Mizuno Long Game - 2023 Forum Review

[vandyland]

Playing update 8/27/2023:

A great day driving the ball. These stats are out of this world for me...

AVERAGING over 300 yds and gaining 2+ shots against a scratch is crazy. It even rained last night so it is not like it baked out. Fairways hit was up and honestly the fairways I missed, I probably had 3 missed fwys where I was less than 2 yds off the fairway. There is also a few big dogleg holes where i hit it through the fairway. In all, I had one bad driver swing and it was on #18 where I toed one into the bunker at 270. I carried a bunker on #13 that I didn't even know was carry-able (280 to carry) for me. For posterity's sake, here are the holes I hit driver and where they ended up. Currently I am over the moon about my driving and that is carrying my game. For posterity, here are the driver holes. 

 

HYBRID AND UTILITY

I had some pretty poor swings at the hybrid today and they all still went 210+ and stayed in play, which is good. Had two swings at the Fli Hi with mixed results. I think with the hybrid, I was trying to stretch it too much...make it too explosive. The utility, I just think I made a bad swing where I spun out. I hit it off a tee on one and it was a beautiful shot. Just don't quite trust it in a competitive round off the turf. On the positive side, I don't think I have missed a utility shot to the right yet. My "bad" swings are a toe side and they go left but not mega left. I like to think I almost can't hit this club right with a decent swing which I think is a good thing (I can't really hit an intentional fade with any club). 

 

Edited August 28, 2023 by vandyland

[Swood1994]

Alright this weekend was filled with a lot of golf so I'm doing a small recap of my rounds from Saturday (8/26) and Sunday (8/27). This weekend was two very different rounds. Saturday I could not get off the tee to save my life. Sunday was more consistent but still had a couple left misses.

This round was all over the place. I had to scramble my behind off just to scrape together a 82. I could not get off the tee for anything. And it did not put me in any scoring positions. The rough was really grown out at this course and was very penalizing.

This round was really great except 2 holes. More on that in a second. Driver and tee balls were better today and although I only hit 3/13 fairways I the ones I missed were only a few yards off the edge of the fairway. I'll get to more on the clubs but just have to put out there I had 3 Birdies and a chip-in eagle. I was +1 Thru 15. I proceeded to go double, triple (ob), par for my last 3 holes. Not at all how I wanted to finish but I'll take a 78.

Key notes:

• I am still not as consistent as I would like to be with the driver. 
• The driver (for me) is very easy to turn over right to left. This is not my normal shot shape so it is hard to get used to. 
• The 3-Wood can go just as far as the driver when hit well. I am becoming a big fan of this club off the tee. Off the deck is still good but obviously slightly more inconsistent depending on the lie.
• 4-Hybrid is the same story as the 3-Wood. Both clubs are very easy to hit off the tee. It fits the distance gap in my bag and the adjustability is a nice change of pace.

Here's a Nice photo of the views from today and soon this will be all fall foliage:

Edited August 28, 2023 by Swood1994

[russtopherb]

Great feedback and stats everyone. Looks like the hybrid in particular is gaining a lot of fans (myself included).

Sadly aside from one range session I haven't been able to get any time with these clubs the last week. Between my schedule and weather, things haven't worked out. Hopefully once the rain passes the next few days I'll be able to get back out there a few times for some more feedback.

[vandyland]

Hoping to get my hands on a Stealth 2 Plus demo since that won the MGS "Best Golf Drivers of 2023", looking at the top 3 drivers they really separated themselves:

and then you look at Mizuno:

And having hit it for the last few weeks I wonder how a driver can be markedly better? On raw distance, maybe, since you could throw a 46" shaft in it but the accuracy and forgiveness have been very good for me (as well as distance). So If could see what the Stealth or Aerojet LS or TSR3 are bringing to the table that is so different (if anything) I could maybe capture that here. It does have to be a low spin head though and I would have to try to find a comparable shaft which may be difficult. Titleist doesn't carry the LIN-Q Red or MCA Vanquish as stock offering. As always, finding a higher torque stiff shaft is a challenge. 

Update: Taylormade offers the MCA Kai'li Red shaft as a stock offering which is a high torque model. 

 

Edited August 28, 2023 by vandyland

[Swood1994]

My First Impressions section is up on the testing post, Go check it out!

Link: 

 

[Swood1994]

Got an hour in with a trackman and have a decent amount of data to go through. Some of it is a little clunky due to my negligence in doing the tags properly for each club. Luckily they were structured in a way were I could go back and group them. Found a new setting for the driver I’m hoping to try next as well as the hybrid on the +1 up setting is money. 

Unfortunately for the ST-X driver I turned my Paradym back down to 10.5 on Draw setting and it turned into a low spin CANNON. Average almost 14 more yards compared to the Mizuno. I’m combing through all the data and setting up cleaner tables which I’ll post in the coming days. 

With that the Paradym misses me and I miss it so it will be getting some playing time this week at league as we head into the last 2 weeks of the year. The Mizuno 3 wood and Hybrid has a safe spot in the bag so far.

[Donn lost in San Diego]

On 6/26/2023 at 11:35 PM, Beakbryce said:

Really thankful to MGS and Mizuno for this opportunity as a first time tester. I kind of thought that MGS eased one in to testing with a ball test, or maybe a bag or something. Nope, right into the deep end.

I am a retired Marine. In the Marines I flew the RF4, the recce version of the F-4. I have a couple of hundred carrier landings, mostly on the USS Midway.

After I retired from the Marines, I taught computer software and played golf. I worked at being a club pro, but ability and life change got in the way. My last 14 years of work was at the VA.

First, I am 70. I’m pretty much a casual golfer, just enjoying retirement and living breathing golf. I have my own golf cart and animal headcovers, what can I say?

I began playing golf in 1981. I play at least 150 rounds a year. I have played as many as 220 rounds. While there have been inevitable slumps, when I kept a handicap, I have generally been an 8 or less since 1983.

I have never taped my swing, but it feels one plane. I can still get to 90 degrees on the backswing easily. Probably the only odd thing is I grip very tightly. I go wonky with a light grip and more hand action.

I live in a golf course retirement community. 3 courses. However, I mostly play at Falcon Dunes, a military course at Luke AFB. It's just better, more visually interesting, has elevation changes on every shot, and above all, cheaper. I have been playing these courses for 20+ years. The primary test course will be Falcon Dunes. I will also play in the afternoon at one of the courses here in the community, circumstances permitting, as there are course closures this summer.

My plan for testing is to get some yardage numbers using my Sky Caddie SX 400. Since this is a 3 club test, I will be able to report straight up if the Mizuno clubs beat my present clubs. Of course, numbers aren’t the only determining factor, so reports on feel and playability will be judgement issues.

I have hit some Mizuno irons on club testing days here at my community and liked them. Ok, loved them. If I change irons, would test Mizuno and Titleist along with Callaway.

My expectation for these clubs is basically the same for everyone testing clubs that are generations and years beyond what I already have, do they have the technology to be better? The golf nerd in my also wants to know if their adjustability function works.

What would get me to change from my proven companions to these Mizuno clubs? Consistent length that is longer and straighter. C’mon man, what else is more important for woods and hybrids in your golf game? I’m pretty ambivalent about sound, feel, shot flight window, or anything else, if consistent length that is longer and straighter happens.

Added new comments, expectations and fitting: 

Addition: If you are following me on this thread then please go to page 6 for Initial thoughts, range testing, and first three actual play impressions.

 

Hey RF4.  My brother, ret Lt Cmdr. David Rutkoff, was an Navy F4 RIO.  Flew off Ranger n MIdway in Japan from 1978 to 1981, then was at the NARF North Island for a while.  Became Handler on Connie and Kitty til last cruise that ended in SDiego Dec. 1994 on the Kitty.  He is 71.  Did you cross paths with him?  He lives in SDiego.  Visits the Bubbahs at Miramar MCAS Friday breakfasts?  I live nearby in Oceanside.

[Beakbryce]

28 minutes ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Hey RF4.  My brother, ret Lt Cmdr. David Rutkoff, was an Navy F4 RIO.  Flew off Ranger n MIdway in Japan from 1978 to 1981, then was at the NARF North Island for a while.  Became Handler on Connie and Kitty til last cruise that ended in SDiego Dec. 1994 on the Kitty.  He is 71.  Did you cross paths with him?  He lives in SDiego.  Visits the Bubbahs at Miramar MCAS Friday breakfasts?  I live nearby in Oceanside.

There is a good chance that we met. Most of my time on the Midway was 78-80, mostly the hostage taking when the Midway was the first carrier up there. We shared the "Rock" ready room so if he was with them then we were at the least co-located. I live in the Phoenix area. We used to go at least once a year to North Island for vacation but haven't been since Covid. We would spend one day at Miramar golf course. 

[Donn lost in San Diego]

13 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

There is a good chance that we met. Most of my time on the Midway was 78-80, mostly the hostage taking when the Midway was the first carrier up there. We shared the "Rock" ready room so if he was with them then we were at the least co-located. I live in the Phoenix area. We used to go at least once a year to North Island for vacation but haven't been since Covid. We would spend one day at Miramar golf course. 

My bro was also at sea during the Iran gig, said the ship was at sea 90 + days without touching land, a long long on the water deployment.   My bro doesn;t golf tho.  His son was a Seal wannabee  but a shoulder injury ended his navy career.  BTW  V Adm Edward Briggs just passed away, 96.  He was Minn. High School golf champ in 1944, then 2 yrs later at Annapolis was the Maryland college golf champ.  I met him on teh driving range at Oaks North in Ranch Bernanrdo a few yrs ago.  

[Beakbryce]

Ya, we left Perth and were headed toward Kenya when they took the hostages. We diverted to head to Iran but then we were told to stand down and make our Mombasa port call. I was in unofficial "hack" in Mombasa and didn't get off the ship which meant that when we once again headed to off Iran, I spent a long time on the ship. Good times. Loved the flying though. After several months we pulled into Cubi and that night the last thing I remember was 6-8 White Russians set up for consumption. We slept that night under the palm trees next to the O'club. 

I have Recoil shafts in my hybrids, how do you like them in your irons? I just got some new Callaway irons dirt cheap with Tensei shafts and was going to switch them out to the Recoil shafts if they didn't work. So far the Tensei shafts are bang on for me so no need to switch.

[Beakbryce]

One last go with the Mizuno clubs.

Driver: tried stock on front 9 and plus 2 on back side. Made little difference to yardage. Shots straight enough to play. 211 yard average. 

3 wood: finally hit one over 200 yards. 210 downwind but still. Average was dismal at 183.

Hit the 4 hybrid 3 times on par 3 170 yards, choked up, which is what it was to the pin. Played from a couple of different tees to make it 170. On a par 5 hit it 179 off a little mound with the ball above my feet. This club is money!

[Beakbryce]

On 8/28/2023 at 7:03 PM, Swood1994 said:

Unfortunately for the ST-X driver I turned my Paradym back down to 10.5 on Draw setting and it turned into a low spin CANNON. Average almost 14 more yards compared to the Mizuno.

I don't feel like the Lone Ranger anymore...

[vandyland]

Well I like my Mizuno Driver enough that I have put my Cobra up for sale AND I am putting a Mizuno adapter on my Mitsubishi Chemical VANQUISH shaft. This is going to be outside of the Mizuno stock offerings so I will continue to play with the LIN-Q Red shaft (which I like anyway) but I am more just curious if the Vanquish shaft still fits me better. If nothing else, it will be able to tell me how much is the head and how much is the shaft in my comparison between my original Cobra setup with the Vanquish vs the Mizuno with the Vanquish. 

BTW...does anyone want to buy a 10.5* Radspeed XB head in good condition 

[Swood1994]

1 hour ago, vandyland said:

Well I like my Mizuno Driver enough that I have put my Cobra up for sale AND I am putting a Mizuno adapter on my Mitsubishi Chemical VANQUISH shaft. This is going to be outside of the Mizuno stock offerings so I will continue to play with the LIN-Q Red shaft (which I like anyway) but I am more just curious if the Vanquish shaft still fits me better. If nothing else, it will be able to tell me how much is the head and how much is the shaft in my comparison between my original Cobra setup with the Vanquish vs the Mizuno with the Vanquish. 

BTW...does anyone want to buy a 10.5* Radspeed XB head in good condition 

Wow! That’s huge! I played with my paradym last night and although I did not have a great driving round something just felt like home. However… the 3-wood and Hybrid are winners in my book. So far those clubs have been so easy to hit and hit consistently. I’m hoping to get a few more rounds in with the Mizuno driver on some different settings prior to the end of the test to see if I’m leaving anything in the table. 

A small part of me thinks I messed up and should have went with the ST-Z vs the ST-X. 
 

I think it’s really interesting so far how we all have had varying experiences on each of the clubs.

[Beakbryce]

4 hours ago, vandyland said:

Well I like my Mizuno Driver enough that I have put my Cobra up for sale AND I am putting a Mizuno adapter on my Mitsubishi Chemical VANQUISH shaft. This is going to be outside of the Mizuno stock offerings so I will continue to play with the LIN-Q Red shaft (which I like anyway) but I am more just curious if the Vanquish shaft still fits me better. If nothing else, it will be able to tell me how much is the head and how much is the shaft in my comparison between my original Cobra setup with the Vanquish vs the Mizuno with the Vanquish. 

Cool. If your Vanquish shaft is 45.75 to 46" then your test should provide some insight on the swingweight changes with the longer shaft mentioned by Mizuno as a reason they opted for the shorter shaft.

[Beakbryce]

2 hours ago, Swood1994 said:

A small part of me thinks I messed up and should have went with the ST-Z vs the ST-X. 

We could always swap!

[vandyland]

3 hours ago, Swood1994 said:

small part of me thinks I messed up and should have went with the ST-Z vs the ST-X. 

I never saw myself as someone who would benefit so much from “spin reduction.” I was seduced by this whole “spin is control” thing. Turns out if you get spin down to 2300 at 110 mph it goes! I thought about the X but I didn’t like the draw bias (I already play a draw with a open setting). It may help some people but I was interested to watch how Matt Blois at TXG struggled with the X but LOVED the Z. To each their own, I am sure the X helps many people. 
 

got on the range with the STZ hybrid this evening. I am getting more comfortable with the low setting and ready to let it loose on the club championship this weekend!

 

[russtopherb]

I finally was able to get out to the range this morning and spent some quality time with the Mizunos.

Driver - I have to say that bumping up to 11.5* has had a MARKED difference in ballflight. I'm actually kind of shocked at how a little change up in loft and slightly closing the face has made overall. I was hitting some absolute freaking BOMBS this morning on the range. We were on the lower level while the upper level's grass is growing, so I can't tell exact distances. Let's just say there's a dropoff past the 250 yard markers and the balls were landing there, within 10 yards of either side I was aiming. I cannot wait to get back on the course.  The Kai'li shaft may be replacing the Riptide CB as my favorite driver shaft, it's just so stable. 

Fairway wood - I'm still trying to figure this one out. I do think part of it is not having a 3/4w in the bag the last 2 seasons. I'm still trying to get the tee position/height figured out. I will say that the 17* loft is definitely the best for me, as my fitter noted. I still struggle with it off the deck, but that's been a lifelong thing, not a club thing.

4 hybrid - Flight is still lower than I want, and I haven't messed with the loft settings yet because this is the absolute straightest hybrid I've ever hit. As someone who's struggled with hybrids pretty much forever, this is saying something. Every time I consider lofting it up a bit to raise height, I hit some absolute ropes that have me amazed. I do think there are probably some other hybrids out there that are longer - but as someone who's always shied away from longer hybrids (my 5h is pretty decent) knowing I can hit this where I'm aiming is a huge confidence builder. 

[BallsLeon]

11 minutes ago, russtopherb said:

4 hybrid - Flight is still lower than I want, and I haven't messed with the loft settings yet because this is the absolute straightest hybrid I've ever hit. As someone who's struggled with hybrids pretty much forever, this is saying something. Every time I consider lofting it up a bit to raise height, I hit some absolute ropes that have me amazed. I do think there are probably some other hybrids out there that are longer - but as someone who's always shied away from longer hybrids (my 5h is pretty decent) knowing I can hit this where I'm aiming is a huge confidence builder. 

I was curious what your usual hybrid shot is? I struggle with pulling them. Also, what shaft did you end up with for the hybrid? (apologies if I missed this)

[russtopherb]

4 minutes ago, BallsLeon said:

I was curious what your usual hybrid shot is? I struggle with pulling them. Also, what shaft did you end up with for the hybrid? (apologies if I missed this)

I have the STZ-230 4h (22*) with a Lin-Q Blue shaft. When struck well, my usual hybrid shot is a baby fade, and my miss is a hook off the face of the planet. This hybrid shows almost no fade tail that I can see, it's pretty darn straight. 

[Swood1994]

15 hours ago, vandyland said:

I never saw myself as someone who would benefit so much from “spin reduction.” I was seduced by this whole “spin is control” thing. Turns out if you get spin down to 2300 at 110 mph it goes! I thought about the X but I didn’t like the draw bias (I already play a draw with an open setting). It may help some people but I was interested to watch how Matt Blois at TXG struggled with the X but LOVED the Z. To each their own, I am sure the X helps many people. 

 My miss is right so I thought the X would be a good choice. I’ve never went with draw biased drivers in the past but thought this would be a good way to test if it fit my game given my miss. The X is almost too easy to turn over right to left to the point where my miss has been more left than right. On the Sim the 11.5 UP setting produced decent (lower) spin numbers without a massive draw. I’ll be trying that out next on the course. I may have to take @Beakbryce up on his offer to see what the Z has to offer. I think the shorter shaft coupled with higher spin is where I’m seeing my distance loss.

Edited September 1, 2023 by Swood1994

[vandyland]

3 minutes ago, Swood1994 said:

 My miss is right so I thought the X would be a good choice. I’ve never went with draw biased drivers in the past but thought this would be a good way to test if it fit my game given my miss. The X is almost too easy to turn over left to right to the point where my miss has been more left than right. On the Sim the 11.5 UP setting produced decent (lower) spin numbers without a massive draw. I’ll be trying that out next on the course. I may have to take @Beakbryce up on his offer to see what the Z has to offer. I think the shorter shaft coupled with higher spin is where I’m seeing my distance loss.

It would be #wild to see testers swap heads but I also think that adds intrigue to the test. If you all both find that they work better for you it could be a good case study. If they don't work better for you...at least you exhausted all options!

It was interesting to see the TXG guys talk to Johnny Wunder (Callaway) about how much balls can have an impact on ballflight, spin, etc. I always wanted to be different so I didn't play ProV1s for a long time but once I got on a launch monitor it turned out they were best for me. I like the feel of a softer ball (Taylormade Tour Response is a good example) but they just don't do what I want them to either around the greens or in the air. 

Edited September 1, 2023 by vandyland

[Beakbryce]

1 hour ago, russtopherb said:

I have the STZ-230 4h (22*) with a Lin-Q Blue shaft. When struck well, my usual hybrid shot is a baby fade, and my miss is a hook off the face of the planet. This hybrid shows almost no fade tail that I can see, it's pretty darn straight. 

I agree completely. This club loves to be hit straight and is consistent in yardage. It's a winner. I was getting higher flight until I went with higher loft on my Big Bertha 19 4 hybrid which didn't change my required yardage. Both clubs about the same now in yardage and flight. 180 full on and 170 choked up. The Mizuno is a fun club to hit as the head is smaller, forcing a tighter swing, which has helped my entire game.

[Beakbryce]

29 minutes ago, Swood1994 said:

The X is almost too easy to turn over left to right to the point where my miss has been more left than right.

I'm sorry, did you mean it is to easy to turn right to left or left to right? If it is draw biased, it should be right to left as your misses are left. Just making sure.

[Swood1994]

4 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

I'm sorry, did you mean it is to easy to turn right to left or left to right? If it is draw biased, it should be right to left as your misses are left. Just making sure.

Right to left. I edited my original post. Between work and getting ready for the weekend apparently I lost the ability to tell the difference. 
 

2 hours ago, russtopherb said:

This hybrid shows almost no fade tail that I can see, it's pretty darn straight. 

I Also find this club the be extremely straight. I said time and time again that it’s also very easy to work in both directions. Of the 3 it’s #1 for me

[Beakbryce]

32 minutes ago, vandyland said:

t would be #wild to see testers swap heads but I also think that adds intrigue to the test. If you all both find that they work better for you it could be a good case study. If they don't work better for you...at least you exhausted all options!

When I had wood woods I played the ball a little further back and hit push draws that ended up where I was aiming. Could swing as hard as I wanted because it would result in a slightly bigger push and slightly higher hook spin. Loved that shot. When I received my Callaway original Big Bertha, I couldn't play it far enough back to not hit it off the planet uncontrollably in either direction so had to redo my swing. Fought a hook for years.

Anyway, wondering if the X would result in the same swing. 

My new Rogue ST irons are working with that old swing. Slightly from the inside resulting in a bit of a push and a bit of draw. I know they are jacked lofts, I hit an 8 iron Tuesday that was at least 10 yards farther than any other 8 iron I have ever hit. Maybe because it is an 8.5 iron compared to my Steelheads? Getting a chuckle out of my buddies' reactions. They are working remarkably well filling the yardage gaps between my Vokeys and my hybrids.

[Swood1994]

42 minutes ago, vandyland said:

It would be #wild to see testers swap heads but I also think that adds intrigue to the test. If you all both find that they work better for you it could be a good case study. If they don't work better for you...at least you exhausted all options!

To be completely honest I’m not even sure if it’s allowed. But I would certainly finish the test on the X first. It would definitely be a cool comparison to see if one works better than the other for my specific swing

[Beakbryce]

3 minutes ago, Swood1994 said:

Between work and getting ready for the weekend apparently I lost the ability to tell the difference. 

Thank you for the clarification. I know, long weekends always require more work, sometimes defeating the purpose. I hope you are able to golf some of the days.

[Beakbryce]

2 minutes ago, Swood1994 said:

To be completely honest I’m not even sure if it’s allowed. But I would certainly finish the test on the X first. It would definitely be a cool comparison to see if one works better than the other for my specific swing

I'm betting it hasn't ever been done or even suggested. Actually, I was kind of being humorous when I suggested it but what the heck, I'm a gamer. Don't think this is too much of a spoiler alert, I'm certainly not going to play this driver. I'm not sure what their objection would be though other than they may have a self-imposed limit on how long the initial test should go. Ours has already dragged on a bit waiting for club delivery. Pretty sure they just want as complete a test as possible so their decision were we to ask could go either way. 

However, they did suggest follow up comments every once in awhile if the clubs are kept as gamers so there's that opening. 

I am going to be playing a lot in September so would have plenty of time to work on additional testing. 

[Shrek74]

6 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

I'm betting it hasn't ever been done or even suggested. Actually, I was kind of being humorous when I suggested it but what the heck, I'm a gamer. Don't think this is too much of a spoiler alert, I'm certainly not going to play this driver. I'm not sure what their objection would be though other than they may have a self-imposed limit on how long the initial test should go. Ours has already dragged on a bit waiting for club delivery. Pretty sure they just want as complete a test as possible so their decision were we to ask could go either way. 

However, they did suggest follow up comments every once in awhile if the clubs are kept as gamers so there's that opening. 

I am going to be playing a lot in September so would have plenty of time to work on additional testing. 

I think it's worth the inquiry with the team to see if they'd allow it. Especially if it could affect whether people keep them as gamers or just turn around and sell them. They may want you to finish the initial test before swapping, but they'll give that detail.