instructor did not care to be

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

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10 minutes ago, BIG STU said:

For me I go off of instinct and feel--- But Chisag can give you a better and more detailed answer since is is an instructor. I have never been an instructor did not care to be

Thanks Stu, yes... feel is a big part of it for me as well.  I talk in 1/2 and 3/4 swings but not in a Bryson sort of technical approach... more of a shorter aggressive swing to get the ball flying low and with some bite.  I know that (and I think this is what Chisag was referring to)... when I take a full swing and launch a wedge up in the air... my margin of error increases exponentially.  

Edited by Tiftaaft
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3 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The JB is effectively 11 now due to the reduction in loft. There a 1:1 ratio for bounce change to loft change. 

Also forgot to mention earlier just changing from 56/60 setup to a 54/58 won’t automatically fix thing of the bounce is still wrong.

Since you are good out of the sand with the 56 you can either learn how to hit it better from the fairway or learn to play different shor with your gap wedge. Or use the JB wedge out of the fairway and find a 58 or 60* that works in the bunker. What is the bounce on the 60*.

But before we get into that type of discussion and decision. Explain your sand game technique including how you setup, how you lay the club and how you swing. Then do the same for how your fairway shots? Also what is the grass and ground like on the fairway?

Bounces can be tricky. But as a general rule of thumb it is accepted as a 1:1 ratio. Now I have seen some bounces vary due to offset and sole grind. If I am really messing with a wedge I will check with my Maltby wedge guages. For me most of the time on my stuff I will hit my deflection board and take a few divots to see. A lot of times it also has to do with a persons AOA. I have had to make adjustments because with my swing changes I have a more shallow AOA now days with my reduced length swing.

Kinda off topic and meaning to ask you this--- Is that your Circle T bag in the avatar?

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

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11 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

Curious, how did you approach that learning curve.  I try to control my flight by using 1/2 and 3/4 swings with lower lofted wedges to get the same distance as a full swing with a higher lofted wedge - but also concentrate keeping the swing equally aggressive (just shorter) to produce the spin.  But I may be approaching it incorrectly... 

To the thread question, I have wondered if my gaps are too tight in my wedges - and I carry a larger gap between my set PW and Vokeys (43 to 50).  I have considered bridging the gap by expanding the separation to 6*... something like 43(set PW)-48-54-60.  But my 58 may be my favorite club in the bag... so it would be hard to part with it.   If Vokey made a whole set of irons... I would probably get them.  haha.  Love those wedges.

 

 

... Lots and LOTS of practice. Learning to be equally aggressive with 1/2 and 3/4 wedges was part of the learning curve, so you aren't incorrect. Moving the ball back in your stance also takes plenty of experimenting to find the best location for your swing.  I think once you get used to partial wedge shots, playing a full swing wedge is just more difficult when going at flags as you just have more control with a lower flight for a myriad of reasons including the wind. 

... Personal preferences but I would not like the 43 to 50* gap as that is usually a full swing range. The higher the loft the more most can get away with larger gaps, if they practice and work on the short game. Considering some modern irons have 2* - 3* gaps with their longest irons it makes sense that there are bigger gaps on the opposite end. 

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3 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

Thanks Stu, yes... feel is a big part of it for me as well.  I talk in 1/2 and 3/4 swings but no in a Bryson sort of technical approach... more of a shorter aggressive swing to get the ball flying low and with some bite.  I know this (and I think this is what Chisag was referring to)... when I take a full swing and launch a wedge up in the air... my margin of error increases exponentially.  

Depending on the courses you play and the shots you may face if you feel confident keep it close to the ground. Even though I used to be a decent wedge player around our greens here I do a lot of bump and runs. I can also do the shot you described a low flyer with bite with one of my 50* wedges. But it does pay to learn a lot of different shots and gain confidence with your scoring or shot saving clubs into and around the greens. LOL the other day on my vintage round I had like a 75 yard shot to a green. One of the kids that worked on the course was talking to me. I told him what I was trying to do. I took my 1953 Tommy Armour wedge at 55* and hit the perfect little  one hopper stopper. Of course to be honest I was hitting a balata ball. Was not sure I could pull that one off it came strictly from feel and memory and yes the balata ball helped. Makes me feel good to know sometimes I can pull off shots like I did in the past. 

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

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9 minutes ago, BIG STU said:

Bounces can be tricky. But as a general rule of thumb it is accepted as a 1:1 ratio. Now I have seen some bounces vary due to offset and sole grind. If I am really messing with a wedge I will check with my Maltby wedge guages. For me most of the time on my stuff I will hit my deflection board and take a few divots to see. A lot of times it also has to do with a persons AOA. I have had to make adjustments because with my swing changes I have a more shallow AOA now days with my reduced length swing.

Kinda off topic and meaning to ask you this--- Is that your Circle T bag in the avatar?

Yeah it’s one of 2 that I have. I’ve passed on several in the last year just because the hassle to flip if I don’t want it is more pain than it’s worth. The only bag I wanted and lost out on was the masters one from this year. That one i would have kept

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

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Just now, RickyBobby_PR said:

Yeah it’s one of 2 that I have. I’ve passed on several in the last year just because the hassle to flip if I don’t want it is more pain than it’s worth. The only bag I wanted and lost out on was the masters one from this year. That one i would have kept

Cool man most down here would have no idea of what it is.--- Yeah this day in time shipping costs are a hassle with trying to flip stuff---- Ok guys sorry back to wedges

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

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7 minutes ago, chisag said:

... Lots and LOTS of practice.

Well... I'm half way there... I have put in "lots" of practice... need to do the other "lots" now!  😉.  

Thanks for the comments Chisag!

 

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10 minutes ago, BIG STU said:

Yeah this day in time shipping costs are a hassle with trying to flip stuff

 

... The really sad part are the things others could use but are just too expensive and too much hassle to flip. I have quite a few clubs and shafts that would sell in the $40-60 range but by the time I factor in my time, gas and $30+ for shipping, it just isn't worth the effort. We used to be happy grabbing a $50 used shaft to experiment using and when it didn't work out we flipped it coming out even or a $5-10 loss so it was well worth it. Not so much today. 

Driver:     :taylormade-small:  Qi10 10.5* ... Ventus Red Velocore 5R
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Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
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... I would also add for chipping/pitching I always think it is best to "master" one shot before moving on to other techniques. Depending on your course conditions like soft lush courses, play everything in the air with your LW until you become proficient with all LW shots. Or on tight bermuda courses play all bump and runs until you can hit every shot needed.  Then start adding the other technique giving you more options and a larger repertoire. 

... Nothin wrong with starting out using all short game techniques if you are willing to put in the practice. But since they take completely different technique and feel, it is easy to get frustrated hitting poor shots with both approaches and then going back and forth as to which you should use. Otoh getting good with flying the ball in the air or running it on the ground means you are giving one technique 50% more practice than both and many will find it is easier to get good at one before moving on to the next. Ymmv of course ... 

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Fairway:  :cobra-small: Aerojet 3/5 ... Kai'li Blue 60R
Hybrids:  :ping-small:      430 Hybrid 22*... Steelfiber 780Hy 
                  :taylormade-small:  DHy #4 ... Diamana LTD 65r 
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Putter:     :cobra-small:  Sport-60 33" 
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48° Pitching Wedge, 54° Sand, 60° Lob.

Necessity really, because I need length at the other end of the bag.  Because of the disappearing loft disease, I've had to make up with hybrids.  If I was allowed 15 clubs, which I feel should be allowed because of the DLD, I would change the wedge system to 48, 52, 56 and 60.

 

 

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On 11/17/2021 at 5:22 PM, Hook DeLoft said:

I’ve noticed that some strong lofted sets come with a 6 degree gap between wedges. Obviously, if this caused problems, you could adjust the lofts. But I was wondering if folks who have a set up like this find the gap to be too large. I have seen some write that the designers know what they’re doing and the gapping should be just fine, but the cynic in me suspects the big gap is a compromise. 

Trouble is when you start meeting with lofts on say Vokeys, the bounce angle changes too and also the grinds.

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Yes,

I play a 46 degree pitching from the set make up a 52 degree gap wedge and 58 degree sand wedge. It give me a lot of versatility at the bottom of the bag. Which allowed me to play with the top end. Hope this helps.

Wes

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Not me, I prefer about 3 degrees.  Have a 46, a 49, a 52, and a SW with more bounce.  Just me, I prefer a full swing when possible.

Dave Mueller

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My Titleist T200 irons have a 43 PW and 48 GW, so 5 degrees there.  I also play a 54 and 60 SM8.  I do not notice any issues, but approach shots are not my strength.  The 54 was the result of only being able to find that wedge grind and bounce in the 54.  I think we are all faced with partial approach shots, some more than others. Learning your wedge set distances may be more important than the specific degree gaps.

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I do not play with a 6 degree gap between wedges. Pitching wedge to 48 degree wedge is a 5 degree gap but then go 52 degree to 56 degree. Six degrees is a lot to me between wedges. 

Golfnut

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My wedges are 48PW, 52GW and 56SW. They're probably weaker on the first two than is current, but these are Nicklaus irons and the wedges came with the set.

Cobra Woods

Nicklaus & Nike Hybrids

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I have a 7* gap between PW and GW. The PW is 45*, a JPX 900 forged, and the 52 is an SM8 Vokey AMT White stiff shaft (1st ever Vokey). I also have 56* Cleveland RTX Zipcore, 60* and 64* in an RTX 4. The 64* gets sacrificed for a G425 2 hybrid when I play away from my home course. I toyed with a 50* in a TM Hi-Toe (I know, what is the point of it in a 50*). I just found it was a little hit on bump and runs. Full shots were nice but any wedge in my bag needs to do more than one job. It also lacked the loft for those back in the stance 50-60 yard shits which could bounce short of a tier on a green and check up when it got up the tier. It could have been the loft, it could have been the bounce/grind. Either way it got bumped. As for the 7* gap, I have no problem choking down on my PW, playing punchy lower-flighted shots or popping it forward in the stance and sending it up a bit. As a stock shot with PW, GW and SW (56*) I will always lean towards lowering flight to control distance. The 50*, which I thought was solving a gapping problem, did not work for me. That's just my two cents anyway. 

Edited by jaybeemaestro
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I have a 6 degree gap between all my wedges. I have no issues at all, I do hit a lot of partial shots though and rarely hit anything shorter than a 9 iron with a full swing. I like to play a 62 degree wedge mostly just for around the greens but the going from 62 to a 54 is a bit much.

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I actually play a 6 degree gap between my pitching wedge and gap wedge, 46 and 52 respectively.  After that I keep it at a 4 degree gap for my sand wedge and lob wedge (56 and 60).  I looked into changing my lofts to 46, 50, 56 and 60 but the yardage gain with the two degree increase was almost nonexistent and not worth the change.  I have been playing the 46, 52, 56 and 60 set up for more than 20 years and for me, I am comfortable with that set up and right now not willing to make the change to anything different.

I play a Titleist TS3 9 degree driver, Ping G410 14.5 degree 3 wood, Titleist 818 H1 19 degree hybrid, Titleist 718 CB 4-9 irons, Vokey 46, 52, 56 and 60 degree wedges, with an Odyssey Black Series 1 putter.

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My set PW is 46, and set GW is 51.  My Vokeys are bent to 55 and 59.

I don’t pay a ton of attention to stamped lofts.  The actual carry is going to change from OEM to OEM anyway.  The concern, in my mind, should be if you can take enough off the PW to hit the yardages you can’t quite get to with the gap.  If you can no worries in my book.

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2 hours ago, YamYam said:

Trouble is when you start meeting with lofts on say Vokeys, the bounce angle changes too and also the grinds.

That is with any wedge or any iron for that matter some worse than others

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

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Yes, I have a 52 gap and use either 58 thick sand low bounce or 60 fluffy sugar sand +12 bounce.

 

I can open a 52 and make it 54/56.

Driver FW - Titleist 917

Irons 4 to 8 - Titleist T300 2° flat

Irons 9 to wedges - George Nicoll Royal musclebacks 70s vintage

Putter - Scotty Cameron Select blackout

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