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Liv Golf Central Thread: Events and News


Thin2win
Message added by GolfSpy_APH,

We haven't had to say this in a while, but as a reminder to all that we are keeping this thread to the golf/signings and related content.

We are not going to get into the politics of it all and where the money is coming from etc.

If you wish to comment on that aspect of it all please feel free to do so on other platforms. Not here.

While much of LIV has become more accepted over the years there are still those who feel strongly against it and the backing. We respect all those who are both for and against LIV, however will not tolerate going into the weeds of all the "other stuff"

If you are not sure whether you should post something either ask a mod or don't post it. 

As we have before we will continue to moderate, remove or edit posts that go against our moral code and members will receive alerts or warnings to follow.

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10 hours ago, IndyArcher said:

So why do pros play golf? Should all of them who have enough to retire with an average lifestyle drop out or give up all their earnings? Seems exceedingly arrogant to presume the motivations and needs of someone else you’ve likely not met. And it’s funny how you don’t paint all those pros who have MORE than DJ as greedy, but he must be because he changed jobs. 
 

Personally, I’m not here to judge ANY of them. Let them decide for themselves what is most sensible. 

That last line summs it up for me--- I could care less where any of them play or if they play or not--- I will not go to any trouble to watch either--- I am like Rev in the sense if it is on during the time I am playing golf myself so be it--- Or if I choose to work in the shop--- That goes for any of the tours---- If I am in the house kicked back and it is on then I will watch. But I do not make any special effort to watch with one exception Masters Week--- The other majors or any other events I can take or leave

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

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15 hours ago, 550025KV said:

I'll go on record as a 20% interested observer. I'm more interested in seeing how this plays out with the various Tours. Part of that has to do with my disdain for Greg Norman. He's a pompous ass. His countryman Wayne Grady said it best. Google it and you'll see. The quality of field is a joke. They all hide behind the veil of "growing the game". That's total BS. If it wasn't for the $$$, not a soul would have showed up. 

Gotta agree with you 110% about Greg Norman and for me it goes all the way back to his playing days--- The only player in my entire time around golf I disliked and pulled against. Wayne Grady told it exactly like it is. 

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

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It’ll be on YouTube, so I might catch it to see how it’s covered. But if you’re really looking forward to watching something alternative to pga or DP golf, I’d suggest disc golf.

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HYBRID Pinglogo.png.11947cc88c8641d62e0a99c26da08b18.png G410 21°  |  UTILITY Untitled-9(1).png.4964fe6cb2103eef562fd832a625b0d5.png 699 V2 U 5/23°
IRONS Untitled-9(1).png.4964fe6cb2103eef562fd832a625b0d5.png 699 V2 6-PW
WEDGES Clevelandgolflogo.png.9b2e702587cd5230010a835ced0f97a0.png CBX 2 50°, 54°, 58° PUTTER Untitled-8.png.42ad9734db415b5a132df0574137f4f0.png KS1

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Probably not, but then again I do not really watch PGA either.

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Too many Alpha males in one place at one time lol, I actually believe that the World pays way to much to golfers. A bigger percentage of this money should go to charity to help those without the means to help themselves, just saying...

I’m a hacker who loves nothing more than to change how I play, be that grips shafts and heads its all fair game lol…

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3 hours ago, BIG STU said:

with one exception Masters Week-

Well... that is a given Stu!  🙂

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The Telegraph are reporting the Bryson Dechambeau & Patrick Reed are joining LIV 😮

Telegraph

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As to keep things in one place all LIV golf threads/topics will be merged into this one. Same rules all apply. No politics, keep it to golf. As this topic is sensitive and we are going to keep discussion to golf any posts which go outside of this will be hidden or deleted. Please report any that do not follow these simple guidelines. 

Discussion about the backing and other more political issues can be discussed on another site or forum as we look to keep the discussion on golf for this topic. 

Thank you

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Sorry to see Rickie join, he was such a stand up guy (I've witnessed in person). But with where his game has been for the last 2-3 years he's been a ghost on the PGA tour. I'm not going to miss anyone that's joined so far. I will agree with the comments that a big problem is that this league is backed by the Saudis. If Warren Buffett started this league, it would likely be viewed very differently. But I'm not the one who has to sleep at night. 

I also liked the mention of the PGAs tournaments are not really worth watching during the summer. I watch a lot of the PGA starting around the Farmer's at Torrey through the Masters. Then over the summer, I really only commit to watching The Open. I'll try to watch the PGA, U.S. Open, and Memorial.

All the more reason to give more attention to the Ladies in the LPGA! 

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Maybe it's me, but I just see this as the updated golf version of the WHA (except of course the WHA wasn't trying to sportswash). A few decent pros and a bunch of washed up players & nobodies signed huge contracts that NHL teams weren't going to match, within a few years the majority of the decent players were back in the NHL because they realized they weren't playing against the best (and also the grand promises about huge pay and luxury all fell apart) and the WHA was gone a few years later. 

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With both Rickie & Bryson playing in the LIV, Cobra will be looking for new players to sponsor.

Driver: image.png.6ba1c8a254ad57aa05e527b74c2e04ba.png0311 XF 10.5* w/Project X Cypher 40 gram Senior shaft or 0811 XF 12* w/Evenflo Riptide CB Senior shaft

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8 minutes ago, fozcycle said:

With both Rickie & Bryson playing in the LIV, Cobra will be looking for new players to sponsor.

Sign me up! As a cobra player that is.

⛳🛄 as of Nov 6, 2023 (Past WITB
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Irons:   :titleist-small: T Series - T200 5 Iron
                                          T150 6-9 Iron
                                          T100 PW/GW

Wedge:  Toura Golf - A Spec 53,37,61 degree 

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12 hours ago, GaDawg said:

Competition is good for all businesses. Keeps everyone on their toes....

Others have said it but I don't see this as competition. Sure, DJ and maybe Phil's contracts are an accurate reflection on value but the other guys? No way. They are crazy overvalued. Unrealistic for the PGA tour to compete unless you bring in owners to draft teams like the other American sports leagues.

I've come around that LIV won't fail and unfortunately will end the PGA Tour. They simply can't compete. I think it is going to have horrible downstream impacts on KFT and mini tours and the beloved Monday Qs. 

We need a better golf product, but teams with logos made on Canva is not what we are looking for. Also, the majors won't be the same either. Quality of play will be drastically worse. Maybe not in the next 2-3 years but if LIV becomes the dominant tour, these guys won't have the same type of reps and prep for 72 hole stroke play. 

PGA tour needs to embrace PGL or even LIV. Sign agreements that top 20 players can play, and the other 20 players can be drafted for the 8 events. Reduce the schedule. Elevate some KFT events. Just something because pro golf is going to be miserable for the next few years if not.

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1 hour ago, DiscipleofPenick said:

All the more reason to give more attention to the Ladies in the LPGA! 

A BIG +1 on that one DoP!

 

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20 minutes ago, TBS said:

Others have said it but I don't see this as competition. Sure, DJ and maybe Phil's contracts are an accurate reflection on value but the other guys? No way. They are crazy overvalued. Unrealistic for the PGA tour to compete unless you bring in owners to draft teams like the other American sports leagues.

I've come around that LIV won't fail and unfortunately will end the PGA Tour. They simply can't compete. I think it is going to have horrible downstream impacts on KFT and mini tours and the beloved Monday Qs. 

We need a better golf product, but teams with logos made on Canva is not what we are looking for. Also, the majors won't be the same either. Quality of play will be drastically worse. Maybe not in the next 2-3 years but if LIV becomes the dominant tour, these guys won't have the same type of reps and prep for 72 hole stroke play. 

PGA tour needs to embrace PGL or even LIV. Sign agreements that top 20 players can play, and the other 20 players can be drafted for the 8 events. Reduce the schedule. Elevate some KFT events. Just something because pro golf is going to be miserable for the next few years if not.

Excellent point. This is not market competition, and if LIV wrecks the PGA Tour in this way that would be a very bad outcome for golf fans.

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22 minutes ago, TBS said:

PGA tour needs to embrace PGL or even LIV. Sign agreements that top 20 players can play, and the other 20 players can be drafted for the 8 events. Reduce the schedule. Elevate some KFT events. Just something because pro golf is going to be miserable for the next few years if not.

Another great observation. The big issue is the top 20 or so players needing to get massively paid more. Set up an off-season schedule just for those top players with massive payouts to counter LIV.

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1 hour ago, DiscipleofPenick said:

All the more reason to give more attention to the Ladies in the LPGA! 

I agree BUT... I have to think that LIV is going to make the LPGA product and coverage even worse. 

All LIV would need to do to dismantle LPGA is offer Lexi, Nelly, Lydia, and Minjee a similar outrageous contract. Pull them out of the LPGA to do co-ed team competitions. The Saudi "grow the game" idea fits right in with doing that next year. Also the partnership with Asian tour, pull in more young lady Korean players will hurt LPGA as well.

Pull those players out and LPGA will get ZERO coverage (strength of field clauses in TV coverage). Then all we have left is NCAA coverage... OH WAIT - LIV can start pulling those players for 500k to $1 mil for a 2-3 year contract or an NIL deal then they are gone. 

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Bryson DeChambeau, Patrick Reed will jump to LIV Golf tour

https://sports.yahoo.com/report-bryson-de-chambeau-patrick-reed-jump-to-liv-golf-tour-130120438.html

Look like things are changing daily!

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49 minutes ago, TBS said:

I agree BUT... I have to think that LIV is going to make the LPGA product and coverage even worse. 

All LIV would need to do to dismantle LPGA is offer Lexi, Nelly, Lydia, and Minjee a similar outrageous contract. Pull them out of the LPGA to do co-ed team competitions. The Saudi "grow the game" idea fits right in with doing that next year. Also the partnership with Asian tour, pull in more young lady Korean players will hurt LPGA as well.

Pull those players out and LPGA will get ZERO coverage (strength of field clauses in TV coverage). Then all we have left is NCAA coverage... OH WAIT - LIV can start pulling those players for 500k to $1 mil for a 2-3 year contract or an NIL deal then they are gone. 

Not in a million years would this ever happen. Ever. 

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:mizuno-small: ST-Z 15* Kai/li Blue R Flex
:mizuno-small: ST-Z 4h Linq Blue R Flex
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3 minutes ago, russtopherb said:

Not in a million years would this ever happen. Ever. 

What wouldn’t happen? The saudis offering to include women in the events or something along those lines? Or the lpga members jumping ship?

Danielle Kang posted not that long ago about how making the cut didn’t even let her break even for the event. When one of the best players on the lpga isn’t breaking even for making the cut the offer of multiple millions to play just a few tournaments and not having to worry about making the cut becomes very enticing 

There’s been at least one LET event in Saudi Arabia so female golf isn’t out of the equation for them. They’ve also allowed females to be part of wrestling matches there (albeit not in their normal attire) which is unheard of for that part of the world

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38 minutes ago, russtopherb said:

Not in a million years would this ever happen. Ever. 

 

49 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

At the risk of bordering on the political... if you think Women's Rights and Equality is a struggle in the U.S.  .....

I don't see the ownership of the LIV Golf movement going co-ed anytime soon.  

It's already happening with Ladies Euro Tour -> https://golfweek.usatoday.com/2021/11/06/saudi-international-ladies-european-tour-criticism-need-versus-greed/  Multiple events held in the Saudi Arabia with elevated purses from Golf Saudi.

LPGA is next. 

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That would require the Saudi group to pay women and promote womens sports.  If that sort of paradigm shift occurred maybe this would be a good thing.

The pga as it is setup, has been making the top players disgruntled for a good while. With it being a 501c non profit,  I'm under the impression that that is why it can't put out different pay scales and rules for the top 10 or so players,  the entire membership has to be treated the same. It is also why the pga gives so much money to charity. It is setup very different then the other American sports.

I like my job and my company,  but if I was offered 5x the money to go from thirty five  4 day work works to eight 3 day weeks... yeah.  I'm in.

Saying this isn't good for golf might be short sided. It isn't good for strength of field and the PGA. but it is better for professional golfers.  I thought the PGL plan was a really cool idea to make the non major weeks worth watching.  Maybe this inspires the PGA to change,  adapt and come out with a more compelling product. Because the FedEx cup format sucks(imho). And watching 48 stroke play events is boring. The Zurich is fun,  but the teams are a one week thing and it comes off as a gimmick. 

I'll put a 3 golf tee wager that by the last LIV golf event of this year,  it has a stronger strength of field then the pga event the same week.

 

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FW Wood:     th.jpg.d6e2abdaeb04f007fd259c979f389de6.jpg Gen5 0311 7w  Fujikura Motore X F3

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1 hour ago, TBS said:

Others have said it but I don't see this as competition. Sure, DJ and maybe Phil's contracts are an accurate reflection on value but the other guys? No way. They are crazy overvalued. Unrealistic for the PGA tour to compete unless you bring in owners to draft teams like the other American sports leagues.

I've come around that LIV won't fail and unfortunately will end the PGA Tour. They simply can't compete. I think it is going to have horrible downstream impacts on KFT and mini tours and the beloved Monday Qs. 

We need a better golf product, but teams with logos made on Canva is not what we are looking for. Also, the majors won't be the same either. Quality of play will be drastically worse. Maybe not in the next 2-3 years but if LIV becomes the dominant tour, these guys won't have the same type of reps and prep for 72 hole stroke play. 

PGA tour needs to embrace PGL or even LIV. Sign agreements that top 20 players can play, and the other 20 players can be drafted for the 8 events. Reduce the schedule. Elevate some KFT events. Just something because pro golf is going to be miserable for the next few years if not.

I’ve heard that the contracts outside of a few of the big guys have language for future earnings as part of what they are paid for going to LIV. So until they reach those earnings they have to keep playing for LIV on the original deal

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The PGA gives around 20% to charity. Not a ton for a charity whose paying their commissioner 5 million +. 2018 they only paid 16% to charity. I’d like to think they could do better…

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10 minutes ago, Thin2win said:

That would require the Saudi group to pay women and promote womens sports.  If that sort of paradigm shift occurred maybe this would be a good thing.

Which is happening. Check out Vision 2030 - https://www.vision2030.gov.sa/

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Let's get back to the event. A road down what they are or are not doing for women in sports can be determined in another thread and is a touchy subject at best. 

I know there is a Lot going on with this and the topic of LIV has so many off shoots, but I'll put it this way as we are already on edge with it any posts that take any sort of political angle should be reported and will then be hidden. Continued posts of this nature will mean locking this thread or enabling post approval.

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35 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Danielle Kang posted not that long ago about how making the cut didn’t even let her break even for the event. When one of the best players on the lpga isn’t breaking even for making the cut

Danielle Kang has over $7.5 million in career earnings. She has over $500k in earnings thus far this year. Her weekly tournament earnings have ranged this year from $6k to $225k. Ok, so in her worst finish in a non-major this year she didn't break even for the week in a year where if she played a regular schedule she would make over $750k in tournament winnings. Add in her sponsorship money and she isn't struggling.

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22 minutes ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Let's get back to the event. A road down what they are or are not doing for women in sports can be determined in another thread and is a touchy subject at best. 

I know there is a Lot going on with this and the topic of LIV has so many off shoots, but I'll put it this way as we are already on edge with it any posts that take any sort of political angle should be reported and will then be hidden. Continued posts of this nature will mean locking this thread or enabling post approval.

Yes - back to the event!

Mod request - can we get updated badges of each of the LIV teams logos for MGS members to show their support on the profile??

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5 minutes ago, LICC said:

Danielle Kang has over $7.5 million in career earnings. She has over $500k in earnings thus far this year. Her weekly tournament earnings have ranged this year from $6k to $225k. Ok, so in her worst finish in a non-major this year she didn't break even for the week in a year where if she played a regular schedule she would make over $750k in tournament winnings. Add in her sponsorship money and she isn't struggling.

She wasn’t talking about struggling. She was making the point about how for an lpga member that barely making the cut still results in a loss of money. 
 

quote from the interview. So once again your take is incorrect on what was stated.

Let’s kind of look at it from a broader perspective. I’m one player. How about the average tour players? I made $6,000 last week, made the cut; I didn’t break even last week. That’s me budgeting. I have to drive, rent a car, get a hotel room. Luckily enough for me I’m sponsored by BMW that provides for me the car. That saves like $500, $1000 etc.”

 

The winner of January’s Tournament of Champions was enthusiastic about the future:

“We have to think about all these things. So for us, when companies step up and give us an opportunity to make a living, make the tour better and broader and for players to compete and to be an actual job, it’s nice to see that.”

and if you want to read more 

https://www.golfwrx.com/674158/made-the-cut-last-week-and-didnt-break-even-danielle-kang-on-financial-realities-of-life-on-lpga-tour/

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