MGS Beef with Rick Shiels? He addresses on his new podcast

[bens197 11,737]

I miss the good old days where you just hire a professional long driver, film him smashing a half dozen bombs and then sell it after 11pm on PBS for $249.99

 

 

[Tyler86 414]

3 minutes ago, bens197 said:

I miss the good old days where you just hire a professional long driver, film him smashing a half dozen bombs and then sell it after 11pm on PBS for $249.99

 

 

Hahahaha. “375 at least!” “Its not coming down”.

[bens197 11,737]

11 minutes ago, Tyler86 said:

Hahahaha. “375 at least!” “Its not coming down”.

To be serious for a moment...

The Hammer driver folks were pioneers in attracting the propagandized golfer.  They knew there was that segment who would see this and think it has to work for me...Regardless of facts, people see what they want and believe the same.  

It cleared the path for the Killer Bee, Alien Wedge and even the tight lies...25 years later, despite the best efforts of small-time golf influencers and the MGS staff, there is a segment that will always remain inpentrable.  Facts won't matter when they choose their X brand driver even though the Y brand will be far better.

 

[Thin2win 3,617]

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Other than maybe rock Shiels what yt reviewer hits that many shots?

 

I haven't seen them all, but I would bet a good steak dinner that Crossfield, Etches, TXG, Finch, etc all do. They are professionals making money off their reviews, they want to hit that club enough that they know what they are talking about. Even the non paid reviews done on this site hit hundreds of balls. Because we all want to put out a good review, paid or not. These guys are not just hitting 10 shots and calling that a wrap. They are reviewing what 10 drivers a year? They have the time and resources to hit 100's of shots. They are all given reviews of how they like the product. MGS MW is not a review, but a test. Calling out a reviewers opinion as invalid because they don't test the way you do is silly, they aren't trying to do what MGS does and aren't claiming that they are.  

All that aside, I'll echo what Rick said on his podcast, even if he did only hit 10 shots, if this club had crazy ball speeds why didn't he see them on the first one? You only get 1 swing on a tee box(hopefully). It needs to prove itself on hit 1.  But again, that really doesn't matter. I have an issue with MGS saying that your opinion isn't valid because you didn't do things their way.  If they said that to you, anyone on this forum or anyone else in the world that doesn't sit well with me. 

 

[Mdrnsamurai 47]

This is social media doing what it does best... Bringing people together so they can murder each other...

[RickyBobby_PR 9,258]

2 hours ago, Thin2win said:

I haven't seen them all, but I would bet a good steak dinner that Crossfield, Etches, TXG, Finch, etc all do. They are professionals making money off their reviews, they want to hit that club enough that they know what they are talking about. Even the non paid reviews done on this site hit hundreds of balls.

Alex hits a bunch of shots in his videos but I can’t see him hitting 200 shots per club especially they way he swings.

Its been a while since I’ve watched a txg video by I doubt Matt hits 200+ shots with a driver even though his swing is less violent than Alex’s swing. 
 

None of them show the number of shots they hit. But just because they are professional and want making money off their channels doesn’t mean they do things people thing they do. It’s about finding a way to get views and that’s usually by using titles that are or are close to click bait and using a good picture. 
 

Rick started out hitting 10 shots in his reviews and like others mentioned he talked about changing his method which the last time I watched any of his videos he was hitting some shots indoors (didn’t look like 100) and some on the course (combined didn’t look like 200+).

But again Rick is one person where as mgs has dozens of reviewers and several staff. The amount of data between mgs and any of the yt reviewers isn’t even close.

Yes the mgs reviewers hit hundreds of shots over the course of weeks. Not the same as Rick swinging away one day in his place and one day or same day on a course. 

[Thin2win 3,617]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The amount of data between mgs and any of the yt reviewers isn’t even close.

Agreed. Lol, I didn't know we were debating this. Testing VS review. Absolutely. 

[sixcat 4,041]

6 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Yes the mgs reviewers hit hundreds of shots over the course of weeks. Not the same as Rick swinging away one day in his place and one day or same day on a course. 

Obviously you didn’t watch/listen to Shiels’ entire video. He literally talks about hitting balls with the Stealth over the period of more than a week, at a number of different facilities, weather conditions, indoors off a mat, outdoors, and from a hitting bay. 
 

Besides, in the original review video Shiels did that brought this whole thing to a head, Rick hits way more than 10 shots!!!

My overarching point to all this, there is obviously enough Kool-Aid to go around. MGS doesn’t need to perform drive-by’s on others in the same arena. 

[Btshiloh@yahoo.com 8]

14 hours ago, Thin2win said:

See, I think I end up using more then twice as many 1 ply sheets compared to when I use 2 ply. I think because I'm needing to use more of the roll on single ply, I end up saving on 2 ply. At least I like to think so. 

With two-ply you can turn it over and use the other side. 

[Middler 3,458]

12 hours ago, Thin2win said:

I haven't seen them all, but I would bet a good steak dinner that Crossfield, Etches, TXG, Finch, etc all do. They are professionals making money off their reviews, they want to hit that club enough that they know what they are talking about. Even the non paid reviews done on this site hit hundreds of balls.

Getting paid isn’t the point. MGS isn’t a charity, they’re making a living here too, even if there are also unpaid reviewers included. The question is how much if any money the source takes directly from OEMs. Golf Digest is the totally bought off by OEMs, I thought that’s what birthed MGS. We don’t really know what $ influence OEMs have on each YouTube golf channel, some have (Crossfield totally above board) and others we really don’t know. Some definitely get paid by golf apparel companies. Money? Equipment? T&E? As I understand it MGS does not take any $ from OEMs, not sure about buying the equipment (other than golf ball lab, they buy thru retail).

 

[GolfSpy_APH 7,164]

2 minutes ago, Middler said:

Getting paid isn’t the point. MGS isn’t a charity, they’re making a living here too, even if there are also unpaid reviewers included. The question is how much if any money the source takes directly from OEMs. Golf Digest is the totally bought off by OEMs, I thought that’s what birthed MGS. We don’t really know what $ influence OEMs have on each YouTube golf channel, some have (Crossfield totally above board) and others we really don’t know. Money? Equipment? T&E? As I understand it MGS does not take any $ from OEMs, not sure about buying the equipment (other than golf ball lab, they buy thru retail).

 

I'll just link this here for those to reference. Most of us know that companies such as Evnroll and Sub70 have been sponsors in the past and may still currently be? https://mygolfspy.com/advertise Either way this outlines their advertising packages and some options. 

[fixyurdivot 16,632]

13 hours ago, Thin2win said:

Calling out a reviewers opinion as invalid because they don't test the way you do is silly, they aren't trying to do what MGS does and aren't claiming that they are.  

That's the interesting thing - Rick is on record saying MGS has a much more thorough and rigorous testing protocol.  Looks to me like whoever wrote the MGS comment (might not even be a staff member) never heard him make that statement. 

1 hour ago, Middler said:

Getting paid isn’t the point. MGS isn’t a charity, they’re making a living here too, even if there are also unpaid reviewers included. The question is how much if any money the source takes directly from OEMs. Golf Digest is the totally bought off by OEMs, I thought that’s what birthed MGS. We don’t really know what $ influence OEMs have on each YouTube golf channel, some have (Crossfield totally above board) and others we really don’t know. Money? Equipment? T&E? As I understand it MGS does not take any $ from OEMs, not sure about buying the equipment (other than golf ball lab, they buy thru retail).

 

No, not the point of the MGS comment that started this discussion/debate, but by no means exclusive of product testing and how it might affect reviews.  You are absolutely correct that MGS is not a charity and needs to pay bills and make profit. How they walk the tightrope to do that and make product reviews as non-monetary influenced as possible I don't know.

I can say that my image of them, and why I place so much credence into their reviews, is based on two things.  First, that Adam founded the company (per his own story) for the explicit reason/purpose of providing the golfing community unbiased reviews of equipment.  And second, no less important to me, is that the testing is conducted by unpaid golfers whose ball striking prowess covers the range of amateurs like us.  Add to that the numerous forum product reviews on many of these same equipment, by "we the people", and that's the best I've ever found.

Adam does not strike me as someone who would start selling out his "Truth Digest" core principle.

[bens197 11,737]

2 hours ago, Middler said:

Getting paid isn’t the point. MGS isn’t a charity, they’re making a living here too, even if there are also unpaid reviewers included. The question is how much if any money the source takes directly from OEMs. Golf Digest is the totally bought off by OEMs, I thought that’s what birthed MGS. We don’t really know what $ influence OEMs have on each YouTube golf channel, some have (Crossfield totally above board) and others we really don’t know. Some definitely get paid by golf apparel companies. Money? Equipment? T&E? As I understand it MGS does not take any $ from OEMs, not sure about buying the equipment (other than golf ball lab, they buy thru retail).

 

This is where I really have a hard time with the guys alleging MGS is somehow taking backdoor cash.  Yes, they sell ad revenue and yes, they are transparent about the fact.  Nothing in this world is free, but to allege they are somehow influenced is bonkers.

I mean, Tommy Armour won the most wanted mallet in consecutive years...Tommy Armour...

Some folks just love themselves a good old fashioned conspiracy theory.

[PMookie 17,027]

Man, THREE threads in-a-row talking about Shiels and MGS and two weren’t even IN the “Shiels vs MGS” thread.

Good gracious. Aggravating.

[Riverboat 786]

43 minutes ago, bens197 said:

This is where I really have a hard time with the guys alleging MGS is somehow taking backdoor cash.  Yes, they sell ad revenue and yes, they are transparent about the fact.  Nothing in this world is free, but to allege they are somehow influenced is bonkers.

I mean, Tommy Armour won the most wanted mallet in consecutive years...Tommy Armour...

Some folks just love themselves a good old fashioned conspiracy theory.

Not saying they are accepting money, but they brought this melee on themselves. Attacking a reviewer who has said good things about mgs' methods because he said some mildly negative things, then giving an unnecessary defense of taylormade, when the review really wasn't bad (just tepid, as many have been about this product), is just terrible optics. Not sure why some of you don't see that. You can love this site without defending every single move they make. This was a screw up, period. And it gives the appearance, real or not, of too cozy a relationship with TM.

[bens197 11,737]

18 minutes ago, Riverboat said:

Not saying they are accepting money, but they brought this melee on themselves. Attacking a reviewer who has said good things about mgs' methods because he said some mildly negative things, then giving an unnecessary defense of taylormade, when the review really wasn't bad (just tepid, as many have been about this product), is just terrible optics. Not sure why some of you don't see that. You can love this site without defending every single move they make. This was a screw up, period. And it gives the appearance, real or not, of too cozy a relationship with TM.

never mind. I had something written but I just can’t. I’m not doing this. 

[Riverboat 786]

5 minutes ago, bens197 said:

It’s a random post…One out of thousands that they’ve made. I am not pinning this on them primarily because I am not convinced it even was one of them. Secondly, I’ve been around here 5 years in May and this is yet again, some unfounded allegation.  One anonymous poster saying they’re mygolfspy. Yawn.  
 

One post doesn’t define a business. 

And you don't think they would have simply come out and said they had nothing to do with it if that was the case. Doubtful. 

[Thin2win 3,617]

1 hour ago, PMookie said:

Man, THREE threads in-a-row talking about Shiels and MGS and two weren’t even IN the “Shiels vs MGS” thread.

Good gracious. Aggravating.

It's this or talk about CC buying TXG  

I blame Hawaiian golf and snow on the ground

[LICC 271]

12 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Alex hits a bunch of shots in his videos but I can’t see him hitting 200 shots per club especially they way he swings.

Its been a while since I’ve watched a txg video by I doubt Matt hits 200+ shots with a driver even though his swing is less violent than Alex’s swing. 
 

None of them show the number of shots they hit. But just because they are professional and want making money off their channels doesn’t mean they do things people thing they do. It’s about finding a way to get views and that’s usually by using titles that are or are close to click bait and using a good picture. 
 

Rick started out hitting 10 shots in his reviews and like others mentioned he talked about changing his method which the last time I watched any of his videos he was hitting some shots indoors (didn’t look like 100) and some on the course (combined didn’t look like 200+).

But again Rick is one person where as mgs has dozens of reviewers and several staff. The amount of data between mgs and any of the yt reviewers isn’t even close.

Yes the mgs reviewers hit hundreds of shots over the course of weeks. Not the same as Rick swinging away one day in his place and one day or same day on a course. 

But why does this matter. Shiels isn’t saying he is hitting as many balls as MGS. 

He doesn’t need to hit as many in order to have enough of an experience to give an informed, accurate opinion based on what he experienced. 

[RickyBobby_PR 9,258]

5 hours ago, sixcat said:

Obviously you didn’t watch/listen to Shiels’ entire video. He literally talks about hitting balls with the Stealth over the period of more than a week, at a number of different facilities, weather conditions, indoors off a mat, outdoors, and from a hitting bay. 
 

Besides, in the original review video Shiels did that brought this whole thing to a head, Rick hits way more than 10 shots!!!

My overarching point to all this, there is obviously enough Kool-Aid to go around. MGS doesn’t need to perform drive-by’s on others in the same arena. 

You picked a piece of a comment that stated I haven’t watched his videos in years so the likelihood I listened his podcast is pretty low. But no I didn’t and won’t. Ricks content isn’t appealing to me anymore and there’s nothing I’ve learned or gained from him when I didn’t watch his videos. 
 

Ricks equipment knowledge is on or with what one can find from reading golf websites and his understanding of numbers pales in comparison to TXG and that of members on another forum who are and have done fittings for their career. He’s far from the best instructor on yt. 
 

MGs didn’t do a drive by. The comment they replied to brought up Rick, they then applied to reply to rick. Mgs didn’t bring Rick into the conversation he was already there. 

6 minutes ago, LICC said:

But why does this matter. Shiels isn’t saying he is hitting as many balls as MGS. 

He doesn’t need to hit as many in order to have enough of an experience to give an informed, accurate opinion based on what he experienced. 

It matters because the point of mgs rad about how many shots Rick hits compared to the data mgs has. They have 9000 shots 1/2 way thru 2022 most wanted driver testing, now add that to the the amount of data they have from previous years.

Not to mention the amount of analysis mgs does with that data compared to Rick.