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I'm sure everyone's heard Steve's take on the drop, that he thinks a DQ was in order. According to Rex Hoggard from Golf Channel, a lot of other Tour pros and caddies feel the same way.

 

We probably should let this drop(pun intended), but I figure they let him move a friggin' boulder, so whatever's good for Tiger, blah, blah blah....

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I'm not really a huge Tiger fan since 'the incident' - but the rule of allowing penalty shots to be assigned to a players card after signing and not DQ'ing was put in place for this very reason.

 

I still don't like it but it's what's in place right now. Sorta like the BCS - nobody cares for it but heck, it's what's there now, so we gotta deal.

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I had no problem with anything other than the simple fact that he admitted he improved his lie- once you do that you are cheating. No ifs ands or buts

 

I also think that the rules committee said hey- we f'd up and didn't rule correctly, we will give you the opportunity to dq yourself. We all know what that egotistical pos did then... I'm willing to guess that every other player in that event would've taken the high road.

 

Did you guys hear him complaining about the conditions Sunday in his post round interview? What a narcissist....

 

What do you guys think would've happened had this situation would've been that guan kid?

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Personally, I was a bit disappointed that Tiger didn't disqualify himself.

 

Having said that, The "rules committee" or whatever they are called, saw fit to levee the two stroke penalty instead of DQing him. I can live with it... so long as the same approach is taken with another player should the same thing happen in the future.

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I had no problem with anything other than the simple fact that he admitted he improved his lie- once you do that you are cheating. No ifs ands or buts

 

I also think that the rules committee said hey- we f'd up and didn't rule correctly, we will give you the opportunity to dq yourself. We all know what that egotistical pos did then... I'm willing to guess that every other player in that event would've taken the high road.

 

Did you guys hear him complaining about the conditions Sunday in his post round interview? What a narcissist....

 

What do you guys think would've happened had this situation would've been that guan kid?

 

Funny thing happened today on the course. On the 16th hole, my neighbor's approach shot came up a bit short, hit the rocks, and bounced back, crossed back over the corner of the fairway and went into the water beside the fairway. He did exactly like Tiger did and moved to the ideal distance along his line of flight and took a drop.

 

However, just like in Tigers case, the ball did not last cross the hazard line on the line of flight. It crossed at a significantly different angle because of the bounce. So he took an illegal drop. We were playing match play so he lost the hole anyway but had this been a stroke play event and had he signed his card then this would have been just like Tiger's situation. But he hit the ball directly at the flag and it went into the hazard. He knows that as he can move forward or backwards along the line and take a drop or drop in the same spot or in the drop zone. However, there is not a drop zone so that is out. What he does not realize it that the line he is dropping on is not the proper line. This is exactly what Tiger did. Was my neighbor cheating? Was he trying to take unfair advantage? It did not matter he lost the hole anyway.

 

When Tiger was questioned about this, because he had made the statement that he dropped 2 yards back and they thought he dropped as close as possible, he said that he dropped back because he thought you can move anywhere along that line. He did this. They said you can but that is not the line where it crossed the hazard. So Tiger like my neighbor had to drop as close as possible to where he last played the ball. Which when he was told that they looked at the video, it looked like he dropped as close as possible and Tiger said absolutely not. He dropped 2 yards back. This made it an illegal drop. And the penalty for this is two strokes. The penalty for this is not DQ.

 

Since this was brought up after he has signed his card, before April 2011 he would have been DQed but they changed the rule so that if an infraction comes to light after you have signed you card you are no longer DQed simply because you had signed your card. The committee did not consider DQ ing him because in their opinion, this was the reason the rule was changed in the first place. They can DQ a player for signing for the wrong score, but if there is a penalty that changes the score than this is the reason for the rule change in the first place.

 

I believe that no matter who this was, they would not have DQed them.

 

As far as Tiger complaining about the conditions, I thought he was complaining that the rain made the greens much slower and he always has trouble on slow greens. I see nothing wrong with complaining about the weather.

 

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Personally, I was a bit disappointed that Tiger didn't disqualify himself.

 

Having said that, The "rules committee" or whatever they are called, saw fit to levee the two stroke penalty instead of DQing him. I can live with it... so long as the same approach is taken with another player should the same thing happen in the future.

 

Let's say that they change the rule for hitting the ball out of bounds. Instead of you must replay the shot from as close as possible to where you originally hit it, that they now allow it to be played like a hazard. You get to drop along the line of where it went OB.

 

Would you still play this as a stroke and distance penalty?

 

If not, why should Tiger withdraw from a tournament where he received a penalty, but did not receive a penalty that was as severe as it used to be. If the reason that the score you signed for is wrong, because of a penalty that you were unaware of or a ruling that came down after you signed you card, then the penalty is no longer automatic disqualification. Why should a player withdraw when they are receiving the appropriate penalty anyway.

 

If Tiger would have withdrawn, how many Tiger-haters would then claim that he withdrew because he was mad because he got a penalty he did not like?

 

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Fairway:   :mizuno-small:  ST190TS 15° on Fujikura ATMOS Black

Hybrids     :mizuno-small:  CLK 22 & 25 (set to 20° & 23°) on Fujikura SPEEDER

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Let's say that they change the rule for hitting the ball out of bounds. Instead of you must replay the shot from as close as possible to where you originally hit it, that they now allow it to be played like a hazard. You get to drop along the line of where it went OB.

 

Would you still play this as a stroke and distance penalty?

 

If not, why should Tiger withdraw from a tournament where he received a penalty, but did not receive a penalty that was as severe as it used to be. If the reason that the score you signed for is wrong, because of a penalty that you were unaware of or a ruling that came down after you signed you card, then the penalty is no longer automatic disqualification. Why should a player withdraw when they are receiving the appropriate penalty anyway.

 

If Tiger would have withdrawn, how many Tiger-haters would then claim that he withdrew because he was mad because he got a penalty he did not like?

 

I see your point, and after thinking about it, I agree with you.

 

For the record, I'm not a Tiger hater at all. I love to watch him play. I'm not a fan of the man so much, but I don't watch him because he's a great guy! ;)

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The problem was that the committee knew he made a wrong drop, the head of the committee said that they didn't want to interrupt and assess the penalty while he was playing the 18 th hole. This was the committees fault. The new rule 33-7

Came into affect because the committee screwed up. The non DQ at that time was the correct decision, but because the committee waited until the next morning to say anything, they could not DQ him because of rule 33-7, Tiger did not screw up, he was the beneficiary of the new rule and an incompetent committee. This will not be so much of an issue in the future if every other golfer gets the same treatment, but I think the fear in this whole mess is that this benefit is only for Tiger, and no one else get be afforded this benefit.

Lefties are always in their Right Mind

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The problem was that the committee knew he made a wrong drop, the head of the committee said that they didn't want to interrupt and assess the penalty while he was playing the 18 th hole. This was the committees fault. The new rule 33-7

Came into affect because the committee screwed up. The non DQ at that time was the correct decision, but because the committee waited until the next morning to say anything, they could not DQ him because of rule 33-7, Tiger did not screw up, he was the beneficiary of the new rule and an incompetent committee. This will not be so much of an issue in the future if every other golfer gets the same treatment, but I think the fear in this whole mess is that this benefit is only for Tiger, and no one else get be afforded this benefit.

Whereever you heard that the committee knew he made the wrong drop while he was on 18 is simply wrong. They looked at his drop and ruled it fine based on the video. They cleared him before he finished 18. So even if he would have asked them about it, and I have no idea what they say in the scorers tent, they would have said he was good.

 

In his post round news conference he said he dropped 2 yards back using the part b of the rule. But by then he had signed his card. They did not talk to him about this until the next day. Now it is obvious here that he had no idea it was a bad drop otherwise he would have said nothing.

 

Either way the rule was made so that no one is DQed for a penalty.

 

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Fairway:   :mizuno-small:  ST190TS 15° on Fujikura ATMOS Black

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Wedges: :mizuno-small: MP-T5 52*, 56* & 60* on True Temper Dynamic Gold Wedge

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I see your point, and after thinking about it, I agree with you.

 

For the record, I'm not a Tiger hater at all. I love to watch him play. I'm not a fan of the man so much, but I don't watch him because he's a great guy! ;)

Thank you. I do not watch Tiger because he is a great guy either. I appreciate the fact that you read may argument and were able to change your mind on this.

 

Driver:      :mizuno-small:  ST190G on Fujikura ATMOS Black

Fairway:   :mizuno-small:  ST190TS 15° on Fujikura ATMOS Black

Hybrids     :mizuno-small:  CLK 22 & 25 (set to 20° & 23°) on Fujikura SPEEDER

Irons:     :mizuno-small:  MP5 5-P on True Temper Dynamic Gold

Wedges: :mizuno-small: MP-T5 52*, 56* & 60* on True Temper Dynamic Gold Wedge

Putter:    :cameron-small: 2018 Select Newport 2

Balls:      :titelist-small: Pro V1X

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I find it amusing when people take a self righteous stand, and pontificate about what they or others would/should do in a hypothetical situation, lol

 

My sense of humor is a little different B)

 

 

Fairways & Greens 4ever

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I agree with you, I have beat this down like a dead horse.

 

I am willing to bet 90% or more of the people reading this would just have dropped in the drop zone and not even contemplated the other two options if they even knew them by the rules. They would have never even found themselves in the situation Tiger did because of the logic / decision making of the average player.

 

With that said if John Doe makes the same mistake when the cameras are not pointed at him, I have a feeling that the player doesn't get caught by the rule. The problem is more that the stars / leaders are under the microscope way more then the no-names that still make a living on tour but don't often win, they just truck along and keep themselves in the top 100 on the money list. It's more unfair to the stars / leaders then it is the "nobody".

 

I think that Rule 33-7/4.5 has set the expectations for the stars / leaders of a golf tournament that are under the microscope the DQ will always be waived when a rules infraction happens that they are not aware of. I mean honestly, I can't say that anyone that is on Tour is going to attempt to violate a rule on purpose to gain an advantage over the field and flat out cheat. You might see that kind of crap on your local Mini Tours from time to time but those guys will never make it past where they are at.

 

So the guy not under the camera gets no penalty and the guy under the camera looks down the barrel of a 2 shot or DQ because they are a star. I don't really think it's fair to the field / competition to have only a select group of people "caught by the rules".

 

The USGA / PGA Tour need to figure out a way that will give a even playing field across the board for everyone in every tournament. If that means putting a walking official with every group using shot tracker / technology to confirm scores for everyone while they are still on the course, whatever it takes to gain the level playing field again. Maybe the simplest answer is to stop allowing the stupid ass call-ins on rules violations as it only effects what is shown by TV Networks and no one else, bring in "caught by the rules".

 

Oh well just my 2cents, this is the third time I have posted something about this situation on this site alone, I got asked about it at the Golf Course by employees and members that know me as well what I thought about it. Almost seems like hell has frozen over :)

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Maybe the simplest answer is to stop allowing the stupid ass call-ins on rules violations as it only effects what is shown by TV Networks and no one else, bring in "caught by the rules".

 

Best post you've ever had! :lol: Write that in to the PGA Tour! I bet they'd agree! At least the player's association would!

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Maybe they would agree with me or not, they were the ones that did add the rule for the reason of PGA of America / Rules officials could call in if they saw something. So that really goes against what I think :)

 

We are the only sport that allows the score to be determined by someone not on the field of play. You call into a football game because they missed a call like holding a play or two before the offensive team scores a touch down, they laugh at you and say "we are human and can't catch everything". It's not like they are going to adjust whom won the game by removing the 7 points for the TD and PAT the play or two after the missed violation happened.

 

I guess I'm just trying to find a little logic in a game where some of the rules are far from logical.

 

 

Really, a lot of us here play serious golf by the rules, if we know we violated a rule we call it on ourselves. If we are not sure of a rule we ask our playing partners or a rules official when available. i carry a rules book in my bag so that I can look up a rule if needed for someone. I think it is WAY over kill to have TV callers aka "sofa officials" watching every move of the stars and letting the John Doe off because they not on TV for the same violation.

KZG VC-420 ML (10.5* Loft & 0.2* Open Face Angle) @ 44.50" (2" Bore Depth) w/ Graphite Design Tour AD DI-7 Stiff

Tour Edge Exotics CB3 Tour 16.5* @ 42.50" w/ RT Technologies Zeus (85g) Stiff (Tipped 1/2")

Srixon Z U45 19.0* @ 39.75" w/ KBS Tour-V X-Stiff (Soft Stepped 1x)

Cleveland 588 MB 3-P @ 38.75" - 35.25" (0.25" under), 60.5* - 64.0* (0.5* upright), 22* - 48* (1* weak) w/ KBS Tour-V X-Stiff (Soft Stepped 1x)

Cleveland 588 RTX 2.0 Black Satin (Blade) 54-12 @ 35.25", 64.00* w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold s400

Cleveland 588 RTX 2.0 Black Satin (Blade) 60-10 @ 35.25", 64.00* w/ True Temper Dynamic Gold s400

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Let's be honest about this. The same people who say he should have withdrawn are the same ones that would have been here all week pontificating about how he is a spoiled brat and got caught trying to cheat and got mad and went home. These people would not be happy no matter what.

 

Glad to hear Jack agrees with me and JMiller.

 

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Fairway:   :mizuno-small:  ST190TS 15° on Fujikura ATMOS Black

Hybrids     :mizuno-small:  CLK 22 & 25 (set to 20° & 23°) on Fujikura SPEEDER

Irons:     :mizuno-small:  MP5 5-P on True Temper Dynamic Gold

Wedges: :mizuno-small: MP-T5 52*, 56* & 60* on True Temper Dynamic Gold Wedge

Putter:    :cameron-small: 2018 Select Newport 2

Balls:      :titelist-small: Pro V1X

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I'm fine with the way that the events transpired, I think that simply adding strokes after the round is the best way to handle post round penalty strokes. The signed scorecard used to be the only way to validate a player's score, now we have shot tracker and Golf Channel cameras all over the place, a player could not bother with a card and everyone would know what they shot. I get the tradition of a signed scorecard, it is representative of the honor of the game.

 

On a side note, one of my shop kids brought up an interesting view on having rules officials with every group. All of the "major" sports, including soccer, have an official put the ball back in play or approve the spot of a ball put back in play. If a rules official is with every group, they can be charged with approving the placement of every drop that may take place in each group.

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On a side note, one of my shop kids brought up an interesting view on having rules officials with every group. All of the "major" sports, including soccer, have an official put the ball back in play or approve the spot of a ball put back in play. If a rules official is with every group, they can be charged with approving the placement of every drop that may take place in each group.

 

That's adding 50 or more officials to the clutter of the fairways and also the attendant cost of equipment and support. You're talking about a considerable increase in overhead.

 

 

Shambles

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That's adding 50 or more officials to the clutter of the fairways and also the attendant cost of equipment and support. You're talking about a considerable increase in overhead.

 

 

Shambles

 

Not to mention training all of these people, in a perfect world that would be the way it is done, actually in a perfect world the players would know the rules or have the sense to call for an official if they have any questions.

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If a rules official is with every group, they can be charged with approving the placement of every drop that may take place in each group.

 

This was my initial thought and if I were a PGA tour professional, this is what I would want! However, I wonder if this would have an adverse affect on Pace of play? I do not think it would speed up play. Would we now see 5-6 hour twosomes on the PGA tour or would the 4 1/2-5 hour twosomes remain?

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