Swing Weight

[Douglas2123]

I purchased a new Ping G LS Tec (I was fitted for it via trackman). I felt very comfortable with it and looked online at the specs and listened to the clubfitter. The one thing I did not think about and the clubfitter did not bring up was swingweight. I weight my clubhead  and it weighed in at 200.5 g (Ping website says 207.5 g). The sole weight is 5.3g. Ive got the Tour 65x shaft with an oversize Lamkin crossline on it. The original length of club was 45.25" I had it cut to 44.75". Shaft weight with grip and adapter is 156 g. The website says the club is D4 SW. I measured and it came out as a C6 SW. I understand that cutting the shaft down caused the SW to change. But from what I understand for every 1" cut is 6 SW points. If this is true then I only lost 3 SW points due to it being 1/2" cut off (So I started off at a C9?)...It just doesn't seem correct.

 

Total Club wt : 356.5 g

Balance Point: 30.5 in

 

I know that I can get heavier sole weights from Ping. I think they come in 8, 10, 12.5, and 14 grams. I would have to go to 14 grams. This would bring the total club wt to 365.2 g and it might change my balance point 1/4 - 1/2 in which would bring the SW to a D0 possibly a D1. 

 

Would a lighter grip work? Even though it would change the balance point, it would also change the overall weight of the club.

 

I just need some thoughts and feedback on Swing weight and what to do. The club just feels superlight. Is this something that Ping would correct with the head being 7.5 grams lighter than what is advertised. Also I am trying not to put lead tape on my club. 

[Douglas2123]

Thought: Would counterbalancing the driver help in any way?...don't know much about counterbalancing

[jaskanski]

365.5g at 30.5" (bad practice to mix your metric and imperial units) is indeed C6.

Ignoring the factory specs for one moment - at what swing weight did you try (and like) the club you purchased? If it is at what you have at the moment, then you have absolutely nothing to worry about.

Whilst on the subject of balancing components in a final build, it's worth remembering that the total weight (mass) distributed throughout the clubs length (i.e. swing weight) can be misleading.

An oversize grip for example tips the balance towards the butt, however you don't swing the club holding the head and hit the ball with the grip! Therefore the force applied during the swing at the fulcrum (your hands) is pretty insignificant compared to the force at the extreme end of the club head. In other words, swing weight can be "tricked" into reading as a low(ish) quantity when in actual fact it feels somewhat different.

So it's entirely possible to build a club at a certain swing weight that "feels" heavy or light depending on it's static balance - which is exactly what swing weight refers to - the balance of a static club. And not many balls can be struck with a motionless club.

[Douglas2123]

I tested the club at a D4. Great response jaskanski (I had a scale with only grams and a tape measure with only inches, but my apologies)

 

I sat down with a club fitter/builder yesterday afternoon and had a lengthy discussion on SW. After some talk we came to a conclusion for the time being... we took the oversize grip off and installed a standard grip with 5 wraps underneath to bring the grip to a midsize feel. This dropped the weight of the club, moved the balance point from 30.5 in to 32.5 in, and it brought the SW to a D1...Positive action. He also called Ping (he is a Ping Dealer) and they are sending me a heavier sole weight (14.5g)...previous sole weight 5.3 g. So hopefully we will be able to get it back to where I want it.

 

I also talked with a club builder from Ping on some options as well. We talked about grip size as well. But he mentioned if I did not want to go with a lighter grip then I could put hot melt in the club. I could send it to Ping with the desired grip size (midsize/oversize) and they would get it to to my desired SW by getting some hot melt in the club head. He also said that it would mute the sound as well.

[Douglas2123]

Does anyone have experience with having hot melt in their drivers?

[jaskanski]

Take notice of any change in flex when adding large increments of weight to the head of a club. As a general rule of thumb, each increase in 1 sw point will soften the flex by 1 cpm also. That means shifting weight to the head to move from C6 to D1 (5 points) will be 5cpm - or half a full flex. That means your overall flex profile in cpm will be softer, possibly adding a touch of launch and spin. A better option may have been to tip trim by half and butt trimming to follow for the final playing length.

[revkev]

I still wish that Jaskanski lived close by - if it weren't for two little bodies of water I would go and see him for a fitting.  I might even bring a cup of my favorite coffee along.

[jaskanski]

Fear not - I get over the pond now and again. Do you have Neros coffee in Florida? 

 

Anyways...

 

It's all about the free exchange of information and knowledge. If it helps someone to find what they're looking for, or helps to point them in the right direction, then it makes it all worthwhile. 

[03trdblack]

Does anyone have experience with having hot melt in their drivers?

I have a hot melt gun and use it in drivers. What did you want to know?

[apprenti23]

Did you not order it at the exact SW you were fit for? Perfect example on why it is so important having your clubs built custom over ordering from the manufacturer.

 

I would experiment with lead tape before hot melt because once it's in there it is not coming out. Last year I played my G30 at 44.25" and 15 grams of HM in the head.

[Douglas2123]

I did my driver test with a 45.25" shaft...There was not a 44.75" shaft available to test. I knew that the SW characteristics would change but did not realize that much. 

 

03trdblack - I talked with a guy a Ping about HM just wanted to make sure I know what I am getting into. He said they can set it up in the heel, toe, or neutral. How precise are they with this? Will it dampen the sound of the driver? how much will it change ball flight, etc? 

[03trdblack]

03trdblack - I talked with a guy a Ping about HM just wanted to make sure I know what I am getting into. He said they can set it up in the heel, toe, or neutral. How precise are they with this? Will it dampen the sound of the driver? how much will it change ball flight, etc? 

 

They use a gun with a long thin nozzle that allows them to place the hotmelt basically anywhere they want in the head.  They can place some in the toe, heel or just on the sole in the middle.  Usually they aren't going to add more than 5 grams of melt so don't expect massive amounts of flight change just because they stick it in the heel or toe area, especially when the clubhead weighs 200+ grams.  Depending on how much they add the sound will change slightly and become more solid sounding and won't have quite as much hollow sound.  I've found if you add a lot then a head can sound almost too solid and dead sounding (performance will still be fine).  It all depends on what you like a driver to sound like.  If you like the old persimmon head sound then you'd have to add a LOT of hotmelt to get that affect, especially in the Ping head.  I personally think the G driver sounds quite tinny and I added some cotton balls to mine to quiet it down some.

[Douglas2123]

Cotton Balls? Interesting...I suppose those are in there for good.

[Douglas2123]

Can you feel the cotton balls moving or are they so lightweight its not noticable?

[03trdblack]

Can you feel the cotton balls moving or are they so lightweight its not noticable?

 

You can't feel them moving around.  You can't stuff the cotton in as one solid ball because the hole in the weight screw is too small.  You have to pull the cotton apart and push it through in much smaller bits.  There are some different ways to get the cotton out but for the most part it's in there for good.

[Douglas2123]

How would you go about getting the cotton out if for some reason you got it in there and decided to remove it?

[Douglas2123]

how much should you use?

[jaskanski]

how much should you use?

 

A bit obvious - the amount you use will be determined by the final swing weight you intend to have. So weigh it first before inserting it (or anything else) into the head.

[03trdblack]

How would you go about getting the cotton out if for some reason you got it in there and decided to remove it?

 

Depending on the size of the cotton balls, I've found approx 3 cotton balls = around 2 grams which is 1 swingweight point.  Again it depends on the cotton balls.  

 

One way to remove the cotton would be to squirt some lighter fluid in the head and light it on fire.  The cotton will burn and you can shake the ashes out if there are any left.

[AH1980MN]

Hahaha! And then watch it rocket out of the garage and through your neighbor's window!

[03trdblack]

Hahaha! And then watch it rocket out of the garage and through your neighbor's window!

 

That's part of the fun of course!

[TinkerGolfMan]

My local golf shop put a weight at the tip end of the the shaft, just before the shaft adapter, still making the shaft adapter usable, I went from C6 SW to D1 SW. 

[Douglas2123]

Update: I finally got a new weight from Ping. 14.5 grams. I have since put on a midsize grip and got the SW back to a D5/6, which is about wear I want it. The club feels great and I am hitting the ball well.

[apprenti23]

My driver swing weight is E3, hybrid D4, irons D5, Gap D6 sand and Lob D7

[ole gray]

If you cut one inch off the butt end of a driver (Ping G25) shaft taking it from a 45.5 to a 44.5, how would you get the swing weight back to factory spec which is D3?  

 

1 -  Add lead tape ?

 

or

 

 

2 -  put a larger grip on to offset the inch cut off?

[ole gray]

If you cut one inch off the butt end of a driver (Ping G25) shaft taking it from a 45.5 to a 44.5, how would you get the swing weight back to factory spec which is D3?  

 

1 -  Add lead tape ?

 

or

 

 

2 -  put a larger grip on to offset the inch cut off?

 

Well here I go quoting myself again but since no one got the correct answer I will tell ya what I did today.   I started out playing with no tape at all.  That was not a good thing as I was good bit shorter than where I normally hit my drives.  I started adding tape to the middle back part of the head.  Well that gets the ball way up in the air like a buzzard shopping for his next dinner. I went ahead and added some tape from the toe area back towards the center. Two pieces about three inch's in length. Hmmmmm that started feeling a bit better however it didn't just right yet. I hit a couple more drives and was pushing them out to the right so I added another three inch piece from the center back towards the heel. Now I was cooking with Crisco!   Pound town again and my confidence was back.  When you whack an inch off your shaft it makes you wonder if it will ever work the same again. You just got to keep playing with it until you get that good feel back. I have no idea what the swing weight is now however next time I'm by Dick's I'll have my buddy there put it on his little machine and tell me what I came up with.  All I know is it feels good, flight is good, and distance is back with maybe a tad more because I'm hitting the center of the face.