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Shaft Hack - The Otto Phlex Journey


azstu324

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I think I have a winner! 

Garaffalloy GWX A flex 52g. Took it to the launch monitors tonight to compare it with the PLB. #'s were super close between the GWX and PLB but the GWX just edged it out. Flight was just a hair lower and spin was right at 2k. As crazy as it sounds, it felt a little smoother. The PLB already feels fantastic so I thought that expecting it to feel any better would be asking too much. I think it's the slightly softer mid that just gives it a smoother feel. Both shafts can handle a full bore swing without issue.  Honestly had I never even known about the GWX, I would have been 100% satisfied with the PLB. The killer looks of the black and silver on dark grey carbon with the lower flight and spin and just the extra touch of slightly smoother profile gave the win to the GWX. 

Can't wait to get this to the course! 

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, TheFonzzz said:

Great, so was it performance or the looks🧐. Finale set up PXG Gen5, 52g cut to 45 D1, 7.5….great, what now?

The answer is YES 😜

Albeit the performance difference was probably negligible, what tipped the scale ever so slightly was the slightly smoother bend and the murdered out look. 

The race was so close though that I'll be keeping both shafts in the bag for a bit. I know the Blue performs on the course so the Black has to mind it's business or it could easily get benched 

I'll say this about the GWX (the Blue wasn't far off), that out of about 60 shots last night I don't think that more than 5 were outside of the 300 yd green area. I even had a few almost go in the hole. That's a tight pattern right thur! Spin was also very consistent staying between 1900 and 2100 RPM's. 

Playing Saturday so if the GWX performs, that should pretty well button things up for me. 

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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Well. Just ordered the PXG 0211 deal.  Senior flex Riptide 5.0.  Couldn't decide between that or the Cyprus.  Oh well for $119 just that same shaft was going to cost that much for me to try it in my Cobra LTDX.  I usually play a Smoke Blue RDX x-flex, but played with a friend of mine that has the LTDX with a Smoke Green regular, and I was killing it.  Hopefully the "otto phlex" concept will work with my new PXG 0211.

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ok I got the gplb 45 a flex some good numbers on the garmin r10, rain today so no play. I'm trying it out with a sim and a sim maxd head. testing vrs the helium stiff shaft it is gonna be close, will report later. Did take 10 ball to get a feel for a slightly different feel at about 100 mph swing speed, gplb was about 90 shipped.

dg

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I was extremely skeptical since I have always played stock in my 65 years of playing.

Today 75 years old. hcp still 4 - 6. very competitive when I was younger. Tried the GPLB in my Srixon zx 5 today. Had to counter weight shaft to get to a D1 sw.

Have not hit ball sooo well in many years. Distance is back to 10 years ago, slight draw after 125 yds. I have drank the kool-aid. Do not even have to swing very fast and ball just flies.

Looking at the PXG offer. Anyone got results to post? Anyone made this change to a fairway metal?

Edited by Allen
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17 minutes ago, Allen said:

I was extremely skeptical since I have always played stock in my 65 years of playing.

Today 75 years old. hcp still 4 - 6. very competitive when I was younger. Tried the GPLB in my Srixon zx 5 today. Had to counter weight shaft to get to a D1 sw.

Have not hit ball sooo well in many years. Distance is back to 10 years ago, slight draw after 125 yds. I have drank the kool-aid. Do not even have to swing very fast and ball just flies.

Looking at the PXG offer. Anyone got results to post? Anyone made this change to a fairway metal?

Love it! Thank you for sharing your success story. I really think the PLB might just be the go-to for an OttoPhlex transition. Still hopeful that some of these other shafts might work out though and am anticipating some other reports to come back.  What's blows mind is that the disbursement for me seems to have tightened right up AND with extra distance. It's almost like the extra flex acts like a shock absorber on not so great hits so they don't go crazy offline. 

So far I'm seeing no reasons to turn back. I'm still debating taking the PLB and plugging it into my Cobra 3 wood. I'm pretty confident that I'll be keeping the Garafalloy GWX in my driver but I need to see how it performs on the course Monday. 

Cheers

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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On 10/1/2022 at 7:43 PM, azstu324 said:

... that said, the neither the Fuji Motore F3 or the PX Riptide Evenflow CB are on it either... 

The reason those shafts aren't on the list in the Wishon bend profile database is it hasn't been updated since around 2014 or so. Supposedly Diamond Tour has a beta of a new software but I haven't seen it yet. 

My bag is a revolving door!

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The Fuji Air Speeder 45 in regular flex came in this week and I installed a Ping adapter for my G425 Max 9° driver and set the club to 7.5°.  The club measures 45.75 inches and it comes in at D6.5 swing weight, which I was surprised at.  My Ventus Velocore Blue 5S playing at 45" inches has a swing weight of D3.5.  The next day after work, I took 10 balls out in the yard for the initial testing.  Before I go any further, I have to say that I hit my Ventus shaft very well (for me).  It is a fairway finder and I have gained yardage over my former gamer shaft.  Hitting downwind with a mild wind, the first ball had a nice high, baby draw trajectory and distance appeared good.  In total, 7 of the 10 balls hit were impressive, with the errant shots coming from over swinging.  On one ball, I turned and hit into the wind to see if the ball ballooned, but it actually appeared to cut through the wind, so spin numbers must be good.  On the last ball, I picked out a tree in the distance to aim at and concentrated on taking a smooth swing.  The ball soared straight at the tree and appeared to just keep going.  Tomorrow will be the first test on my course. 

 

Ping G425 Max 9° w/UST MP5 L-Flex

PXG Gen 5 0311XF 8° w/Grafalloy ProLaunch 45 A-Flex

Ping G425 3 wood 14.5° w/Ventus Velocore Blue-6R tipped 1"

Cleveland Halo Launcher 5 wood 18° with Project X Cypher R

Callaway Rogue 19° hybrid regular

PXG Gen 3 0311XF 5 - G steel regular

Corey Paul wedges bent to 53° and 58°

Scotty Cameron Phantom X 11.5 putter

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3 hours ago, Allen said:

I was extremely skeptical since I have always played stock in my 65 years of playing.

Today 75 years old. hcp still 4 - 6. very competitive when I was younger. Tried the GPLB in my Srixon zx 5 today. Had to counter weight shaft to get to a D1 sw.

Have not hit ball sooo well in many years. Distance is back to 10 years ago, slight draw after 125 yds. I have drank the kool-aid. Do not even have to swing very fast and ball just flies.

Looking at the PXG offer. Anyone got results to post? Anyone made this change to a fairway metal?

I just finished installing a shaft in my PXG Gen 5 XF "3" wood.  I qualify the 3 wood because its standard setting is 16 degrees and I typically play it at 17 degrees.  That said, I've set it for 16 degrees and will go up or down based on performance.  I've been using the Bassara W series (the made for Titleist versions which I suspect are a bit different from the Wyvern shaft on which they're based).  It's a shaft I've always gotten along with and picking up the L flex versions is dirt cheap.  Club will play at D0 and is 43 3/4 inches in length with no counterweight needed.  Shaft is 45 grams nominal weight.    It's going to be upper 30's when I tee of so I'll see how things work out given the weather...

Stay tuned.

Ping G430 Max 10.5*

Ping G430 SFT 3 wood and Ping G430 HL 7 wood SR flex

Ping G430 4,5,6,7 hybrids  SR flex

Cleveland Launcher XL Halo 8,9,P,G, SW irons   A Flex

Cleveland Smart Sole S wedge  A Flex

Cobra Nova putter

 

 

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2 hours ago, David Leighton Reid said:

The Fuji Air Speeder 45 in regular flex came in this week and I installed a Ping adapter for my G425 Max 9° driver and set the club to 7.5°.  The club measures 45.75 inches and it comes in at D6.5 swing weight, which I was surprised at.  My Ventus Velocore Blue 5S playing at 45" inches has a swing weight of D3.5.  The next day after work, I took 10 balls out in the yard for the initial testing.  Before I go any further, I have to say that I hit my Ventus shaft very well (for me).  It is a fairway finder and I have gained yardage over my former gamer shaft.  Hitting downwind with a mild wind, the first ball had a nice high, baby draw trajectory and distance appeared good.  In total, 7 of the 10 balls hit were impressive, with the errant shots coming from over swinging.  On one ball, I turned and hit into the wind to see if the ball ballooned, but it actually appeared to cut through the wind, so spin numbers must be good.  On the last ball, I picked out a tree in the distance to aim at and concentrated on taking a smooth swing.  The ball soared straight at the tree and appeared to just keep going.  Tomorrow will be the first test on my course. 

 

It looks like the Ping heads will definitely be the harder to work with for this project. You'd need to shed roughly 10g in the head in order to get the SW on target. Luckily it looks like you can get a 13g weight pretty easily. I just don't know how that would impact the MOI .. maybe the shaft will help compensate for that? You could also do what some of us have done and just cut it down to 45". In this case, you kind of get both benefits of more control AND distance with the added speed. 

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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Took out the GPLB today to the course. No warm up, windy day. 4 weeks out from knee surgery, first round back, so I was swinging around 60 percent I'd say. Popped a Callaway Epic Speed LS dialed down to 9.5 degrees. I was nervous to try it without hitting it on the range first, I was half expecting the shaft to snap and the head go flying. My SS when healthy is around 116-120 on the course, today I'm  guessing I swung around 107ish. First drive, a high baby draw into the wind, around 275 I'd say. A little high, but the thing just kept going. A few holes later, cranked one around 320 with another high baby draw. Felt effortless. I usually play X stiff shafts, so I don't ever feel much loading. Felt a little weird and cool at the same time. Blocked a couple, that soared a mile to the right, more of a reflection of swaying instead of kicking the left leg straight. Finished up the last hole with a nice easy 310 yarder, and left a very difficult scoring day(short game was absoulutely trash today) with a nice birdie. I get the concept. I'm thinking of going to try long drive again next year, knee will be fully recovered, and at 57 years old, can bring it when I need to. I talked to a few of the long drive guys,, and it seems like a lot of them are going with 40 gram TPT shaft. 

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9 hours ago, BadgerRick said:

Took out the GPLB today to the course. No warm up, windy day. 4 weeks out from knee surgery, first round back, so I was swinging around 60 percent I'd say. Popped a Callaway Epic Speed LS dialed down to 9.5 degrees. I was nervous to try it without hitting it on the range first, I was half expecting the shaft to snap and the head go flying. My SS when healthy is around 116-120 on the course, today I'm  guessing I swung around 107ish. First drive, a high baby draw into the wind, around 275 I'd say. A little high, but the thing just kept going. A few holes later, cranked one around 320 with another high baby draw. Felt effortless. I usually play X stiff shafts, so I don't ever feel much loading. Felt a little weird and cool at the same time. Blocked a couple, that soared a mile to the right, more of a reflection of swaying instead of kicking the left leg straight. Finished up the last hole with a nice easy 310 yarder, and left a very difficult scoring day(short game was absoulutely trash today) with a nice birdie. I get the concept. I'm thinking of going to try long drive again next year, knee will be fully recovered, and at 57 years old, can bring it when I need to. I talked to a few of the long drive guys,, and it seems like a lot of them are going with 40 gram TPT shaft. 

(Insert "Hooked on a feeling" by Blue Swede) 

This is awesome and thanks for sharing! It's definitely an unfamiliar feeling at first, but becomes very comfortable and addictive very quickly. I think the results being as good as they are, paired with a feeling that's really pleasant just makes it what it is. 

 

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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Today's focus, for me, was on using the concept in a 3 wood.  As I described a few posts back, it's a PXG 0311 XF which I had set to 16 degrees.  Played just a smidge under 44 inches in length, 2 inches shorter than my driver.

It was 38 degrees when we teed off.  I was dressed for the weather but still a bit chilled, to the point I had to remind myself not to clench my teeth so tightly to prevent shivering that I'd crack a molar.  Yeah, that kind of morning.

Results were about an 8-10% increase in distance.  Hit a couple of shots with the 3 wood that were 15-17% longer than typical.

Yes, I plan to convert my 5 wood and, for the hell of it, at least one hybrid.  The bad news is that our Wisconsin season is rapidly drawing to a close.  Even if I can get out on a quiet day in the 30's the ball flight in that weather isn't representative of anything other than a golf loon stretching the season as far as he can...

My bottom line, and I stress it's not me implying this is for everyone but 'tis for me, is that this concept applied to both my driver and the 3 wood have resulted in great feel, a noticeable increase in distance, and dispersion that's the same or perhaps a wee bit tighter than previous.

Ping G430 Max 10.5*

Ping G430 SFT 3 wood and Ping G430 HL 7 wood SR flex

Ping G430 4,5,6,7 hybrids  SR flex

Cleveland Launcher XL Halo 8,9,P,G, SW irons   A Flex

Cleveland Smart Sole S wedge  A Flex

Cobra Nova putter

 

 

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20 hours ago, azstu324 said:

It looks like the Ping heads will definitely be the harder to work with for this project. You'd need to shed roughly 10g in the head in order to get the SW on target. Luckily it looks like you can get a 13g weight pretty easily. I just don't know how that would impact the MOI .. maybe the shaft will help compensate for that? You could also do what some of us have done and just cut it down to 45". In this case, you kind of get both benefits of more control AND distance with the added speed. 

It was not a stellar day driving the ball with the new set up.  Distance was comparable to my normal setup, but my dispersion was all over the place.  Maybe the increased swing weight and length led to the inconsistency.  I will continue to experiment by trimming the shaft down to 45".  

Ping G425 Max 9° w/UST MP5 L-Flex

PXG Gen 5 0311XF 8° w/Grafalloy ProLaunch 45 A-Flex

Ping G425 3 wood 14.5° w/Ventus Velocore Blue-6R tipped 1"

Cleveland Halo Launcher 5 wood 18° with Project X Cypher R

Callaway Rogue 19° hybrid regular

PXG Gen 3 0311XF 5 - G steel regular

Corey Paul wedges bent to 53° and 58°

Scotty Cameron Phantom X 11.5 putter

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36 minutes ago, sl1111 said:

I’m in on the Otto experiment. For reference in case someone is searching, I am 50 years old, in good physical shape minus a back injury last year and play to a 5 index. I am a high spin; descending blow driver of the golf ball and any fitting I end up in a low spin/low lofted shaft/head combo.

Current driver is a TaylorMade Stealth+ 9 degree in the second lower setting. HZRDUS Green PDV Small Batch Tour Stiff tipped 1 inch. 106 mph swing speed at D5 swing weight, 45 inches, 60 grams. Ball flight is a slight fade with my miss being high right if I quit on this shaft at all.

 

Had a credit at the local club builder so I picked up a Pro Launch Blue A flex at 45 grams. I’m a hobbyist club builder with a swing weight scale and I blow my mid-size grips on a and off, so adjustments are easy. Epoxied the shaft in the adapter un-tipped and cut to 46.5 inches in the standard 9-degree loft setting to get a baseline. Swing weight was in the F range, so I started trimming at half inch increments to get it down to an acceptable level. I didn’t want to go too short as I wanted to stay with the theme of the experiment. At 45.5 inches I was at D3 and didn’t want to go any shorter, so I removed the10 gram slider weight from the head and landed at D1 with a standard grip. Blew on a mid-size and hit D0 on the button. No big loss as I played the slider in the neutral position. I thought removing the slider might have a negative effect on the feel of the head but was glad to find out it did not change in my opinion.

I tested today at my local driving range with yellow limited flight balls. I am very familiar with the range and can judge ball flights and distances for all of my clubs. The resort I practice at is remodeling hotel rooms, so they have metal sea containers for storage placed at the end of the range. My current driver lands just short of the sea containers and bounces into them and occasionally I am rewarded with the loud clang from landing on top of the containers. The grass members range is to the right of the containers, and I usually practice there, but today I wanted to hit toward the containers as I know where my current set up lands. I warmed up and then hit my current set up. 20 or so drives into or on top of the sea containers. Switched to the PLB Otto and removed the sliding weight to start the experiment.

Set up for my first swing and did the mandatory “waggle test” and thought there is no way it will hold up or this will be “spray and pray.” First swing was probably 80% and the flight appeared at least 20 feet higher than normal and landed dead center of the sea containers, “clang.” I did not feel uncomfortable with the set up at all after the just a few swings, in fact they felt easy, and the flight was still penetrating with a slight fade, just higher. I feared the left miss and it did not develop. After about 20 drives I stopped hearing the clang and seeing the huge bounce off of the sea containers and assumed the experiment was over because I was now landing short of the containers and not bouncing into them or on them. My eyesight isn’t what it used to be, and I assumed the experiment was landing well short and not reaching where my current driver was landing. I decided to take a break and put my HZRDUS back in the driver and go on with my day. Just as I stopped the head professional who was teaching on the other end of the range pulled up in his golf cart. He looked pissed and was waving at me and then smiled as he saw it was me, as we are friends. He said, “What the “F” are you doing?” I told him I was testing an experimental shaft, it felt easy to hit, but wasn’t as long as my HZRDUS. He laughed and said, “does your HZRDUS fly the sea containers by 10 yards?” I said no, it hits or bounces into them or maybe on top of the first one.” He said “don’t switch back then because your first two balls scared us when they hit the containers and the rest flew over them. You quit hitting just when I jumped in the cart to come over tell whoever it was to stop hitting into the fitness center!” What I presumed as being short of reaching the containers was flying them, so I didn’t get the clang.

Here's where it got weird. I put my HZRDUS and weight back in the driver and it felt totally foreign to me. It was heavy, stiff, and suddenly felt like work. I didn’t even want to hit it anymore. I hit 20 drives taking note of peak height (which now seemed very low) and dispersion. The dispersion looked pretty normal for me until I put the PLB back in. I immediately noticed the PLB had a tighter dispersion pattern and appeared to be much higher on the horizon. As soon as I put the PLB back in I noticed my swing was much smoother as I didn’t have to work as hard to move it.

 I then decided to conduct two tests. I have been working on not overswinging or going 100% full send with every club in my bag. I want to have and 80% swing and the occasional full send. So, I first swung the PLB at a perceived 80% fairway finder for 10 drives. Everyone of them hit the top of the sea containers and was dead straight. I usually aim up the left side and leak a fade into the left middle. I found with the PLB I could pick a target and hit it straight at an 80% effort and be as long as my fitted HZRDUS when I swing hard.

Test two was the exact opposite. Swing as hard as possible while maintain balance and see if the PLB A flex would spray the yard or be a hook machine. I giggled as the slight fade returned but the dispersion was tight. It held up.

Now I was intrigued and had to have more answers in the absence of launch monitor. Decided I had to hit real golf balls on the course, so I ventured to the first tee on a course I have played three times a week for 10 years and know where my shots land. There is a bunker on the right that I can comfortably be next to with roll after a good drive. Told the starter I needed to hit five drives as a test and proceeded to hit them quickly before the next group showed up. First two were the 80% swing aiming dead center. Next two were my normal full swing with a fade and the last one was the full send that I don’t want to make more than once or twice around. All of them were way higher than my normal ball flight, but all looked as if they were in play. If I played here 5 times, I would miss the fairway right two to three times, all five of these were in play. When I got to my balls, I found the 80% group to be where my current set up usually ended. The two normal swings were 10 yards past the bunker and the full send was 15 yards past the bunker.

If you have read all of this, I commend you as I knew this was going to be long. Especially since I have no launch monitor data yet to back any of this up. I will get to the monitor ASAP and update, and I need to play an actual round of golf under pressure to see if it stands up. I am hoping this was not all honeymoon or driving range placebo, but I am here for it!

Sounds familiar although my distances are nowhere near yours.  Congrats and welcome to being an "Otto".

Ping G430 Max 10.5*

Ping G430 SFT 3 wood and Ping G430 HL 7 wood SR flex

Ping G430 4,5,6,7 hybrids  SR flex

Cleveland Launcher XL Halo 8,9,P,G, SW irons   A Flex

Cleveland Smart Sole S wedge  A Flex

Cobra Nova putter

 

 

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1 hour ago, sl1111 said:

I’m in on the Otto experiment. For reference in case someone is searching, I am 50 years old, in good physical shape minus a back injury last year and play to a 5 index. I am a high spin; descending blow driver of the golf ball and any fitting I end up in a low spin/low lofted shaft/head combo.

Current driver is a TaylorMade Stealth+ 9 degree in the second lower setting. HZRDUS Green PDV Small Batch Tour Stiff tipped 1 inch. 106 mph swing speed at D5 swing weight, 45 inches, 60 grams. Ball flight is a slight fade with my miss being high right if I quit on this shaft at all.

 

Had a credit at the local club builder so I picked up a Pro Launch Blue A flex at 45 grams. I’m a hobbyist club builder with a swing weight scale and I blow my mid-size grips on a and off, so adjustments are easy. Epoxied the shaft in the adapter un-tipped and cut to 46.5 inches in the standard 9-degree loft setting to get a baseline. Swing weight was in the F range, so I started trimming at half inch increments to get it down to an acceptable level. I didn’t want to go too short as I wanted to stay with the theme of the experiment. At 45.5 inches I was at D3 and didn’t want to go any shorter, so I removed the10 gram slider weight from the head and landed at D1 with a standard grip. Blew on a mid-size and hit D0 on the button. No big loss as I played the slider in the neutral position. I thought removing the slider might have a negative effect on the feel of the head but was glad to find out it did not change in my opinion.

I tested today at my local driving range with yellow limited flight balls. I am very familiar with the range and can judge ball flights and distances for all of my clubs. The resort I practice at is remodeling hotel rooms, so they have metal sea containers for storage placed at the end of the range. My current driver lands just short of the sea containers and bounces into them and occasionally I am rewarded with the loud clang from landing on top of the containers. The grass members range is to the right of the containers, and I usually practice there, but today I wanted to hit toward the containers as I know where my current set up lands. I warmed up and then hit my current set up. 20 or so drives into or on top of the sea containers. Switched to the PLB Otto and removed the sliding weight to start the experiment.

Set up for my first swing and did the mandatory “waggle test” and thought there is no way it will hold up or this will be “spray and pray.” First swing was probably 80% and the flight appeared at least 20 feet higher than normal and landed dead center of the sea containers, “clang.” I did not feel uncomfortable with the set up at all after the just a few swings, in fact they felt easy, and the flight was still penetrating with a slight fade, just higher. I feared the left miss and it did not develop. After about 20 drives I stopped hearing the clang and seeing the huge bounce off of the sea containers and assumed the experiment was over because I was now landing short of the containers and not bouncing into them or on them. My eyesight isn’t what it used to be, and I assumed the experiment was landing well short and not reaching where my current driver was landing. I decided to take a break and put my HZRDUS back in the driver and go on with my day. Just as I stopped the head professional who was teaching on the other end of the range pulled up in his golf cart. He looked pissed and was waving at me and then smiled as he saw it was me, as we are friends. He said, “What the “F” are you doing?” I told him I was testing an experimental shaft, it felt easy to hit, but wasn’t as long as my HZRDUS. He laughed and said, “does your HZRDUS fly the sea containers by 10 yards?” I said no, it hits or bounces into them or maybe on top of the first one.” He said “don’t switch back then because your first two balls scared us when they hit the containers and the rest flew over them. You quit hitting just when I jumped in the cart to come over tell whoever it was to stop hitting into the fitness center!” What I presumed as being short of reaching the containers was flying them, so I didn’t get the clang.

Here's where it got weird. I put my HZRDUS and weight back in the driver and it felt totally foreign to me. It was heavy, stiff, and suddenly felt like work. I didn’t even want to hit it anymore. I hit 20 drives taking note of peak height (which now seemed very low) and dispersion. The dispersion looked pretty normal for me until I put the PLB back in. I immediately noticed the PLB had a tighter dispersion pattern and appeared to be much higher on the horizon. As soon as I put the PLB back in I noticed my swing was much smoother as I didn’t have to work as hard to move it.

 I then decided to conduct two tests. I have been working on not overswinging or going 100% full send with every club in my bag. I want to have and 80% swing and the occasional full send. So, I first swung the PLB at a perceived 80% fairway finder for 10 drives. Everyone of them hit the top of the sea containers and was dead straight. I usually aim up the left side and leak a fade into the left middle. I found with the PLB I could pick a target and hit it straight at an 80% effort and be as long as my fitted HZRDUS when I swing hard.

Test two was the exact opposite. Swing as hard as possible while maintain balance and see if the PLB A flex would spray the yard or be a hook machine. I giggled as the slight fade returned but the dispersion was tight. It held up.

Now I was intrigued and had to have more answers in the absence of launch monitor. Decided I had to hit real golf balls on the course, so I ventured to the first tee on a course I have played three times a week for 10 years and know where my shots land. There is a bunker on the right that I can comfortably be next to with roll after a good drive. Told the starter I needed to hit five drives as a test and proceeded to hit them quickly before the next group showed up. First two were the 80% swing aiming dead center. Next two were my normal full swing with a fade and the last one was the full send that I don’t want to make more than once or twice around. All of them were way higher than my normal ball flight, but all looked as if they were in play. If I played here 5 times, I would miss the fairway right two to three times, all five of these were in play. When I got to my balls, I found the 80% group to be where my current set up usually ended. The two normal swings were 10 yards past the bunker and the full send was 15 yards past the bunker.

If you have read all of this, I commend you as I knew this was going to be long. Especially since I have no launch monitor data yet to back any of this up. I will get to the monitor ASAP and update, and I need to play an actual round of golf under pressure to see if it stands up. I am hoping this was not all honeymoon or driving range placebo, but I am here for it!

Man it's wild how similar your story is to mine! Even down to the ping sound at the end of the driving range to let you know you sent one! 🤣

Great write up! 

 

   PXG 0311 Gen 5 9°/ Fujikura MotoreX F1 6X
:cobra-small:  F6 3 Wood 14* / Kuro Kage Silver 65X
:cobra-small: F8 6 wood 20* / Fujikura MotoreX F3 6S

:cobra-small: RADSpeed Hybrid 24*
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg TS1 4-GW / FCM Precision 6.5 Rifle
post-76102-0-38507100-1525284411_thumb.jpg  TSW Wedge - 56/12
:edel-golf-1:  EAS 1.0 / Grip master 2.0 

MAXFLI  Tour CG

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, sl1111 said:

I’m in on the Otto experiment. For reference in case someone is searching, I am 50 years old, in good physical shape minus a back injury last year and play to a 5 index. I am a high spin; descending blow driver of the golf ball and any fitting I end up in a low spin/low lofted shaft/head combo.

Current driver is a TaylorMade Stealth+ 9 degree in the second lower setting. HZRDUS Green PDV Small Batch Tour Stiff tipped 1 inch. 106 mph swing speed at D5 swing weight, 45 inches, 60 grams. Ball flight is a slight fade with my miss being high right if I quit on this shaft at all.

 

Had a credit at the local club builder so I picked up a Pro Launch Blue A flex at 45 grams. I’m a hobbyist club builder with a swing weight scale and I blow my mid-size grips on a and off, so adjustments are easy. Epoxied the shaft in the adapter un-tipped and cut to 46.5 inches in the standard 9-degree loft setting to get a baseline. Swing weight was in the F range, so I started trimming at half inch increments to get it down to an acceptable level. I didn’t want to go too short as I wanted to stay with the theme of the experiment. At 45.5 inches I was at D3 and didn’t want to go any shorter, so I removed the10 gram slider weight from the head and landed at D1 with a standard grip. Blew on a mid-size and hit D0 on the button. No big loss as I played the slider in the neutral position. I thought removing the slider might have a negative effect on the feel of the head but was glad to find out it did not change in my opinion.

I tested today at my local driving range with yellow limited flight balls. I am very familiar with the range and can judge ball flights and distances for all of my clubs. The resort I practice at is remodeling hotel rooms, so they have metal sea containers for storage placed at the end of the range. My current driver lands just short of the sea containers and bounces into them and occasionally I am rewarded with the loud clang from landing on top of the containers. The grass members range is to the right of the containers, and I usually practice there, but today I wanted to hit toward the containers as I know where my current set up lands. I warmed up and then hit my current set up. 20 or so drives into or on top of the sea containers. Switched to the PLB Otto and removed the sliding weight to start the experiment.

Set up for my first swing and did the mandatory “waggle test” and thought there is no way it will hold up or this will be “spray and pray.” First swing was probably 80% and the flight appeared at least 20 feet higher than normal and landed dead center of the sea containers, “clang.” I did not feel uncomfortable with the set up at all after the just a few swings, in fact they felt easy, and the flight was still penetrating with a slight fade, just higher. I feared the left miss and it did not develop. After about 20 drives I stopped hearing the clang and seeing the huge bounce off of the sea containers and assumed the experiment was over because I was now landing short of the containers and not bouncing into them or on them. My eyesight isn’t what it used to be, and I assumed the experiment was landing well short and not reaching where my current driver was landing. I decided to take a break and put my HZRDUS back in the driver and go on with my day. Just as I stopped the head professional who was teaching on the other end of the range pulled up in his golf cart. He looked pissed and was waving at me and then smiled as he saw it was me, as we are friends. He said, “What the “F” are you doing?” I told him I was testing an experimental shaft, it felt easy to hit, but wasn’t as long as my HZRDUS. He laughed and said, “does your HZRDUS fly the sea containers by 10 yards?” I said no, it hits or bounces into them or maybe on top of the first one.” He said “don’t switch back then because your first two balls scared us when they hit the containers and the rest flew over them. You quit hitting just when I jumped in the cart to come over tell whoever it was to stop hitting into the fitness center!” What I presumed as being short of reaching the containers was flying them, so I didn’t get the clang.

Here's where it got weird. I put my HZRDUS and weight back in the driver and it felt totally foreign to me. It was heavy, stiff, and suddenly felt like work. I didn’t even want to hit it anymore. I hit 20 drives taking note of peak height (which now seemed very low) and dispersion. The dispersion looked pretty normal for me until I put the PLB back in. I immediately noticed the PLB had a tighter dispersion pattern and appeared to be much higher on the horizon. As soon as I put the PLB back in I noticed my swing was much smoother as I didn’t have to work as hard to move it.

 I then decided to conduct two tests. I have been working on not overswinging or going 100% full send with every club in my bag. I want to have and 80% swing and the occasional full send. So, I first swung the PLB at a perceived 80% fairway finder for 10 drives. Everyone of them hit the top of the sea containers and was dead straight. I usually aim up the left side and leak a fade into the left middle. I found with the PLB I could pick a target and hit it straight at an 80% effort and be as long as my fitted HZRDUS when I swing hard.

Test two was the exact opposite. Swing as hard as possible while maintain balance and see if the PLB A flex would spray the yard or be a hook machine. I giggled as the slight fade returned but the dispersion was tight. It held up.

Now I was intrigued and had to have more answers in the absence of launch monitor. Decided I had to hit real golf balls on the course, so I ventured to the first tee on a course I have played three times a week for 10 years and know where my shots land. There is a bunker on the right that I can comfortably be next to with roll after a good drive. Told the starter I needed to hit five drives as a test and proceeded to hit them quickly before the next group showed up. First two were the 80% swing aiming dead center. Next two were my normal full swing with a fade and the last one was the full send that I don’t want to make more than once or twice around. All of them were way higher than my normal ball flight, but all looked as if they were in play. If I played here 5 times, I would miss the fairway right two to three times, all five of these were in play. When I got to my balls, I found the 80% group to be where my current set up usually ended. The two normal swings were 10 yards past the bunker and the full send was 15 yards past the bunker.

If you have read all of this, I commend you as I knew this was going to be long. Especially since I have no launch monitor data yet to back any of this up. I will get to the monitor ASAP and update, and I need to play an actual round of golf under pressure to see if it stands up. I am hoping this was not all honeymoon or driving range placebo, but I am here for it!

Nice write up, I really want to try this in my driving iron because I have the black in there

2 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

Man it's wild how similar your story is to mine! Even down to the ping sound at the end of the driving range to let you know you sent one! 🤣

Great write up! 

 

Yea I had a little Déjà vu reading that as well

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1 hour ago, azstu324 said:

Man it's wild how similar your story is to mine! Even down to the ping sound at the end of the driving range to let you know you sent one! 🤣

Great write up! 

 

Ya man, I read your original post a few days ago and thought I would head to the opposite end of the range to use the clang!! Then all of a sudden there was silence, which turned out to be a good thing  

 

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1 hour ago, tommc23 said:

Nice write up, I really want to try this in my driving iron because I have the black in there

Yea I had a little Déjà vu reading that as well

Funny you mention your driving iron. I play Project X 6.5 in my irons and I have been hunting for a driving iron style head in the 21 degree range. A friend of mine handed me a ZX4 4 iron with a random black shaft in it. He says, don’t look at the shaft, just hit a few and see if it works. It was really good and when he told to look at the shaft it was a soft stepped R flex Miyazaki. I immediately dismissed it even though I hit 10 pretty good shots with it. After this driver experiment I may reconsider. 
 

I’ve been so hung up about flex and I know the Auto Flex and Otto are not the same as an iron, but the old saying about swing the lightest flex you can controll has merit. 
 

Honestly has me considering my entire set up!

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5 hours ago, sl1111 said:

Funny you mention your driving iron. I play Project X 6.5 in my irons and I have been hunting for a driving iron style head in the 21 degree range. A friend of mine handed me a ZX4 4 iron with a random black shaft in it. He says, don’t look at the shaft, just hit a few and see if it works. It was really good and when he told to look at the shaft it was a soft stepped R flex Miyazaki. I immediately dismissed it even though I hit 10 pretty good shots with it. After this driver experiment I may reconsider. 
 

I’ve been so hung up about flex and I know the Auto Flex and Otto are not the same as an iron, but the old saying about swing the lightest flex you can controll has merit. 
 

Honestly has me considering my entire set up!

Me as well.  Interesting what it takes to shake us out of a paradigm.

Ping G430 Max 10.5*

Ping G430 SFT 3 wood and Ping G430 HL 7 wood SR flex

Ping G430 4,5,6,7 hybrids  SR flex

Cleveland Launcher XL Halo 8,9,P,G, SW irons   A Flex

Cleveland Smart Sole S wedge  A Flex

Cobra Nova putter

 

 

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Question to sl1111, instead of removing the draw/fade weight, can you not just add some lead tape under the grip to get to the D0 SW? I think 5g under grip lowers SW 1 point. 1/2 inch shorter equals 3 SW points. 

Edited by TheFonzzz

Two steps forwards one step back!

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I'm going to try competing in the super senior long drive competition next year, and from talking to some of the guys, most are using really light, whippy shafts. A lot are using the TPT shafts, and I think that Fast Eddie is using the 21 Hi. Thats a 40 something gram shaft, and pretty whippy. I'll probably get a Callaway Epic Speed LD 5 degree head, and hopefully try and get fit to one of the TPT shafts somewhere out here in Los Angeles when my knee is 100%. I'll probably experiment with things like the Evenflow riptide 40 until I do, but the fact that I was hitting bombs in my first round out after knee surgery 4 weeks ago is very exciting.

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Very interesting reading, I've got a Callaway 5wood shaft that is very wippy that's stiff. I've got a Taylormade adapter on it and hit some balls with my SIM head, didn't look much so put it in the shed but I'm getting it out and going to try it again. Maybe shaft extension lead tape etc, keen to continue chasing the numbers...

I’m a hacker who loves nothing more than to change how I play, be that grips shafts and heads its all fair game lol…

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5 hours ago, TheFonzzz said:

Question to sl1111, instead of removing the draw/fade weight, can you not just add some lead tape under the grip to get to the D0 SW? I think 5g under grip lowers SW 1 point. 1/2 inch shorter equals 3 SW points. 

You could absolutely hit a target swing weight with lead tape under the grip, especially if you wanted to use the weight in a setting besides neutral. This was just quick and easy for the experiment and did not change the head performance. I was also trying to stick to the theme of an overall lighter static weight, as I think that is part of the objective. 

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So, I dove head first into this. Bought a White Tie Matrix 45g A flex shaft on eBay. Added an adapter and went to range and played 9 holes. On the range, it was performing extremely well. Straight ball flight, somewhat high but penetrating versus rising from spin. The. I went out to the course and swing crashed, not equipment, but my swing. Tempo went to crap and I was so quick that the first was a major slice, second was a drop kick hook. Then 3rd and 4th were awesome. About 270+ each drive. I’m definitely intrigued but I do need to tinker with tempo to make it repeatable. Going to try and get indoors on a simulator today. More to come…

fyi - I play a TSi4 9* and standard shaft is a Ventus red 6x at 44.5”.

this test shaft is playing at 45” and about D2 swing weight. Again, Matrix white tie 45g A flex.

M3 kuro kage XM 6s

g425 3w LST tour ad VR 6s

Baffler F6 5w evenflow red 7s

F7 OL 4i Steelfiber 110cw

Miura PP9005g 5-PW elevate tour

cleveland rtx 50* DG

Glide 3.0 eye 54* DG

Hi-toe 60* DG

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