Mizuno JPX 923

[tony@CIC]

4 hours ago, MattF said:

Put my order in...

3 and 4 Fli Hi Hzrdus Smoke RDX Black 80 6.0
5-PW JPX223 Hot Metal Pro 5-PW Recoil 95 F4
T-22 Denim Copper 48°, 52° and 56° S grind Recoil 95 F4

Hmmmmm  didn't you just get new irons 

[Hook DeLoft]

They look nice.  The HL is an interesting addition to the series.

[russtopherb]

Gimmie all that HL goodness please, and thank you very much.

[ryan.mzzz]

11 hours ago, Vegan_Golfer_PNW said:

US embargo makes it technically illegal

please explain how if possible. 

[GolfSpy_APH]

12 minutes ago, ryan.mzzz said:

please explain how if possible. 

On the forum we stay to the US embargo dates as will the main site. Companies such as Mizuno and others have been great to the forum in the past with testing opportunities and we would rather not bypass their embargo dates just because somewhere else they are available. Of course feel free to check out the japanese site and share thoughts as well as what you may want to buy or test, but in terms of photos and such again we will wait till the US embargo date passes and then it is open season!

[ryan.mzzz]

2 minutes ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

On the forum we stay to the US embargo dates as will the main site. Companies such as Mizuno and others have been great to the forum in the past with testing opportunities and we would rather not bypass their embargo dates just because somewhere else they are available. Of course feel free to check out the japanese site and share thoughts as well as what you may want to buy or test, but in terms of photos and such again we will wait till the US embargo date passes and then it is open season!

i get that. i was asking specifically about the word ‘illegal,’ as in, breaking the law. seems a little hyperbolic to me, unless i’m missing something. 

 

[MattF]

13 hours ago, tony@CIC said:

Hmmmmm  didn't you just get new irons 

I got the Wilsons 2 years ago and my current ones I built in 2014, so no.

[Nolan220]

I loved my JPX 900 HM .. these look amazing .. you can see them on mizuno Japan Twitter 

[Golfspy_CG2]

19 hours ago, Middler said:

Why didn't someone post a pic?

[Didn't think restrictions applied to third parties since we can easily find, translate and read the JP site, but I've removed them, since I certainly don't want to create issues for MGS. I thought only official golf media was restricted.]

 

Yes, this is a forum, but it's part of the My Golf Spy site.  Do you not consider MyGolfSpy official golf media 

[Golfspy_CG2]

19 hours ago, Jay2000 said:

Thanks for the info to the Japanese site!  I've been trying to find info on the 923 hmp's.  They don't show a 4 iron? Does anyone know if they are going to produce one? I don't hit hybrids or fairway woods, the 4 iron is my 210-220 yd club.  It would be a bummer if they don't make one. I guess I would have to buy 921 hmp 4 iron. 

Thanks

There is a 4 iron avaiable in the Hot Metal and HM Pro

And just for good measure, for those wondering about wedges.  There is a JPX 23 Series Wedge in 49, 54 and 59 available.   I assuming it blends with either the HM or HMP   The Forged PW is 42.5 so some might find that a bit big of a gap, but honestly for most amatuers, the difference between 5 and 6.5 degees is not going to be huge, especially swince wedges are not full swing clubs typically.

 

[Middler]

19 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yes, this is a forum, but it's part of the My Gof Spy site.  Do you not consider MyGolfSpy official golf media 

Of course I do. I meant MGS (official golf media) versus what any of us post.

I was just looking at the 923’s, and from the back every model, Tour, Forged, HMHL, HMP and HM look an awful lot alike? Obviously the sizes, metals, cross sections and forged v cast are different but it seems odd the HM looks so much like an oversized Tour…guess they’re big on ‘family resemblance.’

[cnosil]

5 minutes ago, Middler said:

I was just looking at the 923’s, and from the back every model, Tour, Forged, HMHL, HMP and HM look an awful lot alike? Obviously the sizes, metals and forged v cast are different but it seems odd the HM looks so much like an oversized Tour…

As I go through the various most wanted testing each year; one of the things I notice is that all clubs look basically the same.  A little bigger here or there with some cosmetic differences but basically the same club.  There are also differences internally that we can’t see like how they are weighted.  

[Golfspy_CG2]

5 minutes ago, Middler said:

Of course I do. I meant MGS (official golf media) versus what any of us post.

I was just looking at the 923’s, and from the back every model, Tour, Forged, HMHL, HMP and HM look an awful lot alike? Obviously the sizes, metals, cross sections and forged v cast are different but it seems odd the HM looks so much like an oversized Tour…guess they’re big on ‘family resemblance.’

I get it.  But everything on this site is related back to MGS's HQ,, even though the forum is operated and run by members like you and me, we still don't publish anything on the forum that the main site wouldn't---in regards to embargo dates.

I agree on the badge looks of each model.  There is a slight difference I can tell in the Forged, but very very minimal, and most would't notice it at first glance.   The cutaways show a difference in the depth of the internal cavity, which is where I would assume the majority of the perforamce variances will be.

Haven't really seen any great comparisons of top line or sole, which is where you might expect the differences to be more notciable.

 

[RollingGreens]

Going to be very interested in demoing the HM pro in a few months vs the pro 225. Really wish the sole was a bit smaller in the HM pro. Really happy with the 921, although cosmetically they do look and feel a bit chunky to me now. 

[GolfSpy SAM]

2 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

I get it.  But everything on this site is related back to MGS's HQ,, even though the forum is operated and run by members like you and me, we still don't publish anything on the forum that the main site wouldn't---in regards to embargo dates.

I agree on the badge looks of each model.  There is a slight difference I can tell in the Forged, but very very minimal, and most wouldn't notice it at first glance.   The cutaways show a difference in the depth of the internal cavity, which is where I would assume the majority of the performance variances will be.

Haven't really seen any great comparisons of top line or sole, which is where you might expect the differences to be more noticeable.

 

There was one chart I was looking at yesterday listing the differences between the HMs, and the length differences was pretty stark between the regular Hot Metal and the Hot Metal Pro - I was actually surprised there was as big a difference in length (of head) between the two - almost 5 mm, with about .5mm top-line difference.  The Hot Metal and the Hot Metal HL (high launch? - this is new for this year, right? slightly larger head than HM, with 2.5 degrees more loft - kind of love that they're doing this) are pretty close in size, with the HL being the larger of the two (minimally).

I'd love to see the top-line differences, though, especially at address, as .5mm seems pretty subtle, but the 5mm length difference would be quite noticeable. I wish I had the game/wallet to justify the "Forged", as to me those are just perfection.

 

[Golfspy_CG2]

55 minutes ago, Samsonite said:

There was one chart I was looking at yesterday listing the differences between the HMs, and the length differences was pretty stark between the regular Hot Metal and the Hot Metal Pro - I was actually surprised there was as big a difference in length (of head) between the two - almost 5 mm, with about .5mm top-line difference.  The Hot Metal and the Hot Metal HL (high launch? - this is new for this year, right? slightly larger head than HM, with 2.5 degrees more loft - kind of love that they're doing this) are pretty close in size, with the HL being the larger of the two (minimally).

I'd love to see the top-line differences, though, especially at address, as .5mm seems pretty subtle, but the 5mm length difference would be quite noticeable. I wish I had the game/wallet to justify the "Forged", as to me those are just perfection.

 

Yes I saw the specs yesterday on probably that same chart.  I didn't get into the exact differences in size on the length and width etc.  As i'm more of a wait and see visual type vs numbers on a chart.  My guess is it will look appropriately different for the target market of each iron, the HM being more of a GI iron and the HMP being more of a tweener, a players distance with a bit of forgivness built in.   

Yes, the Hot Metal HL is new to the line.  While I haven't seen it in hand yet, I assume it has the wider/larger sole and weight placed lower in the head.  Thus the reason for adding loft, wich is th eopposite of what most people would think of a SGI iron.   But as other OEM have done, most notably Cobra and Callaway have done with some of their SGI lines.   Where the GI lofts are actually a bit lower than the SGI lofts.  AS the SGI it's all about trying to get the ball in the air easier for those that need the help. 

[depan]

5 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

There is a 4 iron avaiable in the Hot Metal and HM Pro

And just for good measure, for those wondering about wedges.  There is a JPX 23 Series Wedge in 49, 54 and 59 available.   I assuming it blends with either the HM or HMP   The Forged PW is 42.5 so some might find that a bit big of a gap, but honestly for most amatuers, the difference between 5 and 6.5 degees is not going to be huge, especially swince wedges are not full swing clubs typically.

 

Good to hear the 4i will be available. Set GW looks like it would be 48* in the HM & HMP which makes sense but I feel it would be a little bit hard to find 48* wedges if you wanted to go with another brand there. Cleveland and Callaway appear to stop at 50*, T22 has 46 & 50 but no 48. Seems to limit your options when you are looking to blend your irons into your wedges. Of course you could do some bending though.

[GolfSpy TCB]

17 hours ago, depan said:

Set GW looks like it would be 48* in the HM & HMP which makes sense but I feel it would be a little bit hard to find 48* wedges if you wanted to go with another brand there. Cleveland and Callaway appear to stop at 50*, T22 has 46 & 50 but no 48. Seems to limit your options when you are looking to blend your irons into your wedges. Of course you could do some bending though.

I bounce (no pun intended) back and forth on the set wedge v. specialty wedges... I am currently leaning heavily on the specialty wedge offerings (as you can see from my bag below), and am considering adding the 46* to remove my set PW.  For me... it is a shot-makers choice.  If I'm trying to hit varying shots by flighting or controlling the spin... it is specialty wedge all day... but if I'm looking at the wedge for one distance with the same shot shape every swing... I will opt for the set wedge.  At least that is my approach with the gap wedge currently.  Vokey has the 46* in their lineup as well FWIW.

 

 

Edited August 24, 2022 by Tiftaaft

[GolfSpy TCB]

23 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Haven't really seen any great comparisons of top line or sole, which is where you might expect the differences to be more notciable.

I would expect to see some differences in the offset for each model as well... difficult to see from the "other" site until we have the official release from MizunoUSA.  I would assume the "tour" along with the more traditional lofts than the HMP and HM, will be slightly more offset than the 223, and much less offset than the HMP  and so on... but just conjecture at this point.  

Edited August 24, 2022 by Tiftaaft

[Golfspy_CG2]

1 hour ago, Tiftaaft said:

I would expect to see some differences in the offset for each model as well... difficult to see from the "other" site until we have the official release from MizunoUSA.  I would assume the "tour" along with the more traditional lofts than the HMP and HM, will be slightly more offset than the 223, and much less offset than the HMP  and so on... but just conjecture at this point.  

Yeah, I think all those assumptions are pretty spot on.  I'm going back and forth with our rep to set up a time to meet.  Was supposed to be last week but he had to cancel.   Also waiting on the heads for our fitting cart but no estimated arrival on those yet.

Mizuno did a chart last year and I assume they will with the new ones, showing each head on a graph from say least forgiving on the far left to most forgiving on the far right with both the Pro and JPX lines accounted for.   I think it pretty much falls in line with what you mentoned above on offset specs and such.

[GolfSpy SAM]

1 hour ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yeah, I think all those assumptions are pretty spot on.  I'm going back and forth with our rep to set up a time to meet.  Was supposed to be last week but he had to cancel.   Also waiting on the heads for our fitting cart but no estimated arrival on those yet.

Mizuno did a chart last year and I assume they will with the new ones, showing each head on a graph from say least forgiving on the far left to most forgiving on the far right with both the Pro and JPX lines accounted for.   I think it pretty much falls in line with what you mentoned above on offset specs and such.

This is fascinating to me - I didn't realize that the two lines had differing offsets.  So the 223 would be for someone who likes as little offset as possible, while the JPX Tour/Pro would have slightly more?  Is that catering to two different caliber players, or is it just preferential?  As my swing has gotten more mechanically sound and my contact gets better, I'm noticing more and more the offset in my clubs (not BAD for me, per se, but definitely noticeable), and I'm curious if the "JPX" line, in general, caters more to a specific player than the MP line does.

In my fitting, I hit the 919 Hot Metal, and it was hands-down the best-feeling club I hit in that fitting, but it was just slightly out of my budget at the time, so ended up with the Sim Max heads, which have done great for me over the last two years.  

It's pretty nerdy that I'm fascinated by this nuance, isn't it? You can say yes - I can take it. 

[Golfspy_CG2]

Here's the chart I was talking about, it's from 2020 I believe after the JPX21 line was released.  I think it will hold true to the current Mizumo Pro and JPX23 lineup as well.  With the addtion of the Hot Metal HL probably being slotted at the very top right after the Hot Metal.

For those who haven't followed the Mizuno naming convention going from MP to Mizuno Pro they would be

MP20 MB = Mizuno Pro 22

MP20 MMC = Mizuno Pro 223

MP20 HMB = Mizuno Pro 225

 

 

[GolfSpy TCB]

1 hour ago, Samsonite said:

It's pretty nerdy that I'm fascinated by this nuance, isn't it? You can say yes - I can take it. 

I think you have aptly described most of us here

Just to add a bit to @Golfspy_CG2 post above, there are a several factors that can provide the golfer forgiveness... including where the weight is positioned around the club head (lower weight distribution to help the ball get up - especially for slower swing speeds, and/or with less of a negative AoA).  Another of the methods to help add forgiveness is the offset.  You could argue that more offset is for higher handicap players, and lower offset for better players - and is true to a certain extent... but that isn't absolute.  Personal preference also plays a role.  But in general, more offset helps the golfer square the club face from open, so golfers with fade/slice or push tendency would find more offset helpful in straightening out the shot shape.  It also improves the launch by moving the club center of gravity back further... helping the ball get up in the air.  

I love the look of less offset personally, and I can better judge my club face "squareness" with less offset (or shape shots both directions easier)... which is why I love a blade.. (and don't get me started on the top line discussion ;)), and also why I chose my current gamers (they offered lower offset with a bit more GI aspects than a traditional blade or players club style).  Having said that,  I have also really enjoyed testing out some other higher offset irons recently - and more offset irons may find their way into my bag at some point (which is why I'm on this thread :)). 

Anyway, as a reference point, here is a run down of the current Mizuno Irons with the offset shown on the right most chart.  

Now, let your nerdiness blossom

Edited August 24, 2022 by Tiftaaft

[GolfSpy TCB]

3 hours ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yeah, I think all those assumptions are pretty spot on.

One correction to my own statement I realized after pulling the screen capture above... The offset for the "tour" looks to sit right between the blade and everything else... which now makes sense when I think about it.  That "tour" model JPX my be the best players club in the bunch.  Man, I can't wait to see the 923 in my hand!  CHA here I come.

Edited August 24, 2022 by Tiftaaft

[GolfSpy SAM]

Okay, so the good news is, according to Mizuno's charts above, I should be playing either the 223, 225 or JPX Forged. 

The bad news is that, according to Mizuno's charts above, I should be playing either the 223, 225 or JPX Forged. 

I'll be right back - gotta go list a kidney on ebay.

[Golfspy_CG2]

8 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

One correction to my own statement I realized after pulling the screen capture above... The offset for the "tour" looks to sit right between the blade and everything else... which now makes sense when I think about it.  That "tour" model JPX my be the best players club in the bunch.  Man, I can't wait to see the 923 in my hand!  CHA here I come.

Yeah, I wasn't going to nit pick, especially wihtout having all the data right in front of me, I figured that was the case. But that's great info onthe chart.  I think I have that one is in our MizunoFitters site somewhere as well. 

And good comment about usually for higher caps but not 100% absolute, I wish I could remember who it was but there is a tour player--current--who has made no secret about it, that he actually prefers a bit of offset in his irons.  For some reason I want to say it is Kevin Kisner, but I am probably completely wrong on that. 

[ejgaudette]

1 minute ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yeah, I wasn't going to nit pick, especially wihtout having all the data right in front of me, I figured that was the case. But that's great info onthe chart.  I think I have that one is in our MizunoFitters site somewhere as well. 

And good comment about usually for higher caps but not 100% absolute, I wish I could remember who it was but there is a tour player--current--who has made no secret about it, that he actually prefers a bit of offset in his irons.  For some reason I want to say it is Kevin Kisner, but I am probably completely wrong on that. 

I know Adam Scott's one of one irons both from Titleist and now have more offset. That was common when he was younger to have more offset in blades is what he has said.

[GolfSpy BOS]

21 minutes ago, Tiftaaft said:

I think you have aptly described most of us here

Just to add a bit to @Golfspy_CG2 post above, there are a several factors that can provide the golfer forgiveness... including where the weight is positioned around the club head (lower weight distribution to help the ball get up - especially for slower swing speeds, and/or with less of a negative AoA).  Another of the methods to help add forgiveness is the offset.  You could argue that more offset is for higher handicap players, and lower offset for better players - and is true to a certain extent... but that isn't absolute.  Personal preference also plays a role.  But in general, more offset helps the golfer square the club face from open, so golfers with fade/slice or push tendency would find more offset helpful in straightening out the shot shape.  It also improves the launch by moving the club center of gravity back further... helping the ball get up in the air.  

I love the look of less offset personally, and I can better judge my club face "squareness" with less offset (or shape shots both directions easier)... which is why I love a blade.. (and don't get me started on the top line discussion ;)), and also why I chose my current gamers (they offered lower offset with a bit more GI aspects than a traditional blade or players club style).  Having said that,  I have also really enjoyed testing out some other higher offset irons recently - and more offset irons may find their way into my bag at some point (which is why I'm on this thread :)). 

Anyway, as a reference point, here is a run down of the current Mizuno Irons with the offset shown on the right most chart.  

Now, let your nerdiness blossom

It's the same for me... some offset definitely helps me hit it straighter, but too much and my alignment gets wonky and it does more harm than good.  

 

[Golfspy_CG2]

Just now, GolfSpy_BOS said:

It's the same for me... some offset definitely helps me hit it straighter, but too much and my alignment gets wonky and it does more harm than good.  

 

Yep, exactly for me.  Somethng like the Callaway Rogue, I couldn't stand to look at.  But the Titlesit T300 for a GI or the PXG 0311 XP are not offensive at all...to me at least. 

[GolfSpy TCB]

2 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yeah, I wasn't going to nit pick,

I appreciate you giving me the opportunity to nit pick myself .