Instructor vs. Coach

[BostonSal]

Although I didn't play for a high school team--we didn't have one--

I very much did play golf when in high school. Started at thirteen, I believe.

First I was driving range taught by friends and relatives and a driving range pro--you can just imagine--

and then got proper instruction from a Class A PGA pro who was also a pretty successful regionlal competitive player.

But those initial lessons were it.  I never took swing lessons again.  I'd occasionally book a lesson to learn a specific shot.

 

Never, however, did I desire something as personal as a coach.   That would have been a step too far for me.

Perhaps I would have become a better player if I could have handled that kind of relationship,

but it wouldn't have been something that I enjoyed.

 

Same thing goes for launch monitor / simultor club fitting.

The likely rewarding result didn't seem worth enduring the process.

 

 

 

Edited November 30, 2021 by BostonSal

[cnosil]

33 minutes ago, BostonSal said:

Never, however, did I desire something as personal as a coach.   That would have been a step too far for me.

Perhaps I would have become a better player if I could have handled that kind of relationship,

but it wouldn't have been something that I enjoyed.

 

Same thing goes for launch monitor / simultor club fitting.

The likely rewarding result didn't seem worth enduring the process.

 

We all seek something different.  You have pursued what you want to achieve your specific goals and are; I assume, happy with where you are with your game.   
 

you are also assuming that a player coach relationship is personal.  It could be more or less personal than an instructor.  I would even say that some of the  information presented by coach can be found in books and is more informative than swing instruction books.  As discussed in the video; which I am assuming you still didn’t watch, and instructor is more about the mechanics and swing feelings and A coach is more about decision making, focus, and thought process.
 

launch monitors are simply a way to gather information.  There are other ways to gather the same information.   Just like instructors and coaches gather and present different information.  
 

the point of the topic was that there is a difference between an instructor and a coach.  Depending on where you are with your game and what you are trying to achieve you may get more benefit from instruction or you may get more benefit from coaching.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

15 hours ago, Shapotomous said:

This is probably a separate thread but I am truly curious what constitutes "the basics" when it comes to a golf lesson. 

Is it keep your eye on the ball or is it keep your weight inside your trail foot or is it shaft lean & hit down on the ball with your irons (and even fairway woods depending on your lie) and have a positive angle of attack on the driver or does it include teaching somebody to properly set their wrists or is it teaching somebody how to read the grain on the green or is it turn don't sway or weight transfer or teaching someone how to bump and run with an 8 iron rather than grabbing for a wedge 100% of the time around the green, or how to play for ball flight tendencies off different slopes, or.......? 

Or do some of these get past "the basics" and into over instruction? 

 

Go to a range and you will find a lot of people that have good grips, acceptable posture and yet make bad swing and have terrible contact and face control.

Learning how to properly transfer pressure, set the wrists and rotate are IMO al prt of the basics. 
 

Unfortunately people who can’t get into more of the nuances of the swing stick to their guns on certain aspects to support their position

[GolfSpy AFG]

Man, talk about a thread getting hijacked and pulled off the rails quickly.

Golf is a game that can be enjoyed at many levels and in many different ways.  Some are happy to hit and giggle, some aren't happy unless they're turning over every rock looking for every iota of improvement they can possibly attain, and many are somewhere in between.  Me, I'm certainly the turn over every rock type, but I don't take issue with someone who is not inclined to spend money on lessons, or spend hours doing drills or practicing.  I DO take issue with the condescending suggestion that I'm one of many who are "lost" or foolish to spend my time/energy/funds in the manner I choose to in pursuit of lower scores.

As to the coaching vs instruction discussion, I can safely say I've benefited from both.  I've taken quite a few lessons and can say I'm a much better ball-striker than I was a few years ago, but I needed coaching (in my case DECADE) to learn how to take that ability to the course.  Both have contributed equally to my ability to lower my scores.

[cnosil]

51 minutes ago, Riverboat said:

At any rate, it really seems that some of us are wound just a little too tightly when someone disagrees with their take on things. I'm okay with you and others being all for using instructors and coaches for virtually every aspect of the game, but that doesn't preclude me from being able to state that it may not be the best way to go for most players.

Seems like you think I overanalyze things,  but I don't think you have any idea how much coaching and instruction I have or how much I work on my game independently.   I am pretty sure I have agreed that there are lots of people on the forum that have and do overanalyze.  You are 100% correct in your statements that people need to be able to figure things out for themselves.   I also don't think I am wound too tightly I just try to explain my position and better understand the position of others.  I like to learn and I ask lots of questions and restate things and yes differing ideas and opinions are important.

[GolfSpy AFG]

FWIW, the Off Course with Claude Harmon podcast interview with Cameron McCormick has plenty of quality content concerning the coaching versus instruction dynamic.  Very informative and entertaining listen.

[TaketheCannoli]

Like @revkev I'm older than most posters. I've had lots of instruction and unfortunately very little coaching. 

When I've played my best for extended periods of time, seasons or years, I had the luck to have a good coach.

I also think the PGA teaches pros to be instructors, how to teach the golf swing, how to fix a golf swing. Beyond that, they teach them how to run a business.

I think as a student, getting a coach requires they are available to you, perhaps to go out on the course somewhat regularly. 

I think it's getting easier to coach due to the availability of simulators. 

 

FWIW, my first coach put together a terrific program. I was a beginner with a 36 handicap. He had me take a driving range lesson weekly, he gave me a playing lesson weekly and we would play 18 holes weekly. He even took me to the local PGA pro-ams 3-4 times. When we started, I couldn't break 100. After 6 months of this, I shot 78 in a pro-am and my handicap dropped to 12. Obviously the 78 was an outlier :).

 

The second coach played 18 with me about once a month, gave me playing lessons about every six weeks, and a handful of driving range lessons. This dropped my handicap from 11 to 5 over one season.

Unfortunately, as I got older my game got worse and I am no longer a single digit player.

 

 

[tony@CIC]

On 11/25/2021 at 11:13 AM, cnosil said:

TXG has started another instructional series of videos and I just watched the one linked below and really enjoyed the topic.    Definitely a huge difference between an instructor and a coach and what they are trying to achieve.     Listening to the conversations in the video makes me think about the various questions on the forum and whether people want/need coaching or instruction.   

 

 

 

The video was interesting - but it seemed like the comments were more of what an instructor would say than a coach. 

[cnosil]

20 minutes ago, tony@CIC said:

The video was interesting - but it seemed like the comments were more of what an instructor would say than a coach. 

I watched it again based on your comment and I thought the opposite; most if it was coaching.  Other than the close the clubhead, look at path stuff on the driver it was mostly coaching about thoughts, focus, and what the player was feeling. 

[Goober]

so is this an instructor or a coach? I have no idea what they are talking about. But seem to have a connection of some time. I’m thinking one is the caddy and one is a tour player I assume. 

[cksurfdude]

On 11/25/2021 at 11:13 AM, cnosil said:

TXG has started another instructional series of videos and I just watched the one linked below and really enjoyed the topic.    Definitely a huge difference between an instructor and a coach and what they are trying to achieve.     Listening to the conversations in the video makes me think about the various questions on the forum and whether people want/need coaching or instruction.   

Finally watched this all the way through - pretty interesting, I think, and ... both the player and the instructor/coach each made comments clarifying a few points to distinguish between instructor vs coach.

I've benefited, unquestionably, from taking... swing technique lessons, on-course playing lessons, in-depth multi-day golf schools and from attending a mental game clinic (which I may repeat sometime).

(..and I still suck but I suck way way less vs when I started all this )

Golf is a hard game .. those who may be self-taught and happy with where they're at, kudos to you! .. for me having pros help instruct and guide me has been hugely beneficial.