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what is the appropriate length of a putt to give?


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29 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I’ll ask the dumb follow-up question.   Match play doesn’t have to be a tournament, it can be played with your golf buddies.  You don’t give puts when playing a friendly Nassau or skins? 

No, protect the field.  The skins matches we play in, can have anywhere from 24 plus players.  Most cost $20 to get in for the good skins matches at the course, the one worth playing in.  To keep an honest handicap, which I maintain, I always putt out.  The men's group I play in we have 32 players and we play a modified stapleford game.  No one will will play skins in this grouping.  I also play in our City Men's Interclub League with teams from ten other clubs on the first Monday of each month and we play the same format.  Ten men on each team and throw out worst two scores.  Have not played nassau matches in years.  Do not play with a regular group.  Our men's groups mix it up.  At our ages (65-90), we are enjoy golf for the love and fun of the game.  Guess we are old school kind of guys.        

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36 minutes ago, cnosil said:

I can’t say never.  Team play where a playing partner is outside his partner that is putting for a better score to avoid showing the closer player the line.  

Yeah, match play would be an exception to my rule, particularly in a team match.  If the hole is over pick up and move on.  Or as you said, if you are giving the putt as a strategic move to not let the other team get a read on a potential winning/halving putt.  

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9 minutes ago, ChuckZ said:

No, protect the field.  The skins matches we play in, can have anywhere from 24 plus players.  Most cost $20 to get in for the good skins matches at the course, the one worth playing in.  To keep an honest handicap, which I maintain, I always putt out.  The men's group I play in we have 32 players and we play a modified stapleford game.  No one will will play skins in this grouping.  I also play in our City Men's Interclub League with teams from ten other clubs on the first Monday of each month and we play the same format.  Ten men on each team and throw out worst two scores.  Have not played nassau matches in years.  Do not play with a regular group.  Our men's groups mix it up.  At our ages (65-90), we are enjoy golf for the love and fun of the game.  Guess we are old school kind of guys.        

It's easy to maintain your handicap while being conceded a putt in match play.  You are supposed to count your most likely number of putts from where your putt was given to you.  So if you're 15-20 feet out you might score for 2 putts.  It doesn't impact your match play but helps to maintain accuracy in your handicap index:

"Unfinished Holes or Conceded Strokes

A player who starts but does not complete a hole or is conceded a stroke must record for handicap purposes the most likely score. The most likely score consists of the number of strokes already taken plus, in the player’s best judgment, the number of strokes needed to complete the hole from that position more than half the time. The most likely score is not to exceed the player’s maximum allowable under Equitable Stroke Control. However, there is no limit to the number of unfinished holes the player may have in a round, provided that failure to finish is not for the purpose of handicap manipulation.

Example: A player lies 3, 12 feet from the hole and is conceded the putt. For posting purposes, the player will records x-5 because 5 is the player’s most likely score, based on the player’s best judgment that two putts would have been required to complete the hole."

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On 1/5/2024 at 5:46 PM, ryan.mzzz said:

or, what is etiquette for giving a putt in a friendly game, say between family or good friends? I generally give putt’s two feet and in, but if my dad-in-law gets inside of six feet he starts looking for the okie doke. 

 

Me and my buddies usually do gimmes for anything inside of the metal on a putter (from head to grip). Usually favors me due to my putter being the length of an armlock.

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... I think for most it is the exact opposite of manhood estimates. You know, a "9 inch" putt is actually much longer, not much shorter than what he is claiming. 🤪

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I know you MGS guys are 'no putts given', but that never works in my circle. No one in my group ever four putts, as I give everybody's 3rd putt. Nothing more demoralizing than a 4 or 5 putt green, also I can't stand by and watch it happen as it takes so much extra time, pace of play, you know!

I've played with guys who start out stating you have to hole out everything, then when their round goes south, start to rake in 6-10 footers. 

It's different with every group. Try not to get too carried away or you are never recording a REAL score.

That's what makes golf such a great game!

Cheers, FORE

Mike

 

 

 

 

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I am all for speeding up play, and not having someone languish over a 2foot putt, or any length putt for that matter.  Doesn't mean if we are playing for bragging rights or money I will give away a close putt.  Stroke play unless there is some arrangement before we start, you putt everything out.  Match play is totally dependent on the match, where we stand, how well they've been putting etc.  It's golf, it shouldn't take 5+ hours to finish a round, but at the end of everything it is supposed to be a competition and I would rather lose a match with the yips and putting out,  than win because someone is giving me putts.  

My 2 cents.....

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3 hours ago, BLD7 said:

@ChuckZ if we are playing match play style golf, and Im in the hole, and you miss the putt to halve the hole, then I tell you to pick it up and we move on. 

Heck, if he misses the putt for a tie, he can do whatever he wants to do, the hole is completed.  No need to say a word.

Reading some of the responses, I see something of a divide between a concession (match play only) and a "gimme, which seems to apply to almost any kind of play.  Conceding a putt is situational, it depends on status of the match, format (fourball v. foursome v. individual), possible advantage to a partner, etc.  Simple "gimmes" serve basically to shorten the time (and potential heartbreak) involved in being forced to hole out on every hole.

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There isn't an accepted "standard"; however, anything beyond one foot is a stretch. Most of the players in our Senior Group (60+ members) putt everything out.

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Our club gives inside the putter grip (doesn’t include the grip) roughly 2’ - 2’6”. Does not include the tournaments.

Have been to all major tournaments in the U.S. and the Valhalla Ryder Cup to watch the golfers.

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It really is dependent on so many things. 

$$$ on the line in stroke play just putt it baby.

$$$ on the line group match play if you can't will the hole.  IT's Good from anywhere.

$$$ same as above but if it will win the hole putt it from anywhere.

Fun golf nothing on the line I work from, would I sweat this putt?  Are we playing slowly?  Is there anywhere to go if we speed things up?  If its a friend that needs to get his head right?  Is it for boggie or worse?  I don't care what score you write on the card if its a fun round.  I likely am not even writing scores down because I am practicing something.  

 

 

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4 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

That was quick.  BTW, what does your pen name cnosil stand for?  I used to work for a large bank and it was amusing how many acronyms were used and commonly understood inside the large employee base.

It was quick because I happened to read the post right after you posted.  As for my forum name,  that is extra secret and you would have to meet me in person to know.   Its my first initial and lastname. 

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I make fun of a guy saying that if he can touch the flag with one hand and reach the ball with his outstretched putter, it is a gimme.

Same guy complained in a match that he has not missed a 4-footer since 1985. I asked how many times he has actually tried.

In seriousness, I give putts that I think the person will make 90%+ of the time. There is no reason for someone to be upset by the 1 in 10 that they had a spasm or loss of concentration. A 2-foot slider can be more difficult than a 4-footer up the hill so it is a judgement call. My other thought is whether or not they think they will make it. If their knees are already knocking and they are begging for the gimme, might want to see them putt it.

 

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2 hours ago, DaveP043 said:

Reading some of the responses, I see something of a divide between a concession (match play only) and a "gimme, which seems to apply to almost any kind of play.  Conceding a putt is situational, it depends on status of the match, format (fourball v. foursome v. individual), possible advantage to a partner, etc.  Simple "gimmes" serve basically to shorten the time (and potential heartbreak) involved in being forced to hole out on every hole.

Great point on the distinction between a concession and a gimmie.  Specific terminology is very important for intent.  

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The men’s club here plays 18 inches is the gimmie range for weekly money games. Big tournaments we putt out. In the weekly groups I play they all have different rules. If it is a match play event, I give putts early and make them putt them late in the round. Often you will get them to miss one or two if they haven’t had to drill one for about 10 holes. 

Play like a champion today!

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On 1/11/2024 at 5:30 PM, chisag said:

 

I play with folks that will move the ball out of a divot, roll it in the rough, move it from behind a tree/bush

yeah, father in law does all those. he doesn’t take mulligans though or redo chip shots though so i guess i can be thankful for that. with him doing all that and myself playing it fairly by the book, it’s always interesting with either of us only winning by a few shots, and this is only a couple times a year. so it’s a tricky balance i have to maintain. also he just hit 70 and is still a fairly good player, so i guess I should enjoy what I have now. over the years I’ve discovered the key to a successful match is to pay extra so we can each have our own cart, and to remember that if I added up all the penalty strokes he deserves I would win by dozens of shots every time. That said, I still find it really frustrating having to pretend to not see when he’s rolling the ball around in the rough looking for a good lie. 

Edited by ryan.mzzz

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10 hours ago, Hook DeLoft said:

 

My question for the OP is, does your FIL give you 5 or 6 foot putts?  If not, then he shouldn't expect you to give him those.

 

he gives me usually 2 feet and in. if i’m blowing up on a hole, triple+, then he’ll do me a favor and extend the range somewhat. I think he thinks he’s giving me the same gimme's as he expects. 

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12 hours ago, MC3157 said:

I manage a large golf group here and we play for a bit of money every week and we use a modified stableford scoring system. We used to allow gimmees inside the putter grip. But then, depending on who you were playing with that week, a grip length became a bit longer and so on. Kind of like the old saying, "give them an inch, they'll take a mile". So we banned that practice since money is involved every week. So in our group, no gimmees allowed! Everything is putted out unless it's for double bogey or worse as you can't score points in stableford once your past a bogey.

this is exactly right. Our group which plays a simultaneous team stableford, individual nassau, skins, trash, plus 2 other types of bets(all kept track of by a decades old computer program for money 3 times a week)- trued up quarterly---found the same thing out. if we have 4 foursomes out, who knows what gimme range is for each group. so no gimmes.  And so by extension i play ball in hole to keep this part of my game in shape. 

Edited by bbanksp1
syntax errors, driving me crazy
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I am that guy that doesn't give any puts and don't expect to get any puts given.  We always have some form of competition going in the group and I find that guys that are used to not put those little 2 footers because they are given the whole time, tend to mis them quite often when there is something on the line.  I will hold the flag and wait for you to put out.....🤣

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My best memory of giving putts happened in an InterClub match that my brother and I were partners. We were playing at the away course and were up against their top duo. 

Match was always going to be close but my brother kept giving their putts starting out very early. I was starting to go a little crazy when he gave them a putt to win a hole. He did it again before the turn, so we were 2 down heading into the back nine. He still kept giving them putts. We had a bit of a discussion and he just asked me to trust him.

So, we get to 15 and we are still 2 down. All of a sudden they are staring at a couple of 4 foot par putts to tie the hole. Neither of them had holed a putt that meant anything for the entire day. My brother didn't say anything. Both missed! You could see the change in their confidence immediately. We won 2 of the next 3 holes to beat their aces 1 up. My brother had a funny smile on his face for the ride home and many hours after. He had used a little gamesmanship on them and it worked in our favour. I'll never forget that match.

Cheers and FORE

Mike

Played this wonderful game for 53 years now. Still love it!

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When playing for cash no putts are given.

Playing for fun its up to your group to give the ok/no particular distance.

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Putt for birdie, outside 2 feet for par, and something over a putter length for bogie or worse if they want the Okey-dokey.. Pace of play, etc..  At least for friendly games.  Leagues with season end prizes get closer to putt them all out.

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It doesn’t really matter in a friendly game as long as everyone plays by the same “rules.” But I’m sure someone will disagree. Same argument improving lies/winter rules, never ends.

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30 minutes ago, Middler said:

It doesn’t really matter in a friendly game as long as everyone plays by the same “rules.” But I’m sure someone will disagree. Same argument improving lies/winter rules, never ends.

you are absolutely correct, as long as everyone agrees, all good, same with lies, winter rules, whatever, the operative word here is "friendly game". 

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