To have Lessons or not to have lessons

[GolfSpy WD]

Anyone can answer this question not just Richard, sort of an open question to get people thinking about what part of the game is more important long term and why.

 

Very simple answer, it's whatever causes you to have the most fun. Most high handicappers focus on the long game because of the ego aspect, but also because they're so damn sick of searching for balls in the woods. Additionally, I bet most don't keep score, so the short game point is a bit moot. Finally, they don't want to embarrass themselves by slicing the ball on a drive.

 

Once a player can reasonably hit it in playable territory (not necessarily the fairway), then they should practice the short game more than the long game.

 

That said, putting and chipping can be done in a basement and should be done as often as possible, but if you have to focus on one thing, I guess my answer is it depends on your skill level and what is fun for you.

[Blade]

Player B. When I first started, I couldn't hit a FW to save my life, but I still scored in the 90s because I had practiced my short game so much before ever getting on a big course. Even at that, my putting wasn't/isn't great. But if I had been lousy near the green, even finding FWs etc. I would have scored higher. You can make up for bad shots if you're good around the green. If you're losing them there, you're out of chances to recover.

[JMiller]

WD that is likely the case, but this is the 19th hole, I'm purposely going off topic here a little to get a point across. You are not out there to have fun and screw around playing $50 a hole unless you are way richer then I am My screw off bets are $1 a hole personally not $20 plus a hole.

 

Player A has a great short game, it's as good as a 5-9 handicap players short game.

Player B has a really good long game, it's as good as a 5-9 handicap players long game.

 

Both players shot roughly the same scores and are 20 handicaps (call it 90 to 95 scores on a par 72 if you want). You are a 2 handicap and would play to scratch against either one giving them 18 strokes regardless whom the one player you pick to play against is. Think about this very carefully from an aspect of not losing a ton of money and possibly making money.

 

So whom do you pick to play $50 a hole against where you can double the bet (automatic press) at any point during the hole?

 

 

 

 

 

My selection would be Player B to explain this let me show where player A and Player B have the potential to be lower then then handicaps.

~ Player A could in theory have a great ball striking day off the tee and into the green, if this happens you are plying a 10 handicap roughly not a 20. You are giving that person 8 strokes free to their maximum potential.

~ Long game fluctuates more then the short game and putting, putting and short game are pretty steady aspects of a players game. You might get up and down 70% one day 80% the next but it really stays within 105 normally. The long game you might hit 90% fairways one day and 30% the next day. Player A can be really no worse then a 22 handicap but has the potential of being a 10handicap on the good striking days.

~ Player B has the potential at best to be a 15 handicap when he has a little better day with the flat stick and wedges. However, if they have an off day with the long game they have the potential of being a lot worse then a 20 handicap maybe upwards of 25+ handicap because he can't get bailed out with the wedges and putter.

 

In short:

~ worst case I give Player A 8 strokes on his best day and my average day.

~ worst case I give Player B 3 strokes on his best day and my average day.

~ Best case Player A gives me 1 or 2 strokes on my average day his bad days.

~ Best case Player B gives me 5+ strokes on his bad days and my average days.

 

The best bet is to give as few strokes out as possible on the persons best days, and get the most strokes possible when they have a bad day and you play your average... If you both play to your averages it is a wash anyways or win / lose 1 hole not that big of a deal.

 

 

The player that has a good short game has a lot more potential for going low then the player that has a great long game simple as that.

[JMiller]

Oh I know I was just tossing a fun little what the hell thing out there... the golfer that has one extremely good aspect of there game and one very piss poor one is rare if not un-heard of. It is always a mixed bag between the two leaning one way or another.

 

Yes men have massive egos but to play good golf you need to drop the ego all together, maybe that is the true lesson of today.

[JDFish]

Congratulations! Before kids, I had a similar goal. I had taken periodic lessons through the years, with different pros, some of whom screwed me up royally for a while. But I found someone that, taking a look at 2 swings, made a slight correction or suggestion and was able to head me in the right direction. But golf is a game of habits, mostly bad. He told me that for each lesson, to groove it, it would take about 1000 balls. And I found he was right. Over the course of a summer, my handicap dropped from a 14 to a 4 and I was able to keep it there for 3 or 4 years until kids came along. There is no magic fix. It takes time and practice. Since my practice time dropped to near 0, my handicap rose and hovered between 10 and 11. But both of my girls have an interest in the game, my oldest played on her junior high team this year, and we all take lessons and hit balls together (and occasionally play), which is the best part. And my handicap last year dropped back down to 8.

[JMiller]

I just get worried reading stuff that people want to get better but all i see is crap about full swing. It is likely this person will eventually hit "the wall" in improvement and get no better, it's possible they will blame their full swing and then get worse rather then better.

 

As the old saying goes "Drive for show putt for dough". Dropping the ego in golf will allow you to focus on the little not so "sexy" or "macho" crap of the game like hitting it 350 off the tee. It replaces the focus of playing the game from green to tee and that's how you get your handicap to drop the fastest take less putts, get up and down more often.

 

I would say that a pitch shot is a mini version of a 1/2 wedge shot, a 1/2 wedge shot mini version of a 3/4 wedge, a 3/4 wedge is a mini version of the full swing. If you do the 9/3 drill really well the full swing is just a little more lift or rotation or both to get to the top of the full backswing.

 

Good short game can spill into a good long game, it doesn't really go the other direction to often I don't think.

[parsave]

I had this quote in my sig a few weeks back. It's one of my favorites:

 

"Practicing your short game will help your long game in every way, however, practicing your long game wil not help your short game in any way."

 

-Harvey Penick

 

He taught the game this way, as did his proteges.

 

HaHa, he's lookin down smilin at ya, which is what he would do, saying nothing, just a smile, when someone "got it"

 

 

Fairways & Greens 4ever

Love a lot of Penick's advice. Best I heard was "learn the game from the cup back to the tee." Anytime my game goes stale I always start from the cup and work my way back. Works for me anyway.

[revkev]

Okay I'm going to start by saying that I fully agree that its about the short game stupid. I've always felt that practicing part wedges benefits the full swing and when you have confidence that you can make putts and hit chips close the long game gets way, way easier because the pressure is off.

 

Having written that I hate the old saying, "Drive for show, putt for dough." I hate it because it's not true - It's about the short game assuming you have enough long game to not shoot yourself in the foot before you even get to the green. You can shoot in the 80's, heck you can shoot even par with a series of pretty crapy shots in the long game so long as you aren't racking up penalties - You need to have at least enough long game to keep the thing out of trouble most of the time though - I greatly prefer - "Drive to set the hole up, putt for dough."

[RoverRick]

I have avoided this topic because the one time I even thought about taking a lesson they guy wanted to change everything I did so I abstained from the whole lesson thing. I have read a couple of books now, with mixed results.

 

The first book, The Four Magic Moves to Play Better Golf by Joe Dante was my first golf instruction other than what my dad, who was a horrible golfer. This book took me from a 13 handicapper to a 3. However, one of the "Magic Moves" hurt my back. I tried to play through it for a year but since it was never getting better I decided to change things up.

 

The last book was The Plane Truth for Golfers by Jim Hardy. Hardy does not advocate one swing over the other, One Plane or Two Plane, well, he actually does but he claims not to. But he separates the two and lets you figure it out for yourself. I found his book really helped my understanding of the two swings. I was a Two Planer, and switched to a One Planer a few weeks ago, and then switched back yesterday. Actually the day before. I videoed my swing earlier this week and learned that everything I had worked a year to get rid of had come back when I went to the one plane swing. So I went back to the two plane, but with some set up changes and have a Freddie Couples like swing now. (Sometimes:rolleyes:)

 

But what I found extremely helpful was yesterday evening I went out with a golfer of comparable skill, he and I alternate on who wins the weekend matches. He has a picture perfect swing, but is lacking in the short game department. I on the other hand swing like a tire on a rope but have a terrific short game. I told him what I wanted to do and he watched me and told me what I was or not doing. Within 7 holes I was hitting the ball great with all my clubs. I played again this afternoon and really struck the ball well. Without his help I would have taken much longer to make these changes. If this is the type of teacher/coach you have, than that is great. If I hit a bad shot I would tell him what I thought I did and he would confirm or deny that that really happened. Then when we got close to the green we worked on his short game.

 

So someone to help with your swing is great, but they have to understand first how to do it right and what you are doing wrong.

[revkev]

Plus 1 RR I would also add what you are trying to do.

 

I really miss my teacher from Wisconsin because he knew what I was trying to do. I think Hardy is the bomb when it comes to golf because he recognizes that there are two swings (probably more.) We are who we are and unless we are doing this for big time money and concerned about whether or not our swing will hold up on Sunday at a Major we're best to go with what we got and working on making that more efficient. Heck there are lots of guys on tour who have games that fit certain courses better than others - guys who grew up in the Southeast that become competitive when the tour moves here and so on and so forth and they're able to be succesful.