Unofficial PuttOUT Devil Ball Reviews

[GolfSpy MPR]

So I know we've got member testing on these coming up in short order, but I bought my own and thought I'd start a thread for the rest of us to post our thoughts.

My initial impression: very positive. Full disclosure: I am a bit of a PuttOUT fanboy. I've got two Pressure Trainers (one for home and the other for the office) and the big PuttOUT mirror with one gate. In general, their products seem very well made. And especially with the Pressure Trainer, they hit the sweet spot for training aids: 1) if you get better at the aid, you're likely going to be better at golf and 2) challenging in a way that's engaging and therefore encourages more practice.

So far, I think the Devil Ball is hitting a similar sweet spot. It's hard to hit the ball properly on the flat side. I say a bit more about the flat side here:

What I'm finding is that, when I do work with the Devil Ball, going back to a normal ball seems quite easy.

My struggle, for what it's worth, is short putts. I'm statistically a good lag putter, but I miss way too many putts from 3-9', according to Arccos. So starting my putt on my intended line is a point of emphasis for me this winter.

[Jim Shaw]

1st. time I have ever seen anything like this, I am pretty traditional in the fact that if I dont see it on "live from" then the best putters in the world aren't using them. I would stick with alignment sticks and putting mirrors. 

[cksurfdude]

Gonna be following along .. a bit on the fence about getting one... Do have two other putting trainers that sorta try to do the same the thing.

[GolfSpy MPR]

5 minutes ago, cksurfdude said:

Gonna be following along .. a bit on the fence about getting one... Do have two other putting trainers that sorta try to do the same the thing.

Just curious: did you check the video? Because I offered a comparison between the Devil Ball, the Pill, and the Putter Wheel. Do you have another in this category?

[thejestes]

6 hours ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

My struggle, for what it's worth, is short putts. I'm statistically a good lag putter, but I miss way too many putts from 3-9', according to Arccos. So starting my putt on my intended line is a point of emphasis for me this winter.

I feel your pain @GolfSpy MPR  Just starting using Arccos about 3 weeks ago and I’m really tired of seeing negative numbers every round on putting. I love to practice chipping but hate (never found a putting aide or practice routine that hold my interest) putting. 
Were you fitted for your putter? If so by whom?

[Jim Shaw]

Putting, my favourite subject. I dont have the exact statistics but mygolfspy does, I do know if you can move your average putts made up from 3-4-5-6-7 and 8 feet your handicap will go down. When I decided to compete at a high level of competitive senior men's golf I knew I had to become a great putter, so for 4 years I have been working with my coach on putting. We found a great pre round routine that has helped and I stick with it every round. I would find a pga teaching pro that speaks the same language as you, and spend as much time putting as you do ball striking.

[cnosil]

11 hours ago, thejestes said:

I feel your pain @GolfSpy MPR  Just starting using Arccos about 3 weeks ago and I’m really tired of seeing negative numbers every round on putting. I love to practice chipping but hate (never found a putting aide or practice routine that hold my interest) putting. 
Were you fitted for your putter? If so by whom?

you could always adjust your strokes gained comparison to be against higher handicap players .   Yes,  he was fitted for an Edel putter as part of the forum testing  opportunities.  You can read about it here:  

 

11 hours ago, Jim Shaw said:

Putting, my favourite subject. I dont have the exact statistics but mygolfspy does, I do know if you can move your average putts made up from 3-4-5-6-7 and 8 feet your handicap will go down. When I decided to compete at a high level of competitive senior men's golf I knew I had to become a great putter, so for 4 years I have been working with my coach on putting. We found a great pre round routine that has helped and I stick with it every round. I would find a pga teaching pro that speaks the same language as you, and spend as much time putting as you do ball striking.

putting is my favorite subject as well.   However, I’d disagree about its importance unless you can define it as a weakness…3 putts, lag putting, or poor putting from the distances you mentioned.   I can one putt every green from every distance but if my ball striking is poor, I won’t score well.  Stats show that distance with driver and double or worse avoidance are potentially better ways to reduce scoring.  Scratch to a 20 handicapper is only about a 3 birdie per round difference.  

what is you pre round routine?  

I am definitely interested in the reviews on this product since it looks like a great aid for start line practice.  Is it better than simply using a set of gates?  Is it going to improve the testers putting?  I’ll be interesting to hear as I listened to a webinar with David Orr a while ago and he doesn’t place a lot of emphasis on start line drills so not every putting coach believes that start line is a key performance improvement area.   

[Jim Shaw]

in response to the comment regarding "the importance of putting only if it is a weakness". You are correct, I was remiss in mentioning that at a high level of competitive golf, depending how high you are competing at, all, and I mean all, the competitors are good to great ball strikers, that is when the putting really makes a difference. We all have better ball striking days just like we all have better putting days but in my experience the best putters that week win the tournament. So in my world, being able to putt really well is something that I strive to do, so getting back to the original post with the puttout devil ball, it intrigued me as to how working with it could give me an advantage.

There was a another comment about my pre shot routine, there are mechanics and "feel" combinations involved so I believe it would have to be shown in person, as the competitive players on this site know, every tournament you go to has different green complexes so a routine has to be developed that is solid and will travel well. 

[cnosil]

Was at HQ today and Phillip has let me borrow a devil ball.     I have played with it a little bit and it can be frustrating but I am able to roll the ball properly fairly regularly.    Since I am testing putters to pick my putter for the year,  it might come in handy as an evaluation tool.  

[GolfSpy MPR]

If anyone wants to see how challenging these things are, here is a very long video of Kirke and me missing a bunch of putts:

Kirke made a good observation about halfway through: the Devil Ball exaggerates misses, but the ramp on the Perfect Putt map amplifies them further.

[Blueberry_Squishie]

Does it come with a little disc thing that helps you stand it up accurately? I haven't handled one but I imagine it could go off line immediately if it wasn't position (no matter how square you strike it).

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, Blueberry_Squishie said:

Does it come with a little disc thing that helps you stand it up accurately? I haven't handled one but I imagine it could go off line immediately if it wasn't position (no matter how square you strike it).

The alignment disc won't help you set it up; you have to set it up with the line or the plus in the correct position.   It really isn't any harder that positioning a golf ball with  line.   They do mention in the videos on Youtube that it is important to position the ball correctly or it may not roll correctly.   

[cnosil]

Watching the football game so I figured I would roll some putts with the devil ball. 

I have pretty flat berber carpet in the room that is pretty flat and smooth.   I think it does impact the roll a little bit but it seemed to work okay.  I also tried it on my hardwood floors which I think gave a better idea of roll.    

At this point I am not sure of my thoughts about the product.   I felt like the easy and intermediate "setting"  were fairly easy to roll the ball properly.   Advanced mode was different and I was able to roll it properly about  4 out of 10 times.  Not sure  if that was my carpet or my stroke.   

In the videos on youtube it was mentioned that the aid was for practicing 3-5 foot type putts and not 20 footers.  I was definitely more successful when I made strokes for the shorter distances.    

The potential negative is that if you start hitting the ball poorly you want to make adjustments.  Does the aid start to force you to change things too soon or when you shouldn't change things?   I found that I started tweaking path and grip and other aspects of my stroke....is that a good thing or a bad thing?????

 

[GolfSpy MPR]

12 hours ago, cnosil said:

In the videos on youtube it was mentioned that the aid was for practicing 3-5 foot type putts and not 20 footers.  I was definitely more successful when I made strokes for the shorter distances.    

The potential negative is that if you start hitting the ball poorly you want to make adjustments.  Does the aid start to force you to change things too soon or when you shouldn't change things?   I found that I started tweaking path and grip and other aspects of my stroke....is that a good thing or a bad thing?????

Great question.

Here's my decidedly non-professional take: it seems difficult for me to imagine that striking the ball more squarely would be a bad thing. Without guidance or a good knowledge of putting, massive overhauls are probably not a great idea, and I could see someone diving down that rabbit hole, given the level of frustration that the DB can cause.

I guess what I'd encourage for most people is this: take those ten putts (or even better, 100 or so). Are there tendencies in the misses? Lots more pulls than pushes? (I'm speaking hypothetically.) Is there a small tweak that could even that distribution?

I think the good thing about the DB is that it isn't intended to make you stroke conscious. There are lots of training aids that say, "Make this move." The DB doesn't care what your move is. It just asks, "Can you hit me squarely?" Ideally, having that external focus might lead to swing changes without conscious focus on the stroke itself.

[GolfSpy MPR]

13 hours ago, Blueberry_Squishie said:

Does it come with a little disc thing that helps you stand it up accurately? I haven't handled one but I imagine it could go off line immediately if it wasn't position (no matter how square you strike it).

The rubber ball marker/alignment tool, as @cnosil said, doesn't prop the ball up. It just helps with alignment. Right now, I'd say it's very likely going to be the marker I use on course next year. It's a bit bigger than I'd like, but it's very useful for alignment. Not only does it have all the lines, but it's shape (with the forward arc prongs [devil horns?]) is very helpful. Some might remember the MLA Putter brand, which featured a similar sort of alignment shape on the top of its putters.

A side benefit: I use a Perfect Practice putting mat for most of my indoor practice at the church. It has a long wooden ball return on its side; I have the 14' long model. Sometimes, when I just want to practice 6' putts, I need a way to stop the balls from returning all the way down the rail; the rubberized bottom of the DB alignment marker is perfect for setting on the track where I want the balls to stop .

[cnosil]

43 minutes ago, GolfSpy MPR said:

Great question.

Here's my decidedly non-professional take: it seems difficult for me to imagine that striking the ball more squarely would be a bad thing. Without guidance or a good knowledge of putting, massive overhauls are probably not a great idea, and I could see someone diving down that rabbit hole, given the level of frustration that the DB can cause.

I guess what I'd encourage for most people is this: take those ten putts (or even better, 100 or so). Are there tendencies in the misses? Lots more pulls than pushes? (I'm speaking hypothetically.) Is there a small tweak that could even that distribution?

I think the good thing about the DB is that it isn't intended to make you stroke conscious. There are lots of training aids that say, "Make this move." The DB doesn't care what your move is. It just asks, "Can you hit me squarely?" Ideally, having that external focus might lead to swing changes without conscious focus on the stroke itself.

Great perspective and it makes me wonder if this really isn’t a training aid but more of a stroke/putter assessment tool.  You asses your misses and then that gives you guidance on something you need to work on.  Let’s liken it to tools like Arccos or Shotscope, they give me data about my game and I then have to figure out how to improve and by looking at the data over time I can see if I am getting better.   
 

with the devil ball hit a series of putts and asses your performance and when you think you are better, come back.  
 

I am currently using it to assess putters and figure out which ones I more consistently deliver a square face.   I am definitely seeing different results based on which putter I pick.   

[Jim Shaw]

i am intrigued that this product has gotten so much traction on this site, from the video that was posted it looks to me like trying to hit one of those old jumping beans, I think your time and money would be better spent on finding a great putting coach that you trust and letting them take a look at areas of opportunity. Putting is so personal, look at the pros, very few are the same, btw Adam Scott shot 63 yesterday with a broom lol...

[GolfSpy MPR]

7 minutes ago, Jim Shaw said:

i am intrigued that this product has gotten so much traction on this site, from the video that was posted it looks to me like trying to hit one of those old jumping beans, I think your time and money would be better spent on finding a great putting coach that you trust and letting them take a look at areas of opportunity. Putting is so personal, look at the pros, very few are the same, btw Adam Scott shot 63 yesterday with a broom lol...

Jim,

No one is doubting that getting a coach would be a good idea. Further, part of the appeal of a product like the Devil Ball is that it doesn't demand that everyone have exactly the same putting setup or style; Adam Scott, Bryson DeChambeau, or Tiger could use it without adjusting their strokes. So the fact that putting is "personal," as you say, is not a problem here.

It is a feedback tool. If you don't hit it squarely, it goes offline. If you want to practice that with feedback, it's a tool you could use. It costs $30, which is likely less than almost any putting lesson.

I'm with you on your big point, but being for coaching doesn't require being against a training tool.

[cnosil]

48 minutes ago, Jim Shaw said:

I think your time and money would be better spent on finding a great putting coach that you trust and letting them take a look at areas of opportunity. Putting is so personal, look at the pros, very few are the same, btw Adam Scott shot 63 yesterday with a broom lol...

That is the great thing about forums like this, everyone has an approach to playing this game.   Some get fit for equipment while, others say it is a waste of time.  Some recommend lessons and others will, say I got to a scratch golfer without them.  Putting is also in its own unique category.  So say you just need a putter that looks good and some say it is all personal. The instructor I worked with explains putting as a series of choices and finding combimayions of choices that don’t conflict with each other.    Lots of ways to get to a goal.  

[Jim Shaw]

great points everyone, consil, I am really new to this forum however I am happy to see that there is flexibility to comments, I am thinking, but I dont know for sure, that most of the golfers on this site are looking to improve, as golfspy MPR mentioned, "being for coaching doesn't require being against a training tool" is absolutely correct, as all of us probably have witnessed on the range a lot, and I mean a lot, of golfers have something to help them, as a matter of fact 2 years ago one of the golfers I often practice with rolled an old tire down to the range to practice "impact" drills... I got a good kick out of that, you should have seen the looks from the other golfers on the range.... because the DB is not for me is ok, maybe something else will peak my interest. 

[cksurfdude]

On 11/29/2022 at 3:44 PM, GolfSpy MPR said:

Just curious: did you check the video? Because I offered a comparison between the Devil Ball, the Pill, and the Putter Wheel. Do you have another in this category?

Yesssir! Did watch (and you have a wonderful speaking voice). And yes the thingamajig is kinda like the Wheel.

Fwiw also have a Delta Putt which is not bad; for those who haven't seen it you putt a small plastic triangle where each side corresponds to a difficulty level in making go straight. Honestly not quite as engaging, tho....

[cksurfdude]

On 12/2/2022 at 10:06 AM, GolfSpy MPR said:

Some might remember the MLA Putter

Still using mine!!

[cnosil]

I’m continuing to experiment with my devil ball.   Seems like it mightbe a good fitting aid to help determine how well a putter fits your stroke.   I have tried using the ball with my DF 2.1, Odyssey RSX, and Seemore mFTP2.  I seem to have the most success with the Seemore and the least with the DF and I notice that to improve the success with the different putters I have to tweak my stroke a little.  This makes sense as each putter is pretty different in how it rotates through the stroke.  While the DF and the Seemore might be considered similar regarding the no torque/face balanced at impact design , the grip and setup adjustments might have a bug influence on actual impact position I achieve with the stroke.   Putter design and your individual stroke has a bit influence on whether the too woks.   Is it easier to change putters or change how you putt?
 

[TR1PTIK]

I was really thinking of getting one of these but based on the information provided in this thread I think I'll hold off. Seems like a good aid, just not exactly what I'm after right now though. Keep up the good work gents!

[cksurfdude]

7 hours ago, cnosil said:

Is it easier to change putters or change how you putt?

According to that Bruce Rearick interview it would be "A" (..he said something to the effect of manipulating your stroke won't work and you'll go back to your old "comfortable" putting stroke...)

[Jim Shaw]

way easier to change putters than change your stroke, however never forget, it is the putee not the putter that delivers the results. however having said that on occasion it is good to change putters just to get a different "look" at the putter, sometimes refocuses the golfer. 

 

[cnosil]

4 hours ago, Jim Shaw said:

way easier to change putters than change your stroke, however never forget, it is the putee not the putter that delivers the results.

 

But you still should have the right putter.   Just like any other piece of equipment you should find the right putter to help optimize the results.   A putter that matches your stroke tendencies is much easier to swing that one that has conflicts with what you are trying to do.  

[Jim Shaw]

it isnt hard to find your putting tendancies now with the technology available to us, there are so many other variables when if comes to putting...I have some questions about aimpoint putting, is this the forum to start that conversation?

[cnosil]

1 hour ago, Jim Shaw said:

it isnt hard to find your putting tendancies now with the technology available to us, there are so many other variables when if comes to putting...I have some questions about aimpoint putting, is this the forum to start that conversation?

No,  its not hard,  but many people still believe it is a waste of time.  

 

I'd start an aimpoint discussion in this forum:  https://forum.mygolfspy.com/forum/16-lessons-drills-mental-game-and-fitness-tips/    If you do a search,  you can find a couple of topics that talk about green reading and aimpoint.