Jump to content
TESTERS WANTED! ×

Misconception of playing muscle back forged irons


Golfn' Dude

Recommended Posts

I was thinking of writing an article about the misconception of muscle back irons...and who 'should' play them and players that 'should not' play them.

 

I personally think it's what you've grown up playing. I like the clean look of blades, and find I hit them pretty far. When I miss a shot I never really think I was I had cavity back irons for that one.

 

I think they're a lot easier to hit than what most people think. My long iron game I can struggle with at times but I wouldn't want anything else in my bag than what I have.

 

What do you guys think?

What's in my Sun Mountain 3.5 Deluxe Bag?

 

Driver - Callaway Razr Fit, 9.5 degree loft, standard face setting, fade bias weighting, Matrix Ozik HD6 Stiff shaft, tipped 1 inch

3 Wood - Callaway Razr Fit 15 degree loft, open face setting, stiff shaft

 

Irons 3 to PW - Titleist 712MB with KBS Tour Stiff steel shafts

3 to 5 iron - .5 degree flat; 2 degrees stronger

6 to PW - 1.5 degree flat; 3 degrees stronger

 

Mizuno MP-R12 54 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 53 degree loft; now 8 degree bounce

Mizuno MP-R12 58 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 57 degree loft; now 9 degree bounce

Titleist Vokey 64 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 62 degree loft; now 5 degree bounce

 

Putter - Odyssey Metal X 9

 

Ball - Callaway Chrome +

 

 

My Golf Site

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think the modern blade is a lot different than the vintage blades. The modern blade is forgiving, the vintage blade had a sweet spot the size of a dime and you knew when you missed it. There's no who should or shouldn't be playing what clubs. Sure, there are suggestions and GI clubs have built in help vs a blade, but the way I see it is people play for different reasons. Some play to shoot a score, some play to have fun, and some play just for te challenge. Who am I to tell someone how to spend their money? If hitting blades makes them happy, why should they play anything else?

In The Bag
Driver: TaylorMade M2 (2017) w/ Project X T1100 HZRDUS Handcrafted 65x 
Strong 3 wood: Taylormade M1 15* w/ ProjectX T1100 HZRDUS handcrafted 75x
3 Hybrid: Adams PRO 18* w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4 Hybrid: Adams PRO 20* (bent to 21*) w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4-AW: TaylorMade P770 w/ Dynamic Gold Tour Issue Black Onyx S400

SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
LW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
XW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger stepped
Putter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"

Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. Bomb and gouge. Yes, I'm a club gigolo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Exactly, there is no right or wrong answer to this question, it's all about what makes you happy while playing golf.

 

Personally I'm happier on the green than looking at a thin top line so I'm playing the Amp Cell's that I reviewed for MGS.

Driver: :taylormade-small: SLDR w/ Fujikura Ventus Black

3w: :taylormade-small:'16 M2 hl w/ Diamana D+ 82

5w: :cleveland-small: Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Yellow

Hybrid: :cleveland-small: 22 deg. Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Black

Irons: :cleveland-small: 5i - gap Launcher CBX w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Wedges: :cleveland-small: 54 CBX & 58 Zipcore w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Putter: :odyssey-small: Red 7s

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is a subject I have been debating for some time. I love the MP33's and the MP 59's. When I mishit the 33's it is more like a misswing than a mishit. I swapped the MP33's on the CTLites about a month ago. I have to say that I have never had a better month of ball striking than I am having with the MP59's. But I fear I may be confusing longer for better.

 

Here is what I mean, in the week before I changed, I was killing the ball with the irons. I actually scored 5 out of 7 rounds in the 60's. Never happened before. But driving was awesome, as was putting etc... Just for the record, to fire a round in the 60's everything is good. But I had planned on changing these to the MP59's and did. This also increased my distance because of the stronger lofts. I was so happy. Since making this change, my iron play is better than ever. Par 3's have become birdie holes. And I am hitting the par 4's more often in regulation.

 

However, here is the interesting thing. My average score is not getting lower. I am finding that the MP59's while more forgiving on the full swing, are not as near as accurate on the partial swings as the MP33's. I was planning on swapping these back before the Texas Open but am now considering waiting until afterwards.

 

 

I have switched back to my older Titleist wedges and changed to a new ball so I will see how these changes effect me.

:ping-small:G430LST 10.5° on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Driver 

:ping-small:G430MAX 3w  on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Fairway 

:ping-small:G425 3H on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Hybrid 

:taylormade-small:P790 Black 4-A 
on :kbs: TGI 80S
 

:mizuno-small: ES21 54-8° & 58-12° on :kbs: Hi Rev

:L.A.B.:DF2.1 on :accra: White

:titelist-small: ProV1  

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro  NX7 Pro

All Iron grips are BestGrips Micro-Perforated Mid

Driver, 3w, 3H are JumboMax JMX UltraLite XS 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm all for people spending their money how they want, but if you're gonna play muscle backs you better be a damn good ball striker or do a combo set. Even tour players need a little forgiveness.

 

Nobody gets happiness out of hitting shitty shots or bad scores. Nobody. Anyone who says that is a liar.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good post. Always good to read yours.

 

If you're shooting in the 60's then you shouldn't be having a problem with muscle back irons. I'm generally around par - make a boatload of birdies can I'm prone to be a mental midget out there at times as well. ;).

 

I wrote an article about it. I'd be interested to see what you think...what anyone thinks.

 

As for the golf ball...have you tried the Callaway Chrome + yet? Great ball. I don't play anything different now. I figure if it's good enough for Lefty and Gary Woodland then it must be good enough for me.

 

This is a subject I have been debating for some time. I love the MP33's and the MP 59's. When I mishit the 33's it is more like a misswing than a mishit. I swapped the MP33's on the CTLites about a month ago. I have to say that I have never had a better month of ball striking than I am having with the MP59's. But I fear I may be confusing longer for better.

 

Here is what I mean, in the week before I changed, I was killing the ball with the irons. I actually scored 5 out of 7 rounds in the 60's. Never happened before. But driving was awesome, as was putting etc... Just for the record, to fire a round in the 60's everything is good. But I had planned on changing these to the MP59's and did. This also increased my distance because of the stronger lofts. I was so happy. Since making this change, my iron play is better than ever. Par 3's have become birdie holes. And I am hitting the par 4's more often in regulation.

 

However, here is the interesting thing. My average score is not getting lower. I am finding that the MP59's while more forgiving on the full swing, are not as near as accurate on the partial swings as the MP33's. I was planning on swapping these back before the Texas Open but am now considering waiting until afterwards.

 

 

I have switched back to my older Titleist wedges and changed to a new ball so I will see how these changes effect me.

What's in my Sun Mountain 3.5 Deluxe Bag?

 

Driver - Callaway Razr Fit, 9.5 degree loft, standard face setting, fade bias weighting, Matrix Ozik HD6 Stiff shaft, tipped 1 inch

3 Wood - Callaway Razr Fit 15 degree loft, open face setting, stiff shaft

 

Irons 3 to PW - Titleist 712MB with KBS Tour Stiff steel shafts

3 to 5 iron - .5 degree flat; 2 degrees stronger

6 to PW - 1.5 degree flat; 3 degrees stronger

 

Mizuno MP-R12 54 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 53 degree loft; now 8 degree bounce

Mizuno MP-R12 58 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 57 degree loft; now 9 degree bounce

Titleist Vokey 64 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 62 degree loft; now 5 degree bounce

 

Putter - Odyssey Metal X 9

 

Ball - Callaway Chrome +

 

 

My Golf Site

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good one...made me laugh. I would agree with you about hitting shitty shots and bad scores. I personally hate it but I know with my misses it just wouldn't matter. Believe me, I've hit some awesome shots with pings or my old mizuno mp 58's...real pure and real ugly.

 

As I wrote in my article, i think a lot of it depends on swing styles as well, what you've grown up with, etc.

 

I'm all for people spending their money how they want, but if you're gonna play muscle backs you better be a damn good ball striker or do a combo set. Even tour players need a little forgiveness.

 

Nobody gets happiness out of hitting shitty shots or bad scores. Nobody. Anyone who says that is a liar.

What's in my Sun Mountain 3.5 Deluxe Bag?

 

Driver - Callaway Razr Fit, 9.5 degree loft, standard face setting, fade bias weighting, Matrix Ozik HD6 Stiff shaft, tipped 1 inch

3 Wood - Callaway Razr Fit 15 degree loft, open face setting, stiff shaft

 

Irons 3 to PW - Titleist 712MB with KBS Tour Stiff steel shafts

3 to 5 iron - .5 degree flat; 2 degrees stronger

6 to PW - 1.5 degree flat; 3 degrees stronger

 

Mizuno MP-R12 54 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 53 degree loft; now 8 degree bounce

Mizuno MP-R12 58 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 57 degree loft; now 9 degree bounce

Titleist Vokey 64 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 62 degree loft; now 5 degree bounce

 

Putter - Odyssey Metal X 9

 

Ball - Callaway Chrome +

 

 

My Golf Site

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think that when you look at the fact that even the pros dont play blades anymore, its time to move on and go with something more forgiving.

"I suppose its better to be a master of 7 than to be vaguely familiar with 14." - Chick Evans

Whats in my Sun Mountain 2.5+ stand bag?

Woods: Tommy Armour Atomic 10.5* 

Hybrid: Mizuno MP Fli-Hi 3H

Irons: Mizuno T-Zoid True 5, 7 and 9-irons

Wedge: Mizuno S18 54* and Top Flite chipper

Putter: Mizuno Bettinardi A-02

Ball: Maxfli Tour X

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I played blades for years and loved them. Jpx-825 pro's now, and love them too.

A pure hit is a pure hit, but a blade pure hit gives greater orgasms.

Just less of them...

 

:titleist-small: TSr2 on tensi blue stiff

:cobra-small: Speedzone 3-wood on Tensi blue S

:callaway-logo-1: Epic Max 5 and 7 woods on HZRDUS  Reg flex

:callaway-logo-1: Paradym 9 wood on HZRDUS reg flex

:taylormade-small: P770 / P790 combo set on Ventus R-6 shafts 6-AW

:mizuno-small:  T22 Denim Copper 54°, 58° on Kinetic X Trajectory 

:EVNROLL: ER3 or,

:edel-golf-1: E.A.S. #4   (“Fang” or “Adele”)
 

:titelist-small: ProV1x, or, Maxfli Tour X

:callaway-small: .Org 14 cart bag

Adidas Tour 360 , or Sketcher shoes

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good post. Always good to read yours.

 

If you're shooting in the 60's then you shouldn't be having a problem with muscle back irons. I'm generally around par - make a boatload of birdies can I'm prone to be a mental midget out there at times as well. ;).

 

I wrote an article about it. I'd be interested to see what you think...what anyone thinks.

 

As for the golf ball...have you tried the Callaway Chrome + yet? Great ball. I don't play anything different now. I figure if it's good enough for Lefty and Gary Woodland then it must be good enough for me.

 

 

 

I have no problem with MB irons. And was playing the MP33's until around the British Open. I just am amazed that clubs that I seemingly hit better (MP59's) simply do not score as well. But to be fair, I have shot 70-75 during the last few weeks. Since I have only shot in the 60's maybe 10 times in my life, I was probably just on a very hot streak at the time.

 

Also, I would say that in order to break 90 all you really need from your driver is to keep it in play. In order to break 80 you need to drive it near the fairway. But in order to break 70 you better be driving the ball really well. This has been my "Achilles Heel" of late. Literally, I have a minor Achilles problem and while I am keeping the driver in play for the most part, it is just barely in play at time.

 

I will change back to the MP33 muscle backs after the Texas Open in a couple of weeks, but will wait until after that. I will need all the help I can get there. Zach is refusing to give me the 6 strokes a side I am asking for. :lol:

:ping-small:G430LST 10.5° on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Driver 

:ping-small:G430MAX 3w  on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Fairway 

:ping-small:G425 3H on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Hybrid 

:taylormade-small:P790 Black 4-A 
on :kbs: TGI 80S
 

:mizuno-small: ES21 54-8° & 58-12° on :kbs: Hi Rev

:L.A.B.:DF2.1 on :accra: White

:titelist-small: ProV1  

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro  NX7 Pro

All Iron grips are BestGrips Micro-Perforated Mid

Driver, 3w, 3H are JumboMax JMX UltraLite XS 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After post the above comment I went out and played around of golf. The MP59's are just as capable if not more so as the MP33's of scoring low. Since I said that I was having difficulty with the driver I decided to only use it on the par 5's. I did not hit it very well 2 of 4 times but did on the last two times. I striped the 4 wood however, and played just fine. I broke my scoring slump so now all I have to do it keep it up. Or down as the case my be.

:ping-small:G430LST 10.5° on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Driver 

:ping-small:G430MAX 3w  on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Fairway 

:ping-small:G425 3H on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Hybrid 

:taylormade-small:P790 Black 4-A 
on :kbs: TGI 80S
 

:mizuno-small: ES21 54-8° & 58-12° on :kbs: Hi Rev

:L.A.B.:DF2.1 on :accra: White

:titelist-small: ProV1  

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro  NX7 Pro

All Iron grips are BestGrips Micro-Perforated Mid

Driver, 3w, 3H are JumboMax JMX UltraLite XS 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think there is a misconception about 'forgiveness' in equipment and it starts with the misconceptions towards the 'sweetspot.' People tend to think the sweetspot is an area. With the irons, the myth is that it's about the size of a nickel (or so). The reality is that the sweetspot is the size of a needle point. The closer you are to that needle point, the higher the MOI of the head is. And just as big of a myth is that they think Tour players hit the sweetspot all of the time. They actually miss it fairly frequently.

 

Musclebacks provide a more penetrating ball flight. Cavity backs assist with a higher ball flight. That's why I play with CB's in my 3-6 irons and MB's in my 7-PW. I have a bunch of sets, some that are all MB. I mis-hit shots all of the time and still have no problem hitting those shots fairly close to the hole.

 

In the end, I think there are a lot of golfers that are a 10 handicap or less that could hit MB's better than CB's in the long run. A lot of it depends on how serious about the game they are and if they practice.

 

 

 

 

 

 

3JACK

Author of Pro Golf Synopsis. The Moneyball approach to golf strategy and analysis.Driver: Wishon 919THI, 10° loft, UST Mamiya VTS Red 7x, 44-3/8” long, 2,825 kg/cm^2 MOIGONZO WOOD: confidential2-Hybrid: Mizuno Fli-HiCLK, 17° loft, 40-7/8" KBS Tour Hybrid shaft (stiff)3-Hybrid: Mizuno Fli-HiCLK, 20° loft, 40" KBS Tour Hybrid shaft (stiff)4-6 iron: Wishon 575MMC (CB)7-PW: Wishon 575MMC (MB)SW: Edel Golf driver grind, 52° loft, 16° bounce, Nippon WV 125 shaft.LW: Edel Golf Digger Grind, 60° loft, 27° bounce, Nippon WV 125 ShaftPutter: Edel Golf Columbia Custom Made, 35" long, 72° lie angle, 3° loft. Ball: Titleist Pro V1xGrips: PURE Grips P2 Wrap (red)Shoes: FootJoy Dry-Joy (black, size 14)3Jack's Golf Blog - http://3jack.blogspot.com

Link to comment
Share on other sites

That's great to hear.

 

I need to start playing as much as you...

 

After post the above comment I went out and played around of golf. The MP59's are just as capable if not more so as the MP33's of scoring low. Since I said that I was having difficulty with the driver I decided to only use it on the par 5's. I did not hit it very well 2 of 4 times but did on the last two times. I striped the 4 wood however, and played just fine. I broke my scoring slump so now all I have to do it keep it up. Or down as the case my be.

What's in my Sun Mountain 3.5 Deluxe Bag?

 

Driver - Callaway Razr Fit, 9.5 degree loft, standard face setting, fade bias weighting, Matrix Ozik HD6 Stiff shaft, tipped 1 inch

3 Wood - Callaway Razr Fit 15 degree loft, open face setting, stiff shaft

 

Irons 3 to PW - Titleist 712MB with KBS Tour Stiff steel shafts

3 to 5 iron - .5 degree flat; 2 degrees stronger

6 to PW - 1.5 degree flat; 3 degrees stronger

 

Mizuno MP-R12 54 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 53 degree loft; now 8 degree bounce

Mizuno MP-R12 58 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 57 degree loft; now 9 degree bounce

Titleist Vokey 64 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 62 degree loft; now 5 degree bounce

 

Putter - Odyssey Metal X 9

 

Ball - Callaway Chrome +

 

 

My Golf Site

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well said. I think if you have a good swing you can play MB irons. A lot of players weakness is in the short game and putting...and that's why they're a 5 or 7 or 10 handicap. Not the ball striking.

 

And the biggest thing for people is to get past the looks of them. I have one buddy that hits it pretty good, sets my 712 MB's down and says "there's no way..."...when in fact he likely could. I remember thinking that the first time I tried a set. Well I guess not the first time but after going 5 years without playing blades. Picked up a buddies Titleist irons with an X-stiff shaft, and thought there's no way in hell I'm hitting these. After a few swings I was puring them. That was 20 years ago. Have played some cb irons but my last few have all been MB.

 

Surprise surprise...it's all in the brain...that's a new one when it comes to golf...

 

I think there is a misconception about 'forgiveness' in equipment and it starts with the misconceptions towards the 'sweetspot.' People tend to think the sweetspot is an area. With the irons, the myth is that it's about the size of a nickel (or so). The reality is that the sweetspot is the size of a needle point. The closer you are to that needle point, the higher the MOI of the head is. And just as big of a myth is that they think Tour players hit the sweetspot all of the time. They actually miss it fairly frequently.

 

Musclebacks provide a more penetrating ball flight. Cavity backs assist with a higher ball flight. That's why I play with CB's in my 3-6 irons and MB's in my 7-PW. I have a bunch of sets, some that are all MB. I mis-hit shots all of the time and still have no problem hitting those shots fairly close to the hole.

 

In the end, I think there are a lot of golfers that are a 10 handicap or less that could hit MB's better than CB's in the long run. A lot of it depends on how serious about the game they are and if they practice.

 

 

 

 

 

 

3JACK

What's in my Sun Mountain 3.5 Deluxe Bag?

 

Driver - Callaway Razr Fit, 9.5 degree loft, standard face setting, fade bias weighting, Matrix Ozik HD6 Stiff shaft, tipped 1 inch

3 Wood - Callaway Razr Fit 15 degree loft, open face setting, stiff shaft

 

Irons 3 to PW - Titleist 712MB with KBS Tour Stiff steel shafts

3 to 5 iron - .5 degree flat; 2 degrees stronger

6 to PW - 1.5 degree flat; 3 degrees stronger

 

Mizuno MP-R12 54 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 53 degree loft; now 8 degree bounce

Mizuno MP-R12 58 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 57 degree loft; now 9 degree bounce

Titleist Vokey 64 degree - 62.5 degree lie; 62 degree loft; now 5 degree bounce

 

Putter - Odyssey Metal X 9

 

Ball - Callaway Chrome +

 

 

My Golf Site

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...