Liv Golf Central Thread: Events and News

[LICC]

On 6/16/2022 at 8:21 AM, cnosil said:

Referring to the PGA pros that have discussed they aren’t chasing money and going to liv and playing the PGA tour to have their name on a trophy next to players like Hogan.  These pros play 15-25 tournaments a year.  

How do you know how much money any of them do or don’t donate to charity?

[LICC]

6 hours ago, fixyurdivot said:

And, sadly, this is something they should have worked out before choosing the nuclear option.  If they at least attempted to work a deal that allowed both to exist it would have looked better to the players and fans. Some argue there is no way they can make both work - I disagree.  There is always a way forward if people have a mind to make it happen.

Not sure where your sources are coming from, but yeah, losing those guys would be bad and likely be the catalyst for others to consider LIV as well. 

As I shared on our FTx chat, #decimelplacematters 

What would that “deal” look like?

[BIG STU]

On 6/16/2022 at 7:46 AM, cnosil said:

I’m waiting for those that say they don’t play for the money but to see their name on a trophy and play against the best in the world to donate all the money they win to charity.  

I gotta give Stacy Lewis credit on that one---- What ever tournament she won that year she gave her entire winnings for flood relief for Houston Texas I believe it was

[LICC]

14 hours ago, PeterHenric said:

Over on another site, there were a number of high profile golfers that are now rumored to be jumping ship. Brooks Koepka, Xander Schauffele, Collin Morikawa, and Viktor Hovland. If they were true, that would be a huge blow to PGA. I know that Fowler and Wolff aren’t what they used to be but that doesn’t leave a ton of high profile guys left.

If that were true, PGA might be forced to do some dealings with LIV.

Morikawa would be a big loss for the Tour. At this point Koepka would help LIV but wouldn’t be devastating for the Tour. Xander would hurt but losing Morikawa would be tough. 

[cnosil]

3 hours ago, LICC said:

How do you know how much money any of them do or don’t donate to charity?

My point wasn't about what they do or don't currently donate to charity as was a reaction to players that say that they aren't playing golf for the money.   

The top name players that are turning down the LIV offers are saying it isn't about the money. Rory and other have stated or implied that it is about the PGA events, the courses, the best players, and having their names on a trophy next to names like Hogan.   These tour players have typically been successful, have high paying sponsors, and have a nice bank account.   Many of us would  believe they have steady income streams without tournament winnings;  so my point was that if they aren't playing golf for the "money" and simply for the reasons I listed then donate ALL of their winnings to charity.    

Employee surveys indicate that money isn't the top driver in employee satisfaction or retention and thinks like how employees are treated, work conditions,  and social interactions rank higher.   But money is on the list.   My company recently did such a survey and the results indicate that money wasn't a main driver, but reading feedback on employee forums and in town hall type meetings, there are people that are driven by the financial side.   This is probably influenced by how well they are able to provide the basic needs for themselves and their families.  Some people are willing to leave jobs for equal or lower pay simply to improve their working conditions.  

The players that have chosen to play LIV golf are most likely doing it for the  money and to ensure they are able to take care of themselves and their families long term.  The amount someone needs to believes they need is linked directly to that person and no one can judge what they need or don't.   Whether they say it or not the players remaining on the PGA tour are still playing golf for the money;  they are just in a position where they can make a choice not to accept the higher paying LIV tour.  

Based on your statement and my interpretation of your statement, we should NEVER judge anyones salary or what they do or don't donate to charity.   These players play golf for a living and they play on some tour that pays them to play.   Based on the PGA tours 501.C status,  they are not able to provide perks to individuals that are not provided to everyone so they cannot do the pay to play type things other tours might do.  My guess is that based on the amounts of money the LIV is paying these players,  the PGA tour would do the same if they were legally allowed.   Also, If we looked at the jobs or people on this forum, we could probably find people that worked for US based companies that others would never work for simply because of who they deal with or what they manufacture. 

At the end of the day professional golf is entertainment and we are all free to choose what forms or entertainment we want to watch or support.  

 

 

 

[LICC]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

My point wasn't about what they do or don't currently donate to charity as was a reaction to players that say that they aren't playing golf for the money.   

The top name players that are turning down the LIV offers are saying it isn't about the money. Rory and other have stated or implied that it is about the PGA events, the courses, the best players, and having their names on a trophy next to names like Hogan.   These tour players have typically been successful, have high paying sponsors, and have a nice bank account.   Many of us would  believe they have steady income streams without tournament winnings;  so my point was that if they aren't playing golf for the "money" and simply for the reasons I listed then donate ALL of their winnings to charity.    

Employee surveys indicate that money isn't the top driver in employee satisfaction or retention and thinks like how employees are treated, work conditions,  and social interactions rank higher.   But money is on the list.   My company recently did such a survey and the results indicate that money wasn't a main driver, but reading feedback on employee forums and in town hall type meetings, there are people that are driven by the financial side.   This is probably influenced by how well they are able to provide the basic needs for themselves and their families.  Some people are willing to leave jobs for equal or lower pay simply to improve their working conditions.  

The players that have chosen to play LIV golf are most likely doing it for the  money and to ensure they are able to take care of themselves and their families long term.  The amount someone needs to believes they need is linked directly to that person and no one can judge what they need or don't.   Whether they say it or not the players remaining on the PGA tour are still playing golf for the money;  they are just in a position where they can make a choice not to accept the higher paying LIV tour.  

Based on your statement and my interpretation of your statement, we should NEVER judge anyones salary or what they do or don't donate to charity.   These players play golf for a living and they play on some tour that pays them to play.   Based on the PGA tours 501.C status,  they are not able to provide perks to individuals that are not provided to everyone so they cannot do the pay to play type things other tours might do.  My guess is that based on the amounts of money the LIV is paying these players,  the PGA tour would do the same if they were legally allowed.   Also, If we looked at the jobs or people on this forum, we could probably find people that worked for US based companies that others would never work for simply because of who they deal with or what they manufacture. 

At the end of the day professional golf is entertainment and we are all free to choose what forms or entertainment we want to watch or support.  

 

 

 

These players can easily get a fortune more than they make now if they joined LIV. They choose not to. Clearly, their choice on which Tour to play is not driven by the money. Nothing you said nor your comment about donating to charity changes that conclusion. 

Edited June 18, 2022 by LICC

[cnosil]

9 minutes ago, LICC said:

These players can easily get a fortune more than they make now if they joined LIV. They choose not to. Clearly, their choice on which Tour to play is not driven by the money. Nothing you said nor your comment about donating to charity changes that conclusion. 

Yes, they can make more money by joining LIV and while they don't necessarily need the money it is a reason they do what they do otherwise they would remain an amateur or donate the money or refuse to be paid.  They simply chose to not switch where they work.   I just don't want to hear them continue to say I don't play golf for the money because money is a main reason people work.  Those that switched did so for the paycheck and I don't fault them for making that choice.  

[LICC]

6 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Yes, they can make more money by joining LIV and while they don't necessarily need the money it is a reason they do what they do otherwise they would remain an amateur or donate the money or refuse to be paid.  They simply chose to not switch where they work.   I just don't want to hear them continue to say I don't play golf for the money because money is a main reason people work.  Those that switched did so for the paycheck and I don't fault them for making that choice.  

You are trying to dismiss those who didn’t sell out to LIV because they still get paid well playing on the PGA Tour. They are choosing to forego massively more money to stay with the Tour. 
Those who sold out to LIV are terrible not just because they sold out for more money, but because of who they are helping by being stooges for them, and just for more money. I don’t want to go further into this door you opened because the moderators want to keep this to golf and not politics. 

Edited June 18, 2022 by LICC

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, LICC said:

You are trying to dismiss those who didn’t sell out to LIV because they still get paid well playing on the PGA Tour. They are choosing to forego massively more money to stay with the Tour. 
Those who sold out to LIV are terrible not just because they sold out for more money, but because of who they are helping by being stooges for them, and just for more money. I don’t want to go further into this door you opened because the moderators want to keep this to golf and not politics. 

I am not dismissing anyone.   People  choose a job for a multitude of reasons one of which is money.  Yes, some get paid well playing on the PGA tour and these are the players we hear from that say it isn't about money.   There are players that leave golf daily because they can no longer afford to play golf professionally.

It is simply yours and others opinion that the players that play the LIV tour are terrible; you are dismissing those players.   People change jobs daily for more money and to go to work for companies; even completely US based companies, that others wouldn't go to work for.  

This is simply the entertainment business and a company offered players a job and some accepted and some didn't for their own reasons;  it is nothing more.   Just like any other form of entertainment you can choose to watch or no watch.  For me it is simply golf.  

 

 

[fixyurdivot]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

 I just don't want to hear them continue to say I don't play golf for the money because money is a main reason people work.

Agree.  These type statements coming from players who have already stuffed their beds with feathers is a wee bit empty.  It's an easy statement to make at this point in their career and personal, generational wealth.  Does Rory, Rahm and others make these same claims as rookies and prior to making their fortunes?  According to the PGA's data, in 2021, the average tour player bagged $1.5M/year with #1 Rahm earning $7.7M and #250 Parker McLachlin earning $6100. 

While I suspect a few more "big name/big bank account" players will leave, the biggest risk to the PGA (and DP Tour for that matter) are those in that nuttin to 60% annual earning group... those who haven't yet made their fortunes. 

[Bang60]

Gents I think your missing the point, every country in the world has history even here in NZ. My ancestors were cannibal WOW… point is we’ve become civilised as has Northern Ireland USA etc. only difference I see is we got there sooner . We need to support anyone trying to improve not exclude them, I was taught when I got help hitting the ball I was obliged to do that for the learner I played with which I’ve done both with Tennis and Golf ️ cheers 

[Grand Stranded]

On 6/9/2022 at 9:56 AM, russtopherb said:

Probably not the best Titleist example, as he wouldn't be a sponsored pro (or even on the tour at all, for that matter) if not for his father.

He’s a former US Am winner and has (I believe) 3 wins on the European Tour. 

 

Edited June 21, 2022 by Grand Stranded

[Grand Stranded]

On 6/10/2022 at 6:21 AM, LICC said:

He is a credentialed member of the press. He should expect to be able to be there without getting physically removed. 

 

On 6/10/2022 at 6:57 AM, russtopherb said:

Yeah that’s hilarious, the thought of a well respected golf journalist being physically abused for doing his job. Why on earth did you think this was something even remotely worthwhile or appropriate to post given everything we’ve been talking about????

 

On 6/10/2022 at 12:14 PM, TBS said:

Or covering the event as a credentialed journalist.

I always assumed it was common knowledge that in order to be considered a “credentialed journalist” a journalist would have to be issued credentials to cover the event in question.

Apparently this is not something many people know.

Edited June 21, 2022 by Grand Stranded

[LICC]

On 6/18/2022 at 7:19 PM, Bang60 said:

point is we’ve become civilised as has Northern Ireland USA etc. only difference I see is we got there sooner

That is the “stage theory” in sociology, which has been discredited as highly flawed. 

[MacTourney]

On 6/17/2022 at 7:12 PM, PeterHenric said:

Over on another site, there were a number of high profile golfers that are now rumored to be jumping ship. Brooks Koepka, Xander Schauffele, Collin Morikawa, and Viktor Hovland. If they were true, that would be a huge blow to PGA. I know that Fowler and Wolff aren’t what they used to be but that doesn’t leave a ton of high profile guys left.

If that were true, PGA might be forced to do some dealings with LIV.

I would like to look at that, what site, or link?

[cnosil]

Looks like Koepka and Ancer might be on the move.  

https://www.skysports.com/golf/news/12176/12637521/brooks-koepka-to-quit-pga-tour-and-join-liv-golf-invitational-series

[GolfSpy_APH]

13 minutes ago, cnosil said:

Looks like Koepka and Ancer might be on the move.  

https://www.skysports.com/golf/news/12176/12637521/brooks-koepka-to-quit-pga-tour-and-join-liv-golf-invitational-series

From the sounds of it they will have a slow bleed of announcements to keep them relevant in news cycles longer.

Sucks to see Brooks leave at least for me personally.

[MGoBlue100]

Ancer & Koepka gone; who’s next? I think a few will wait until after the Scottish Open & Open Championship and then see what the situation looks like. These won’t be the last. If they want to badly enough, they can always find a tour (Asian, Japan) to play a few events and gain some OWGR points. 

[Golfspy_Lukes]

Brooks is the poster child for LiV

only cares about money. Not even sure he actually likes playing golf

[LICC]

26 minutes ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

From the sounds of it they will have a slow bleed of announcements to keep them relevant in news cycles longer.

Sucks to see Brooks leave at least for me personally.

I can't explain exactly why, but I don't feel like I'll miss Koepka. He has gotten to be such an annoying individual, he never was a dynamic or likeable personality, he never brought the same level and focus to Tour events as he did the majors, and his game has slipped recently.