Jump to content
TESTERS WANTED! ×

Would you play someone with non-conforming equipment for money?


Rickles

Recommended Posts

Just read the great article about TM making non-conforming drivers. I have no problem with the average golfer playing whatever equipment they want and I do think most golfers rarely play in tournaments. However, most golfers do play regularly for a little money. I have already heard golfers say that players with anchored putters are cheating and say they didn't want to play them for money in a regular game. I think this will only get worse once the ban goes into effect and if or when companies start producing non-conforming equipment.

 

So my question for y'all is: Would you play someone who uses non-conforming equipment for money?

 

My personal opinion is it's not a big deal because you might be able to buy distance but it's doubtful you can buy a short game or a putting stroke. However, If non conforming drivers start giving people 30 more yards I might change my opinion.

It's all about the short game, unless you can't keep it in play!

What's in my Bag:
Driver: Adams Speedline Super LS 10.5 with Excalibur T7+ tour stiff shaft
3 Wood: Adams Speedline Super LS 13 degree with Excalibur TFW Tour stiff shaft
Hybrid: Nickent 6DT 19 degree Aldilla Voodoo NV Stiff shaft
Irons: 4-9 KZG Tour Evolution with Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 tour 120 x flex shafts
Wedges:49 degree Dave Pelz wedge with a Nippon N.S. Pro Modus tour 120 x flex shaft. 54,64 Dave Pelz wedges with Rifle spinner shafts 59 Degree Scor wedge with rifle spinner shaft.
Putter: Bentinardi Ben Hogan Big Ben Center shafted 33 inches with best grips custom pistol putter grip.

Ball: Titleist Pro V1X, Callaway Hex Chrome +

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd agree Rickles. I don't play for money, but if I did it would be just something I'd factor into my decision I guess. I do think that if someone is playing non-confirming equipment then others should be made aware of it - and you probably should get unanimous agreement that it's okay at the get-go so there's no sniveling after the round by anyone who lost money.

 

Like you, I think my answer to the question would be "it depends" - I'd want to wait and see what kind of advantages these clubs may give.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So my question for y'all is: Would you play someone who uses non-conforming equipment for money?

 

 

 

Bring it on. I am not playing for the rent money. Usually, all winnings go towards the bar bill. My losings also go towards the bar bill so I get "free beers" paid for with my money. I do occasionally make more than the bar bill though. I can buy the same equipment if I am so inclined. I play a 2002 4 wood and muscleback irons because I want to. I play against a guy with RocketBladeZ and RBZ2 Hybrids and FM. Same thing, When you campare the two it is almost like cheating and yet I make money most every weekend.

:ping-small:G430LST 10.5° on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Driver 

:ping-small:G430MAX 3w  on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Fairway 

:ping-small:G425 3H on     T P T    POWER 18 Hi Hybrid 

:taylormade-small:P790 Black 4-A 
on :kbs: TGI 80S
 

:mizuno-small: ES21 54-8° & 58-12° on :kbs: Hi Rev

:L.A.B.:DF2.1 on :accra: White

:titelist-small: ProV1  

:918457628_PrecisionPro: Precision Pro  NX7 Pro

All Iron grips are BestGrips Micro-Perforated Mid

Driver, 3w, 3H are JumboMax JMX UltraLite XS 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I don't play for money but it wouldn't matter to me to each his own as you suggested, there are other factors involved in playing well. In golf the bottom line for me is someone having fun with it and if someone gets the ball down there... good for them. I also think there is a very big market for this.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You wouldn't catch me doing it, but I don't think I'd care until it became a habit for lower handicapped golfers in money games... But since I'm not a low handicap, and I don't play for money, whatever...

Driver: TaylorMade R9 9.5* with a Diamana Kai'li 70 S shaft

Fairway: TaylorMade R9 TP 13* with Graphite Design Tour AD YSQ-st X flex

 

UtilityWilson Staff FYbrid 19.5* Aldila RIP Sigma Stiff

 

Irons: Wilson Staff FG Tour V2 KBS Tour X flex 4-pw (soft-stepped)

Wedges: Wilson Staff FG Tour TC 50* (standard grind, bent to 51*) TT DG Spinner, 56* and 60* (tour grinds, bent to 55* and 59*) Dynamic Gold Wedge flex

Putter: Yes! Abbie Tour Forged Pro Series 33" 

Ball: Wilson Staff FG Tour, Maxfli U4

 

Bag: Wilson Staff NeXus 100th Anniversary carry bag

 

Backup Irons: Wilson Staff FG-17 Tour Blades with TT Dynamic Stiff 3-PW

 

Backup Utility: Mizuno MP-H4 2 iron TT Dynamic Gold R300

 

Backup Putter: Pro Gear CG 100 33" (Pro Gear is what turned into Yes!)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If it brings more people into the game then I am all for it.

Twitter @angrygolfhulk

Instagram angrygolfhulkDriver-Callaway Razr Fit 9.5* Stiff3 Wood-Taylormade R9 15* StiffHybrids 3,4,5 Rocketballz RegIrons 6-Gap Rocketballz RegSW-Cobra Trusty Rusty 55*LW-Taylormade Rac Black 60*Putter-Odyssey Sabertooth 33"Back up irons-Taylormade Rac Muscleback Forged 5-GW Rifle Shafts 6.0

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Could really care less about the putters, personally. But if we're talking huge distance gains with non-conforming drivers, well, I'd have somewhat of a problem with that. Can I buy the same clubs? Yes, but I also play tournaments and I'm not going to convolute that nor will I subject myself to trying to keep conforming and non-conforming separate. If we're talking a few yards, no biggie, but if it's a guy gaining 30 yards or something crazy like that, no. I play by the rules, personally, and if someone wants to cheat themselves, that's on them.

In The Bag
Driver: TaylorMade M2 (2017) w/ Project X T1100 HZRDUS Handcrafted 65x 
Strong 3 wood: Taylormade M1 15* w/ ProjectX T1100 HZRDUS handcrafted 75x
3 Hybrid: Adams PRO 18* w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4 Hybrid: Adams PRO 20* (bent to 21*) w/ KBS Tour Hybrid S flex tipped 1/2"
4-AW: TaylorMade P770 w/ Dynamic Gold Tour Issue Black Onyx S400

SW: 56* Scratch Tour Dept(CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
LW: 60* Scratch Tour Department (CC grooves) w/ Dynamic Gold Spinner
XW: 64* Cally XForged Vintage w/ DG X100 8 iron tiger stepped
Putter: Nike Method Prototype 006 at 34"

Have a ton of back-ups in all categories, but there are always 14 clubs in the bag that differ depending on the course and set-up. Bomb and gouge. Yes, I'm a club gigolo.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good replies all.

It's all about the short game, unless you can't keep it in play!

What's in my Bag:
Driver: Adams Speedline Super LS 10.5 with Excalibur T7+ tour stiff shaft
3 Wood: Adams Speedline Super LS 13 degree with Excalibur TFW Tour stiff shaft
Hybrid: Nickent 6DT 19 degree Aldilla Voodoo NV Stiff shaft
Irons: 4-9 KZG Tour Evolution with Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 tour 120 x flex shafts
Wedges:49 degree Dave Pelz wedge with a Nippon N.S. Pro Modus tour 120 x flex shaft. 54,64 Dave Pelz wedges with Rifle spinner shafts 59 Degree Scor wedge with rifle spinner shaft.
Putter: Bentinardi Ben Hogan Big Ben Center shafted 33 inches with best grips custom pistol putter grip.

Ball: Titleist Pro V1X, Callaway Hex Chrome +

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll go with a little more expansion on the comment I made in the blog. All of this is in relation to the group of guys I play with on a regular basis, and yes we always play for money. It's usually "friendly" money, a big loss would be $40-$50 bucks, but typically is more in the $10-$20 range. Plus if you lose more than $10 then the guy owes you a drink, more than $20 and they buy something to eat as well.

 

If anyone in my group started using non-conforming equipment I would have no problem with that. I would however expect them to maintain an accurate handicap with the non-conforming clubs. So say the guy was a 12 handicap with regular clubs, now he starts playing non-conforming clubs and gets down to an 8. It's really no big deal to me how he got to an 8, but he will only get strokes at an 8 handicap instead of the 12 he would be with conforming clubs.

 

So for me I really don't care how you get to whatever handicap you play at as long as it's accurate. As long as the non-conforming clubs don't help someone sandbag they can play whatever they want and we will divvy up the strokes based their abilities with whatever they have in the bag.

 

Now when it comes time for the club championship they better all be conforming clubs or there will be an issue :)

Driver: :taylormade-small: SLDR w/ Fujikura Ventus Black

3w: :taylormade-small:'16 M2 hl w/ Diamana D+ 82

5w: :cleveland-small: Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Yellow

Hybrid: :cleveland-small: 22 deg. Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Black

Irons: :cleveland-small: 5i - gap Launcher CBX w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Wedges: :cleveland-small: 54 CBX & 58 Zipcore w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Putter: :odyssey-small: Red 7s

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll go with a little more expansion on the comment I made in the blog. All of this is in relation to the group of guys I play with on a regular basis, and yes we always play for money. It's usually "friendly" money, a big loss would be $40-$50 bucks, but typically is more in the $10-$20 range. Plus if you lose more than $10 then the guy owes you a drink, more than $20 and they buy something to eat as well.

 

If anyone in my group started using non-conforming equipment I would have no problem with that. I would however expect them to maintain an accurate handicap with the non-conforming clubs. So say the guy was a 12 handicap with regular clubs, now he starts playing non-conforming clubs and gets down to an 8. It's really no big deal to me how he got to an 8, but he will only get strokes at an 8 handicap instead of the 12 he would be with conforming clubs.

 

So for me I really don't care how you get to whatever handicap you play at as long as it's accurate. As long as the non-conforming clubs don't help someone sandbag they can play whatever they want and we will divvy up the strokes based their abilities with whatever they have in the bag.

 

Now when it comes time for the club championship they better all be conforming clubs or there will be an issue :)

 

I see your point regarding the handicap, but my question is how did he get to an 8 using non-conforming clubs as he can not play in sanctioned matches that would drop his official HC? Also if his HC did get down to an 8 officially using non-confoming would it not make sense that when he uses conforming clubs for the Championship he should play off of 12? blink.gif

 

AJ

WITB

Driver: Ping G25

FW: TM RBZ

Irons: Miura 57 Series w/KBS C-Taper

Wedges: Vokey SM4 52-08,56-12,60-04

Putter: Watch This Space

Ball: SRixon Z Star

Other: Tourstriker 7i

 

"Go Hard or Go Home"

 

"Do or Do Not. There is NO "TRY"

 

"Be normal, and the crowd will accept you. Be deranged, and they will make you their leader"

 

"I don't fail. I succeed at finding what doesn't work"

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I see your point regarding the handicap, but my question is how did he get to an 8 using non-conforming clubs as he can not play in sanctioned matches that would drop his official HC? Also if his HC did get down to an 8 officially using non-confoming would it not make sense that when he uses conforming clubs for the Championship he should play off of 12? blink.gif

 

AJ

 

I completely understand that using non-conforming clubs would completely negate having an official handicap, however when you enter scores there is not a place that asks if you are using conforming clubs. So I would have no problem having someone use non-conforming clubs all year in league and enter their scores. In theory they will still have a handicap based off their abilities with those clubs and it should be a fair match.

 

As for the club championship I would just assume that anyone choosing to use non-conforming clubs would understand they can't enter any sanctioned events. The club championship at my course is the closest I'll ever get to a true tournament, and that is the one place I would expect that nobody is using non-conforming clubs at. It's a handicapped event to determine which flight you play in, but then within the flight it's straight up scoring for two days. So in my opinion if you want to play in the club championship you have two choices. Play your non-conforming clubs all year long and have a lower handicap, then for the club champ you would enter in the flight based on the handicap you currently have, but you have to play conforming clubs. Or you just decide that you don't want to play non-conforming clubs and then it's a non-issue. But if you play non-conforming all year and get down to an 8, don't expect to be put into a higher flight just because you have to switch back to conforming clubs.

 

And let's be honest here, the club champ is not a sanctioned event. The USGA is nowhere around when we play it, even though our club chooses to play by their rules. If non-conforming really takes off and lots of guys are doing it then just make a non-conforming flight and use net score instead of gross.

 

But back to the original question, if one of the guys I played with used non-conforming clubs I would still have no issues playing them for money in our group. They just need to have an accurate handicap that reflects their abilities with the non-conforming clubs.

Driver: :taylormade-small: SLDR w/ Fujikura Ventus Black

3w: :taylormade-small:'16 M2 hl w/ Diamana D+ 82

5w: :cleveland-small: Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Yellow

Hybrid: :cleveland-small: 22 deg. Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Black

Irons: :cleveland-small: 5i - gap Launcher CBX w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Wedges: :cleveland-small: 54 CBX & 58 Zipcore w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Putter: :odyssey-small: Red 7s

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There is a lot of sense in this thread! Great thoughts peeps!

 

I concur. The problem with the equipment goes back to what Hacky said. There will always be some situation where someone will get angry that someone else is playing non-conforming clubs. For him it is the club championship. For others it would be playing for money. For others it would be even whether they had a handicap. That is the problem, there is always a line where it would not be ok and for that reason I won't play non conforming clubs. Because I aspire to lay serious amateur golf is another.

 

That being said, everyone else can play whatever they want. They just have to worry about the line where it becomes an issue to those they play with.

It's all about the short game, unless you can't keep it in play!

What's in my Bag:
Driver: Adams Speedline Super LS 10.5 with Excalibur T7+ tour stiff shaft
3 Wood: Adams Speedline Super LS 13 degree with Excalibur TFW Tour stiff shaft
Hybrid: Nickent 6DT 19 degree Aldilla Voodoo NV Stiff shaft
Irons: 4-9 KZG Tour Evolution with Nippon N.S. Pro Modus 3 tour 120 x flex shafts
Wedges:49 degree Dave Pelz wedge with a Nippon N.S. Pro Modus tour 120 x flex shaft. 54,64 Dave Pelz wedges with Rifle spinner shafts 59 Degree Scor wedge with rifle spinner shaft.
Putter: Bentinardi Ben Hogan Big Ben Center shafted 33 inches with best grips custom pistol putter grip.

Ball: Titleist Pro V1X, Callaway Hex Chrome +

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I concur. The problem with the equipment goes back to what Hacky said. There will always be some situation where someone will get angry that someone else is playing non-conforming clubs. For him it is the club championship. For others it would be playing for money. For others it would be even whether they had a handicap. That is the problem, there is always a line where it would not be ok and for that reason I won't play non conforming clubs. Because I aspire to lay serious amateur golf is another.

 

That being said, everyone else can play whatever they want. They just have to worry about the line where it becomes an issue to those they play with.

 

I completely agree with you on this quote. My personal choice would be to not play them, and each individual golfer will need to make that choice and accept the consequences one way or the other. I truly think that most people who play for money with their buddies, keep a handicap, play golf league, and play in year end tournaments wouldn't really be interested in non-conforming clubs. However I can think of 10 people off the top of my head that would most likely benefit from them. That being said they are also 10 people who very seldom, if ever, buy new equipment.

 

Personally I have no idea if non-conforming clubs can actually succeed in retail, and that's probably why I'm not the CEO of a major golf OEM :) But I do hope they come to market because I really don't see a big downside. Best case is they take off and we have more people enjoying and playing golf. Worst case is they flop and the OEM's lose some money. Either way 1% of the golfing community is going to be pissed off...

Driver: :taylormade-small: SLDR w/ Fujikura Ventus Black

3w: :taylormade-small:'16 M2 hl w/ Diamana D+ 82

5w: :cleveland-small: Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Yellow

Hybrid: :cleveland-small: 22 deg. Launcher HB w/ HZRDUS Black

Irons: :cleveland-small: 5i - gap Launcher CBX w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Wedges: :cleveland-small: 54 CBX & 58 Zipcore w/ Nippon Modus 3 125

Putter: :odyssey-small: Red 7s

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I read it on the blog yesterday and I commented under my name so instead of getting redundant on here I will say this. Like someone said "Club Championships" are not USGA regulated and clubs can form a "Committee" and play their own rules. As far as legal handicaps people like Rookie are going to be honest and play conforming equipment. As far as some stated some guys playing their low small stakes fun games know what each other plays like and can "handicap" accordingly. On big money matches it can also be "handicapped" also I mean for years we have made games revolving "grease" or no "grease" (or no spin lube as it is known now). I don't play many what I call money matches anymore but remember a real golf gambler figures he has the match won before he tees off no matter the factors. I personally will play conforming equipment (have never used "grease" even though in some circles my Dad has the dubious honor of being the man who discovered it) As far as the recreational golfer using non conforming equipment I could care two hoots less I play my game and they play their game. If it helps them enjoy and stay in the game so be it. Some of these retirees down here have nothing else to do but play golf and that keeps them going. The anchored putter thing has stirred things up a bit down here because some folks have back problems and the long putter keeps them playing. Heck all the young guys hit it a mile past me anyhow so what difference is more yards? I will make it up with my wedges and putter. In a nutshell I don't give a rats arse. Whats the USGA gonna do send hueys to arrest you and close the course or ban you from playing with your buddies? Screw them do what you want to do play your equipment stay in the game

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hey Dude, Great to see ya!!

 

 

We've missed ya.

 

I know that you're busy with school, the family & the golf team.

 

I hope all's well with the team!!

 

Are you gonna drop in on the Crump Cup?

 

You're in my thoughts Bro

 

My Best,

Richard

 

Doing well brother. Golf season is starting to wind down. One more match, then league tournament, then district qualifier, then districts. Been busy looking into a new CC that I am fond of and joined as a trial member. Boys are both in sports now (gymnastics and soccer as well as keeping up golfing) Been a stranger for a bit but plan on setting time aside to post (and not just on twitter :) Thanks RP Be well my friend

Twitter @angrygolfhulk

Instagram angrygolfhulkDriver-Callaway Razr Fit 9.5* Stiff3 Wood-Taylormade R9 15* StiffHybrids 3,4,5 Rocketballz RegIrons 6-Gap Rocketballz RegSW-Cobra Trusty Rusty 55*LW-Taylormade Rac Black 60*Putter-Odyssey Sabertooth 33"Back up irons-Taylormade Rac Muscleback Forged 5-GW Rifle Shafts 6.0

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is just the thread I was looking for! Thanks Rickles.

 

What a mess if this happens because how do you police it? Of coures I could care less what is going on when I play casual rounds - to date I hadn't though much about it in my weekly money game or league or the local tournaments that I played in - I've always assumed that the guys I'm playing with are using conforming equipment, carrying the proper number of clubs in their bag, etc.

 

If manufacturers start to release non-conforming equipment, now what? Of course I dont' care what a recreational player is doing but come on - how in the world are we ever going to police our league with 100 plus players teeing off from 2 in the afternoon until 5 or the money game that I play in where its us and not really run by anyone else? How about the upcoming city am? What are they going to do, have everyone send in their clubs the night before the tournament for inspection? It's nuts.

 

It's time now for the USGA to just pull it's head out of the sand and recognize that they need to free the PGA tour up to make its own set of rules (yes bifurification or however it's spelled) like all other major sports. Then it can focus its attention on simple rules for the rest of us. Simple, like you go look for your ball and can't find it you take a drop with a stroke penalty. Simple, like all equipment must be able to be swung and balls must be this size and weight. Simple, like any marks can be fixed on the green at any time (in fact we encourage you to fix them and then some.) Top, top amatures will adjust when it's time to switch over the rules that the pros play by - colleges use aluminum bats and the top players figure out how to use wood, the 3 point line is longer and court bigger in the NBA but guys seem to cope.

 

At first I was furious about the possibility of Manufacturers releasing non-conforming equipment because its going to cause issues for guys like me who want a fair fight at the level where we have a chance to compete - but now I think it's a great thing.

 

By the way unless its the ball that's illegal I'm thinking the gains won't be quite as spectacular as some would think.

Taylor Made Stealth 2 10.5 Diamana S plus 60  Aldila  R flex   - 42.25 inches 

SMT 4 wood bassara R flex, four wood head, 3 wood shaft

Ping G410 7, 9 wood  Alta 65 R flex

Srixon ZX5 MK II  5-GW - UST recoil Dart 65 R flex

India 52,56 (60 pending)  UST recoil 75's R flex  

Evon roll ER 5 32 inches

It's our offseason so auditioning candidates - looking for that right mix of low spin long, more spin around the greens - TBD   

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ok so how many people out there are still using clubs that are now non-conforming? I stopped using my R7 (the non conforming version) when it became non-conforming, but the differences are very hard to spot and do some players even know its non conforming? That thing was long as well, so perhaps it should have been banned!

 

How many comps do people play were clubs are checked? When I played field hockey and cricket - both sticks and bats were checked before games when you reached a certain level - but in golf we are trusted more than perhaps any other game.....which is great but does cause any issue for the ignorant.

 

How many people have sharpened grooves on wedges beyond legal parameters?

 

It's easy with a belly putter, but with so much else it's not easy at all for players to even know the legality of clubs.

 

As for the question, yes I'd play people for money if they had non conforming equipment - I probably have already! on the rare occasion I play a money game though I'd never check someone else's clubs, I've yet to see a game decided by a club after all.......

 

 

 

Rest in peace long sticks - I'll remember you

 

TM Burner Superfast 2.0 TP Regular

TM RBZ Stage 2 Fairway 14.5 stiff

Adams Blue Hybrid No. 3 stiff

Adams Super xtdHybrid 21.5 Stiff

 

Ping G30 4 and 5 Iron - Regular CFS Shaft

Ping i25 6 - PW Regular CFS Shaft

TM Y Groove Gap Wedge

Cleveland CG10 Sand Wedge

 

PingTR Piper Putter, adjustable shaft, SuperStroke Fatso

 

Titleist StaDry Cart Bag

 

Motocaddy S3 Pro Trolley

 

Foot Joy City, Adidas Boost Boa and Adidas Superstar shoes

 

Pro V1x in the summer, Titleist Velocity in the winter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I actually do play some people with non conforming clubs. One or two even play a chipper. I no longer feel there is a measurable advantage to be gained from non conforming equipment, but if I could truly buy a game, I would. Fact of the matter is, there isn't, so it does not matter if the guy plays non conforming unless you let it get into your mind and become a believer.

 

Much more dangerous is the guy who is truly better than he looks, and they are many.

 

 

 

Shambles

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No problem. If they beat me, they will have had to play well period.

That's the stupidity of the whole thing.

Non conforming clubs aren't going to make an 18 turn into a 6, no matter what they do. So what's the point, other than to take the first step on the very slippery slope.

 

Where does it end? If a little cheating is ok, then just a little more is too. When is it too much? Why even start?

 

Call me old fashioned I guess...

 

:titleist-small: TSr2 on tensi blue stiff

:cobra-small: Speedzone 3-wood on Tensi blue S

:callaway-logo-1: Epic Max 5 and 7 woods on HZRDUS  Reg flex

:callaway-logo-1: Paradym 9 wood on HZRDUS reg flex

:taylormade-small: P770 / P790 combo set on Ventus R-6 shafts 6-AW

:mizuno-small:  T22 Denim Copper 54°, 58° on Kinetic X Trajectory 

:EVNROLL: ER3 or,

:edel-golf-1: E.A.S. #4   (“Fang” or “Adele”)
 

:titelist-small: ProV1x, or, Maxfli Tour X

:callaway-small: .Org 14 cart bag

Adidas Tour 360 , or Sketcher shoes

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

To me it really depends on if the equipment was at one time conforming or not. If you are buying equipment to "cheat" like a spin dr wedge or such it would bother me but if it is non conforming due to a rules change to me that is understandable. When I play someone who doesn't follow the guild lines of the rules it does make me feel like ther should be an astrix next to the score but I get over it and enjoy just being out.

My Bag

Driver Diablo Edge

Fairway Nickent DX 3 and 5

Hybrid Nickent DT 3 and 4 hybrid

Iron VR Pro Combo5-pw

Wedge Adams Idea Pro 60 and 56

Putter STX X-Form 1

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I actually do play some people with non conforming clubs. One or two even play a chipper. I no longer feel there is a measurable advantage to be gained from non conforming equipment, but if I could truly buy a game, I would. Fact of the matter is, there isn't, so it does not matter if the guy plays non conforming unless you let it get into your mind and become a believer.

 

Much more dangerous is the guy who is truly better than he looks, and they are many.

 

 

 

Shambles

According to what I have read a chipper is not illegial unless it has two sides but if that is the case why is a Bullseye type putter legal?

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is just the thread I was looking for! Thanks Rickles.

 

What a mess if this happens because how do you police it? Of coures I could care less what is going on when I play casual rounds - to date I hadn't though much about it in my weekly money game or league or the local tournaments that I played in - I've always assumed that the guys I'm playing with are using conforming equipment, carrying the proper number of clubs in their bag, etc.

 

If manufacturers start to release non-conforming equipment, now what? Of course I dont' care what a recreational player is doing but come on - how in the world are we ever going to police our league with 100 plus players teeing off from 2 in the afternoon until 5 or the money game that I play in where its us and not really run by anyone else? How about the upcoming city am? What are they going to do, have everyone send in their clubs the night before the tournament for inspection? It's nuts.

 

It's time now for the USGA to just pull it's head out of the sand and recognize that they need to free the PGA tour up to make its own set of rules (yes bifurification or however it's spelled) like all other major sports. Then it can focus its attention on simple rules for the rest of us. Simple, like you go look for your ball and can't find it you take a drop with a stroke penalty. Simple, like all equipment must be able to be swung and balls must be this size and weight. Simple, like any marks can be fixed on the green at any time (in fact we encourage you to fix them and then some.) Top, top amatures will adjust when it's time to switch over the rules that the pros play by - colleges use aluminum bats and the top players figure out how to use wood, the 3 point line is longer and court bigger in the NBA but guys seem to cope.

 

At first I was furious about the possibility of Manufacturers releasing non-conforming equipment because its going to cause issues for guys like me who want a fair fight at the level where we have a chance to compete - but now I think it's a great thing.

 

By the way unless its the ball that's illegal I'm thinking the gains won't be quite as spectacular as some would think.

Rev you brought up some good points on policeing the equipment on most equipment it takes a special machine to check the grooves and a skilled person to be able to interperpt the facts it also takes a specialized operator to determine the COR on drivers. In your case with the city am I don't know the solution maybe we will have to rely on intregrity of your playing competitors

Driver ---- Callaway Big Bertha Alpha  Speeder 565 R flex- 5W TM V-Steel Fubuki 60r--- 7W TM V-Steel UST Pro Force Gold 65R----- 9 W TM V Steel TM MAS stiff---- Irons 2015 TM TP CB Steel Fiber 95 R--- GW Callaway Mack Daddy 2 52* shaft unknown junk pile refugee. SW Callaway PM Grind 56*  Modified sole grind--- KBS Tour Wedge-- LW Vokey 58* SM5 L grind--- Putter Ping B90I Broom Stick 

 

 

 G

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hard and fast ...

 

For money, not for money, in competition, casual not in competition, it all doesn't matter to me.  There are rules.  Play by the rules !  They are an intricate part of golf !

 

If we want other, better gear, change the rules first !  But WHY would we ?  Only to buy more gear and make revenue for golf companies, full stop.  Why do we have to keep hitting farther and straighter.  It's all marketing BS anyway.  95% of the result is the golfer, not the equipment.

 

If golf companies want to make more money, stop the marketing BS, start real custom fitting, and deliver to spec instead of all the other hot air blowing that's going on !

In custom James Stewart golfbag:
Ping Tour-S Rustique 60/TS & 55/13 / Ping CFS Stiff / Ping ID8
Ping i20 4-PW+UW / Ping CFS Stiff / Ping ID8
Ping G15 2H 17° & driver 9° / stiff aldila serrano / ping 703
Odyssey White Hot XG 2-Ball / 33" / 2°up
Srixon AD333 - Oakley Flack Jacket XLJ G30

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would play against someone that had them, no problem at all for me head to head.  I would wonder why they had them in the first place, and I'd be keeping a pretty close eye on the person.  I mean hey, if playing non-conforming equipment doesn't bother you, you might feel the same about the other rules too.  I don't care much about your equipment, but I'm not playing a guy that fluffs up or betters his lie without it being clear from the get go that that is the rules of the day.

 

There's going to be big problem in tournaments and leagues and with handicaps as have already been pointed out.  I find it very disturbing that a major OEM would embrace this idea and my initial impression for myself is that I am very likely completely done with TaylorMade, as I view this as a huge disrespect to the game in general.  The very idea of it is offensive to me. The rules are the rules, if you don't like them, there are procedures to change them.  

 

I really don't see why anyone that is seeking to compete, even at the most basic level like say a friendly bet, would ever buy a non conforming club.  It is just asking for trouble.  I think this is pure lunacy on TM's part, the idea of releasing non-conforming equipment.  I can see myself and others avoiding the company entirely just to not have to deal with the extra scrutiny using TM clubs is going to bring.

 

Most of the guys in our group are at least somewhat aware of equipment rules and everyone polices each other.  I don't see any of our guys intentionally using and surely not buying a club they couldn't use all the time, and they wouldn't be able to use it in our events.  If they tried to use it in daily play they'd be tossing the club in the lake by the 9th hole after getting tired of hearing the "cheater" comments.

Ping I20 8.5* - Aldila NV 65g S
Adams XTD Super Hybrid 15* - Stock Fubuki S
Adams DHY 21* - Stock Matrix Ozik White Tie S
Mizuno MP58 4-8 Irons - Fujikura MCI 100 S
SCOR 42,46,50,54,58* - SCOR/KBS Genius S
STX Robert Ingman Envision TR 35", Iomic grip

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think for non conforming clubs to be a non issue and be highly successful for all players they need to seperate two different types of markets. Non conforming clubs could be a great idea and product for newer golfers who are looking to play recreationally. When I started to play golf more seriously a few years ago I started with 3 other people. Of the 4 of us, I am the last person still playing weekly and actually putting the time and effort into improving my game. I am sure I would get many different excuses from the quitters but at the end of the day none of us played during our youth and lessons are expenseive. It was honestly brutal getting through a round and looking at a score card with 8's, 9's, and 10's written and shooting 60+ for a round of 9 holes deters new comers and has been a serious hinder to the sport. If non conforming clubs would help individuals hit a ball straighter and longer off the tee, it would help people who start the game continue to play. Like others have said though, this will not help anyone drastically improve there short game or eliminate 3 putts so total handicaps won't drop as drastically as we may be led to believe, but atleast give golfers that feeling of a great "golf shot" which may be just a big enough "win" for them to keep playing.

 

The second market that becomes an issue to a majority of players is low handicap golfers using it as a way to increase a competitive advantage. Non conforming clubs should be easily identifiable and a new handicap should be calculated. The argument to me of the "slippery slope" that confides with using clubs that are non conforming is non existent. I don't think non conforming clubs would be the ice breaker towards someone who wants to gain an advantage through cheating. The dreaded foot wedge, adjusting lies, "misunderstanding" proper scoring and drop zones for unplayable shots, and sandbagging a handicap are already being done if someone wants to cheat. Giving someone a non conforming club should provide no advantage with a handicap calculated using scores with the non conforming equipment. At the end of the day I still feel like this is a non issue with this market as I am sure the non conforming clubs will have something easily identifiable on them that would show what they are. One item that would most likely need to be eliminated would be items like longest drives during tournaments if drastic improvements could be made in accuracy and yardage though.

 

Maybe I am just dense on the subject, but what advantage am I given if I go from a 15 to a 12 handicap due to non conforming equipment and follow the same rules as you a 6 handicap with conforming clubs?

Driver: Taylormade R9 8.5° S

Fairway Wood: TBD
Irons: Cobra Amp 4i-9i
Wedges: SCOR 4161 43, 47, 51, 55, 59
Putter: Odyssey White Hot Rossie XG

Bag: TBD

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...