Deer Antlers - The Fountain Of Youth For Vijay

[GolfSpy_X]

 

The US Tour has repeatedly warned players against using sprays made by a company called SWATS – Sports with Alternatives to Steroids.

 

In 2011, former Open Champion Mark Calcavecchia was told to stop promoting the product.

According to Sports Illustrated, Singh paid $9,000 for the deer antler spray, an oscillating 'beam ray' lightbulb, stickers bearing holograms of a pyramid and power additives in November. He is quoted as saying that he uses the spray ‘every couple of hours….every day.'

 

Singh. a member of the World Golf Hall of Fame, said he sleeps with the 'beam ray' on and has put stickers, which SWATS term chips, on his ankles, waist and shoulders.

 

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail...l#ixzz2JTh5npYw

 

[Walkerjames]

If Vijay knew it was a band substance and still told SI he was using it then I think the spray also kills brain cells and he should stop using it.

[revkev]

Don't even know what to say about this given that it's in the news big time in two of the major team sports right now. I've yet to go on my schpeel on MGS and I know that Rookie won't like it when I do but he's entitled to his opinion as am I so here goes with no malice towards him. I also want to go on record that this isn't an older guy saying these young guys can't possibily do what they are doing without cheating. Aside from PED's all professional sports have changed radically in my lifetime. Beyond a doubt athletes are bigger, stronger and faster but even more significantly the amount of money involved has grown exponentially greater. When I was a kid all but the biggest stars in their sport needed to work some sort of offseason job to support themselves - that included pro golfers who regularly sold cars, insurance, did assitant pro work, gave lessons, etc., etc. Comparing guys who played in the 50's to guys who play today is not apples to apples by any measuring stick.

 

And so here goes, with the money available in golf it is nieve to think that there aren't guys out there who are using or have at some time used some sort of PED. The only question really is who they are, how many of them are there and what type of PED is being used. Guys are going to do what they can do to gain an edge. I don't pretend to know enough about these things to understand how they work or how much of advantage they bring - What if it's the equivalent of a stroke a week during the season - it would be interesting to take a guy from the middle of the money list and see how much he would have earened had he shot one stroke better each week. I'm betting its significant.

 

Finally for round one I would never think of a guy who is using a PED as lazy - they are done by and large to enable the athlete to recover quicker so that he can work harder or to allow the work that he's doing to have a greater impact.

[Aotearoa_Brad]

My two cents: I agree with you Rev that Vijay is likely the tip of (hopefully) a small iceberg, and I have to say that the PGA Tour are in no position to throw their arms up in the air and claim that they're shocked. My understanding from the report and the report on Golf Channel last night is that testing for this substance requires a blood test, and that the PGA Tour only utilise urine samples to test in their random testing program. Without someone coming out and admitting using the substance (ahem, Mr Singh) I can't see how they'd be able to keep this in check. You know for damn sure that players who even have a passing interest (and I'm confident it is a small minority) will be aware that the urine tests don't show this substance up, and there's a very real chance that this is too much of a temptation for some.

[furu]

I'd like to know if the deer gets paid! That much money - something should go back to the deer community.

 

This is actually a serious case but it'll be gone in a few weeks. Small fine for Vijay, "never do it again" statement that actually means "do it again but never tell anyone again".

 

I'm sure there's doping in golf. Not when the play and are healthy, but when recovering from injury.

 

Only testing urine is so 1983. Look to other sports and get a modern system in place. Can they be part of the Olympic Games when their doping checks are basically non-existent?

[revkev]

I'd like to know if the deer gets paid! That much money - something should go back to the deer community.

 

This is actually a serious case but it'll be gone in a few weeks. Small fine for Vijay, "never do it again" statement that actually means "do it again but never tell anyone again".

 

I'm sure there's doping in golf. Not when the play and are healthy, but when recovering from injury.

 

Only testing urine is so 1983. Look to other sports and get a modern system in place. Can they be part of the Olympic Games when their doping checks are basically non-existent?

 

Furu We've disagreed on a couple things but we are in total agreement here. Although they aren't perfect I way prefer the Olympic testing to the testing done by pro sports in this country. At least it has some teeth to it and it's harder to dupe.

 

Don't know if anyone caught what Joe Ogilvie said on the topic but it implies that there are others who use.

[RoverRick]

Oh deer, where do I start? This is something that I deerly would like to address. Excuse me, he spent $9,000 on this junk. Obviously, he has more money than he has sense.

 

I deerly hope that they do something but I do not think he deserves the one year but I honestly could not careless what they do to him. He had plenty of opportunity to find out if it was OK and anyone who is subject to drug testing must find out if it is legal before they take it, unless it is some type of medical deal but then they should immediately contact the Tour and find out.

 

I guess he did not see the banned substance because it was written in BLAZE ORANGE.

 

I would like to think that this is not that wide spread because it is so stupid. However, I see guys wearing magnets, copper braclets and such all the time.

 

One last thing about Vijay, he did not give a press conference today because he was out rubbing his forehead on trees.

 

It will be funny to see the fans reaction on 16. Will they dress for deer hunting or will the hold their hands like antlers.

 

Finally, one of the biggest worries about this is that Vijay has this overwhelming desire to cross the cartpath about dusk.

 

 

Vijay, said he is anxious to get this behind him and looking forward to "Locking horns with his fellow competitors at the Waste Management Open.":lol:

 

He did not intentionally "BUCK" the system.

[The Dansome]

Would suck if there's a suspension and he's not Champions Tour eligible next month. Was looking forward to his domination.

[Will Par]

I think this speaks to the mindset of some athletes who are rich and famous. They can purchase anything they want except their health and their youth. Given the opportunity, they will buy anything that promises to recapture the youth and skills they see are declining. I don't think Vijay is trying to gain an edge... He's trying to hang on to what he once had. Maybe it works. He has had more success in his 40s than most pros.

[Super Tuna]

Would suck if there's a suspension and he's not Champions Tour eligible next month. Was looking forward to his domination.

 

I haven't a clue if it's actually effective at helping him be more a range rat but, it obviously has the side effects of destroying brain cells. Lets give a brilliant interview admitting to using a banned substance. What a fantastic idea.

 

As to doping on the rest of the tour, I don't see why they wouldn't. Putting yips? Beta Blockers baby. Though I equally suspect that the "doping" side may be more of the recreational variety then performance enchancing. I still suspect, as others have said, that the "jet skiing injury" to DJ last year was something else entirely.

[BK in TEXAS]

Damn...I have a garage full of deer antlers. I should get Vj's number....

[RoverRick]

Flashing lights and deer piss, now that is a party.

 

 

 

I know I would feel younger.

[Walkerjames]

Oh deer, where do I start? This is something that I deerly would like to address. Excuse me, he spent $9,000 on this junk. Obviously, he has more money than he has sense.

 

I deerly hope that they do something but I do not think he deserves the one year but I honestly could not careless what they do to him. He had plenty of opportunity to find out if it was OK and anyone who is subject to drug testing must find out if it is legal before they take it, unless it is some type of medical deal but then they should immediately contact the Tour and find out.

 

I guess he did not see the banned substance because it was written in BLAZE ORANGE.

 

I would like to think that this is not that wide spread because it is so stupid. However, I see guys wearing magnets, copper braclets and such all the time.

 

One last thing about Vijay, he did not give a press conference today because he was out rubbing his forehead on trees.

 

It will be funny to see the fans reaction on 16. Will they dress for deer hunting or will the hold their hands like antlers.

 

Finally, one of the biggest worries about this is that Vijay has this overwhelming desire to cross the cartpath about dusk.

 

 

Vijay, said he is anxious to get this behind him and looking forward to "Locking horns with his fellow competitors at the Waste Management Open.":lol:

Puns intended love the post RR.

[RookieBlue7]

I really don't want to delve into the world of PED's, but I will anyway. Until someone fails a test, I will not assume anything about them. Did Vijay admit to this, absolutely, and assuming it's on the PGA Tour's banned list (IGF-1 is, for the record, but SWATS Ultimate Spray isn't listed anywhere I've seen), then he deserves any penalty that's handed down.

 

That said, as the Ray Lewis story was the first to break, then the story from the owner of SWATS that the Alabama football team used it before the 2012 BCS National Championship game, Vijay was last. What was my first response? I immediately pulled all of the banned substances lists. None featured SWATS Ultimate Spray by name on there, IGF-1 appeared on all of them. Thing is, SWATS Ultimate Spray hasn't been tested and evaluated by the FDA, and has not been confirmed to contain IGF-1. Is it claimed? Sure. Do I believe the porn star that started the company's marketing claims? Well, considering their website is vague and the marketing is vague, I'm not sure I even know what I'm supposed to be believing.

 

The next person that will be linked to this, some way or another? Tiger Woods, I'm nearly certain. It may not be SWATS per se', but the rumors will start swirling about his PED usage again. And guess what? He's NEVER failed a test, EVER. But, it's not natural to get that big and strong and dominant without it they'll say. I counter with he's busted his ass since the age of 2 when he was told he couldn't do something (and that something was play golf because of his skin tone). But he got so huge so quick. Well, no, he didn't. If you'll go through pictures (readily available via google, or you can search Getty Images) from 1996 to current, you'll see that he didn't turn into the Incredible Hulk, he in fact put on muscle mass slowly over a period of time, gradually getting bigger. It's also hampered his ability to drive the ball straight (remember his masterful performance fresh out of Stanford when he BLEW the field away at Augusta in record setting fashion? He did it as a wirey kid with a 43.5" steel shafted driver and he was BLOWING it past everyone. AND IT WAS STRAIGHT.)

 

And I didn't get on this to get on a Tiger rant. I'm not really certain where I was going when I started typing, I just let my brain release, and the typed verbal diarrhea above is what you got. I will say that instead of point the finger at every athlete on the planet in today's sports world (as that's what anyone over the age of 40 is going to do more than likely), consider this. Medicine advances. Knowledge of nutrition advances. Training methods and understanding advances. Athletes specialize from a young age. When you were a kid, did you focus on one sport? Unless you're younger (I'm about to turn 30 myself), you likely played EVERY sport out there. Now, kids play 1 sport and they play it their whole life in hopes of turning professional. And they do it in spectacular fashion. With the advancements in nutrition, training, the human body, etc, sorry, but the guys from the 30's, 40's, 50's, pick a generation, are being passed by. Is it PED's? Well, until you can prove it, nope. It's god given talent, and it's dedication to the craft. And NO amount of PED's is going to change a person's DNA or give them superhuman abilities, or even abilities they didn't already have before. Find a bum under a bridge and give him steroids, or choose your PED. If he couldn't hit a 90 MPH fastball before, he won't be able to now. if he couldn't hit a golf ball straight before, PED's won't enable him to. If his fast twitch and slow twitch synapses didn't fire at a high level of a professional athlete's before, no amount of drugs or medicine are going to change that.

 

So go ahead, fire away at my post. This topic has already been beaten to death on a few sports pages I'm on, so I might reply, and I might not. Who knows, depends on what buttons get pushed.

 

Yeah, there's my rant for the day.

 

Oh, and for the record, if he spent $9k on it, he hasn't been on it long because the spray alone is $279 per bottle.

[RoverRick]

I guess he did not want to have a press conference today because he might be accused of "having that deer in the headlights look.":P

[RoverRick]

When ask if he was feeling any effects he said that he did feel like he was in a "rut" between November 13 - December 15.

[revkev]

For some reason Rookie and I never seem to reach a middle ground on this topic. I intentionally stayed off of Tiger and will continue to do so. I will point out however that Lance Armstrong never failed a drug test and we see exactly what that meant.

 

Anyone who thinks taking PED's can get a guy from under a bridge to hit a 90 mph fastball is nuts. But it can take a guy from the minors to a spot on a major league roster and a minimum salary of 400K plus instead of 2K a month. It can also take a 4th outfielder, career ,265 hitter and make him into a .300 plus hitting allstart who goes from 3 million per year to 12 million plus. This is about the money.

 

So if that would happen in baseball I'm very certain that there are PED's and a way to use them that would benefit a professional golfer if only in coming back from an injury or in body recovery time for more intense workouts - the primary benefit of PED's as I understand them anyway.

 

I haven't a clue who are how many on tour are using PED's. I'm simply saying there are some beyond a doubt. Some are doing it unwittingly because those lists are in fact more difficult to figure out than you might think. They do it when they're trying to come back from injury or by talking to other pro athletes about their workout routine. A few probably do it intentionally. I'd like to think that since golfers are used to enforcing the rules themselves that they are way fewer of them doing PED's than in other sports. I really do buy that.

 

I totally agree with Rookie that there are tons of reasons why athletes today are bigger, faster and stronger than athletes in years gone by that have nothing to do with PED's and everything to do with hard work and self discipline. I'd like to see a level playing field for everyone though and I don't believe there will be until PED's are legalized or there is some sort of test that will catch the cheaters. I'd prefer the latter.

 

So in short my comments on this thread have nothing to do with thinking that today's athlete is worse than yesterdays and has to cheat to make himself look good nor is it about Tiger. It's about the fact that a Hall of Fame golfer has admitted to using a banned substance and that I believe, as does Joe Ogilvie apparently that there are others on tour who do as well.

[RookieBlue7]

Joe Ogilvie as a reference isn't a very good one. He can't keep up with the big boys so of course he wants to try and point the finger at them. He wants his prospects of actually winning to go up.

 

There is not one test that can prove one is doping for IGF-1. IGF-1 is a chemical that is naturally produced in the body. You want it out of sports? You're going to have to remove every professional athlete's pituitary gland. Have fun with that. The media leads us to believe that this spray is supposed to make one produce more IGF-1. There is no normal level that's the same across the board.

[JohnBarry]

Here is my rant/opinion. Please take it as you will and don't let it define my character.

 

PED's for recovering from an injury are fine and should be perfectly legal and administered to any golfer by a PGA approved and monitored Doctor.

 

Any PED used to give a specific healthy golf an edge over another healthy golfer should be banned and the golfer face a suspension.

 

Short rant, but what I think should be correct and put in place.

[furu]

You can't use an insufficient system as argument for the lack of revealed doping cases. Look at cycling. They caught them after they developed new tests.

 

I don't think anyone would claim that golfers use drugs to get bigger and stronger. I'm sure they use them to stay healthy and get back from injury. It's still doping.

[Paul S]

Well, ignorance is not bliss, that much is for certain. While I think that this should be an eye-opener on tour, I feel that the PGA Tour should probably react consistently with their treatment of Mark Calcavecchia in a similar matter.

 

The media is frustrating in that they seem for the most part to be trying to hang Singh for oversight. Give him the benefit of the doubt this time, move forward, and stress future penalties for such infractions.

 

This shouldn't be something that is received with such emotional reaction. Watching Morning Drive today, all three of those guys spent some time with Tom Pernice Jr. on the phone and essentially spent the whole conversation trying different methods to get Tom to condemn Singh and cry for suspension like they were. I generally like the show, but I did not appreciate watching them employ tactics like that with a very clear agenda.

 

I guess you could argue that by posting like this that I too am getting emotional about it... It's kind of a contradiction, but oh well.

 

Paul

[whiskey golf]

This might seem like a stupid question but can someone explain to me what the hell he took exactly and what is it supposed to do. I'm too lazy to read through the comments or research it.

[TWShoot67]

Damn...I have a garage full of deer antlers. I should get Vj's number....

 

I thought it comes from the velvet, not the antler itself.... Otherwise I can start eating all my deer antlers I have hanging o the wall. LOL

[TWShoot67]

I really don't want to delve into the world of PED's, but I will anyway. Until someone fails a test, I will not assume anything about them. Did Vijay admit to this, absolutely, and assuming it's on the PGA Tour's banned list (IGF-1 is, for the record, but SWATS Ultimate Spray isn't listed anywhere I've seen), then he deserves any penalty that's handed down.

 

That said, as the Ray Lewis story was the first to break, then the story from the owner of SWATS that the Alabama football team used it before the 2012 BCS National Championship game, Vijay was last. What was my first response? I immediately pulled all of the banned substances lists. None featured SWATS Ultimate Spray by name on there, IGF-1 appeared on all of them. Thing is, SWATS Ultimate Spray hasn't been tested and evaluated by the FDA, and has not been confirmed to contain IGF-1. Is it claimed? Sure. Do I believe the porn star that started the company's marketing claims? Well, considering their website is vague and the marketing is vague, I'm not sure I even know what I'm supposed to be believing.

 

The next person that will be linked to this, some way or another? Tiger Woods, I'm nearly certain. It may not be SWATS per se', but the rumors will start swirling about his PED usage again. And guess what? He's NEVER failed a test, EVER. But, it's not natural to get that big and strong and dominant without it they'll say. I counter with he's busted his ass since the age of 2 when he was told he couldn't do something (and that something was play golf because of his skin tone). But he got so huge so quick. Well, no, he didn't. If you'll go through pictures (readily available via google, or you can search Getty Images) from 1996 to current, you'll see that he didn't turn into the Incredible Hulk, he in fact put on muscle mass slowly over a period of time, gradually getting bigger. It's also hampered his ability to drive the ball straight (remember his masterful performance fresh out of Stanford when he BLEW the field away at Augusta in record setting fashion? He did it as a wirey kid with a 43.5" steel shafted driver and he was BLOWING it past everyone. AND IT WAS STRAIGHT.)

 

And I didn't get on this to get on a Tiger rant. I'm not really certain where I was going when I started typing, I just let my brain release, and the typed verbal diarrhea above is what you got. I will say that instead of point the finger at every athlete on the planet in today's sports world (as that's what anyone over the age of 40 is going to do more than likely), consider this. Medicine advances. Knowledge of nutrition advances. Training methods and understanding advances. Athletes specialize from a young age. When you were a kid, did you focus on one sport? Unless you're younger (I'm about to turn 30 myself), you likely played EVERY sport out there. Now, kids play 1 sport and they play it their whole life in hopes of turning professional. And they do it in spectacular fashion. With the advancements in nutrition, training, the human body, etc, sorry, but the guys from the 30's, 40's, 50's, pick a generation, are being passed by. Is it PED's? Well, until you can prove it, nope. It's god given talent, and it's dedication to the craft. And NO amount of PED's is going to change a person's DNA or give them superhuman abilities, or even abilities they didn't already have before. Find a bum under a bridge and give him steroids, or choose your PED. If he couldn't hit a 90 MPH fastball before, he won't be able to now. if he couldn't hit a golf ball straight before, PED's won't enable him to. If his fast twitch and slow twitch synapses didn't fire at a high level of a professional athlete's before, no amount of drugs or medicine are going to change that.

 

So go ahead, fire away at my post. This topic has already been beaten to death on a few sports pages I'm on, so I might reply, and I might not. Who knows, depends on what buttons get pushed.

 

Yeah, there's my rant for the day.

 

Oh, and for the record, if he spent $9k on it, he hasn't been on it long because the spray alone is $279 per bottle.

 

 

Nothing against your post, but I just went on the SWATS site and it's 64.00 a bottle and if you buy 3 you get 1 free. So that's so thats $192.00 + 6 for shipping for 4 bottles not $279 per bottle. But then again he bought the Hologram stickers and STROBE light for visuals while sleeping...lol

 

 

Here's a link for all those who want to buy my spray:

My link

[TWShoot67]

This might seem like a stupid question but can someone explain to me what the hell he took exactly and what is it supposed to do. I'm too lazy to read through the comments or research it.

 

 

Look at my link above you'll see. It's deer antler stray, supposed to contain a series of special ingredients that help with a number of things when it comes to getting old and recapturing that youthful glow.

[TWShoot67]

When ask if he was feeling any effects he said that he did feel like he was in a "rut" between November 13 - December 15.

Brother your on a roll. The Buck stops here!

[revkev]

Rookie - I don't think you're catching what I'm saying about this or maybe you are and you honestly believe that no pro golfer has ever used a PED because there is no benefit to them for golf or because golf is somehow immune to an issue that has plagued other sports.

 

 

If that's the case we disagree - Of course there's a benefit if only for healing and recovery to do additional training. I suspect there's more of a benefit.

 

I suppose this is because we (Rookie and I) have a history on this topic that others here aren't privy too - I'm not accusing Tiger in this thread, I haven't a clue if Tiger ever used or didn't use - I believe Tiger is one of the top 3 players of all time and I would never quibble with anyone who put him in the top spot. I think he worked like a dog to get where he was and continues to work hard to try and get back to the top so that he can reach his life goal of catching Jack. I admire his play and have loved watching him particularly when he was at his best. I'd like to see that again just as I'd love to see Jack play at his best just that one more time. I admire greatness.

 

Can I say anything else so that whenever this topic comes up you wont' think I'm taking a backhanded swipe at Tiger?

 

In regards to PED's I would agree with whoever wrote, (John Barry perhaps), that they should be fine for recovery from injury. They should be fine for whatever their intended medical use is - I have no trouble with that. Good luck figuring out how to write the rule and how to apply it.

 

This issue is really something - consider that a guy who had 3,000 hits in his MLB career and was never linked to any PED use didn't make the baseball Hall of Fame this year in part because of the way a bunch of PED users muddied the waters of the ballot.

 

I'm afraid I see that sort of thing coming for golf - I hope I'm wrong because it's made such a mess out of the sport that was my first love (not any more.)

 

I'd like to know how football coasts through all of it - they had such a problem with steroid use in the 70's that guys were dropping like flies from abusing them and yet very little of it has stuck.

[skihippy]

Alright guys here is what where going to here about for the next month. I can't believe that Vijay had the knowledge of it being illegal. If he did I don't believe he would just come out and admit to it. I don't see deer antler being any type of performance enhancer all that deer antler is is calcium.

[Firstkart]

what amazes me is that there is a plethora of sports that seem to think that performance enhancing drugs are an exception in their case and not the norm.

 

MoroGP lets riders take pain killer injections minutes before a race so that a rider can ride, AFL (football here in Australia has 3 strikes rule, WTF)and god knows what else is out there.

 

Cycling ( Lance Armstrong) has been dragged over the coals ( lets not forget they all did it) and lets not forget the Russian Olympic program etc etc.

 

If you think that a drug is not enhancing your performance then pull your head out of the sand (read ARSE) and get with the program.

 

If your body can not handle the pressure of the sport and your body needs a substance to perform then you are cheating, plain and simple and you should be dealt with consistently regardless of the sport.

 

AJ

 

PS 2 year ban for Vjay and learn from your your mistake.

[RookieBlue7]

Nothing against your post, but I just went on the SWATS site and it's 64.00 a bottle and if you buy 3 you get 1 free. So that's so thats $192.00 + 6 for shipping for 4 bottles not $279 per bottle. But then again he bought the Hologram stickers and STROBE light for visuals while sleeping...lol

 

 

Here's a link for all those who want to buy my spray:

My link

 

 

The other day when I looked when the Ray Lewis story broke, it was $279 a bottle. I've listened to this guy's interviews a few times, as local radio has interviewed him a few times. He was on local AM Sports Talk radio yesterday. Seems to me he's trying to restart a company that has been bankrupt and using the largest stage in sports to do it.