Confession Corner - Admit Your Golf Equipment Biases

[Andrew75]

7 hours ago, Tom54 said:

Positive: 

Callaway - have had 4 drivers, countless hybrids, wedges, using 6 year old irons, and even a Toulon putter. My most positive company. 

TaylorMade - first driver, and possibly my favorite irons ever, the RocketBladez

Titleist - original AP1 irons. And or course, a ball or two you may have heard of.

NIKE - yes. Slingshot irons FTW

 

Negative:

Mizuno - fitted for the 919 JPX HMP. Hit them so bad and so sideways I almost stopped playing. Finally gave up on them and put my old Callaways back in and now I’m back to being at least competent. 
 

PING - spent more than I care to remember on a fitted Ping driver. Ditched it in a year. 
 

And yes, I realize negative feelings about Ping and Mizuno make me an alien in the MGS community. 
 

To be perhaps fair, though, it’s entirely possible the particular boutique fitters I went to put me in the wrong clubs, or more likely in the wrong shafts. But the performance of the irons has more or less scared me off from Mizuno, and more importantly, from boutique fitters. Can’t waste money on equipment like that. 

I'm not a believer in fitters. After 51 years I know my shaft flexes, lies, lofts and lengths very well. I have a strong grasp of smash factor, swing path and trajectory. I'm an experimenter and I'd tried just about every combo under competition. 

I keep seeing all these reviewers say "see a club fitter" in response to silly questions. I'm no Hogan, but I'd hazard a guess he never saw a club fitter.

Went to a club fitter once about ten years ago when everyone was starting to hype them. Well known boutique chain.  Had a horrible experience. They are cookie cutters and work from surmises that aren't particularly sound. They want to push certain products to exclusion of others. 

[GolfSpy_APH]

13 minutes ago, Andrew75 said:

I'm not a believer in fitters. After 51 years I know my shaft flexes, lies, lofts and lengths very well. I have a strong grasp of smash factor, swing path and trajectory. I'm an experimenter and I'd tried just about every combo under competition. 

I keep seeing all these reviewers say "see a club fitter" in response to silly questions. I'm no Hogan, but I'd hazard a guess he never saw a club fitter.

Went to a club fitter once about ten years ago when everyone was starting to hype them. Well known boutique chain.  Had a horrible experience. They are cookie cutters and work from surmises that aren't particularly sound. They want to push certain products to exclusion of others. 

Interesting take. Had you thought about going to another to see if the experience is any different? Fitting tech and more has come a long way since then.

Sure I understand you've played a long time so understand your swing and so on, but what about those with less experience who want to ensure they get the right equipment and don't have time or access to try tons of combos and so on? 

[cnosil]

2 minutes ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

Sure I understand you've played a long time so understand your swing and so on, but what about those with less experience who want to ensure they get the right equipment and don't have time or access to try tons of combos and so on? 

It’s not just time, but the financial outlay to buy the equipment to perform the experiments and make the necessary adjustments 

[silver & black]

Driver, wedges and balls - Tileist.

Irons - Mizuno.

Putter - EVNRoll.

Bag - Sun Mountain.

Shoes - FootJoy.

 

 

[TylorJudd]

1 hour ago, Andrew75 said:

I'm not a believer in fitters. After 51 years I know my shaft flexes, lies, lofts and lengths very well. I have a strong grasp of smash factor, swing path and trajectory. I'm an experimenter and I'd tried just about every combo under competition. 

I keep seeing all these reviewers say "see a club fitter" in response to silly questions. I'm no Hogan, but I'd hazard a guess he never saw a club fitter.

Went to a club fitter once about ten years ago when everyone was starting to hype them. Well known boutique chain.  Had a horrible experience. They are cookie cutters and work from surmises that aren't particularly sound. They want to push certain products to exclusion of others. 

They can be a more effective way to target your hard earned money. It's the fastest way to learn about your required lifts, lies, lengths, etc when you don't know instead of spending boat loads of cash on every club under the sun. Especially for those who have not been playing for 51 years. I'm not an advocate for every big chain fitter but there are fitters that would help whomever walked in. This is especially true in a time when technology is making this game evolve faster than it has in its history.

[jaguar55xyz]

I have a set of PXG irons first generation. I have tried their subsequent generations and didn't gain anything over my set or like the feel. I also have Sugar Daddy wedges 50, 54 and Zulu 58. Unfortunately they are becoming like all the other club makers with a new generation every 2-3 years. Not as bad as Callaway (hate) or Taylormade (Neutral).

I really like these wedges, unfortunately PXG stopped making them. So if I need new clubs i will be back to Titleist, or Ping.

I still have 1st gen PXG driver - gained 10 yards. If i need to replace I will try a different shaft rather than buy new one. I have retired the 3 and 5 woods for a Titleist 4 wood and hybrids.

I am becoming convinced that new shafts can resusitate a club you love and don't want to replace.

[ChuckZ]

23 hours ago, KevinJ said:

Ping for my driver and woods.  I had a Ping driver (G400) that the face developed a crack on.  While I had already purchased the G425 I called Ping and asked them about it to see if I had done something wrong.  They told me to take the club to a local Ping Rep and that they would look at it.  4 week later I was given a new Ping G425 driver. What I was impressed with is 2 details.  The club was out of warranty and event thought I was not thinking they would replace it with a new model or even at all, they stood behind their product and said this should never have happened.  

for the Irons, I love the Mizuno's.  I will be getting new irons this year, but I am leaning towards the new line of Mizuno irons. 

I love my Titleist irons and their feel and will stick with them, but Mizuno irons are tops in my books. Best blades out there.  Just do not have the game for their workmanship and results.    

[mackdaddy]

This is a fun thread.

I was a totally biased golfer in my early years.  I had a huge change in the nineties.  I was playing in an old CC that had a very active men's group.  They ran weekend skins for over 80 guys.  I was a hacker but also a very good athlete.  I shot in the nineties some eighties.  I started practicing at the chipping green when waiting to join a group because the club had no tee time on weekdays just first come first serve member play.  My game improved all at once from this practice.  I also started playing with a regular group and got put with the best player in the club, most didn't want to play with him because he had a quirky routine before every shot.  One evening I decide to chase a few laughs and started to mimic him.  I shot my best score ever that day breaking 90 with an 85.  The club pro was playing in our group and suggested  I should be playing forged clubs.  I laughed.  I continued to follow his routine and continued to score better just as the club match play tournament began.  I made it to the finals against the man I mimicked and he was going to have to give me 11 strokes.  My game had drastically improved but my handicap hadn't adjusted to show it yet.  He was pissed about the strokes and lost more than I won.  The prize was a $1000 at a local golf shop that was going out of business in 3 months.  I went in to get clubs and told the fitter I was a brand hoar and that the pro told me I should be playing forged irons.  He laughed and told me If I paid him $100 buck for the fitting (unheard of back then) he would make sure I got the best irons for my swing.  He tapped over the back of all the iron heads.   I really had my heart set on Titleist irons like all the best players at our club.  I hit clubs and told him after 3 swings, keep or pitch.  We got down to a top 5.  He had me come back the next day so I would be fresh.  I got down to the final 3 and couldn't tell them apart.  Two were the same club with a different finish, the KZG ZO  and the third was the MP-52.  We worked on shaft next and I ended up with a graphite shaft and the KZG ZO blades, because there were two of them out of the three.  I had never heard of KZG or Mizuno for that matter but the both felt awesome.    Since that day I will play whatever clubs fit me the best.  I improved by 5 strokes a round after the fitting.

I do think the shafts in clubs matter allot not just for weight and feel but flex, kick point, torc and loading really really effect ball flight and dispersion.  I think a smooth swing and temp player can hit anything and make it work but the best players in the world play the shaft and head combo that lets them flight the ball the way they want.

I play 7 different brands in my bag and they all have earned their spot. (8 if you count the ball)

I  don't care about companies ads for good or bad feelings.  For those of you that diss PXG as gimmicky I would ask why did so many club makers copy what they had done with their irons?  I play mine at the same lofts as my Miura's and KZG before them and the feel just as good.  I won't say just get fit and trust no matter what because my last fitter miswrote my order and I ended up with 2* flat instead of 2* upright, that brought 7 months of painful and baddd play.  I got that fixed and love the clubs now. 

[Parshooter36]

I use to be a huge Ping irons and Taylormade woods fanboy. I even had full bags of each at one time or another.  I still like both companies, but oddly enough I don't have either brands in the bag right now.

[GolfSpy_APH]

I half wonder how many of us who have been lucky enough to test through member testing have had previous bias towards that Brand and if it changed. 

When I tested the Ping i210 I already owned i E1 and it cemented that bias towards Ping for me. 

Odyssey Stroke Lab well I wasn't a big Callaway or Odyssey fan. Loved my Nike and Ping putters, but since I have really come to enjoy a lot more of their product Releases... Except the 2 Ball... i do not like the 2 Ball.

[garyt1957]

19 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Incorrect saying it’s the transmission indicates the shaft isn’t as important as those who think it’s the engine.

My point is, who cares what auto part we call it? The point the person is trying to make is that the shaft is more important then the head. And they should probably  just say that.

[RickyBobby_PR]

18 minutes ago, garyt1957 said:

My point is, who cares what auto part we call it? The point the person is trying to make is that the shaft is more important then the head. And they should probably  just say that.

The point is that the shaft isn’t as important as those people claim is why I posted the myth busting that it’s not as important and that saying it’s like an engine is also false. The more correct info that is posted on a forum the better the forum is.

[null]

1 hour ago, garyt1957 said:

My point is, who cares what auto part we call it? The point the person is trying to make is that the shaft is more important then the head. And they should probably  just say that.

 

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The point is that the shaft isn’t as important as those people claim is why I posted the myth busting that it’s not as important and that saying it’s like an engine is also false. The more correct info that is posted on a forum the better the forum is.

Please take it to Personal Messages or another thread

[TylorJudd]

2 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

I half wonder how many of us who have been lucky enough to test through member testing have had previous bias towards that Brand and if it changed. 

When I tested the Ping i210 I already owned i E1 and it cemented that bias towards Ping for me. 

Odyssey Stroke Lab well I wasn't a big Callaway or Odyssey fan. Loved my Nike and Ping putters, but since I have really come to enjoy a lot more of their product Releases... Except the 2 Ball... i do not like the 2 Ball.

Seems like 2 Ball is a hard love or hate

[Dweed]

I will 110% admit this is all on me. I will not touch a TaylorMade club. If I find a TM ball in the woods, I'll chuck it further in the woods. I really liked Adams equipment. Once TM bought them out and shortly thereafter totally dismantled them, I have a total hate toward that organization.

 

[chisag]

... I have doing this too long to have any real bias. I am open to anything from anyone and try to demo as much of the new stuff I can every year that are in a category I might play. That said:

... I do still have a slightly bitter taste from Callaway. When I went to the PGA Show every year and did reviews of the very best products in every category, one year I couldn't decide between two drivers and awarded both Taylor Made and Callaway the Best Driver award. I talked to the marketing director and some engineers and got all the info needed for a review. Wrote it and sent it to Callaway with my specs for the driver to do the follow up review, something I did with every club that won Best Of. The Marketing Director brought in the VP of Sales and basically told me since the driver was a co-award winner they would not be sending me a driver for further review. Their reasoning? They didn't want to risk me preferring the TM over their driver so they just wanted me to post the review without the follow up. I informed them the follow up on a golf forum after actually playing it is much more important than the initial review. They said they would get back to me. They finally replied a few weeks later and let me know they were running low on stock and couldn't send a new driver. LOL, I said fine, send me a demo or used driver and I will play it several weeks then return it. I never heard back from them. The RAZR Hawk Tour had quality control issues that year which may or may not have entered into it. I will still hit everything Callaway offers that is in my wheelhouse but that slight bitter taste remains. 

... And ever since Cobra released the Amp Forged players iron I have not had an actual bias as I have put P790's, P770's and T100S in my bag, but I do put them at the top of my list every year because the hosel grind is the best there ever was, the heads look just about perfect to my eye at address and they give me the exact kind of performance my game requires.  The King Tours being released this year are no exception. 

[GolfSpy BOS]

Ok, finally have some time to play this one too.  I'm going to take this as my biases per equipment type versus brand, but I'll probably touch on a few brands along the way which would apply to all categories.  I'm also being a little over-the-top as nothing would be impossible to overcome, but in a perfect world...

General Bias:  Aesthetics/Logos I have strong preferences.  The Tour Edge logo, and some of their designs, look cheap to me.  Brands like sub70 have great products, but if the logo/finishing isn't up to par I initially think of them as a lesser product (sub70 may be a bad example, as I do kind of dig their industrial vibe).  The small details matter to me, I guess "bag appeal" so paint finishing and fonts can go a long way towards my initial impressions.

Drivers/Fairways:  I tend to stick with the big OEMs and Cobra.  But have been developing a bias that TM is way more fade biased for me.  Maybe its "Twist Face" not working for me or their internal GC not agreeing with me... Callaway seems to be the best for me right now.  So they'll get first pass.  As mentioned before... Tour Edge could have the best performance, I'm still going to have trouble bagging a club that looks like it sold at Walmart.

Hybrids:  If your name isn't Titleist or Ping you need not apply.  Unless you're adjustable or can be flattened.  I love my hybrids... except when they whisper "hook" in my ear.  So flat lies and more player profiles is what I go for.

Irons:  Ok so here is a big one.... if the name of your iron set is the same as your driver for the year... you're out.  I don't want Stealth or Paradym irons.  I want Mizuno Pro 225, or Taylormade P770, or Ping i230, or Callaway Apex, or Titleist T100s.... you get the point.  I would prefer that my irons be a stand alone family, not something designed to coordinate a release with a driver (even though I'm sure that's not actuallly the case and OEMs are just taking advantage of the branding across a whole line).  For some reason, it comes of cheap to me.  While we're at it... I prefer the model number approach to clubs (TSR3, G410, etc versus names like Epic, Stealth, Rogue, etc.

Wedges:  Give me a Vokey, Vokey, and Vokey.  Players profiles are where it's at... in a darker or copper finish.  PING has a chance... if performance and feel are there... Cleveland has an uphill battle, as does Cobra, but the shapes are good.

Putters:  Milled faces all day long.  I tend to not like insert putters.  It's a feel thing.  I'm sure there are exceptions, but speaking in general biases... don't talk to me if you're not a milled face.  I am a believer in EVNROLL's face tech.

Balls:  I play Titleist ProV1x.... I'm not really sure I need to go expand upon that any further...

 

So some sarcasm and exaggerations aside... those are my biases towards gear! 

[chisag]

21 minutes ago, GolfSpy_BOS said:

General Bias:  Aesthetics/Logos I have strong preferences.  The Tour Edge logo, and some of their designs, look cheap to me.  Brands like sub70 have great products, but if the logo/finishing isn't up to par I initially think of them as a lesser product (sub70 may be a bad example, as I do kind of dig their industrial vibe).  The small details matter to me, I guess "bag appeal" so paint finishing and fonts can go a long way towards my initial impressions.

 

... Interesting and frankly a little surprised to read this. Of course you are far from alone but I have never understood "bag appeal". Kinda like a disappointing night with the head cheerleader that pales in comparison to the average looking flute player in the band and a night that you still remember 50 year later.   

[GolfSpy BOS]

10 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Interesting and frankly a little surprised to read this. Of course you are far from alone but I have never understood "bag appeal". Kinda like a disappointing night with the head cheerleader that pales in comparison to the average looking flute player in the band and a night that you still remember 50 year later.   

Yes… a little exaggerated, but I tend to appreciate things where the finer details are thought out. 
 

I’m a little into watches and it’s the same there, case finishing, dial balance, fonts… it all comes together into the final product and can really make or break a design.

and people in watch forums get into the most minuscule details to argue over.
 

I guess the example I’d roll with is if the Mizuno Pro 225 and Sub70 699 pro gen 2 both performed equal… I’d prefer the Mizuno on “bag appeal” even though I say that for me, not for whoever happens to be looking in my bag. I like the look of it better. 

[GolfSpy_SHARK]

19 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... Interesting and frankly a little surprised to read this. Of course you are far from alone but I have never understood "bag appeal". Kinda like a disappointing night with the head cheerleader that pales in comparison to the average looking flute player in the band and a night that you still remember 50 year later.   

Idk there are good nights on both ends of the spectrum maybe more I don’t even remember!….I guess that kind of proves your point though…..
back to biases!

[chisag]

59 minutes ago, GolfSpy_BOS said:

I guess the example I’d roll with is if the Mizuno Pro 225 and Sub70 699 pro gen 2 both performed equal… I’d prefer the Mizuno on “bag appeal” even though I say that for me, not for whoever happens to be looking in my bag. I like the look of it better. 

 

... I get that and understand two clubs performing equal most would pick the one that is more appealing to the eye. But it's a little like the bag filled with beat up forged clubs unrecognizably slathered in lead tape producing a smooth 69. So some of us are actually drawn to that club that looks great at address but is ignored because of  ... (pause) ... sorry ... (pause) ... still thinking of that flute player ... a somewhat homely look that belies the extraordinary performance.  

[MichaelC_81]

19 hours ago, Splatt said:

Positives

Love my Cobra driver. It just feels so powerful when I catch it right, and even when I slightly toe or heel it, I don't lose a heap of distance and it still feels controllable. I've also had a hit with the Cobra SZ fareway and hybrid and I think I definitely need to complete the set.

Big fan of Taylormade wedges, I have a gap and a lob in Taylormade (my 58 degree lob is probably my favourite club in my bag), and again, I think I need to complete the set and get a Taylormade PW and SW.

 

Negatives

PXG anything. I'll admit I've never had a swing of any PXG clubs, but my god, those visuals! All of their clubs look like something I would have designed in crayon when I was 6. What makes a golf clubs better and faster? More obnoxious weights, of course!

And, a bit of a controversial one here, but the Pro V1 golf ball. I'm sure it's because they're probably not suited to my swing speed and ratty technique, but I've had some of the worst rounds of my life with a Pro V1. Now they just give me the heebie jeebies even looking at them. The first tee box can be intimidating enough without teeing it up with a golf ball actively working against me.

Agree with the Pro V1 comment... Probably best to stick with your bright yellow 3-putt Bridgestones mate  

[MichaelC_81]

Wilson was my first set off branded irons that I purchased brand new and have stuck with them since. LOVE the Taylormade products and have the SIM driver, but the New Wilson driver does look tempting.

[TylorJudd]

5 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... I get that and understand two clubs performing equal most would pick the one that is more appealing to the eye. But a little like the bag filled with beat up forged clubs unrecognizably slathered in lead tape producing a smooth 69. So some of us are actually drawn to that club that looks great at address but is ignored because of  ... (pause) ... sorry ... (pause) ... still thinking of that flute player ... a somewhat homely look that belies the extraordinary performance.  

There is something special about seeing clubs with lead tape. Like a loyal companion that has been through the trenches with you, complete trust and faith.

[GolfSpy BOS]

7 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

… But a little like the bag filled with beat up forged clubs unrecognizably slathered in lead tape producing a smooth 69.

Well now… I never said a character and bag chatter were a bad thing!  And there’s certainly appeal to something that’s withstood the test of time as well! 
 

Some chattered up chrome blades would easily qualify as having bag appeal to me. Sadly… they’ll likely never help me his a smooth 79 let alone a 69.

[chisag]

13 minutes ago, TylorJudd said:

There is something special about seeing clubs with lead tape. Like a loyal companion that has been through the trenches with you, complete trust and faith.

 

... (apologizing for the thread detour) You would love my putter:





 

[IndyArcher]

Another Cobra fan. Been carrying them for years. They've grown with me and my game has grown with them. LTDx-LS has been the most consistent driver I've ever hit, and my F9 3 wood is about the best club in my bag and amazing for long fairway shots or a little shorter drives. I've also been playing the RF Copper irons which have a killer look and play exceptionally well for me. I just love the thin top edge when looking down on the irons. Wedges are okay, but have hit Vokeys several times and probably will move that direction for this next season. For me the weak spot for Cobra is their putters. I honestly can't fathom that the same people that make the copper irons and even the new King forged options also sell what I think are some of the most hideous putters on the planet. Not saying they are bad at all, but the aesthetic is not pleasing to my eye at all.

My putters go between a Callaway Carlsbad and an Odyssey Whitehot OG. 

If I ever venture away from Cobra irons, it will likely be Mizuno or Titleist blades. They tend to both so clean with great lines, and the visual is really important for my play for whatever reason. 

My buddy has a Titleist driver that I really like, and I have to admit the Paradym has my attention. The easily adjustable weight intrigues me. Would take a near miracle to separate me from my LTDx-LS right now, though. 

Brands of which I'm not particularly a fan?

PXG- It's the marketing. I've never hit them; doubt I ever will. I simply can not stand adds that use people with distinctly strong accents to try to convince me that it must be better because of the cool voice. A little too blatant for my taste. 

Ping- This is the absolute definition of bias. I truly KNOW Ping makes great clubs, but when I was learning to golf, there was a guy who played with us in a weekly foursome who was a member of a nice local club and who weekly made it KNOWN that he was a member of a nice local club, and that he played Pings because he could only get them as a member of this (you got it!) nice local club. I was fresh out of college and was playing a set of cheaper oversized clubs and it was clearly intended to demean me and inflate himself. I just bristle a bit when I see Pings. 

[Splatt]

1 hour ago, MichaelC_81 said:

Agree with the Pro V1 comment... Probably best to stick with your bright yellow 3-putt Bridgestones mate  

Now, now, now. My putting has been improving 

[TylorJudd]

1 hour ago, chisag said:

 

... (apologizing for the thread detour) You would love my putter:





 

I'm also a big OG blade putter fan! I played an Odyssey White Hot #8 forever! I'm more stoked you play a Napa style putter

[chisag]

Just now, TylorJudd said:

I'm also a big OG blade putter fan! I played an Odyssey White Hot #8 forever! I'm more stoked you play a Napa style putter

 

... Napa style with a ton of tech though. Roll face insert and the sole has weights in the heel and toe. Very soft insert and puts a great roll on the ball and while I find the heel toe weighting irrelevant on most putts, it's nice to have if its a really long putt with a chance of missing the center.