Shaft Hack - The Otto Phlex Journey

[IndyBonzo]

Another update:

I am still working on dialing in my OP shaft.  Hitting it well on the range, then (as is typical) swinging poorly on the course.  Once I groove in the slower tempo I think it will be good.  Hit a couple of bombs with it yesterday when I slowed down -- led to birdie and par.  If I can rein it in and hit more fairways with it, it will be golden.

My buddy, however, with a swing speed in the 95 range, is absolutely loving and bombing the GPLB 45-L with an Epic Max LS 9* head I made.  It was too flippy for me, but I suspect that will become his forever driver within the week.

[carter18]

On 3/3/2023 at 7:55 AM, azstu324 said:

Same flex. I'm using A in both driver and 3 wood with great results and a similar feel between the 2. 

Stu, did you change the 3W to D2 as well? If so, with good results?

[Ding-dong]

Just joined, have read all 59 pages and order GPLB L 40g. 
I recently broke the autoflex 505 I have had since early 2021. These are seriously expensive and replacing it was and is not possible. I was directed here by the Facebook autoflex group. So I have been reading through all of your posts and experimenting… it’s been awesome, well done and thank you all for your efforts!

I will say I have been tweaking my driver for forever. I have used light shafts like the UST mp5 but never in soft flexes. Autoflex never gave me these huge distances you read about.. I got 3-4 mph ball speed and 5-10 yards carry, but what I did get was low dispersion and the ability to really hit high or play low. Prior to that I struggled with launch and the IM 10 was at 10.5-11.5 degrees to get that height. I play Autoflex at 9.5 and I would say I could get to 8 if the adjustments allowed me ( I was going to experiment with that this year before it broke) .

I did pick up more distance as I delofted as you would expect, I think this is the primary strength. Autoflex is relatively stable but if you over try it does shuffle on you. 
 

anyway I hopefully will be trying the GPLB 45 L spec .. it’ll be in the window of swing weight as my head has been set. 

[carter18]

On 3/6/2023 at 10:10 AM, carter18 said:

Stu, did you change the 3W to D2 as well? If so, with good results?

@azstu324

[azstu324]

28 minutes ago, carter18 said:

@azstu324

Man @carter18I'm so sorry for leaving you hanging. I had meant to get back on Sunday after I had a chance to re-weigh.. and then a buddy called offering me free golf so I lost all track of my priorities. And of course I just forgot to post after all that. 

If I recall, I went with D2 right out of the gate with my 3 wood because of the slightly stiffer profile. I also clipped 1/2" off the tip as well. I'll double check this evening and re post tomorrow but I'm almost certain it's D2. I believe I'm also playing a 42" 3 wood to more or less follow the trend of my driver. I'll confirm though and get back tomorrow. 

[Ding-dong]

I have seen some head weighing going on, my conclusions on Autoflex was it worked sub 200g and best around 194g … I know people talk about swing weight but this is in my opinion about you feeling the head in your swing. With autoflex I experimented with head weight, and I had done some other stuff as well when Titleist released the 910 drivers. For me I was sensitive to the tip, and I found I could influence it with head weight.. so in the end you could play any shaft you just had to find the weight. But this is feel, not launch or spin conditions, so I could find my ideal and then tune in feel.

I also have worked on my delivery, my angle of attack was 0-1 degrees up, this lead to knuckle balls ( spin was 1300-1500 and best was 1800rpm ) or just no carry. I have managed to get to 3 up as standard and 6 up ( spin is around 3000-3400.. bit high maybe). Whilst doing this I have been working on my face impact high and low, and a few have posted on here impact points.. I suggest you seek to manipulate that using tee height or delivery and see what happens, as there is some more to be taken from this set up. 
 

I am worried the GPLB might feel a bit stiff at the tip, so I may have to look at the head weight. I don’t mind dropping to 44” s either so it’s going to be interesting… I may be searching out an epic speed 9 degree head as well. Just as a note the 59g IM10 reg shaft feels a little firm now after autoflex and I can tolerate it but I now know what I really like. 

[azstu324]

1 hour ago, Ding-dong said:

I have seen some head weighing going on, my conclusions on Autoflex was it worked sub 200g and best around 194g … I know people talk about swing weight but this is in my opinion about you feeling the head in your swing. With autoflex I experimented with head weight, and I had done some other stuff as well when Titleist released the 910 drivers. For me I was sensitive to the tip, and I found I could influence it with head weight.. so in the end you could play any shaft you just had to find the weight. But this is feel, not launch or spin conditions, so I could find my ideal and then tune in feel.

I also have worked on my delivery, my angle of attack was 0-1 degrees up, this lead to knuckle balls ( spin was 1300-1500 and best was 1800rpm ) or just no carry. I have managed to get to 3 up as standard and 6 up ( spin is around 3000-3400.. bit high maybe). Whilst doing this I have been working on my face impact high and low, and a few have posted on here impact points.. I suggest you seek to manipulate that using tee height or delivery and see what happens, as there is some more to be taken from this set up. 
 

I am worried the GPLB might feel a bit stiff at the tip, so I may have to look at the head weight. I don’t mind dropping to 44” s either so it’s going to be interesting… I may be searching out an epic speed 9 degree head as well. Just as a note the 59g IM10 reg shaft feels a little firm now after autoflex and I can tolerate it but I now know what I really like. 

Your points/possible concerns are definitely valid and thank you for sharing. I think that the question on everyone's minds here is "how similar is the PLB 45g to the Autoflex?". I'll openly admit that I've never even seen an Autoflex in person let alone swung one. All of my formulation is strictly based off of reading and watching reviews of the shaft. I know for me that the PLB is a great shaft with some beneficial qualities that I've really come to enjoy.. but I'd still like to hear more accounts from individuals who could actually provide a real comparison story. 

Can't wait to hear about your comparisons and whether or not these 2 could be siblings, cousins, or complete strangers to each other. 

[Ding-dong]

5 hours ago, azstu324 said:

Your points/possible concerns are definitely valid and thank you for sharing. I think that the question on everyone's minds here is "how similar is the PLB 45g to the Autoflex?". I'll openly admit that I've never even seen an Autoflex in person let alone swung one. All of my formulation is strictly based off of reading and watching reviews of the shaft. I know for me that the PLB is a great shaft with some beneficial qualities that I've really come to enjoy.. but I'd still like to hear more accounts from individuals who could actually provide a real comparison story. 

Can't wait to hear about your comparisons and whether or not these 2 could be siblings, cousins, or complete strangers to each other. 

It will be interesting, I also think there is a lightweight shaft for everyone. There are people fitted into shafts for their transition, not their speed. I think you have proven here that speed is not a major determinant.

so looking into it should be on everyone’s mind, GPLB 45 is a good place to start, it’s a shaft that ticks a lot of people’s boxes. I think I was looking at the std reg one and when I was younger the stiffer one ( younger or still travelling down the wrong route) 

The irony of autoflex was people going up through the stiffnesses, and then saying distances were not that great. They were not aware of the weight of the shaft, it’s actually not super light weight , when you look at what is out there. 
 

I was going to suggest looking at the UST MP5 or MPS in its softer flexes and I suspect it would be a good alternative to GPLB … 

 

Autoflex feels wobbly initially and you waggle it and it moves around a lot. But that’s because you’re putting sharp inputs so you see it lagging. When you swing it, if you have the head weight right, it feels in place and promotes a finishing swing, so losing momentum beyond the ball .. if you hit at it, your hands will inadvertently destabilise it and you get a shuffle and that’s when you don’t get distance. After a while your confidence builds and you swing hard and smooth and then it flies .. the point is not to hit at the ball and quite possibly you can drop another level … so get lighter 

 

in the end it’s not magic, it’s just away from where we have been going, and thinking about it the golf swing has changed so has that made it more the right way to go ?

[carter18]

15 hours ago, azstu324 said:

Man @carter18I'm so sorry for leaving you hanging. I had meant to get back on Sunday after I had a chance to re-weigh.. and then a buddy called offering me free golf 

No worries dude! Free golf takes precedence!

[azstu324]

3 hours ago, carter18 said:

No worries dude! Free golf takes precedence!

Okay so I just measured the swing weight this morning and I have to stand corrected. It's actually sitting right at D0 and playing at 32.5". 

 I do remember why I was thinking D2 initially. When I put the club together it did come in at D2 but then I remembered that I had about four grams of polyfill that I had stuffed inside the head so that it would play at D4 in my original setup. When I took the poly fill out it then registered D0.

I will say that because of the total static weight of almost 325 grams there is definitely no loss of feeling and the club head and I don't really think I would want to add any more weight to this setup. The transition between driver and 3 wood seems very seamless in this case. 

 

[carter18]

16 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

Okay so I just measured the swing weight this morning and I have to stand corrected. It's actually sitting right at D0 and playing at 32.5". 

 

 

 

Awesome. Thanks for checking sir. I assume you meant 42.5? I look forward to reading your new iron shaft reviews in that thread soon!

[azstu324]

32 minutes ago, carter18 said:

Awesome. Thanks for checking sir. I assume you meant 42.5? I look forward to reading your new iron shaft reviews in that thread soon!

Oh snap! Yeah I meant 42.5"..

No I am NOT using my 10 year old's 3 wood

[Ding-dong]

Just out of interest, are women’s club heads lighter ? The 3 wood, is an issue because it is 215g or there about .. I wonder if you could get lighter and get the GPLB working

[cksurfdude]

6 hours ago, Ding-dong said:

Just out of interest, are women’s club heads lighter ?

I believe (not 100% sure) that, in general, that is correct.

[jonbob]

17 hours ago, Ding-dong said:

Just out of interest, are women’s club heads lighter ? The 3 wood, is an issue because it is 215g or there about .. I wonder if you could get lighter and get the GPLB working

10 hours ago, cksurfdude said:

I believe (not 100% sure) that, in general, that is correct.

I have spent a bit of time researching lighter clubs for my kids, and it seems like most the manufacturers just use the same heads for men and women.   The swing weight is just a lot lighter due to shorter and lighter shafts and grips.

Now the made for women clubs like Ping Le 2 and TM Kalea i think are lighter.

Some of the lightest stock driver heads off the top of my head are the TS1 and maybe Callaway XR.  I don't know though that callaway adapter is so heavy.

Of course there are quite a few TM offerings with moving weights you can remove and really get light.  The Japan drivers (XXIO maybe some others) are supposed to be on the light side as well.

Edited March 11, 2023 by jonbob

[Ding-dong]

I caught a snippet on TXG and they implied that if you fitted a left sleeve on a right sleeve club .. the +2 degrees could become -2 degrees.

Is this the case ? 
If so I would /should have had that installed on my 10.5 degree head which can only get to 9.5 with a std right hand sleeve . 

[Bang60]

3 minutes ago, Ding-dong said:

I caught a snippet on TXG and they implied that if you fitted a left sleeve on a right sleeve club .. the +2 degrees could become -2 degrees.

Is this the case ? 
If so I would /should have had that installed on my 10.5 degree head which can only get to 9.5 with a std right hand sleeve . 

I’ve not done that myself but I know a left handed man who did and he loves it…

I gave him the adapter……

[Ding-dong]

Oh well missed a trick here, but if the shaft works, it arrives today, and I can get a positive result another with this adapter would be cheaper than another head. 

To be honest I am hoping it does work, I was always a little embarrassed about the autoflex. It’s not so well known where I play but it had been rumbled. The GPLB will just fade into the background … like a secret weapon 

[Ding-dong]

Shaft arrived today… it’s light! Not whippy like Autoflex. Let’s just get that out there. I would also say it’s stiffer in the tip.

So that said, who cares, I think this works and I saw some nice numbers. My swing speed increased and ball speed had jumped as well. The R10 was suffering due to the raised mat. I could see the flight, the wind was gusting between 20-40mph right to left and toward me .. that’s the direction you get if you hit from the shed ( given the conditions the shed was a pleasant place to be).

I never felt I over loaded the shaft. I am still not decided on the loft 9.5 and 10.5 work for me. Flight is very high.. but I can pull it down or sling it up there ( this was like my 3 wood .. my driver was just was get what you get) 

flight was right to left, but not uncontrolled, toe strikes, which is where I started and pulled back to middle via set up and lie, created a big sling hook. But once I was coming out the middle the flight was high with a movement right to left. No fades but today a fade might have been a little difficult.

I have some more tuning to do, the grip is not what I want, it’s narrow. I will put a mid size on and possibly tape to parallel.

I need to decide on 9.5 or 10.5 loft , 9.5 will yield more speed and I think opens the face which will pull me back to neutral. 
 

I think this is a very good effort on your part guys, so well done. 
If you want the Autoflex sensation the shaft needs to be more flexible and almost feel like a heavy ball on a cane .. but guys this set up delivers results and I think is not overly sensitive to head weight. So possibly for some like myself a 3 wood option as well. In fact I think I could put more in .. I will of cause investigate. 
 

I may get a chance to do a proper back to back comparison but that won’t be confirmed for a few days yet.

 

However, once again, well done good hack ! 

[IndyBonzo]

I'm curious Ding Dong what swing weight you are using?  I am experimenting with the OP as well, and cannot control it yet nearly as well as I can with my gamer (stiff) driver at a D4 swing weight.  It may just not work for me, but I am curious if further tinkering with the SW will get it there.  Thank you in advance for your input, and thank you for the AF comparison!

Edited March 13, 2023 by IndyBonzo

[Ding-dong]

16 minutes ago, IndyBonzo said:

I'm curious Ding Dong what swing weight you are using?  I am experimenting with the OP as well, and cannot control it yet nearly as well as I can with my gamer (stiff) driver at a D4 swing weight.  It may just not work for me, but I am curious if further tinkering with the SW will get it there.  Thank you in advance for your input, and thank you for the AF comparison!

I am not sure to be honest, I am pretty oblivious to swing weight, just a gorilla in disguise . I suspect it’s quite light as the head is not easy to feel, which is why I could add more weight. I may have to if I increase the grip weight. I am a feel guy, if it feels okay I will live with it if not I will tune it till I am happy. 

16 minutes ago, IndyBonzo said:

[Ding-dong]

Right had time to just assess the data points I have.

std reg IM10 shaft set at 9.5 degrees gave me a SS of 98mph BSpeed 143

Autoflex SF505 set 9.5 degrees gave me a SS of 98mph BSpeed 143 

so to caveat this Autoflex lower dispersion and soft feel, more workable on elevation- better overall … so installed.

GPLB 45g L 9.5/10.5 degrees SS of 98-101 mph ball speed 141-145

So you can see potential here and I don’t have the dispersion yet, but to be honest if you know the ball will go right to left by 10-15 yards maximum is that really a problem? 
 

Also just to state I am desk bound 40hrs a week, don’t do the gym and I am 50, with family obligations.. so guys the speed is what the speed is and I only need 230yards of carry which I have theoretically… or until I actually measure it 

[Bang60]

8 hours ago, Ding-dong said:

Right had time to just assess the data points I have.

std reg IM10 shaft set at 9.5 degrees gave me a SS of 98mph BSpeed 143

Autoflex SF505 set 9.5 degrees gave me a SS of 98mph BSpeed 143 

so to caveat this Autoflex lower dispersion and soft feel, more workable on elevation- better overall … so installed.

GPLB 45g L 9.5/10.5 degrees SS of 98-101 mph ball speed 141-145

So you can see potential here and I don’t have the dispersion yet, but to be honest if you know the ball will go right to left by 10-15 yards maximum is that really a problem? 
 

Also just to state I am desk bound 40hrs a week, don’t do the gym and I am 50, with family obligations.. so guys the speed is what the speed is and I only need 230yards of carry which I have theoretically… or until I actually measure it 

Numbers look good  

[Ding-dong]

Got out for 18 this afternoon , bit of a mixed bag but all good. I have re gripped the club, the supplier did not put any tape underneath so the grip had rotated. Now I have some lamkin thing on and  2 layers plus 1 at the lower half to reduce the taper. 
last 5 holes were good golf, not huge drives due to no roll out and a 2 club breeze but I think I will drop to 9.5 degrees and persist.  18th is 422 yards dog leg left at 150 yards in, I had 167 yards to the middle where the pin was and drew in a 7 iron to 170 yards and sunk the putt to end on a high.

No news from Autoflex about a replacement , but I am okay.

Tonight I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel as the last 9 years I have totally dogged it round , hence the 10 handicap.

But a couple of birdies and being within 10ft on 6 holes for birdie and those where I wasn’t was just distance misjudgements- line was fine. 
So whatever was going on tonight I hope stays , I need to start to just swing freely with the driver and the weather is improving and may be I will start to see my scores improve. Here is hoping ! 

[Ding-dong]

Watched TXG video on Autoflex and freeflex.. thought they said it was 150 dollars but on further investigation it’s 650 dollars plus 100 for tip and shipping… hardly an alternative really.

There was an article that compared both, initially stated ottophlex was a bit temperamental and worked for few … then later he mentioned all the drawbacks of autoflex.

Autoflex doesn’t work for everyone and that’s just a fact of life, it’s no better or worse than Ottophlex … so don’t stop looking and don’t stop searching. Shafts today come in so many flavours and variations. Mix and match torque and head weights and you will get there, the weight of shaft is the key to speed… going up weight boundaries will only minimise your gain .

[03trdblack]

1 hour ago, Ding-dong said:

Watched TXG video on Autoflex and freeflex.. thought they said it was 150 dollars but on further investigation it’s 650 dollars plus 100 for tip and shipping… hardly an alternative really.

They meant by that statement that it was around $150 difference in price compared to AF.  They just didn't say it well.

[Ding-dong]

1 hour ago, 03trdblack said:

They meant by that statement that it was around $150 difference in price compared to AF.  They just didn't say it well.

Yup caught me out … was interesting he used a 405 for his swing speed and it held up.

[Bang60]

2 hours ago, 03trdblack said:

They meant by that statement that it was around $150 difference in price compared to AF.  They just didn't say it well.

Those are the guys I don't return to there blogs, all smoke and mirrors lol...

[Ding-dong]

18 hole club stableford today. Driver was good all the way round, dialled down to 9,5 still got a really high flight. I will leave until the ground firms up, but I don’t feel like I am losing anything. Irons were centred, just the 3 wood cost me 3 blobs . But 34 pts and a share of the roll up pot, plus 2 birdies in the 2s pot should pay for my entry and then some. 
I was targeting 32 pts as reasonable, the greens are ropey and we are just off fairway mats. 
This shaft is doing the business, I am wondering about the 3 wood but I need to look at it. I have a Ping g425 max head weight is 213g, so I was thinking the 45 g pro launch in L ( otherwise known as long spec) … I do like my 3 wood to honest and I do hit it well. But I supposed a quick in out budget shaft wouldn’t hurt.

[azstu324]

2 hours ago, Ding-dong said:

18 hole club stableford today. Driver was good all the way round, dialled down to 9,5 still got a really high flight. I will leave until the ground firms up, but I don’t feel like I am losing anything. Irons were centred, just the 3 wood cost me 3 blobs . But 34 pts and a share of the roll up pot, plus 2 birdies in the 2s pot should pay for my entry and then some. 
I was targeting 32 pts as reasonable, the greens are ropey and we are just off fairway mats. 
This shaft is doing the business, I am wondering about the 3 wood but I need to look at it. I have a Ping g425 max head weight is 213g, so I was thinking the 45 g pro launch in L ( otherwise known as long spec) … I do like my 3 wood to honest and I do hit it well. But I supposed a quick in out budget shaft wouldn’t hurt.

Would you say that the PLB is maybe a little more reliable? My observation over months of using it is that it's suitable for a variety of my imperfect swing traits and when my swing is on point, it's a beast.. AND can really handle some extra juice when applied. 

As for the 3 wood idea, a group of us have really found the Garafalloy GWX sold through Golf works to be a great wood option. Same price as the PLB but a few grams heavier and feels great in a 3 wood.