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  1. There are some very interesting videos by Dr Sasho Mackenzie that may help enlighten any golf academics concerning the 'kinetics' of the golf swing. Actually , you might find it quite counterintuitive to your current beliefs. By the time the club has reached horizontal in the downswing (for virtually all pro swings), the clubshaft is 'forward bending' and this means that the right hand cannot be pushing like a lever (physics says it can't). In fact the angular velocity of the club is so great that the hands are actually resisting (ie. negative torque) against the 'pull' of the club's angular momentum. However , any right arm extension into impact can still push 'right thumb heel pad' on the base of the left thumb (if you are using a Vardon grip) which can help push the lead hand (and handle) faster 'around its hub path track' . The problem with any excessive push pressure on that 'right thumb heel pad' is that the 'left hand/handle' could be pushed too far forward before club/ball impact. Also , depending on the direction of that push force (not in line with the COG of club) , it will most likely also cause a negative torque which can slow down the angular velocity of the clubhead (although imho, I can't imagine it would slow the clubhead by any appreciable amount). Basically after the clubshaft has gone into forward bend state in the late downswing , the golfer is just holding on , while his body pivot is just reacting to the inertial pull of the club on his arms (but it's also stabilizing the body so that its not pulled off balance) . The pivot is also being used to direct the moving distal segments of the body (including the club) in the correct alignment before impact. However, there is nothing to stop a golfer to apply a pull force through/across the handle in the late downswing to increase clubhead speed (maybe add an extra 5mph). People call it 'parametric acceleration' but it's really a 'moment of force' caused by a force that is not aligned through the COG of the clubhead. The problem with doing those sudden pulls is that you have to time it correctly so that you can still hit the ball at the right time and on the sweet spot (Lexi Thompson is pretty good at this). Here are the videos by Sasho https://vimeo.com/158419250 https://vimeo.com/158856998 Here is the article from Dave Tutelman explaining how bend on clubshaft affects the torque on the grip/hands (look for title called 'Shaft Bend'). He stated this when he analysed Lee Comeaux's swing kinetics (ie. 'right hand hit' ). https://www.tutelman.com/golf/swing/handhit.php
  2. Your head moving up and down is quite natural depending on how you pivot. When I swing in 'perpetuity' with an external focus on throwing my clubface to a target or through an intermediate target , or 'cut dandelions' with the edge of the face, my head bobs up and down quite a bit . I never used to allow that for the first 25 years of playing golf due to some pre-conceived notion about mechanics of the golf swing (ie. got to keep the centre of the swing stable). Guess what , the research findings state there is no stable center of the golf swing , it moves all over the place (and a lot of the time it's moving outside of the perimeters of your body) based on various complex movements. Although the shoulder socket does become the center of the swing close to impact if you have any semblance of secondary tilt. Check out this old Shawn Clement video because it changed my whole perception of the golf swing and imho I've been playing my best 'fearless' strain-free recreational golf in the last 30 years . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn8CmDNi0UM
  3. It now looks that I have misinterpreted (sigh) those graphs - see below. I thought they showed a total average over the PGA and LPGA samples tested but in fact they were individual golfer profiles. The 2 graphs below are just for individual male and female golfer , but the table below shows the range of values found for all PGA and LPGA males tested. They do show that at the top end of the ranges that LPGA women have faster rotations of pelvis/thorax/arms/club Example : Male Pelvis : 540 , Male Thorax: 797, Male Lead Arm: 1090, Male Club: 2399 Female Pelvis: 715 , Female Thorax: 1092 , Female Lead Arm: 1417 , Female Club: 2679 But PGA men still drive the ball longer on average than LPGA as NOODLE3872 has shown above. So what does this tell us? That increased body segment rotational speeds is not enough to prove cause and effect of high clubhead speed at impact. Addendum 19th Nov 18 I have found another research article which contained more detail than the table shown above. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/5292347_Swing_Kinematics_for_Male_and_Female_Pro_Golfers So looking at the results we can now make a more refined opinion about what is happening between LPGA and PGA golfers. An obvious and stark major difference is the rate at which the wrists are uncocking and the timing of that uncocking. It seems PGA 'probably' hold lag longer and then release later in such a way that they optimise a higher clubhead speed closer to impact. LPGA create similar clubhead speeds in their downswing but it peaks earlier before impact. Therefore the clubhead speed is reducing more before impact than PGA men and probably explains the difference in driving distances. The author of the research points to the fact that LPGA women suffer twice as many injuries to their wrists compared to PGA men which suggests that wrist uncocking is of prime importance in LPGA women (but where they have some physical limitations on how quickly they can facilitate that uncocking action).
  4. Okay , it looks like that PGA pro and 3D Company director made partially accurate statements but based on statistically skewed data . I've now looked at the graphs for PGA vs LPGA and when averaged out it looks like PGA players have greater pelvis/thorax/arm/club rotational speed. The sample of LPGA players tested are smaller than PGA players where 'some' ladies have shown greater 'pelvis/thorax/arms/club rotational speeds than the max values found for the PGA men (some also have less rotational speeds than the minimum found for PGA players). But making a broad statement that on average LPGA players have quicker hip/ribcage rotations is not wholly accurate.
  5. Wildthing

    The RYKE effect

    I've found that Kevin has patented a couple of inventions using Ryke effect phenomenon so maybe he is more involved in testing the success of their practical use before his book is published. One is a club testing machine robot (unlike Iron Byron or Ping man that use the double-pendulum concept) which will incorporate the Ryke effect , while another are training clubs (see the link below). http://www.freepatentsonline.com/20160051882.pdf Imho , the double-pendulum concept is still applicable for maximising clubhead speed until a few feet from the ball , then maybe Ryke effect can be utilised. In that patent article above , if you read the SUMMARY section 0024 he states the effect is invoked by the movement of the leading hand downwards but it's too vague to make much sense. It could be the leading arm pitching closer to the body during the downswing , or it could be some degree of lead palmar flexion of wrist which triggers the effect. The 'How' this Ryke effect is induced/optimised in a golf swing is still not yet clearly explained in any detail. PS. Weird coincidence but it looks like the Ryke effect might explain why PGA men can drive the ball longer distances than LPGA ladies but still have less arm/club angular rotation speeds. Seems like everything in golf is counterintuitive.
  6. Wildthing

    The RYKE effect

    Kevin - I hope you are still around and respond to posts . Can we now assume after 3.5 yrs that you are still not confident about the techniques used to evoke the Ryke effect using Newtonian physics? From what I've read so far, there is still no clear explanation for the biomechanics involved in creating that 'Transverse Force' that transforms an 'In Plane Double Pendulum motion' type golf swing to a 'Conical Pendulum motion' . Your model still doesn't explain why some golfers like Jamie Sadlowski and other long drivers can drive the ball long distances with appreciably small Ryke angles . You have made an assumption that Jamie Sadlowski must be firming up his wrists through impact and reducing his ROC to fit the human limitations of forearm rotation (and ulnar deviation singularity) built into your computer model . In fact you have stated that the closing of JS's clubface is caused by forward shaft bend rather than him utilising the Ryke effect and that those actions allow him to 'Drive-Hold' . But have you any firm evidence it is actually happening and being repeated in other golfers who have small Ryke angles and still drive the ball long distances? For example , the latter cannot apply to Phil Mickelson (small Ryke angle) who can drive the ball a long way but is actively rotating his lead forearm through impact rather than firming it up.
  7. Focusing on body parts means that you are consciously doing something and will short circuit your kinetic sequence. Scientific research over 2 decades have proved that 'motor learning skills' (including learning the golf swing) should be subconscious using 'external focus' cues based on an intended outcome. That basically means you focus on an intent outside of your body like the trajectory of the ball , or clubface cutting grass , or swinging the clubface over an intermediate target , or throwing the clubface to a target . Instead of thinking about moving your weight to the front foot , you focus on 'pushing or getting the ground' , instead of keeping your butt on the tush line think about pushing a wall behind you . Try and avoid any conscious thought on the movement of a part of your body (which is an 'internal focus' cue). Another example is focusing on the hands being forward for a punch shot vs picturing an image of overhanging trees where your intent is to keep the ball under and through to an 'achievable' target. Your intent must be something that your subconscious thinks is achievable from past experience or you will trigger a 'fear response' where your actions will tighten up (like a rabbit caught in a headlight). Your subconscious will automatically engage a much greater range of muscles to fire in the right sequence in the most efficient manner to try and meet your intended outcome (if you let it). It has been found , that internal focus on a body part will not engage all the correct muscles and your movement will be inefficient (ie. kinetic chain will be impaired). Check out this podcast by Dr Gabriele Wulf as it will change your perception on the best way to learn how to swing a golf club and also how to retain those learning skills .
  8. Wildthing

    Increasing Club head speed

    What Clay Ballard failed to mention is that Sasho Mackenzies findings (ie. vertical ground force reaction to increase clubhead speed) didn't apply to 'rear foot' golfers like Justin Thomas. That is , their COP actually moves towards their rear leg into impact and not onto their front leg. PS. It's been estimated that 1/3 of golfers that were used as test subjects in a research experiment were found to be rear foot golfers. Look at graph below where at ball contact it looks more like 50:50 weight pressure for rear foot golfers.
  9. Actually , I think I've assumed incorrectly that the movement of the ribcage automatically equates to the movement of the shoulder socket . So really what the 3D companies should be measuring is the speed of the shoulder sockets of PGA men vs LPGA women. With regards the comments about swing arc, radius of swing, arm length, club length favouring the men - that might not altogether be true - see Tutelman's article link below where he simulated changes to arm length, club length, weight, height, strength in his computer program. I know he was only using a male golfer and not comparing it to women but I reckon similar comparisons still apply. So it looks like golf instruction proclaiming increased hip speed can increase clubhead speed is questionable. https://www.tutelman.com/golf/swing/tallGolfer.php Summary: longer arms reduce clubhead speed 2mph a longer club gives back the 2mph we lost from longer arms. increasing the golfer's weight drops clubhead speed 1.5mph, almost as much as arm length increase did. Shoulder Torque: increasing the torque to reflect the golfers increased size gives a marked advantage in clubhead speed. This is the only place in the whole study where the tall golfer's clubhead speed actually increased, compared with a shorter golfer. Conclusion: The reason taller golfers hit it farther is mostly because their size provides a frame for more muscle and larger lever arms at the joints. The rest of it -- larger arc, more massive body -- reduces clubhead speed, and the longer club doesn't get enough back to make up for it. But the bigger golfer is also stronger (or at least has the potential to be stronger, given proper conditioning and nutrition). If he/she realizes that potential, the result is higher clubhead speed. Scientific Note : Triple Pendulum (Sasho MacKenzie model) : Note that an accelerating torque does not assure acceleration. For instance, when shoulder torque kicks in it actually retards the torso rotation. This is basic Newtonian physics; every action has an equal and opposite reaction. In order for the torso to exert any torque via the shoulder joint to release the left arm, the left arm exerts an equal and opposite torque back on the torso via the shoulder joint slowing its release. . So can the bolded underlined statement above explain (from a physics perspective) why male PGA players have less ribcage/torso rotation than LPGA women? The shoulder girdle muscles are contracting and pulling the left arm , but these same muscles are also pulling against the shoulder girdle (which is connected to the ribcage via the clavicle ) , which in turn will decrease the rotational speed of the torso/ribcage. PS. It looks like some theories about PGA golfers mainly using a pivot driven swing might need to be revisited . Initial clubhead speed in the early downswing seems to originate mainly from the arms being swung quickly by an active mix of both shoulder girdle muscles. The lower and upper body pivot , secondary tilt , weight shift seem to all combine to move the lead shoulder socket in such a way that it changes the hand path of the swinging arms (mainly via a pull on the lead arm) so that 'Pseudo CF forces' can be induced at just the right time to optimise clubhead speed through impact. Maybe Leslie King concepts were closer to the truth about how to swing a golf club than first imagined.
  10. Various PGA pros and a 3D company director have stated that LPGA players , on average , have quicker rotations of their hips and ribcage than male PGA players. If that is the case , then why aren't female LPGA players driving the ball longer than the PGA men? I personally haven't seen the stats that prove the above , but if it's true then I am confused because that means the upper body pivot power (ie. lead shoulder socket pulling the lead arm around) that is creating the initial speed in the early downswing (before CF forces get induced in a 'swingers' action) is being 'added' to by something the men can do better than the women. So what is it?
  11. Imho, a hit is predominantly a push . In TGM terms , the swing is being powered predominantly with the straightening thrust action of the right arm (release of 'Power Accumulator PA1' - feels like a push on the handle) similar to the punch shot with hands leading the clubhead into impact. Swinging is usually defined as a pulling action where CF forces get induced by the 'Law Of The Flail' whereas hitting overrides that CF effect. The paradox here is all muscles in the human body pull (ie. muscle 'contractions' shorten and stretch) so in theory the feel of a push is really a muscular pull ( you can find contradictions all over the place in golf theory if you look deeply enough). I suspect in a real life golf action , there is a mix of both hitting and swinging, so maybe we are all 'swing-hitters' and maybe the categorisation of a golf action being one or the other can get blurry. But I can imagine if you are a strong muscular bulky individual (especially in the upper body/shoulder area) who has problems creating a full range of upper pivot motion to 'swing' the golf club, you may decide to use your 'shoulder girdle /triceps/biceps' to 'hit' power the golf swing.