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Wildthing

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  1. I still don't understand how pushing the right leg/foot down and twist the foot/knee against the friction of the ground can provide enough twisting force to move a heavy pelvis around in the downswing . Imho , seems like a lot of twisting stress put on the right knee. I find it more realistic to regard the pelvic rotation happening (from P4-P5) due to the powerful contraction of the pelvic rotary muscles. Backswing : Basically you use your torso muscles to move your pelvis around , while your right foot is stabilised on the ground and that stretches those right sided pelvic muscles as your 'right hip joint/pelvis' reaches the end of its rotary degree of freedom (ie. on the tush line). Top Of Backswing /Transition : You get most of your weight pressure on that right hip joint - keeping it stable in space (ie. on the tush line). Downswing: P4- P5 (Hip squaring phase) : You contract those right sided pelvic muscles and it rotates the left (and partial right) side of pelvis back to the tush line (ie. while the right hip joint is still parked on the tush line by all that weight pressure). The above is just a general idea of an opinion that I tend to believe and its far more complex than the above (with regards which muscles are doing what in the full downswing).
  2. This is the bit that I find difficult to understand " He uses the trail foot to externally rotate which gets the separation between the knees as the hips begin to rotate open" . Is this a cause or an effect of pelvic rotation? For example see this instructors opinion on what turns the pelvis (it's not the feet torquing the ground) at 02:47 Basically he saying in the backswing 1. These pelvic rotary muscles stretch (especially the right side). 2. You weight pressure the right hip joint so its stable in space. 3. While point 2 happens , you contract those pelvic rotary muscles and they turn your pelvis counterclockwise (when you look from a top down view). The above sequence squares your pelvis from P4 to P5 only (as you do the squat) , then the 2nd phase of the downswing is using the glutes and other muscles (upper torso/obliques) to help rotate the pelvis some more (ie. from P5 onwards). The right foot torquing against the ground is an 'effect' of the above points 1-3 not a 'cause' for pelvis rotation. So we basically have 2 opinions on cause and effect of the pelvic rotation in the golf swing .
  3. What is GG 'using the ground' for exactly? I know Shawn Clement says 'get the ground' to get the body out of the way of the swinging 'arms/club unit' (being thrown to the target). That this is part of the 'kinetic chain' that we are already 'wired to do' when focused on doing an intended task. Seems there is a lot of talk about 'Ground Reaction Forces' and how it can relate to clubhead speed . But can anyone really explain exactly how squatting and 'pushing off' can create clubhead speed? Here is Shawn demonstrating the bobbing up and down that we would naturally 'bilaterally' do when we wanted swing something faster in a vertical plane. Note 'definition' of Bilateral movement is : Bilateral coordination refers to the ability to coordinate both sides of the body at the same time in a controlled and organized manner; for example, stabilizing paper with one hand while writing/ cutting with the other.Good bilateral integration/ coordination is an indicator that both sides of the brain are communicating effectively and sharing information. Imho , Shawn is demonstrating a different technique to create hand speed and sharp change in hand path. It seems to be a more natural way of creating clubhead speed while also retaining balance (using the muscles in the legs to brace against the increased tension in the clubshaft that is pulling on you). But remember that golf is not all about creating clubhead speed because you also have to square the clubface by impact. We might be 'wired in' to 'throwing things' to a target , but the squaring of the clubface by impact is unnatural imho.
  4. I agree that there are a lot of similarities between good players, especially : 1. The way they rotate their pelvis 2. Their downswing between P6 and P7 Obviously the exception to point 1 are players who use Stack n Tilt or a subtype. The art of golf instruction is teaching 'How' to achieve that motion rather than describing 'what' is happening. For example , look at the 'Athletic Motion Golf' you-tube videos by Shaun Webb and Mike Granato. They use wonderful Gears 3D graphics saying this is 'what' pros do compared to amateurs , but their opinions on 'how' to perform those movements is quite sketchy and doesn't make any logical sense. Its almost 'here is the what, now just get on with it' !
  5. I don't follow Martin Hall but I wouldn't mind one of those contraptions if it was more representative of a real golf club. I suspect one could buy a few laser lights and attach them to a golf shaft. The 'keeping the mouse in the house' is a strange phrase (almost childlike) and wondering why he didn't just say 'retain lag' by delaying the poking of the arm between the 2 forearms.
  6. Actually found an old you-tube video with something called a 'Smart Stick' which looks like a reasonably good teaching tool for 'imperative 3 ' mentioned above. Probably don't make them anymore and looks expensive. PS. Actually found a website but it costs £199.99 !!!!!
  7. Yes , I agree with your comment regarding imperative number 3 . The diagram is suggestive of a 'one plane' type of swing and that is incorrect. Here's a better diagram showing at least 3 different planes that the clubshaft could traverse in a golf swing. Clubshaft planes - using Aaron Baddeley as a model golfer Imperative number 3 applies even if the the golf swing moves through different planes . That is , the end of the club nearest to the ground will always trace the ball -target line (or the Swing Plane Line) for the clubshaft to be 'On Plane'. PS. With regards MDLT , yes , I've watched all the you-tube clinic videos and he's very good at 'qualitative' golf instruction. Personally, I never think about golf mechanics/theory when I swing a golf club (paralysis by analysis). I think the 'essentials' and some of the 'imperatives' should be beneficial enough for non-academic golfers to use without getting overly involved in complex biomechanics. But sometimes there is a need to understand the complexities to argue against possible flawed golf instruction , especially certain instructors who 'cherry-pick' golf science research data to back up some of their claims.
  8. I have been looking at all these new instructions/opinions about : 1. Shallowing the clubshaft 2. Bowing the left wrist 3. Reverse Motorcyle Move. etc , etc They all seem to be based on individual interpretations on 3D data of PGA pros , with the big assumption that if they do it , then it must be correct and therefore we must advise all golfers that this could be the most optimal way. When I look at some of the extra corrections that golfers may have to perform (when doing the above 3) to get the clubshaft back 'on plane' (ie. the 3rd Imperative mentioned further below), the instruction advice seems to be teaching swing errors (ie. moves that will require countermoves to get the clubshaft back 'on plane'). I'm tempted to say that Homer Kelley (The Golfing Machine Book) got some of his 'Qualitative' opinions correct regarding the 'Essentials and Imperatives' of a golf swing (stated below). It's a pity that golf scientists haven't tried monitoring these opinions to collect quantitative data to either approve or disprove them. Essentials 1. Stationary Head Why should one have a stationary head during the golf swing? Well, it’s not so much the head that’s important, it’s what the head is attached to; the spine. Specifically the part of your spine just between the shoulders. In medical terms it’s known as the Seventh Cervical Vertebrae, or C7 for short. If you run your hand down the back of your neck, the C7 is the first prominent bump you feel at the base of your neck. This part of your spine is the centre of your pivot, from where your arms rotate. On the backswing, the clubhead rotates around the left hand, the left hand rotates around the left shoulder, and the left shoulder rotates around the C7. If, during the backswing, you were to move your head (and C7) by an inch away from its address position, you would have moved the left shoulder, left hand, and clubhead by an inch also. An inch makes a lot of difference during impact. It could mean the difference between hitting the ball fat (the ground before the ball), thin (hitting with the bottom edge of the club), and also affect the ball’s shot shape. Any movement of the head away from its address position on the backswing, needs a counter-movement to place it exactly back in its original position on the downswing prior to impact. This is fiendishly difficult to do and leads to inconsistent shots. For that reason, it’s best to keep the head, and by virtue, the C7, in a stationary position during the back and downswing! NOTE: The head is allowed to swivel in the backswing and downswing up to impact. After impact the head is allowed to move forward with the body onto the lead leg. 2. Balance This is perhaps the most obvious of the six key features every good swing should have. Mr Kelley defines balance as “holding the centre of gravity of the body inside the stance without moving the head”.That is to say; you can shift your weight around during the swing, but not so excessively that it makes you uneasy on your feet 3. Rhythm Usually an ambiguous term in the golfing world, relating somewhat to the over all speed or tempo of the back and downswing. In Golfing Machine terms, rhythm is defined as “holding all components of a rotating motion to the same RPM”. That is to say, on the downswing especially, the shoulders, hands and club should all be turning with about the same RPM (revolutions per minute). That’s not to be confused with speed, however. If you imagine two points on the second hand of a clock face. One point at the tip of the hand, closest to the numbers, and another point near the bottom of the hand, closest to the pin. Both points move at the same RPM. That happens to be 1 Revolution Per Minute. However, the speed of those two points on the hand are very different. That’s because speed is distance divided by time. Although the time taken to make a revolution for both those points is the same (one minute), the distance which those points travelled were different, the tip of the hand traveling much further than near the base of the hand. The downswing should be much the same, with the shoulders, hands and clubhead, although all traveling at different speeds, should remain at about the same RPM. When rhythm is off, it means the clubhead tries to overtake the hands, and the hands try to overtake the turning of the shoulders. This leads to a loss of power and control.So there we have the Three Basic Essentials of a precision golf swing. Strictly speaking, they’re not 100% necessary but without them you’re going to struggle to perform the Three Basic Imperatives. Imperatives 1. A Flat Left Wrist A flat left wrist occurs when the back of the left hand and the left forearm are in line. This alignment ensures the clubshaft and the left arm form a straight line. This straight line is best viewed from a “face on” perspective when the left arm is vertical, usually just after impact. If a golfer is performing the first Imperative correctly, at this point you would see the left arm and clubshaft in a straight line. 2. A Clubhead Lag Pressure Point - Golf science has proven Homer Kelley to be wrong for this imperative (especially for long clubs) but might apply to short irons only (or specialist type shots out of rough, etc). Clubhead lag isn’t, as many people assume, just the clubhead trailing behind the hands. It’s more importantly the bending of the clubshaft as the clubhead resists the change in direction and / or velocity at the start of the downswing.We’d learnt from the “Law of the Flail” how by maintaining the flat left wrist through impact we can avoid the clubhead decelerating. A flat left wrist however, is no guarantee of “sustaining the line of compression”. In order to master the “secret of golf” and “sustain the line of compression” during impact, we must be accelerating the clubhead as it collides with the ball. The only way to do this effectively is to maintain this flexed shaft through impact.This is because during impact the clubhead exerts a force on the ball, but the ball exerts an equal and opposite force on the clubhead. If the clubshaft isn’t flexed during the impact interval, it will flex because of the impact, softening the blow, decelerating the clubhead and make sustaining compression impossible. As Mr Kelley explains; “The prestressed clubshaft will resist the added weight of the ball during impact, instead of cushioning the impact with an unstressed clubshaft”. We can use our hands to feel where the club is and how it’s behaving during the swing. This is an important concept in The Golfing Machine, one Mr Kelley refers to as having “Educated Hands”. In order to accelerate the clubhead and bend the clubshaft, we must apply force to the club. Where we apply this force we can feel pressure in our hands as the clubhead resists the change in velocity. So long as we can feel this clubhead lag pressure, we can be sure the clubshaft remains flexed and the clubhead is accelerating. 3. A Straight Plane Line The plane line Mr Kelley refers to is the line traced along the ground by the clubshaft during the swing. If this traced line is straight, as opposed to curved, then we can be sure the golf club is being swung on a two-dimensional plane. Basically , the nearest end of the clubshaft to the ground throughout the swing must be pointed to and tracing the 'ball target line'.
  9. Looks like an early extension issue where you've blocked your right elbow against your right side. Root cause could be you've pushed off with your right leg (extending it and pushing your right hip towards the target line too early in your downswing). Weight pressure your right hip in the backswing , keep your butt on the tush line in the early downswing (ie. up to left arm parallel) , then use right pitch elbow move but this time it will have enough room to be in front for your right hip rather than behind it. PS. You can use the extension of your legs to help turn your pelvis later in your downswing, just don't do it so early.
  10. If your swing works okay and getting fair distance and accuracy , I wouldn't fiddle around with it too much. Seems like you really do whip it through so I guess your clubhead speed is pretty good. If you want a bit more hip turn , then maybe it could be just a simple fix like narrowing your stance (it looks quite wide but difficult to see from a DTL view). Your current swing doesn't seem to be using any pivot to create hand speed and I think you are using your left shoulder girdle muscles to help pull your left arm down. However, you are adducting your right upper arm while pitching your right elbow just above your hip very assertively. It looks like you are using your right arm more to push your left arm down and out towards the ball. I'm unsure but you could be categorised as a 'right arm swinger' but missing the pivot part. Tom Tomasello actually taught a right arm golf swing, so it might be worthwhile reviewing all his videos.
  11. There is a possible explanation for that straight path but its a set of moves that I cannot do without being put into traction . Cameron Champ does it too: Look at : a. Their left shoulder b. Their upper right arm c. Their right lateral side bend d. Their right elbow. To get that straight path they do the below almost simultaneously: 1. Pull their left shoulder towards target (this helps brings their left arm down) 2. Adduct their upper right arm towards their right side ( also helps bring the left arm down) 3. Pitch their right elbow towards their right hip (shallows their downswing plane and also stops their right arm getting blocked behind their torso) 4. Perform a lateral side bend (also helps shallow the downswing plane ) Basically , both DJ and Cameron are performing moves that help create that straighter downswing path and also shallow out their downswing planes (at the same time). So much more complex and requires great flexibility but also puts a great deal of strain on the spine. Bobby Jones didn't do the above and I can imagine he never had too many back problems, contrary to what I've heard about Cameron Champ who is already suffering bulging discs at such a young age. PS. Just been looking at Wikipedia about Bobby Jones to see if he did have back problems as a player . He actually died of a back related disorder. What a sad tragic end for him and his family: Incapacity and death In 1948, Jones was diagnosed with syringomyelia, a fluid-filled cavity in the spinal cord that causes crippling pain, then paralysis; he was eventually restricted to a wheelchair. He died in Atlanta on December 18, 1971, three days after converting to Catholicism. Jones was baptized on his deathbed by Monsignor John D. Stapleton, pastor of the Cathedral of Christ the King in Atlanta, and attended by the Jones family was buried in Atlanta's historic Oakland Cemetery. Jones was inducted into the World Golf Hall of Fame in 1974. His widow Mary died less than four years later in 1975 at age 72, following the death of their son, Robert T. Jones III, of a heart attack in 1973 at age 47.Daughter Clara died in 1994 at age 68.
  12. This is again for those mainly interested in the biomechanics of the golf swing (ie. what is going on rather than how). Just thought it might interest others who are trying to figure out what many of the pros are doing to drive that ball 300+ yards. Lets use DJ as an example about optimising clubhead speed. The secret to his high clubhead speed seems to fit in with physics. 1. From Image 1 to just before image 3 , he has somehow made biomechanical movements that have created a hand path on a 'straightish' path (or an arc with a long radius). 2. Along this 'straightish' path , he has increased his hand speed as much as he can. 3. He has retained left 'wrist cock' angle (angle between shaft and forearm) from top of backswing to just before image 3 (where one can see the 'release' of that angle happening- increasing). Physics proves that more wrist cock before a 'natural' release , the faster the clubhead speed. 4. The 'natural release' of that angle happens due to 'pseudo CF forces', because he has performed biomechanical moves that change his hand path from straightish to a more curved path. His wrists just before image 3 act as oily hinges and he is basically letting the 'momentum' of the clubhead (ie. evoked by pseudo Centrifugal Forces) uncock his wrists (ie. a natural release). A simple 'imperfect' analogy of point 4 is like driving in a car (ie. your hands) on a straight road increasing your speed and then taking a very tight corner turn. Any objects (ie. the clubhead ) in the back seat will go sliding across the seat very fast. The counterintuitive part is that his 'wrists/hands' end up actually restricting the 'angular velocity' of the clubhead because it is rotating faster than the hands can keep up. This is proven by physics which says that forward shaft bend into impact means 'negative torque' at the hands (see image below). So now we know what DJ's hands are doing , the puzzle is figuring out 'how' he is moving his body parts to create the dynamics and geometry of his 'hand speed/path'. Obviously , the above is just about creating clubhead speed and not the biomechanics involved in squaring the clubface (a different matter altogether). So has anyone got any ideas how DJ creates that straight path in the downswing? PS. I thought it would be a good idea to show the hand path of Bobby Jones (in red below) which shows a more circular hand path , where he also had an 'earlier' natural release. He couldn't replicate the hand path of DJ because of the limitations on the strength of hickory shafts . If he tried stressing the shaft using DJ's hand path (ie. straight path and then speedy acute 'corner turn') the shaft would have broken.
  13. Basically , you can have all the correct geometry in your swing, correct posture, wrist cock , swing plane, centre of swing stable, etc . But if you don't swing with a rhythm that matches your own 'body/club' unit frequency, you will still struggle. It's like pushing a kid on a swing , you have to match the pushing to the swinging frequency of the 'kid/swing' system. Same with golf , you have to somehow tune into your own swing frequency (ie. subconsciously , not something consciously manipulated). I am guessing that one can identify your unique biomechanical frequency by just swinging in perpetuity without strain and in balance until you can easily hear the whoosh of the clubhead just after an imaginary impact . Then do the same for all the clubs in your bag using a metronome and check whether swing time is approx constant. Good video below but imho, Peter Finch should not be advocating 'internal focus' cues about your hips and weight pressure transfer to your lead leg. Maybe better to use 'external' focus cues (ie. not directly related to a body part) , like pushing into the ground while getting your belt buckle turning out of the way.
  14. This is what swinging in resonance can do to you. I remember seeing this at college where our lecturer said the crosswind was blowing at just the right frequency that matched Tacoma Bridge's own natural frequency. Now imagine if you did the same for your golf swing - Kabooom !!!
  15. Thought this might be interesting to golf biomechanic nerds like me. According to this Professor, research shows that PGA pros (and very good golfers) drive their bodies in resonance like an harmonic oscillator. They have perfected a biomechanical clock which means they have superb rhythm and tempo. Full Swing : Backswing should take 3 times longer than downswing 3:1 ratio I've just skimmed through his research papers on Putting https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/0903/0903.1762.pdf Same amount of impulsive force used to get the backswing and downswing going but the frequency of the putt is twice the resonant frequency of the body/club unit pendulum. Backswing takes twice as long as the downswing 2:1 ratio. Note that you apply the impulsive downswing force just before the backswing ends, so you can get a sense of the direction the downswing should progress (by pushing against the inertia of the backswing). He quoted Zen Golf at the end of the video but then reinterprets what they say using physics terminology. So swing perpetually and get your metronome's out
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