Are Adjustable Drivers Worth It/

TwoSolitudes · August 21, 2012

I used to be completely sold on ajustibility, but I have kind of soured on it now. Being able to quickly change up shafts is the best thing about it. But I found all the little adjustments to be counter productive, in that I would look to change the driver settings when my swing started to go south, rather than focus on fixing my swing.

My driving actually improved quite a bit when I went back to the glued heads.

Its just too temping to fiddle with it.

TwoSolitudes · August 21, 2012

I'd be curious if a 10 handicapper can really be considered an average golfer

I am going to go out on a limb here (not) and say no. A 10 Hdcper is not an average golfer. 20+ is probably closer to average.

JMiller · August 21, 2012

I'm guessing that the new works that Adams has in its current adjustable renditions don't include that extension piece - It was an attempt to give more versitility but it created some unintended consequences.

The Adams Fast 12 LS comes with a 1/2" extension piece and a longer screw, I have never actually used it personally. My shaft sits at 44.50" without the extension in it would be 45.00" with it in there. Maybe I'll mess around with it when my right elbow finally gets better. I don't really see the point in it personally, think it is mostly a marketing angle.

Matt Saternus · August 21, 2012

Im not saying that it cant impact ball flight. An adjustable driver isnt going to make huge changes on your ballflight though. It wont turn a slice into a draw. Can you fine-tune your ball flight? Sure. Will it fix glaring swing flaws? Nope. An over the top swing is still going to cause a slice even with the driver set to maximum closed.

I don't think I ever said that a driver is going to turn a slicer into a drawer, however here's an example of what I see every day:

Guy comes in with a clubface average 4* open and a path that's 4* left. That ball starts 4* right of the line and has a ton of slice in it. Let's say it ends up 60 yards right of the target line. I change the face angle to 4* shut so now, at impact, his club face is square with a path that's 4* to the right. Now the ball starts on the target line and curves only half as much as it did before. Let's ball park that he's now 20 yards right of target.

Do you want to be 20 yards from your target or 60? Can you really argue that that isn't a HUGE ball flight difference?

No driver (or any club) can fix path, but path/plane are over-loved in pop-golf instruction. Controlling the club face is where it's at.

Finally, not to nit-pick, but being "over the top" does not mean the ball will slice. I teach a couple guys who 100% of golfers would call "over the top" and they hit draws, straight balls, and cuts. "Over the top" is pop-golf instruction crap. "Over the top" of what? To where? To what effect?

revkev · August 21, 2012

The Adams Fast 12 LS comes with a 1/2" extension piece and a longer screw, I have never actually used it personally. My shaft sits at 44.50" without the extension in it would be 45.00" with it in there. Maybe I'll mess around with it when my right elbow finally gets better. I don't really see the point in it personally, think it is mostly a marketing angle.

Here's what happened with the 9064 - when you take that 1/2 piece off you loose all the sound dampening and the thing sounds like a piece of china breaking. I think that's what JP was experiencing - a couple of those shots with that noise and you start to swing it like china is breaking - As soon as we put the piece back on two things happened - it added an inch not 1/2 inch like it said and the sound went back to normal - after a few swings I was hitting it great but I had a 46 inch driver and ultimately that would lead to swing issues for me - so we cut another inch off but put the extension piece back on to bring it to 45 - To me it sounds and feels just like the glued down one now.

I'm guessing Adams resolved that matter in the 12LS.

ZenGolfer · August 21, 2012

I don't think I ever said that a driver is going to turn a slicer into a drawer, however here's an example of what I see every day:

Guy comes in with a clubface average 4* open and a path that's 4* left. That ball starts 4* right of the line and has a ton of slice in it. Let's say it ends up 60 yards right of the target line. I change the face angle to 4* shut so now, at impact, his club face is square with a path that's 4* to the right. Now the ball starts on the target line and curves only half as much as it did before. Let's ball park that he's now 20 yards right of target.

Do you want to be 20 yards from your target or 60? Can you really argue that that isn't a HUGE ball flight difference?

No driver (or any club) can fix path, but path/plane are over-loved in pop-golf instruction. Controlling the club face is where it's at.

Finally, not to nit-pick, but being "over the top" does not mean the ball will slice. I teach a couple guys who 100% of golfers would call "over the top" and they hit draws, straight balls, and cuts. "Over the top" is pop-golf instruction crap. "Over the top" of what? To where? To what effect?

20 yards is still going to put you in the rough, so Im still skeptical of how much of a difference that REALLY makes in a person's game. Not to mention, as someone else said, instead of people working on their swings, they will be simply closing the face of their driver more. Even with it set to maximum closed, you can still slice.

To anser your over the top question: it relates to the target line. Over the top refers to initiating the downswing with your shoulders instead of with your lower body.

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JMiller · August 21, 2012

Here's what happened with the 9064 - when you take that 1/2 piece off you loose all the sound dampening and the thing sounds like a piece of china breaking. I think that's what JP was experiencing - a couple of those shots with that noise and you start to swing it like china is breaking - As soon as we put the piece back on two things happened - it added an inch not 1/2 inch like it said and the sound went back to normal - after a few swings I was hitting it great but I had a 46 inch driver and ultimately that would lead to swing issues for me - so we cut another inch off but put the extension piece back on to bring it to 45 - To me it sounds and feels just like the glued down one now.

I'm guessing Adams resolved that matter in the 12LS.

Nah, it sounds muffled to me not a high pitch sound at all. I probably wouldn't play it if the thing was high pitched and real loud not my style.

Matt Saternus · August 21, 2012

20 yards is still going to put you in the rough, so Im still skeptical of how much of a difference that REALLY makes in a person's game. Not to mention, as someone else said, instead of people working on their swings, they will be simply closing the face of their driver more. Even with it set to maximum closed, you can still slice.

To anser your over the top question: it relates to the target line. Over the top refers to initiating the downswing with your shoulders instead of with your lower body.

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Are you REALLY arguing that there isn't a big big difference between 20 yards right and 60 yards right?

I think I've said all I want or need to say on that point. People can make up their own mind.

With regard to "over the top," I know how most people use it (and it has nothing to do with lower body vs. upper body), I was simply making the point that it's a vague, pop-golf instruction term that I try to stay away from. It doesn't matter if your swing goes "over the top" "under the bottom" or "around the barn door," if you can control your club face and club path at impact, you can play golf.

revkev · August 22, 2012

To Matt's point:

Exhibit 1 - Bob Murphy.

Exhibit 2 - Bruce Leitzke.

Exhibit 3 - Peter Jacobsen.

These guys jump out at me as players who on the surface appear to "come over the top."

No one has jumped on it - either way - and I'd love to hear an informed comment to my remark that many stock glued drivers come 2 or 3 degrees closed. And I don't mean the ones marked "draw". I think that lots of guys are playing with a closed face and they don't even realize it.

JMiller · August 22, 2012

With regard to "over the top," I know how most people use it (and it has nothing to do with lower body vs. upper body), I was simply making the point that it's a vague, pop-golf instruction term that I try to stay away from. It doesn't matter if your swing goes "over the top" "under the bottom" or "around the barn door," if you can control your club face and club path at impact, you can play golf.

LOL, great post Matt... I feel that the terminology in golf is a lot of times wrong or miss understood espesually when it comes to instruction.

Matt Saternus · August 22, 2012

No one has jumped on it - either way - and I'd love to hear an informed comment to my remark that many stock glued drivers come 2 or 3 degrees closed. And I don't mean the ones marked "draw". I think that lots of guys are playing with a closed face and they don't even realize it.

Sorry, RK, got caught up in my own convo there and missed your comment. You're absolutely right, many OTR drivers are built with closed faces or are internally weighted for a draw bias. Same reason the stock shafts tend to be very soft-to-flex and high torque: that's what the OEMs believe will be the best fit for most people. As someone said here or in another thread (I lose track): the OEMs are not evil, at least insofar as they ARE trying to make the best club for the majority of golfers. If their club works the best for golfers, it should sell well which will make money for them. We, as golf equipment snobs, may not like the stock options, but they fit a lot of people.

This is another reason that I like the adjustable drivers: you don't have to sort through the rack to find one driver that looks good, you can just tweak the one you have to suit your eye/ball flight preference.

JMiller · August 23, 2012

Sorry, RK, got caught up in my own convo there and missed your comment. You're absolutely right, many OTR drivers are built with closed faces or are internally weighted for a draw bias. Same reason the stock shafts tend to be very soft-to-flex and high torque: that's what the OEMs believe will be the best fit for most people. As someone said here or in another thread (I lose track): the OEMs are not evil, at least insofar as they ARE trying to make the best club for the majority of golfers. If their club works the best for golfers, it should sell well which will make money for them. We, as golf equipment snobs, may not like the stock options, but they fit a lot of people.

Just to name a few that come to mind that are not closed faces / draw bias that are non-adjustable drivers

Adams ~ Speedline, Speedline 9032LS, Speedline Fast 10, Speedline 9064LS, Speedline F11... Maybe all of the non-draw marked models have a square face angle.

Cobra ~ S9-1 Pro-S (1.5* Open face angle) & Pro-D (2.0 * Open face angle)... I'm sure there were others that were not closed faces

TMaG TP ~ Anyone that remembers the old non-adjustable heads TP meant 1* open compared to the non-tp being 1* closed. Now TP is only shaft options as far as i know in the adjustable drivers.

These are just some I had on the top of my head I am sure there are a lot more out there if we bothered the look around.

revkev · August 24, 2012

To JM - that's probably why I prefer Adams drivers - I like the look of a neutral club face.

Why not a component driver RP? The reality is that most of us have one right now - we have a head that we've paid for from an OEM and then we've ordered a shaft to fit along with a grip, had a guy trim it just right for us - If we purchased quality components and did the same thing what would be the difference other than we wouldn't have some manufacturers name on the head?

GolfSpy Barbajo · August 29, 2012

Good point...I know nothing about component manufacturers...I've heard the names thrown aroun here, though with the exception of a set of wedges, I've never really looked at a component driver head...

Are they the same/superior quality as the big OEM stuff?...

How about cosmetically?....

Fairways & Greens 4ever....

Doing that free fitting thing next week (as mentioned in a different thread). Going to be fit for driver, fairway wood, hybrids and wedges. The fitter is an Alpha & Miura dealer and can put just about any shaft in any club. Liked the Alpha irons when I looked at them last winter, and the Alpha woods are considered very good from what I've read -- the Long Drive gang uses them. Miura? Only if the company has a really good 4th quarter and the bonus is beyond generous!

Will keep you posted on what I learn....

Here's Alpha's website:

http://www.alphagolfclubs.com/collections/drivers