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And why isn't this considered "anchoring"? 🔥

Golf fans react as Gary Evans CRITICISES authorities over putter anchoring

Honestly, I don't care.  If someone kicks their ball, shaves a stroke, or anchors their putter.  I play my game.  If I'm practicing, I'll play two balls off the tee or out of the fairway if the course is open... don't judge me Riverboat ;).   When I'm in competitive rounds (tourneys, events, or even when playing for score with my weekend foursome - anytime I'm turning in my score to GHIN) I do my best to follow the current rules of golf.  But I can't control what others do... I can only control how I let it affect me... and I don't.  Not sure if I'll try the long putter, but if I do... I won't feel bad about whether or not it should be banned, just that it is allowed as long as it isn't anchored.  If I like it, I'll use it until the USGA changes their rule, if I don't, I won't use it at all. 

 

 

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From my understanding on why the ban was instituted, was that it was not in the so called"spirit of the game" which is/was to have the hands/wrists an integral part of making the stroke. If we look at the way the vast majority of tour players stroke the putter, you see that they lock the hands/wrists and stroke with the shoulders. Which by the way is what teachers try to teach in putting. So in reality and since the arm lock style is OK for now, it was/is nothing more than a move by the USGA to appease a certain number of influential players who at the time decried foul, after a player managed to win a major. Until then, it was perfectly legal for well over 20+ years. But in today's game, it's more than alright to have let the OEM's run rampant with equipment that makes many course obsolete for today's tour pros.

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5 hours ago, Tiftaaft said:

And why isn't this considered "anchoring"? 🔥

Golf fans react as Gary Evans CRITICISES authorities over putter anchoring

Honestly, I don't care.  If someone kicks their ball, shaves a stroke, or anchors their putter.  I play my game.  If I'm practicing, I'll play two balls off the tee or out of the fairway if the course is open... don't judge me Riverboat ;).   When I'm in competitive rounds (tourneys, events, or even when playing for score with my weekend foursome - anytime I'm turning in my score to GHIN) I do my best to follow the current rules of golf.  But I can't control what others do... I can only control how I let it affect me... and I don't.  Not sure if I'll try the long putter, but if I do... I won't feel bad about whether or not it should be banned, just that it is allowed as long as it isn't anchored.  If I like it, I'll use it until the USGA changes their rule, if I don't, I won't use it at all. 

 

 

When I stick the butt end against my forearm it feels like anchoring to me   , but I didnt make the rules

The USGA definition of direct anchoring 

is The club is anchored “directly” when
the player intentionally holds the club or a
gripping hand in contact with any part of his
body, except that the player may hold the club
or a gripping hand against a hand or forearm

so hands and forearms are exempt  and not considered "anchoring"

Armlock  is just another technique that  permissible

Take advantage of the rules and try arm lock  

see if you can make more putts that way

There another section for broomstick and side saddle putting that has a definition for " anchor point" that gets more complicated as well  since the butt end is held by the gripping hand , and is not directly anchored  but consider "anchoring "  but way of " anchor point"

the  definition  of the  "anchor point" 

 

"Anchor point” exists when the
player intentionally holds a forearm in contact
with any part of his body to establish a gripping
hand as a stable point around which the other
hand may swing the club

 

 

Edited by Haro
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On 3/15/2022 at 10:59 AM, ballhawk said:

Also, take into consideration all the times that the tour implemented their own rulings on condition and equipment. Just offering a different take on the subject.....

The Tour uses only Model Local Rules that have been approved by the USGA/ R&A, and only allows Equipment that has been tested and approved by the USGA/R&A.  

And we WILL see some rules revisions, 2023 is on the normal 4-year cycle.  But I believe they'll be tweaks, not big changes.  I'd bet a whole lot of money there won't be a "divot hole relief" rule any time soon.

 

11 hours ago, Tiftaaft said:

And why isn't this considered "anchoring"?

Once they decided to revise the rule, they had to "draw a line".  It could have been the wrist, the elbow, the shoulder, they chose the elbow.  Drawing a line is by definition somewhat arbitrary.  

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5 minutes ago, DaveP043 said:

Once they decided to revise the rule, they had to "draw a line".  It could have been the wrist, the elbow, the shoulder, they chose the elbow.  Drawing a line is by definition somewhat arbitrary.  

Agreed Dave.  I was just using that to point out there are a lot of "nuances" in the rules of golf.   Many sports traditions evolve out of existence...  I mean... I remember the glory days of yore when a pitcher actually came to the plate, and didn't have to be given a strip search when leaving the mound every inning.  😉  

Golf is a game of tradition and honor, those that choose not to respect that... that's on them.  Of course, I say that with as much new tech in my bag as I can find/afford... so I guess that makes me a hypocrite.  Still have my MacGregor Eye-O-Matic persimmons and MacGregor blades ready for action though... 🙂  

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The Tour uses only Model Local Rules that have been approved by the USGA/ R&A, and only allows Equipment that has been tested and approved by the USGA/R&A.  

Just as an example, the tour banned the use of the Ping eye 2, even though the USGA ok'd them. I'm sure there are more but the point is made. 

I've always questioned the need for "local rules" since there's already an established "book" of rules.    

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Just to add my 2 cents on this. The anchoring ban was specifically targeted at belly putters and the long putter fell into that category when it came to anchor points. I believe that Tim Clark and Adam Scott were the only two Tour players at the time using a long putter when the ban was announced. Granted Adam Scott won the Masters in 2013 with the broomstick but still it had more to do with belly putters winning majors. Bradley, Simpson and Els all won majors in a short period of time using a belly putter just prior to the ancho ban. Other than Webb the others have not had very much success once the ban was put in place. 

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37 minutes ago, Jmikecpa said:

Bradley, Simpson and Els all won majors in a short period of time using a belly putter just prior to the ancho ban.

It's a fair comment, there did seem to be a rash of winners using the belly putter just before the ban..but Keegan Bradley had been using the belly putter for 3 years prior to his first PGA win, and then won the PGA that same year, and the WGC the following year.  Was it the putter, or was it a hot golf game at the time... hard to tell. 

Just to play the theoretical devil's advocate.... Let's say one of us is having success in scoring within the parameters of our own abilities... over the course of 3 years - working on our game by practicing all aspects, including our putting stroke going from a 20 hcap to a 9.  Then being told... ok... now you can't use the putter you have in your bag and have practiced with for the last 3 years, and you can't swing the putter with the same wrist motion as you have grooved for the past 3 years.  I would venture to guess our scores would worsen in the period following the change... then hopefully improve again.  Of course, I'm generalizing here... but point is... some things are subjective... especially when golf is concerned.  Then you have the likes of Tiger, Phil, Rory, Clarke, Bubba all winning majors in those few years preceding the ban - using a standard length putter obviously (though Phil did dabble with the belly putter for a time if I recall... he has tried just about everything at one point or another).  

Anyway, a lively discussion, all the way around on this thread... more than I expected when I was just looking for a couple of responses saying "yeah I used one... hated it" or "best thing to ever happen to my yips"  haha.  

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Best way to putt ever!  I used a long putter for over 20 years.  It took me from a 14 hcp., to a 2 hcp.  I make every short putt (literally, from 8 feet in), and I have learned to control my lag putting distances.  I found it so much easier on my back, since I could actually just stand up and putt.  Changing the rules about "anchoring" the putter, was an incredible step backwards in the game and rules of golf.  A lot more players, especially beginners, would have found the long putter a much more effective way to putt. I don't adhere 100% to the non-anchoring aspect, but I am not on the PGA tour, or playing USGA sanctioned tournaments.  I am simply enjoying the game of golf, since I have alleviated the problems normally associated with missing short putts by using the long putter.

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When the ban came in, they were directing towards a very small group of hot players. Other players were complaining, saying they got advantage from using said putters. I’ve used all, belly, arm, & broom. Like I said when the ban came out, you have to practice with each to be good with each. Those pros spent relentless hours, like other pros with normal putters, to perfect each styles craft. I didn’t really give the belly long enough, didn’t like it. The arm lock was ok, couldn’t get that decent from long range. The belly is where I found the most success. I felt relief on my back after rounds, while using the broom. Short putts were dialed in rather quickly, took a bit for lag putting, but it came around. In one Mens league I play in, a guy in his early 30s uses a side saddle & is deadly. Another late 20s uses a broomstick & is good. Different strokes for different folks. I’ve never had anyone question if I’m anchoring. Like another member said earlier, golf is a game of integrity. 

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Gday!  Been using various 48" putters for 10+ years.  Anchored till outlawed.. Now have top left hand 1 in from chest, just as good.  Basically use Langer's grip.  Gaming a Ping Craz-E past 3 seasons. 67 yrs young this summer, 5 to 6 index during season. Won our Senior Champs in 2021--last 10 holes made everything from 12 ft in, and hit a key 40 ft lag Putt on 18 to 18ins to cement the win. Wouldn't putt any other way. 5 broomers at my club, and 3 of us are some of best putters here. If you practice it, I believe much more stable and confidence promoting once comfy. Good luck! 

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2 hours ago, Tiftaaft said:

It's a fair comment, there did seem to be a rash of winners using the belly putter just before the ban..but Keegan Bradley had been using the belly putter for 3 years prior to his first PGA win, and then won the PGA that same year, and the WGC the following year.  Was it the putter, or was it a hot golf game at the time... hard to tell. 

Just to play the theoretical devil's advocate.... Let's say one of us is having success in scoring within the parameters of our own abilities... over the course of 3 years - working on our game by practicing all aspects, including our putting stroke going from a 20 hcap to a 9.  Then being told... ok... now you can't use the putter you have in your bag and have practiced with for the last 3 years, and you can't swing the putter with the same wrist motion as you have grooved for the past 3 years.  I would venture to guess our scores would worsen in the period following the change... then hopefully improve again.  Of course, I'm generalizing here... but point is... some things are subjective... especially when golf is concerned.  Then you have the likes of Tiger, Phil, Rory, Clarke, Bubba all winning majors in those few years preceding the ban - using a standard length putter obviously (though Phil did dabble with the belly putter for a time if I recall... he has tried just about everything at one point or another).  

Anyway, a lively discussion, all the way around on this thread... more than I expected when I was just looking for a couple of responses saying "yeah I used one... hated it" or "best thing to ever happen to my yips"  haha.  

3 of his 4 wins were with a belly putter and his 4th was with an armlock putter. I have had the pleasure of a round with Keegan and one of the best ball strikers I have seen in person and also a great dude. His game tee to green didn’t really leave him after the ban, but the belly putter did.
 

If you could find stats on how many belly putters were in use vs long putters that would give the answer. Belly putters were fine until they started to become the norm and not a crutch for guys that couldn’t putt up to Tour standards. The ban was gaining momentum and then 3 of 5 majors were won by a player using a belly putter and that sealed the deal in my opinion. 
 

 

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On 3/18/2022 at 3:56 PM, Tiftaaft said:

Let's say one of us is having success in scoring within the parameters of our own abilities... over the course of 3 years - working on our game by practicing all aspects, including our putting stroke going from a 20 hcap to a 9.  Then being told... ok... now you can't use the putter you have in your bag and have practiced with for the last 3 years, and you can't swing the putter with the same wrist motion as you have grooved for the past 3 years. 

The part of this that sometimes gets lost in the discussion is that those who were "anchoring" their putting stroke had three years to change.  The rule was announced in 2013, and didn't take effect until 2016.  I have no doubt that the change was difficult, but the rule didn't change overnight.

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On 3/17/2022 at 8:47 PM, Tiftaaft said:

And why isn't this considered "anchoring"? 🔥

Golf fans react as Gary Evans CRITICISES authorities over putter anchoring

Honestly, I don't care.  If someone kicks their ball, shaves a stroke, or anchors their putter.  I play my game.  If I'm practicing, I'll play two balls off the tee or out of the fairway if the course is open... don't judge me Riverboat ;).   When I'm in competitive rounds (tourneys, events, or even when playing for score with my weekend foursome - anytime I'm turning in my score to GHIN) I do my best to follow the current rules of golf.  But I can't control what others do... I can only control how I let it affect me... and I don't.  Not sure if I'll try the long putter, but if I do... I won't feel bad about whether or not it should be banned, just that it is allowed as long as it isn't anchored.  If I like it, I'll use it until the USGA changes their rule, if I don't, I won't use it at all. 

 

 

I will agree with you on the fact of why is the arm lock NOT anchoring? I can remember when they were first talking about the anchoring ban it was a Hornets nest down here. At the time there were a lot of retirees anchoring or using the long putters for various reasons. A lot of those guys said if the anchoring ban went into effect they would quit the game. Here the courses acted fast because retiree league play is the steady backbone of the golf industry here. You know like 30 or 40 guys playing 3 times a week or more it adds up. The courses here and the league associations QUICKLY decided to disregard the anchoring ban. Another move by the USGA not taking in consideration issues involving the rank and file players and bottom line operations of courses in general. Now days with all the hoopla that was raised at the time I see very few broomsticks. I guess a lot of those guys either died out or got to old to play. 

I have said this before 99% of all golfers out here in the real world play how ever they want to. They could give 2 rips less what the USGA R&A or the PGA say and do. I guess now since I retired from big money matches and Mini Tours I fall into that category. I play my old Mac irons and old rusty Cleveland wedges. I do not keep a stipulated handicap either do not see a need to and do not care. I do not play leagues either. Most of the time I play the Saturday Shootout and knock it around during the week. No one I play with gives two hoots what someone else plays. That is my fun now and I do different stuff. I may play the signature set and then again play my even older blades with persimmon or even my short game set of 7 clubs. Just depends on the mood I am in that day. Right now at this stage of life I am having more fun than ever playing golf and doing what I darn well please.

And really I have no problem with those that keep a LEGIMATE handicap and play stipulated events using "tested and approved" equipment. Hey it is whatever ones goals and expectations are

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 Another move by the USGA not taking in consideration issues involving the rank and file players and bottom line operations of courses in general.

You have hit the proverbial nail on the head as they say. I personally lost all respect for the USGA, when the Ping groove debacle ensued and they didn't stick to their guns and folded like a cheap suit, for fear of losing money. We have all watched through the years how they transform a golf course for the open,into almost unplayable conditions and in some cases, reconstruct or rather decimate a course, just to allow more attendees, which equals more revenue. We don't see the R&A doing that to their courses, now do we. Since it's seemingly a given perspective, that what we mere mortals play with is not the same as what the tour players play with and we certainly don't play on pristine conditions as they play on, it really stands to reason, that the tour should have their own and separate set of rules and the USGA should place focus on the rest of us and make rules for the true betterment of the game. Lets look at a couple of examples of what I mean. Remember the 2 ton boulder that Tiger was allowed to move, with the help of a moving crew. Yeah, it fell within the guidelines of a loose impediment, but really? How about just lately, when DJ was allowed to enlist about 20 spectators to help find his ball in the rough, us hackers would be on our own, if we encountered such conditions and we would be forced to take penalties as the outcome. I'm sure others could come up with more examples, but you get the point.      

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On the Eye2 groove thing at the time Karsten threatened to bankrupt the USGA with multiple law suits etc. Karsten at the time had more money than the USGA. When Karsten passed they went to his son who decided "for the betterment of the game" to get the court injunction quashed. I always wondered how much the USGA paid him under the table of if it involved future equipment "considerations". 

On the 2010 groove rule thing anyone could see that the USGA was in bed with the equipment companies. They basically forced serious players to buy new wedges. 

FTR I dropped my 20 plus years of USGA membership around 2013 or so. Got tired of their autocratic way of doing things with absolutely no regard for the courses and the general golfing public.

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On 3/18/2022 at 5:23 PM, Jmikecpa said:

3 of his 4 wins were with a belly putter and his 4th was with an armlock putter. I have had the pleasure of a round with Keegan and one of the best ball strikers I have seen in person and also a great dude. His game tee to green didn’t really leave him after the ban, but the belly putter did.
 

If you could find stats on how many belly putters were in use vs long putters that would give the answer. Belly putters were fine until they started to become the norm and not a crutch for guys that couldn’t putt up to Tour standards. The ban was gaining momentum and then 3 of 5 majors were won by a player using a belly putter and that sealed the deal in my opinion. 
 

 

When this ban was announced the pro at the club where I was working looking up the PGA Tour stats on putting.  Of the top 30 putters on the tour at that time only one or two were using an anchored stroke.  Nobody was gaining any advantage.  As was said often at the time, if it was that good a technique, everybody on tour would be trying it.  The story of the croquet putting ban coming about is supposedly that Bobby Jones and Joe Dey, head of the USGA at the time, happened upon Sam Snead squatting over his putter on the practice green at Augusta.  Jones is said to have told Dey he didn't like the way that putting style looked and shortly thereafter the ban took effect.  It didn't keep Snead from putting that way he just went to side saddle.

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On 3/20/2022 at 8:06 PM, BIG STU said:

On the 2010 groove rule thing anyone could see that the USGA was in bed with the equipment companies. They basically forced serious players to buy new wedges. 

@BIG STU this isn't entirely fair.  Yes, elite players had to buy new wedges, with about 16 months notice.   But for the rest of us, we can STILL play with those old wedges, and will be able to do so for about another 20 months.  I'd bet that damn near every player (I know, not all) who's currently playing a 13 year old wedge isn't really concerned about whether it will conform to the rules in 2024.

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11 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

@BIG STU this isn't entirely fair.  Yes, elite players had to buy new wedges, with about 16 months notice.   But for the rest of us, we can STILL play with those old wedges, and will be able to do so for about another 20 months.  I'd bet that damn near every player (I know, not all) who's currently playing a 13 year old wedge isn't really concerned about whether it will conform to the rules in 2024.

You got to remember I was not playing AM events I was playing the minis at the time. Most of them put in the groove rules when the PGA Tour did. But then again I noticed several of the AM Associations adopted the groove rules when the PGA did too or at least around here. And I will agree 99% of the players I know including me will still be playing 13 year or older wedges. Bottom line those same 99% including myself could care less what the USGA PGA or R&A have to say. It was kinda a mixed blessing for me. I ended up finding a lot of non conforming 588 and 900 wedges cheap. In fact yesterday I found a pristine rusty 900 in the bag in the shop. Ended up doing mat and yard practice and liked the weight and feel. Funny thing it was a raw wedge and had rusted quite a bit but the grooves were in darn near new shape. It is in the bag for today along with my trusty old 15 year old + 588. The other blessing was I finally got fed up with associations including the USGA and the BS rules and retired from comps. Now days I do not have to practice if I do not want to and have a blast playing what clubs I darn well please. 

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