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Big Name Companies Claiming They Have The "Longest" driver?


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I have looking at drivers recently and watching PGA, European, Asian and LPGA Tours over the last few weeks and keep thinking to my self, "Why do I continue to see SIM or SIM2 in bags and not Stealth, and this Callaway pro is hitting longer than this TM pro." (and they both are "longer-ish" drivers of the golf ball.  Looking at research on https://www.cbssports.com/golf/stats/pga-tour/drive-distance/ (also toggled through other categories) and from claims I see on forums, reviews and so on I feel like they're convoluted in the sense of knowledge or reality.  Rick Shiels had a video where he demonstrated how a SIM2 did not outperform the brand new revolutionary STEALTH driver and what I have seen is "TaylorMade is longest on tour" ok, no it is not. Also it is not most accurate by tour pros, Callaway, Titleist, and Ping, even Srixon hold spots above TaylorMade, and TaylorMade claims to have a face that helps with accuracy AND distance! Curious to see what ya'll think on this subject. 

 

And to give my full census on the subject, I feel like TM and Titleist are the two best for woods for the "average" golfer. Although coming down to a specific club that works best for each individual is complicated (swing, feel, sound, accuracy, shaft, if they have a fitter that ACTUALLY fitted them properly and so on) and does not show one clubmaker is superior over another on a large scale, IMO.

I have tried all the top brands except PXG for drivers and the feel of Titleist is what suits me along with sound and accuracy. I like the SIM2 and Ping SLT but did not get good enough numbers on them. I hope ya'll have an amazing day, stay happy and healthy! Cheers!

Edited by SoonerBoomer1189
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Stan

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Honestly, it's worth hitting 5-6 drivers using trackman and seeing what speeds, distance, carry, apex etc. you're getting. I have a 5yr old Titleist driver, tried all the new drivers last year on Trackman and none materially performed better. Go for what suits your feel and let the numbers back it up. 

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Big name car companies claim they have the best car

big name phone companies claim they have the best cameras and fastest phones

big name fast food companies claim they have the best French fries

big name shoe companies claim they have the best shoes

big faucet companies claim they have the best faucets

big name tool companies claim they have the best tools

big name shirt companies claim they have the best shirts

big name lawn mower companies claim they have the best lawn mowers

 

are you sensing a pattern here?

 

it’s called marketing and, believe it or not, it is not unique to the golf industry 

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38 minutes ago, jlukes said:

Big name car companies claim they have the best car

big name phone companies claim they have the best cameras and fastest phones

big name fast food companies claim they have the best French fries

big name shoe companies claim they have the best shoes

big faucet companies claim they have the best faucets

big name tool companies claim they have the best tools

big name shirt companies claim they have the best shirts

big name lawn mower companies claim they have the best lawn mowers

 

are you sensing a pattern here?

 

it’s called marketing and, believe it or not, it is not unique to the golf industry 

It’s to the point that I think people are just looking for ways to justify their decision to not go fry something and see if it works or not. This is a never ending take on golf forums. I’ve never seen it on the jeep forums I was a member of in the past. A friend of mine is into knives and it’s never seen on those forums.

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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2 hours ago, SoonerBoomer1189 said:

I have looking at drivers recently and watching PGA, European, Asian and LPGA Tours over the last few weeks and keep thinking to my self, "Why do I continue to see SIM or SIM2 in bags and not Stealth, and this Callaway pro is hitting longer than this TM pro." (and they both are "longer-ish" drivers of the golf ball.  Looking at research on https://www.cbssports.com/golf/stats/pga-tour/drive-distance/ (also toggled through other categories) and from claims I see on forums, reviews and so on I feel like they're convoluted in the sense of knowledge or reality.  Rick Shiels had a video where he demonstrated how a SIM2 did not outperform the brand new revolutionary STEALTH driver and what I have seen is "TaylorMade is longest on tour" ok, no it is not. Also it is not most accurate by tour pros, Callaway, Titleist, and Ping, even Srixon hold spots above TaylorMade, and TaylorMade claims to have a face that helps with accuracy AND distance! Curious to see what ya'll think on this subject. 

 

And to give my full census on the subject, I feel like TM and Titleist are the two best for woods for the "average" golfer. Although coming down to a specific club that works best for each individual is complicated (swing, feel, sound, accuracy, shaft, if they have a fitter that ACTUALLY fitted them properly and so on) and does not show one clubmaker is superior over another on a large scale, IMO.

I have tried all the top brands except PXG for drivers and the feel of Titleist is what suits me along with sound and accuracy. I like the SIM2 and Ping SLT but did not get good enough numbers on them. I hope ya'll have an amazing day, stay happy and healthy! Cheers!

I guess my question is why do people worry about what players on the pro tours play and what online reviewers say?  Your last two paragraphs are what a player needs to worry about….go try the clubs and see what works best for you.   If you are on golf forums you should already know not to just buy off the rack, but in reality that is what 99% of golfers do.   Marketing is designed to get people to pick up their product.

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Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
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Wedge:  :mizuno-small: T20 54-8  :cleveland-small: 588  58-12
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2 hours ago, Bomber said:

Honestly, it's worth hitting 5-6 drivers using trackman and seeing what speeds, distance, carry, apex etc. you're getting. I have a 5yr old Titleist driver, tried all the new drivers last year on Trackman and none materially performed better. Go for what suits your feel and let the numbers back it up. 

Exactly.  As Rick aptly summarized in a recent podcast and SAS golf has stated many times before, everything is pushed up to the limits now so it's more about sound, feel and forgiveness for the most part. Even Rory's choosing to rock his Sim2 instead of the Stealth. 

 

So much of it is personal preference that everyone should try several clubs to figure out what suits them best. 

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Rag tag bag, but it does the job. 

Taylormade R1 driver.

Ping G400 3 wood.

Cleveland Halo Launcher 3 hybrid.

Cleveland CBX launcher irons (5-PW). 

Assorted wedges (48, 52, 58).

Odyssey White Hot Pro 2.0 putter.

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Look, let’s not worry about golf OEMs saying THEIR driver is the “longest”, just go buy those Sqairz shoes because they’re GUARANTEED to help you hit the ball 8 yards farther!!!! I mean, come-on, even Faldo says so!!! Screw getting a new driver, you just need THOSE SHOES!!! Heck, add-in a pack of “4 Yards More” tees and you got yourself TWELVE more yards! ALL of us will get 12 MORE between the shoes and tees!

Get my point???

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Driver: :cobra-small: King F9 Speedback/:callaway-small:Epic Max LS, Xphlexxx Busa 2 Liquid, XX stiff, 45”

Fwy:  :callaway-small: Epic Speed 4w, MMT 80X

Hybrid: :callaway-small: X2 Hot Pro, 20*, Graphite Design Tour AD-DI 105X

Irons: :honma:TR20 Tour P 4-10, :Nippon: Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Wedges: :edel-golf-1: SMS 50D/54V/58D:Nippon:Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Putter:  :edel-golf-1: EAS 1.0

All but putter have Lamkin ST+2 Hybrid Calibrate midsize built to oversize +1

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Years ago TM made the claim they had the longest driver in the industry, Rocketballz, I believe. They were 100% telling the truth! That driver WAS the longest, it was 46” as a shaft spec!!! Longest sometimes doesn’t mean it hits the ball farther…

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Fwy:  :callaway-small: Epic Speed 4w, MMT 80X

Hybrid: :callaway-small: X2 Hot Pro, 20*, Graphite Design Tour AD-DI 105X

Irons: :honma:TR20 Tour P 4-10, :Nippon: Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Wedges: :edel-golf-1: SMS 50D/54V/58D:Nippon:Modus 130 stiff, +1”

Putter:  :edel-golf-1: EAS 1.0

All but putter have Lamkin ST+2 Hybrid Calibrate midsize built to oversize +1

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38 minutes ago, MNUte said:

Exactly.  As Rick aptly summarized in a recent podcast and SAS golf has stated many times before, everything is pushed up to the limits now so it's more about sound, feel and forgiveness for the most part. Even Rory's choosing to rock his Sim2 instead of the Stealth. 

 

So much of it is personal preference that everyone should try several clubs to figure out what suits them best. 

Everything isn’t pushed to the limits. Yes the manufacturers have to stay within parameters that are set forth by the ruling bodies. If a club can generate more swing speed which is what happened with several of the online reviewers. This gives the golfer a chance to create more ball speed and that doesn’t break the CT rules. Stability is also another aspect that can be improved and provides for more consistency results with each swing. This is called standard deviation on launch monitors. 

Also a good read about driver distance 

https://mygolfspy.com/no-driver-distance-isnt-maxed-out/

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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3 hours ago, SoonerBoomer1189 said:

And to give my full census on the subject, I feel like TM and Titleist are the two best for woods for the "average" golfer.

I'd like to hear how you came to this conclusion/opinion. When someone says "average golfer", I usually think weekend players with 18+ handicaps.  And, when I hear TM and Titleist, I tend to think for better than average players. Based on my observations, those average players don't need length as much as they need forgiveness for poor strikes. The one successful thing the marketing teams have done, IMO, is leverage the want for distance, particularly in male consumers, at the expense of being in the fairway more frequently. 

I think all of the "bigs" offer a "max"/"jumbo"/"XB" option aimed at that group of players, but which of these is best.... 🤔

BEST OF THE BEST - DRIVER CHALLENGE | MyGolfSpy

 

 

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42 minutes ago, fixyurdivot said:

And, when I hear TM and Titleist, I tend to think for better than average players. Based on my observations, those average players don't need length as much as they need forgiveness for poor strikes. The one successful thing the marketing teams have d

They don’t have to be mutually exclusive. With the technology in todays golf world with the clubs and launch monitor one can find the club including driver that provides the the distance and forgiveness. Optimizing launch characteristics thru a fitting achieves this. Does that guarantee a player won’t hit a bad shot or won’t hit it off center? No but it helps reduce the penalty for that shot.

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Everything isn’t pushed to the limits. Yes the manufacturers have to stay within parameters that are set forth by the ruling bodies. If a club can generate more swing speed which is what happened with several of the online reviewers. This gives the golfer a chance to create more ball speed and that doesn’t break the CT rules. Stability is also another aspect that can be improved and provides for more consistency results with each swing. This is called standard deviation on launch monitors. 

Also a good read about driver distance 

https://mygolfspy.com/no-driver-distance-isnt-maxed-out/

After reading the article, I had a long winded post that I deleted because the simple message is: you and the article are right, everything isn't pushed to the absolute USGA limit (likely by manufacturer's choice per the article). But the article concedes time and time again that everything is so close that the improvements and year over year gains are minimal and openly admits that it's using a technicality of small gains to defeat the absolute maxed out argument. So while I should have instead said "everything is effectively pushed so close to the limits as to make year over year gains effectively negligible absent groundbreaking technology," I still think the original point stands that it comes down to the individual's preferences and traits (which the article supports by consistently reiterating the need for a fitting). 

....also, I know what standard deviation is mate. 

Rag tag bag, but it does the job. 

Taylormade R1 driver.

Ping G400 3 wood.

Cleveland Halo Launcher 3 hybrid.

Cleveland CBX launcher irons (5-PW). 

Assorted wedges (48, 52, 58).

Odyssey White Hot Pro 2.0 putter.

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39 minutes ago, MNUte said:

So while I should have instead said "everything is effectively pushed so close to the limits as to make year over year gains effectively negligible absent groundbreaking technology," I still think the original point stands that it comes down to the individual's preferences and traits (which the article supports by consistently reiterating the need for a fitting). 

Agree on the personal preference and fitting, which is what mgs staff advocates as do the companies so that people can find the best combo for them.

And yet whenever certain companies comes up with ground breaking technology like TaylorMade has the vast majority look at a handful of online reviews and jump to conclusions that it doesn’t work as advertised before they themselves have tested it. Yet when Callaway comes out with jailbreak or AI or then extend those into the fairways and hybrids they ignore what the reviewers say or even before the reviewers even get their hands on the new stuff they are praising how innovative Callaway is.

So much of the pushback is imo a disservice to what some extremely bright engineers spend their time on and act like they aren’t really doing anything significant and just working on tweaks. 

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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5 hours ago, cnosil said:

I guess my question is why do people worry about what players on the pro tours play and what online reviewers say?  Your last two paragraphs are what a player needs to worry about….go try the clubs and see what works best for you.   If you are on golf forums you should already know not to just buy off the rack, but in reality that is what 99% of golfers do.   Marketing is designed to get people to pick up their product.

it would be nice if all new clubs required a fitting. IF everyone is so enamored with what pros are playing; they should learn from them. Pros don't play anything without being fitted and often times  tweeked well outside of normal ranges. Yes, they are orders of magnitude better than the average golfer, but that doesn't mean we should buy stock anything. 

Family, old cars or bikes and GOLF

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Since the range between my longest and shortest drive in a season is about 50 yards, I don't think I could "detect" a 3,5 or even 10 yard increase. Hence I'm still gaming my clubs from 2018. New clubs would not improve my scores measurably, practice and lessons could.

And when I replace my clubs, to be honest it will probably be because I found something I liked the look and feel of better, coupled with just getting bored with the old and wanting something new. I'll admit it...

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38 minutes ago, MCB14230 said:

it would be nice if all new clubs required a fitting. IF everyone is so enamored with what pros are playing; they should learn from them. Pros don't play anything without being fitted and often times  tweeked well outside of normal ranges. Yes, they are orders of magnitude better than the average golfer, but that doesn't mean we should buy stock anything. 

I agree with you, but that isn’t how most golfers buy clubs. People go to the store, maybe hit a club a few times in the simulator and then buy the clubs.  

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15* set  to 16.5* w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 816H1 19* set at 18* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  21*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 5-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :mizuno-small: T20 54-8  :cleveland-small: 588  58-12
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45 minutes ago, Riverboat said:

In reality, most play custom grinds, shafts, etc.

Not true for shaft and the vast majority of clubs. Yes some brands will make driver heads or fairway heads that have lofts that aren’t available at retail and that’s because not many golfers need an 8* driver or like Tiger who preferred a non adjustable driver. Very rarely will you see an iron head that’s not available at retail. 
 

Their heads are digitally measured and shafts are hand picked for tighter tolerances but they are the same design as the ones listed on a manufacturers website 

Anyone can custom grind to their clubs. It’s just better left to the experts. 

For shafts they play the same shafts that can be had from the manufacturers but most play a TX flex which for pretty much every brand is an aftermarket shaft. I know more amateurs including myself that have a 1 off driver shaft than there are on tour  

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Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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On 2/10/2022 at 6:24 PM, RickyBobby_PR said:

Not true for shaft and the vast majority of clubs. Yes some brands will make driver heads or fairway heads that have lofts that aren’t available at retail and that’s because not many golfers need an 8* driver or like Tiger who preferred a non adjustable driver. Very rarely will you see an iron head that’s not available at retail. 
 

Their heads are digitally measured and shafts are hand picked for tighter tolerances but they are the same design as the ones listed on a manufacturers website 

Anyone can custom grind to their clubs. It’s just better left to the experts. 

For shafts they play the same shafts that can be had from the manufacturers but most play a TX flex which for pretty much every brand is an aftermarket shaft. I know more amateurs including myself that have a 1 off driver shaft than there are on tour  

The only difference for club heads, shafts, grips and balls for pros is usually they are selected to much tighter tolerances than what the rest of us can buy. Pros don't get off centric, off weight or off diameter balls, and the heads, grips and shafts they get are weight selected. The rest of us might get lucky and get dead on quality, but we might not. And many of us wouldn't know the difference...like many pros would. And they have big money on the line, unlike any of us...

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1 hour ago, Middler said:

The only difference for club heads, shafts and balls for pros is usually they are selected to much tighter tolerances than what the rest of us can buy. Pros don't get off centric, off weight or off diameter balls, and the heads and shafts they get are weight selected. The rest of us might get lucky and get dead on quality, but we might not. And many of us wouldn't know the difference...like many pros would. And they have big money on the line, unlike any of us...

Agree. The only problem is that if doing demo day fitting or one with a local shop is that what you were hitting that day may not match what you get in the order. Say you get fit into a 10.5 head but that head was actually 9.7 and then the one you get is 11.2 that’s a big difference and some may see different results with what they got delivered

Its one thing I liked about Ping fittings is they can put in an order with the tour side and get exactly what you want. 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Agree. The only problem is that if doing demo day fitting or one with a local shop is that what you were hitting that day may not match what you get in the order. Say you get fit into a 10.5 head but that head was actually 9.7 and then the one you get is 11.2 that’s a big difference and some may see different results with what they got delivered
 

Are you saying that the +/- tolerance on a head is really that much off? That is disappointing. I would have thought the quality control would have been tighter. 

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