silver & black

I agree, but that wasn't the question?

That's a good question. Other than the known "outlaw" balls, does anyone know the answer? Also, if the known "outlaw" balls are being submitted for handicap, does it affect anything other than a vanity HC that works against you anyway in competition?

Right, but all these balls are currently "legal" for competition. When the roll back happens, if a round is submitted using the current ball/s instead of the roll back ball/s, how does that impact handicap?

How would that impact keeping a handicap if one didn't play "legal" balls for every round submitted for a handicap?

To clarify where I stand on this: If/when the ball is rolled back, I will still play the game... and have fun doing so. I am against rolling back the ball. I'm in favor of freezing EVERYTHING where it is right now. I am against bifurcation. I think the game is just fine where it's at... including the pro game. If EVERYTHING is frozen where it is right now, I see no problem/s in the future of the game. I see no problem/s now. I don't want bifurcation because I want the same rules, specs and equipment across the full spectrum of the game to include everyone that plays the game... including the pros. Golf is unique in that we all play the game by the same rules and equipment, which is the same as the pros use. More accurate would be the pros use the same equipment that all of us use. That allows me to be even more impressed with just how good these people are at what they do. No other sport/game is like this as far as I'm aware.(maybe Basketball?) If/when the roll back happens, I want it to be for the entire golf world. I don't want two sets of equipment rules for the pros and us mere mortal players.

Contentious? Hmmm.... maybe it's just me, but I think this has been/is a fantastic discussion between a lot of really cool, pasionite, level headed members that have shown a lot of respect for each other in over 100 pages. Sometimes things get said in a way that may seem contentious, but I think everyone is just trying to get their point across, and this being the internet with no way to see facial expressions or hear voice inflections, things can sometimes seem to be contentious when they really aren't. MGS has the best forum and members on the net, as far as golf is concerned.

I'm usually impressed if someone uses any meathod.

I have the black belt, but you got me with the diplomatic skills.

Good to see you here!

You must have some reason/thoughts for your post. Can you give some clarification on why you feel this way?

So.... we are arguing semantics? Pro V1 is basically not the same ball as a TP5... or other premium urethane balls? Okay..... not exactly the same, but undiscernable from each other by 99.9% of golfers? I would argue they are all so close as to not make a difference.

I would argue that they all do use the same ball.... just a different maker/name.

Exactly. What more can be done? There is already standards to equipment (clubs/putters). The ball itself... maybe not. Why not just impose a standard for where the ball is at this moment in time? If the decrease in distance from a roll back is only going to be 5 - 10 yards, I fail to see what is actually being accomplished?

Isn't there already equipment restrictions? Driver COR? Wedge grooves? Putter anchoring? I still don't get what problem is being solved with the ball roll back... if there is only a 5-10 yard decrease in distance, what 'problem' is actually being solved/fixed?

Get what under control? Players becoming more 'athletic'? Players figuring out 'how' to hit the ball farther? I guess I just don't understand the need to put a damper on players getting better at what they do.... to what end?

As a better player, how do you feel about bifurcation? If the distance difference is only 5-10 yards on a rolled back ball, what actual problem is being solved?

That's kinda what I figured. In other words.... there really is no problem... just a solution seeking a problem.

What hat? Love your user name!

I chip with solid wrists... more like a hard putting stroke. I pitch with 'some' wrist involved, but not like a full swing... if that makes any sense...lol.

Getting back to the actual topic: I'm personally against bifurcation. Why? Because I like that I play the same rules, balls, clubs and courses (well... ) that the pros play. I don't want the option/s to play different (advantage giving) equipment that the pros don't have the option to play. I think it is cool to watch how good the pros really are... using the same equipment I have access to. Concerning rolling back the ball: what does that actually mean? If it means less distance... and from what I've read it will be around 5 - 10 yards.... what problem does it solve? Certainly not the distance 'problem'? I'm just confused about what the two governing bodies are trying to do with a ball 'roll back'? If whatever is going to happen/is decided on, I want all golfers to be subject to the same rules and equipment as the pros. Maybe that's a personal, selfish view on my part. Having said that, I really have no problem with how anyone wants to play the game or what equipment anyone wants to use. I just don't see the 'need' for bifurcation, as that would separate 'us' from the pros (there is enough already ) as playing the same game that we all love. I will play the game regardless of what decision is made.

Okay.