Not to beat a dead horse about long putters, but....

[RookieBlue7]

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golftalkcentral/usga-to-make-long-putter-ruling-this-year/?cid=facebook_A_gc_LONGPUTTER_USGA

 

The long putter, and specifically anchoring, remains a hot topic in golf circles as the game's rules-makers inch closer to an announcement on the implement's future.

 

Earlier this summer, U.S. Golf Association executive director Mike Davis told GTC that an announcement would come this fall regarding the ongoing use of long putters, and he confirmed on Monday that a statement was imminent before the end of the year.

 

“We do plan to make some kind of announcement, as promised, later this year,” Davis texted. “We have yet to figure out a day, but I would guess sometime late next month or early December.”

 

In July, Davis told GTC that any potential change would likely wait until the end of the current rules cycle (January 2016), although the USGA and R&A have made rule changes in the middle of a cycle in the past.

 

“The only times we've changed during a cycle was when there was something within the rules that absolutely didn't work. Either we didn't have an answer for something or the way the rules were written, it created a problem that was flat wrong,” Davis said.

 

“If we make a change, again, if we make a change, it will be Jan. 1 of '16, and it would be a rules change. We wouldn't ban the long putter, we wouldn't ban the mid-length belly putter. We're looking at the type of stroke that is made.”

 

To me, it's basically saying they're discussing and likely will be banning anchoring.

[furu]

I agree. It's the anchoring. I think this opens up a whole new world of problems. There are going to be so many tv-viewer refs calling in that the "moving ball" episodes seem like nothing even for Padraig and Camilo.

 

They should either ban the long putters by setting a limit on the length of a putter or leave it alone. I hate long putters But I don't want to ban them. Just ignore them.

 

Will Kuchars pressing against the forearm be banned too?

 

One final question - How many European players used a long putter at the Ryder Cup?

[RoverRick]

I believe you are reading words that you want to be there. He said they were going to study it and make a decision. Also, that whatever the decision is it will not have an immediate effect. He goes on about how they never have an immediate effect, but he says nothing that leans either direction. I have used them but do not currently use one, but I may start again no matter what they say.

[RookieBlue7]

The tone is awfully suggestive is all I'm saying.

[whiskey golf]

I agree with RookieBlue7, it sounds like they have made a decision but are waiting a little longer to release an official statement. Also, if they say that they MIGHT make a change, why would they be setting dates for a rules change already if they are "undecided"?

[westy]

Rolls eyes, here we go again. Any chance it'll get put to bed?

And no euros used a long putter and let's remember they didn't hole much for two days.

 

 

 

 

 

[apprenti23]

Boy I can't wait to hear about all the lawsuits!

[RookieBlue7]

What will they be sued for? The putters themselves aren't being discussed as being banned. The equipment will still be 100% legal. The method is all that is being discussed and the method is all that will be disallowed. Does it take the effectiveness of the equipment away? Of course, but its not making the equipment illegal.

[BK in TEXAS]

What will they be sued for? The putters themselves aren't being discussed as being banned. The equipment will still be 100% legal. The method is all that is being discussed and the method is all that will be disallowed. Does it take the effectiveness of the equipment away? Of course, but its not making the equipment illegal.

 

Ya, but you can sue for anything nowadays

 

It sounds like they are technically not going to ban the equipment, but define how a stroke is made. That will in essence, be a ban certain style putters.

 

Unlike groove, or COR changes that affect every player, banning anchoring will only affect a few players. Lawyers could easily argue discrimination; especially since A. there is no proof it offers any competitive advantage, and B. it's been allowed on tour for so long.

 

I don't know that they'd win the lawsuits, but I can see the potential for them. I'm just playing devils advocate, and I'm not a lawyer, nor does it bother me either way what they decide!

[GolfSpy WD]

What will they be sued for? The putters themselves aren't being discussed as being banned. The equipment will still be 100% legal. The method is all that is being discussed and the method is all that will be disallowed. Does it take the effectiveness of the equipment away? Of course, but its not making the equipment illegal.

 

The issue is the idea for the ban is purely arbitrary since there is nothing I've seen so far that backs it up.

 

Put it this way, if you own a company that manufactures dishwasher detergent and the governments makes dishwashers illegal because they decide dishwashers are anti-American. Your product is not illegal, but you're still screwed and I'm sure as hell a lawsuit would be upheld.

 

Personally I think the decision will be to put an end to this issue and explicitly allow anchoring.

[Tyk]

It sure sounds like they are going to change something. It would be much ado about nothing if they weren't going to make a change.

 

I also don't see any merit in a lawsuit as far as equipment manufacturers are concerned, but that doesn't mean they won't try.

 

I do wonder about potential legal action from current tour players that have in some cases grown up using long putters. I could see an attempt made to claim that the PGA/USGA has harmed them in changing the rules.

 

My big beef I guess is that I have not seen anything conclusive that states that using a long putter confers an advantage, and even if it did, if it is available to all players, then "advantage" is not even applicable.

 

Even moreso, I have seen how long putters can extend the longevity and enjoyability of the game among recreational players. The confusion and conflict this will cause will not be good for the growth of the game.

[RoverRick]

I just can not do it. I was trying to ignore this and not argue with the anti long putter Nazi's out there but I can not keep my mouth shut. Actually, it is my laptop that is not shut. My wife does not want to hear it.

 

It is not the manufacturers that will bring a law suit. It will be a class action suit by the people who currently use these putters (PGA Major champions among them) and putting systems. The fact that is discriminatory and prejudice against certain people and not others will make this a winner. It will also have to include anyone who currently or may use anything other than a conventions grip. It does not matter if this is the grip itself, such as Super Stroke or 2 Thumbs, or if the player uses the claw or the saw, because they ban this method, with no factual basis, than they are free to ban any of these other methods.

 

The only thing wrong with this method of putting is that some people do not like it and honestly, this is a media driven debate. You have the same guys who could not make it on tour for various reasons, are now on TV every week griping about these and stirring up a debate that is actually not even an issue for the players.

 

Yes, I have used them in the past and currently own three putters. A conventional, belly, and long putter but I game the conventional most of the time. I think that if any PGA player honestly believed it gave them an advantage over their current putter they would play it right now. That is why some do. It gives THEM and advantage but it does not give everyone and advantage for the same reason putter with a lot of toe flow does not benefit everyone and why a minimal amount of toe flow does not benefit everyone. The fact that it is available to everyone means that it is not an unfair advantage. If you take it away it is now a discriminatory rule that gives and advantage to those people who putt better with a conventional length putter and discriminatory against the others.

[Firstkart]

I HATE PUTTERS

 

Ban them all I say and solve the problem.

 

AJ

[RoverRick]

I HATE PUTTERS

 

Ban them all I say and solve the problem.

 

AJ

 

No kidding. If all we had to do was pick up once we hit the green it would be so much more fun.

[skihippy]

Guys I believe that its time to pick this thread needs to be picked up again. One of the biggest reasons I am bringing this up is because the PGA is about to make there announcement.

 

Also because I am thinking about picking up a Cameron Big Sur S for practice keeping my core together but it I like it I will game it.

 

Whats everyone's thoughts?

[RookieBlue7]

Ski, may want to wait till after the ruling is made, could be cheaper then, LOL. I know a guy that's son is a top ranked amateur, committed to Oklahoma State that's put one in play after years of using a standard putter because he says "it's stupid easy to use and everything goes in the hole".

[RoverRick]

Skihippy,

 

Get it if you want. As a 15 handicapper you probably will not be trying to qualify for the open next year anyway. Also, I do not believe that the USGA and R&A are stupid enough to do away with these. Not that they have ever proven that they are not stupid. But if the decision comes down as it should be that there is no statistical advantage of using one of these over the other than the value may go up. Also, if this is one of the new ones, I have a Big Sur S but from 2002, but the new ones have different weights that can be changed so you can cut it off and make it a standard.

[RoverRick]

SH, RB hit it about waiting. And besides that's a dman expensive practice puutter if ya can't bag it. Hell I've got 9 belly, six of 'em converted traditionals(35"), so I may be convertin 'em back. LOL(Sorta)

 

 

 

Fairwasy & Greens 4ever

 

Richard, do you have a Cameron Newport 2.6 laying around looking for love. I have the 1.5 GSS but I hate the offset shafts that Cameron uses. My Big Sur is a staight shaft model. If the ruling comes down against them I will simply cut it down and use it as a standard length. It will be a heavy sucker. But I used it as a standard length for much of the year and actually only replaced the shaft a few months ago making it a broomstick again. I did install the high dollar Cameron grip without tape, ala the Pure Grip Gun, so that I could remove it and make it shorter and not loose the grip.

[Ice]

The thing that kind of baffles me is that it is irrelevant if the putter provides ANY advantage at all over other competitors, because those other competitors are able to simply go grab a long putter themselves and gain that advantage. If they choose not to, they forgo that "advantage"...

[BIG STU]

Well I am gonna throw my half of cent in I have used all 3 and I have went back to a conventional putter. I have no problem with anyone using them or anchoring them. I dont see an anchored putter as being fool proof for everyone. If you talk about anchoring then would that open up a can of worms on all techniques period ie interlock grip vs overlap grip. If in the pro ranks anchoring the putter was a advantge for everyone then every pro would do it. To ban them is as foolish as saying that a player beats me every week using Ping clubs that Ping clubs should be banned. It would be as stupid as banning metal drivers or hybrids because supposedly they help you play better. Personally I cant hit a hybrid worth a hoot but I dont see banning them. The GC was all over the ban because the Asian kid that won the Asian amateur and got an invite to the Masters was using one. I wonder if they would of got upset if he had been using a 1922 Bobby Jones Calimity Jane putter? It is senseless. It is as senseless as saying a player putted the lights out using a TM Ghost so we should ban them!! Golf has darn near gotten as bad as auto racing on all levels!! far as the pros do I could give a hoot less. For recreational players if it helps keep them enjoying the game dont ban them. Heck if you wanna play with me for fun or money you can use a croquet mallet as far as I am concerned!

[RookieBlue7]

I've heard from a pretty reliable source that a decision has been made and agreed to by the USGA and R&A.

[RoverRick]

This is such crap. I know I have said this before, probably 100 times, with yesterdays purchase of the Kombi it is bringing all back. The Kombi/2 Ball/#7/Spiders, how about all mallets, are much more easier to master than changing to a longer putter. These are the reason for putting stats on tour going up.

 

I switched to the Kombi and while I had several three putts, they were all long putts or tricky breaking putts and I had the speed all wrong. This was due to the weight differential and simply using a putter for the first time. These were on the first 9 holes (22 putts as best I remember) and the middle 9 holes (16 putts), I putted much better. On the last 9 holes my competitors were remarking about how quickly I adjusted to the new putter with just 12 putts on the last 9 holes.

 

So with 27 holes in the books with the new putter it is safe to say that I was no where near that good with the longer putters after 27 holes. Of course I have putted with a short putter, and putted well, before. The lighter head of the Kombi (aluminum) vs the Big Sur (steel and copper plated) does not make the ball roll as smoothly and it will not hold the line like the Big Sur. I have to learn to play a little more break but it is still much easier to align on short putts.