[UST Helium or KBS Max in Srixon ZX4 MkII Irons?]

14 minutes ago, Golf2Much said:

@RickyBobby_PR in a perfect world, I agree 100% with everything you said above. 

Unfortunately, living at the southern end of US1 I'm 150 or more miles away from any access to swinging both shafts at the same time and under the same conditions.  If I get to the mainland four or five times a year that's a lot.  Throw in my physical limitations and I'm probably even more unique segment of the golfing population.  I was just looking for opinions and/or insights that people might have had.   At my level, there's always some level of risk associated with any club purchase I make.  Even with professional fittings, some clubs ultimately work out in the long run and some don't.  I was hoping that any insight (whether I accept it or not) might be more valuable than none at all.  

If 4 people came in and said the kbs shaft didn’t work for them and they had the same swing speed as you how does that help when in your fitting the kbs worked for you.

When it comes to shafts unless or has a late release they won’t notice much difference in shafts outside of possibly feel

[UST Helium or KBS Max in Srixon ZX4 MkII Irons?]

16 minutes ago, Golf2Much said:

With either shaft (even with the KBS shaft upcharge), I'll be paying significantly less than what's listed on the Srixon website.  So, the cost portion of the overall value equation is less of an issue.  Since I didn't have the chance of hitting each shaft side by side under the same conditions, I was hoping some other MGS forum member with a similar swing speed may have tried them both in one fitting and would share their experiences with both shafts.

The issue with the bolded is that someone with you same swing speed doesn’t swing like you. Therefore their experience with a shaft is just that their experience and there’s no way to say that you will have the same experience as them. I know people want to hear others experience but it’s not providing any value. Posting below some reading about this
 

You have hit both shafts in a relatively short period of time between each other so you should be able to tell which one is better for you.

Myth #5 – How a shaft plays and performs for one golfer or group of golfers is important for other golfers to know to be able to make a proper shaft selection

Only if the golfers involved all happen to have EXACTLY, and I mean exactly, the same swing characteristics is someone else’s experience with a particular shaft of any importance. And how often do two or more golfers swing exactly the same way? 

I can’t tell you how many times I have scanned posts on golf equipment internet forums from golfers who ask a question such as, “has anyone tried the XYZ shaft and what do you think of it?” Invariably, almost every golfer’s response comes back citing this or that personal opinion or playing result without ever saying one thing about any of their specific swing characteristics. 

In addition, numerous times I have heard a golfer comment about a shaft to say something like, “that XYZ shaft is really a bad shaft. If golfers knew that shaft performance is so tied to specific golf swing characteristics they would say instead, “that shaft is probably a good shaft for some other golfer, but it is a bad shaft FOR ME AND MY SPECIFIC SWING CHARACTERISTICS.” 

There is no such thing as a good shaft or a bad shaft in this game. There are only shafts that fit their owners and shafts that do not fit their owners. More than any other component, the performance of the shaft is completely related to a series of finite, specific swing and playing characteristics – your clubhead speed, your transition move to start the downswing, your downswing aggressiveness/tempo, the point during the downswing when you unhinge your wrist-**** angle to release the club to impact and whether you as a golfer do or do not have a specific, preferred sense for the bending feel of the shaft during the swing.

[UST Helium or KBS Max in Srixon ZX4 MkII Irons?]

57 minutes ago, Golf2Much said:

I was curious if those who've tried both shafts felt the $25 per shaft upcharge was worth it?

This isn’t anyone can decide. We all place value on things differently. But at least on the Srixon website there isn’t a price difference. Between he helium and KBS shafts. 

[Help me choose my next club]

If you are happy with your setup then spend money on lessons and see what your true potential in the course can be

[How do I know when I should get a fitting?]

8 minutes ago, Dan1993 said:

Thanks a bunch! Question for you! How do you like your PXG set? Saw that they have a "hero" discount and they have a fitter near me out in Suffolk.

 

The USNA course is great, and was tons of fun to learn to play on, but man are there some challenging approaches. Lots of elevated greens.

I haven’t updated my bag or any of my info on here in awhile.

I am a recovering club ho lol. I loved my pxg and have had them twice now. The hero discount is nice and was part of the factor into buying them.

Yeah the course has some tough greens and some tough hole layouts. Last time I played the female golf team was out just in front of us and they were fun to watch when I could catch their shots 

[How do I know when I should get a fitting?]

Whenever purchasing new clubs you should get fit. There are small changes that happen with weighting, cg location, face thickness. How those changes affect the ball flight will vary for each person.

Getting fit gives the golfer clubs that work with their swing rather than the golfer having to manipulate things to get the club to hit the shot they want to hit.

There are different level of fittings and different experience level of fitters. Find a reputable fitter to do the fitting.

 

On a side note I’ve had the chance to play USNA course a few times. I like the course 

[PXG Fitting Question]

13 minutes ago, FightingScot82 said:

My fitting was great. I was worried about judgment from the fitter because I don't play or practice nearly enough to get consistent ball striking, but was quickly eradicated.

I was fit for the 0311 XP but was told with practice the 0311 P would suit me long term. The sticker price is more than I want to spend so I may hold out for a sale or see if I can take these measurements to a well-versed fitter for something more in line with my budget.

I did enjoy the PXG clubs - if I had the money I would have pulled the trigger on the spot. Take advantage of the $25 fitting deal if you can.

If you are looking at the big OEMs you are going to find that clubs are going to be around the same price per irons as these or more. Most fitters are only going to have the big brand irons. Also because of different designs in face thickness, cg location, weight and how that can affect swing and ball flight, just saying to a fitter here is what pxg fit me to what will work for me in brands X,y, or Z is going to be hard to give a definitive answer. The fitter will probably have you try to hit some of the clubs with same shaft to see wha the ball flight is. If he/she just says “go with those combo from brand X” I would walk away.

I can tell you between p790,i5xx from ping and the pxg irons I have been before into different shafts and have had different lm numbers using the same shaft in each.

If price is a factor then you are probably better off looking at a dtc brand like sub 70. Contact them and give them your specs and let them get you on the closest thing possible. 

[Lead weight]

38 minutes ago, emansinwi said:

Hey everyone! I use lead tape on my driver only. I wanted to try a shorter shaft, and was told I needed to add some weight to the clubhead. Do any of you use it in other clubs? I was surprised to see how much some pros use on like their wedges for example.  Anyway, truly love the groups and the chats! Enjoy the Masters!  E

Maybe but maybe not. Depends on how sensitive you are to weight change and how things go with the shorter shaft.

After you cut the shaft hit balls with the setup and check contact point on the face, ball flight, etc. if you don’t like the feel or results slowly add tape tll you get to the point you are happy with the feel and ball flight 

I have used lead tape on irons when I switched to graphite shafts to  get them to match the feel I had with the steel shafts. It was only needed on a couple irons 

[UST Helium or KBS Max in Srixon ZX4 MkII Irons?]

13 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

Didn't catch that. Normally they show next to the choice a price. 

Right. I didn’t see it so I went ahead and added them to the cart to see what would happen and both helium and kbs max were $1299 whereas just the stock setup for 4-p was $1199 and some change 

[divot]

On 2/21/2024 at 7:31 PM, fixyurdivot said:

It's the dumbest rule in the game and should be changed.  Being penalized for a good drive when you have no control of it stopping in a divot, which is technically GUR, is silly.  If your ball rolls onto a sprinkler head or yardage marker you get relief.  The same should apply to fairway divots.  

The USGA and R&A should have spent the time and effort correcting this instead of fixing a distance problem that does not exsist/effect 99% of players.

Provide the section of ground under repair as outlived in the rules of golf that shows a divot would be considered ground under repair.

even if the committee designates them gur when does it not longer become gur? Which is the same when is a divot no longer a divot? Which has been discussed everytime this topic come is. 
 

There is nothing in golf that say anyone is guaranteed a good result for a good shot. 

[UST Helium or KBS Max in Srixon ZX4 MkII Irons?]

1 hour ago, Josh Parker said:

Here is my first suggestion...

Order directly from Srixon with your specs on the KBS or order from GG because I am not seeing that those shafts are an upcharge.

Here is the link to Srixon HERE

I ordered mine that way after being fitted and saved a bunch of money.

 

When the kbs max shaft is added to the cart it’s $100 more for a 4-pw set than if using stock steel shaft.

the helium shafts are also $100 more for 4-pw 

 

[Pockets]

4 hours ago, berkeleybob said:

In suit/dress pants, I took them to be originally for change so it won’t jingle while walking. 

If it’s the same in golf pants and a single marker, well, yeah, that would be annoying, since it’s not convenient to fish it out. I imagine tees can get stuck in them as well, which may or may not be a good thing.

The pocket was originally designed by Levi jeans to protect pocket watches. It was kept as part of the design to protect the integrity of the initial design. It’s been a part of fashion for along time because pretty much every Jean company kept it.

Its not something found in dress pants/suits because there is a pocket in the jacket for a pocket watch.

the interesting part is Levi has or had a patent on the pocket

[Pockets]

They are used to give pants the casual look since that pocket isn’t part of dress pants 

 

[Which driver?]

32 minutes ago, Hacker60521 said:

@Ken Takagi since the driver is generally a tougher club to hit, and given that you’ll have more variation in performance based on stock setups, I’d highly recommend a fitting where you can compare models and obtain real data. It’s always helpful when you can vary head and shaft combos. 

The same thing can be done at a pay superstore, 2ndswing, golf galaxy and so on. They have clubs to demo and one can swap between them.

What variation in performance will be seen with stock setups?

[Which driver?]

2 hours ago, Ken Takagi said:

Thank you for your advise.
I never really understood spin and launch etc where all that data comes out on the screen.

What are some of the points I need to look at when I am ie. testing different drivers - testing them.

I just really go with the feel... and that usually ends up not being right after a few rounds.

Ken,

Club delivery plays a role in spin with dynamic loft delivered, path, face to path, and face angle. The lower on the face the more spin and less launch happens and vice versa for higher on the face.

from a head design perspective I have found the tm heads even the supposedly more forgiving head to be lower spinning than pin heads. Titleist seems to fall in between those two brands.

As to what to look at is face contact. Spray the face with foot powder spray or use impact tape(this will affect launch numbers if using a launch monitor) the foot spray not so much. You want to be middle of the face to about 5mm above center and 5mm towards the toe.

Feel is important because when things feel good there’s a chance we will produce better swings compared to something that feels bad or not as good. The ones that don’t feel good could cause for us to manipulate our swing to get the club to hit the shot we want.

Ball flight is key. Make sure the ball isn’t getting to its apex and then ballooning up this is too much spin. On the reverse side you don’t want a ball that flies low just drops out of the sky this is too little spin.

While self testing is fun a fitting with a reputable fitter would help you find the best combo

[Which driver?]

One thing to consider is spin and launch. The different heads have different weights, different cg locations, different faces. Forgiveness for the most past is moi which is there to reduce gear effect. With higher moi spin js typically going to be higher and we see that in the ping heads where even their lst model Is higher spinning than other lower spinning heads.

How the shaft feels with a head will play a role. I’ve had the ad di and it’s worked in some heads and not other. Had it in the m3 and hated it in m5/6.

 

 

[What/How Did You Practice Today?]

8 hours ago, cnosil said:

There are people that disagree.  I guess it will depend on your definition of practice, but I consider working on mechanics and body motion practice.  
 

 

He’s an outlier in teaching to start with. He starts with downswing? That’s very uncommon teaching because 1) the downswing is .25 seconds from the top of the swing to impact 2) the prevailing nights is the downswing in a reaction to what happens in the backswing and where the club is. So if you are in a and position in the backswing the downswing is just compensation of moves to get got the ball hopefully with a square face.

changing a swing pattern is changing a movement pattern. As someone who is studying to be a corrective exercise specialist learning about the nuero system, how motor neurons work and the motor neuron pathway works is a huge part of the training. The science tells us that it’s slow reps that slowly build up in speed and intensity are needed to make a change and that change can take 8-12 weeks of doing the same movement with the added speed and intensity depending on what the client can handle and how do under control. The science also tells us it takes up to 3000 reps to master a movement.

in the video around the 9:10 mark he show how wide open Corrie’s face is just before impact and that he would hit a bad shot if there was a ball there. Cordie was also in a lot of side bend which isn’t ideal and nobody needs that much to hit a ball.

As they discussed people are focused on the result of the shot, so he tries to get away from that focus and he incorporates a ball relatively early in the process because our brains need to react to hitting an object.

as Monte says if 148 out of 150 pros do something and two don’t you don’t focus on the outlier. Same applies to teaching. If the majority of good to top level instructors teach from impact or p6 then slowly work their way thru the backswing that’s probably where one should start. They all do it somewhat differently. Monte teaches p6 first in efficient swing, Gankas teaches to get to p2. Porzak teaches checkpoint one which is around p2,Milo teaches foundation 1 which it club parallel no wrist set and then turn thru the ball then parallel with wrist set. Dan carraher teaches takeaway and backswing first. All of them use a ball and that contact and results don’t matter because your training a movement and that’s all the focus should be. As you improve the movement contact gets better and the ball starts going in the right direction.

we can look at Monte’s ntc. He says in the video if you are in the position he demonstrates in the backswing then skip everything up to the point, if not then it’s learning wrist hinge, then lead arm parallel then top of swing. The it’s cast a for transition into impact. Cast b aka the release he says if it’s not happening automatically then work on cast b.

[PAR is a mental health issue for golfers.... one man's opinion]

13 hours ago, THE GOLF GUY said:

My favorite mental approach is , one shot at a time . Don’t think par , birdie or anything else when hitting your tee shot.

Agree. The score will be what it is after the hole and after the round. Control that which you can which is the shot in front of you

[What/How Did You Practice Today?]

18 minutes ago, Rob Person said:

The board I saw posted had a ball image ingrained on the board.  So would that still be considered fruitless? It gives you a point of reference and contact.

IMO yes. Because there still is not actual ball to hit and the subsequent results of the swing. One could get a good result on the board with a bad swing. I can hit a straight shot or a good shot on the course with a bad swing. I got to sub 10 handicap and have shots many rounds in the low to mid 70s with a swing that has early extension and too inside of a swing from improper shifting and shallowing. 
 

Practicing on the divot board without a ball wouldn’t fix any of my issues

what fixes my issues is proper practice of doing movement based practice and then shot making practice. The movement practice helps retrain how my nuero system functions and to create new motor patterns 

[What/How Did You Practice Today?]

1 hour ago, Willie T said:

As @Rob Person notes - the Divot Board is a good way to work on swing path and begin to develop a consistent swing.  It  can de used with or without a ball.  Also - don’t try to make practice too complicated - look at what is the “worst” area of your game and focus there…for me it’s been the 150yd in (approach shots) so I do a lot of work on the irons. Also follow this page and see what others are doing and ask questions, post a video of your swing (down the line as well as face on) - preferably is slo-mo.  In the end, small gains are the best gains! 

Making swings without a ball is not a great way to practice. The brain doesn’t have to react to making contact or results. the divot board without a ball is basically making a practice swing and practice swings are not very useful. People’s faces are wide open amongst other issues 

[What's Your Favorite Iron Shaft?]

2 hours ago, Shrek74 said:

How did you like the Proto 110's? I have a set of Recoil Prototype 125's that I'm going to be building a set of Maltby TS1-IM's with Max Milled wedges. Always curious to hear more about other people's experiences with them.

I haven’t noticed a difference between the 110 and 110 proto. I’m a fan of the shaft. I like the feel and balance. They swing weight well

[What's Your Favorite Iron Shaft?]

2 hours ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

I know that is a "correct" answer, but let's live a little!

What's been your favorite or maybe a better way to put it. When you go for a fitting what is the first shaft you try and it is one you know that you typically like or get on well with.

We start with whatever I have at the time.

if I had to just pick a shaft it would be recoil 110

[Looking to add a 3 wood to the arsenal]

Ping 5w with shaft 1/4-1/2” longer

[What's Your Favorite Iron Shaft?]

The one that fits my swing with the head I’m trying. Have no favorite or preferred shaft. Have had several versions of DG s3000/400 including the original amt version. Px6.0, px io, kbs tour, kns tour 90, recoil 110 and 110 proto, $ taper, c taper lite, modus 120

[Golf Ball Fitting]

I have been fitted for golf balls on multiple occasions by Bridgestone as titleist. 
 

I also have tons of experience testing balls on the course and comparing to my gamer. It’s doesn’t take long for me to determine if whatever I’m testing is better, same or worse than my gamer.