Donn lost in San Diego
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Posts posted by Donn lost in San Diego
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I just posted a new thread, my step by step guide to cross handed putting. In Member Community General Q&A. I put a bit of time into writing down my switch and what I think works. I hope a few of you find it helpful. I now use and Odyssey "R" Ball with the Stroke Lab steel and graphite shaft.
- TJ Hall, cksurfdude and Rob Person
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FYI I just posted a new thread in Member Community General Q&A: A Step by Step guide to cross handed putting. I put a lot of time into how I made the switch and my opinions on the subject. I hope some who have putting issues find it helpful.
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Here is my step by step guide on going to cross handed putting. I switched after Jordan Spieth was on the front page of Golf Magazine January 2015 with "Go Low, 5 Secrets . . ". It took a while to put my technique together.
WARNING: Prepare to spend a lot of time adjusting to the switch. And don't practice once your mind wanders. 45 minutes to an hour is a lot of putting. No tees, guides, gates needed, at least for me. I don't use any.
1. I use a face balanced putter and I TRY to go straight, very small arc. I had a putter I liked (A Dave Musty hand made wood mallet) but when I switched, I realized I had to switch to face balanced. Face balanced creates the least amount of arc possible. A lot of unbalanced, with Toe Hang is OK for traditional style stroke with more arc but lots of people have problems and there are hundreds of slightly different Scotty Newport/Ping Anser style putters. Trying to match the weight and the degree of unbalance to match your stroke on any given day is an eternal guessing game, right? Weight in the toe makes the putter swivel. Let's not. Remove that part of the equation. All Face Balanced are Face Balanced, FB. Fewer variables to deal with. A nearly straight stroke for me eliminates practice using gates, mirror, etc. I got a 2015 vintage Scotty Futura X FB with double counter weight curved flying wing. Nice, but I realized in time I liked a triangle shape better. The triangle is more stable than wings or fangs or even Spyder, IMOH. I now have a 2019 Odyssey, Stroke Lab shaft (2 piece, graphite and steel) "R" ball. I rarely see it. Similar to the common 2 ball style. Mine has the white and metal Micro-hinge face insert. I also had a Kmart Precise fang and as soon as I put a fat grip on it it worked great.
2. I think crossx lets me stand more directly over the ball or line of roll. Always a good thing. Eliminate all that eye alignment coaching and fidgeting.
3. How do I actually grip it? Finding what exactly to do with my front-left-low hand, took a while. Claw? Overlap? I ended up this way: I put the left hand index finger on the shaft, yes, facing forward, pointing down, with the other 3 fingers and thumb around the bottom of the grip, very conventional slight overlap. This index finger creates sensory feedback, am I twisting the shaft or keeping it moving straight. I grip the right hand like a regular club, the thumb is flexed, not extended straight. The index finger? Trigger. Just like any club. The trigger adds to ability to control the club. Grip the hand tight enough to minimize twisting, I do not tighten the arms or shoulders. Loose, relaxed, is good.
4. Big fat grip is very important to stop wrist from twisting. I discovered this later, in 2022. I thought the big grip thing was an ego trip. It is not. Pick your own.
5. I don't fidget a lot with my feet, the opposite of Patrick Cantlay. I can actually putt pretty well no matter where I put my feet. We putt with our eyes and only move our shoulder muscles. I don't need to align all my 206 bones or 600-800 muscles. I don't need 30 seconds to hit the ball, I know where I want to hit it, and I am CONFIDENT. Once I do my read, I get in position and it only take a few seconds to grip and mentally calculate speed/distance. Practice.
6. I try to follow thru on my putt stroke just like a partial swing, I often bring it all the way up to shoulder level. It trains you to move smoothly just like any partial swing shot.
I wish I had stats to give you. But I have few full rounds of play recently. I am 69, have arthritis, curved spine, health stuff. I worked full time til December 2023, just a few months ago. I have had 5 surgery or injury stoppages in the last 3 years (knee replacement, thumb arthritis, big toe arthritis surgeries, all successful, Scripps Clinic in San Diego/Torrey Pines). I worked 6 days a week during the virus 2020. On the other hand, I live in San Diego area 2 miles from a lighted range open til 9:00 363 days a year with a real green, so I practice putting a lot. A lot. My style is very similar to lefty Brian Harman, but in the mirror. Xander Schauffle, Billy Horschel and Matt Fitzpatrick putt crossx Fitz even chips crossx sometimes. Mike Bury has a very good you tube. I don't have any guide to reading the green to share with you, I don't plumb, I don't feel with my feet. Oh, 1 guide: take off your sunglasses, no matter how good they are, even prescription, to get the truest read.
I have done a lot of sampling in my local stores. There are excellent FB putters from Ping, Cobra, Cleveland, and Evnroll. Spyders come in hang and FB versions and are maybe my 2nd choice, especially on shorter putts. PXG makes all theirs to either hang or balance based on which shaft is connected. I might spring the $$ for a fitting at Evnroll or a Sacks Parente fitter. I will repeat that I think an arrow shape, a triangle, probably has a bigger sweet spot and is thus more stable, more resistant to tiny twisting. But any mallett and grip might be your ticket. Shaft length and lie are based on your physique as usual, and loft varies little, depending on what the designer builds in to the putter. Same with the face material and design. Your choice is your choice.
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3 minutes ago, cksurfdude said:
Do you know... is that for all putts, or usually just short putts, or __?? Thx
Long and short. I never see a combo. But Matt Fitzpatrick putts and sometimes chips cross. For me, the longer the putt, the better I like cross handed. Short putts are where I need the right comfort level of size, weight, grip to make a straight hit, no twist. For some reason I find it easier to hit longer putts , maybe it is more head speed keeps the inertia of the putter going straight , where as on a short putt, there is less energy moving forward, so it is easier for a small unwantd wrist mvmt to ruin the putt.
- cksurfdude and Rob Person
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An old quote: My two best shots are the practice swing and the conceded putt.
Mine is a tossup between the new Odyssey "R" Ball putter, and the trusty blue Mizuno S18 GFF wedge, 52 x 9.
My worst shot is cortisone, again, into the left shoulder acromio-clavicular joint. I inherited scoliosis and kyphosis (forward protruding neck).
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a little, more for new drivers on the market. Mickey Wright is the best swing though, and I think there is only 1 short "film" of her. Even tho our equip is more powerful, her mastery of the swing is tops. Very few of us can swing out of our toes, like Justin Thomas, Scottie, Tiger, Bryson, or Lexi Thompson. Any reader here might, maybe, know 1 personally.
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9 hours ago, unccross said:
I just read the mygolfspy article on this putter from an email I received this morning. I had never really heard about counter balanced puttters, but had me intrigued! My putting is so bad, I’m looking for any help I can get!
Try cross handed with a face balanced putter. Spyder type, fang type, you choose, but find a face bal you like, spend a few hours practicing. Look at left Brian Harman, or the LPGA rookie winner last October Hae Ran Ryu. A fat grip helps. I place my front (left) hand almost totally below the right hand, index finger on the shaft. Mt right index finger and thumb barely touch the pad of my left palm. I think Billy Horschel does also. I see more pros, men & women, on TV like this.
- cksurfdude and unccross
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1 minute ago, ILMgolfnut said:
Seems to be working rather well for him.
Before the beard, he reminded me of Alley Oop, the old caveman comic strip. The beard hides his chin. I hate how good he is and the foot shuffle. Now that he can putt, I expect he will be rich enough in a few years to buy a Texas baseball, NFL, or NBA team. Or maybe PBR (Professional Bull riding, rodeo). Then, when he is in his 40s or 50s, governor of Texas. Nobody could beat him.
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PW is the 45 deg Ping I 500, set., from 100 yards. (I am old). Then a Mizu, the S18, 52 x 9. From 80 yards in, my best club. Another Mizu, a T7, 60 x 6, from 25 yards in, but only if I have to go over stuff.
My CHIPPER is where I am different. I don't use a wedge near the fringe unless I have to. I have a 60 year old Don Martin Up-n-In bronze chipper with 25 degree loft. The sooner you get the ball on the ground, the less chance of a bad result, so 25 deg is easier to control than 58 or 60 deg around the green. I give up a long shaft in my bag to make room for it.
Sand is another oldie, an original Hogan Sure Out, 56 x 12. The sole is bigger than a 460 cc driver
and heavier than a EV pickup truck. I am on my 2nd onet. It might not be the most accurate, but it gets me out almost every time with the type of sand at my local, Oceanside (CA) Muni.
When the 52 deg Mizu wears down, I will try a fittiing for a 50 degree Indi Golf wedge, their home is 10 minutes away. I want to close the 20 yard gap between my 45 PW and 52 Mizu.
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On 4/16/2024 at 6:34 AM, Parshooter36 said:
I didn't get to see most of this years Masters. Unfortunately Paramount+ only let you see the CBS coverage on Thursday and Friday if you have the basic plan. They make you upgrade to their premium package to see the weekend coverage. Peacock does not do this with the NBC coverage. I ended up listening to most of it on my SiriusXM app while working out in the yard.
I have Cox cable and saw the weekend shows on regular CBS, delayed until the last 2 or 3 groups tee off.
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Anybody here try or have Paradym Star on the UST ATTAS shaft? I am a moderate swing speed 69 yr old, so it is made for me, but $7 beans???? Holy. Cow. I use reg flex on my irons, but usually go to a A flex on the longer stick, 3w and 1w. I am just getting over toe surgery, can't give it a tryout for another few days yet, but I handled one yesterday and it felt "Just Right" on the 48 gram reg flex ultra light shaft. At such a low weight I can probably do the reg flex.
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SUCCESS! The boot came off yesterday, April 8, the doctor said I can resume golf. Six weeks after surgery. It is still stiffer than normal, there is still mild pain with pressure on the front of the foot. But I started taking normal swings. I plan to hit 20 or 30 balls the first few days and work up to my normal range day of a medium bucket, and some time working on chipping and pitching. If I can figure out how, I will try to post the x-rays that show the plate, the 1 longitudinal screw about 1.25 inches long, front to rear, and 3 small vertical screws through the plate in each of the 2 bones being fused. And he took a small piece of bone from the heel, where the bone is a fast re-growing property, and put it in between the 2 toe bones, where the cartilage used to be. I am amazed, six weeks!
- Siamese Moose and Kenny B
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It's easier to predict the next earthquake than it is who might win this year. Way too many good golfers. And some of them are also good putters.
- Splatt and JockyCalvert
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26 minutes ago, BreakfastBall15 said:
Is it Thursday yet?!?
I think it is , in The Twilight Zone, Season 14 Episode Sub 70.
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On 4/6/2024 at 7:12 PM, tdroma98 said:
Never heard of the Tiger scorecard @Samuel09152.
Back when I was a 12-18 handicap, I'd practice a method from a golf school instructor based in Longmeadow, MA. (Cannot remember his name) You'd hit 1, 2, 3 or 4 balls, Based on your handicap range, take the best shot of the shots & do the same for the second shot. Do this for the 18 holes. It was to train your mind you could hit good shots and play good shots. As a 12-18 handicap I'd hit 3 shots
The Tiger Scorecard is a new one for me.
I like it . Positive reinforcement. As long as there are not players waiting behind me.
- tdroma98 and cksurfdude
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12 hours ago, Headhammer said:
How about KASCO K2K hybrids with their Super Hyten metal that made them the longest hybrids ever. I fell for the marketing when they appeared on The Hot List, that was long before MGS was born. Damn things did go pretty far though, or perhaps I was just younger and stronger back then.
Probably maraging steel which dates at least to the 1970s or as early as the 1950s and is still basic to all non Ti or non carbon-blend steel faces.. I think maraging was a big part of Barney Adams promotion.
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1 hour ago, cnosil said:
I'm Chris not Chuck
So far I seem to be doing okay; time will tell. Glad to hear about the foot.
Here is the user group
Oooppps Yes, mt mistake, Chris. Well I found which forum category has shotscope. there are a lot of forums and u have to search each one separately I think. I broke doctors order today , put on a regular sneaker to move my car 1st time in 5 weeks. foot feels promising.
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Here's the title it was March 20 2024 in Golf . com
What’s more important: Greens in regulation or fairways hit? Data tells us
BY: NICK DIMENGO MARCH 20, 2024
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I did see something in a different online bip that greens in regulation is a more important stat than fairways hit. which makes sense. Either way, my surgery boot comes off Monday
the 8th (April 2024) after 7 weeks and I can finally start hitting real balls instead of hitting the keyboard.
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1 hour ago, cnosil said:
Putting has, but measurements take longer to assess. People want benefits to show up in one round, but with putting the measurement needs to occur over a season. If you read the book Lowest Score Wins, they categorize areas of the game that help separate players (https://lowestscorewins.com/separation-value) and putting falls near the bottom. Think about a 3 foot putt; you can practice them all day every day but you probably won't make significantly more than someone that never practices them. As for tech and fitting, they have shown improvement in putting. There is better understanding of launch angle, that the face is the influence for ball direction and path has minimal influence, that there are stroke categorizations and they have specific putter configurations that benefit the player, you can measure how different putter configurations influence ball direction. Unfortunately most people dismiss anything putter tech with the response that it is a small slow stroke and it doesn't matter or that they are a "feel" player. I believe this response goes back to my first statement.
ShotScope metrics get very deep; which is why I stopped using them....way too much detail than I needed at my game level. If you haven't already, start reading the shotscope user group on the forum and ask questions, lots of people that can help you understand the stats being displayed.
1st ? is Chuck, how you feeling? Hope still getting better. My foot is almost healed, the boot comes off Monday, and I think the doc will let me start putting some weight on the front of the foot in a regular shoe.
Next, can you or someone link me to the shotscope user group in forum/ I can't search right, I get hundreds of wrong mentions or nothing.
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4 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:
Exactly it’s not the putting for dough thats important it’s then ball striking and short game.
its a cliche that needs to die. Along with hold the lag which has been shown to not be what pros do. The slow backswing and slow tempo also is a something that needs to die in golf swing discussion. Theres a lot of older school thoughts and cliches that just don’t hold true
Oh NO! You addd another topic to argue about!!! Slow swing!!!! AAaaaggghhh!!!. (Someone forgot to tell Hideki
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36 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:
That mantra has been debunked for awhile like many things golf. Strokes gained, launch monitor technology, fitters like Tom Wishon, Howard jones, others experts like tuttleman, 3d systems have all shown us how wrong many of the old school thinking was.
I wonder about some stats, such as scoring from the fairway versus missing the fairway. Officially, if you are 1 inch off, and you make par or birdie, it benefits scoring from the rough. But nobody tracks scoring where you consider the first cut of rough as if it was a fairway. I am sure that scoring from 1st cut is way better than scoring from the real wilds. So, the tally for scoring from the rough is improved. Which bolsters the idea that you can bomb away and not worry about accuracy. Driving accuracy is underrated? Or, am I just causing trouble for the hell of it?
Anddddddd,, I don't know that good fitting, using club makers and technology, has to do with improving one aspect of the game more than another aspect, Dough or Show. Or has it? Is putting the one part of scoring stats that has not benefitted from the last 20 , 30, yrs of tech & fitting?
Putting Drills
in Lessons, Drills, Mental Game, and Fitness Tips
Posted
I posted a new thread Step by step guide to putt cross handed. take a look.
Grip pressure has to be enough to not let the shaft twist in your hands. Not necessarily a light grip.