Great video on using ground forces

[Hook DeLoft]

I've somewhat understood the concept of the use of ground force in the swing, but I've never been able to understand how to actually incorporate it.  This video really helps.  What do you folks think?

 

[RickyBobby_PR]

Didn’t watch the whole video, but have consumed their content for awhile.

its a good lesson and he does a good job explaining what to do and what’s happening.

 

[Wildthing]

I've seen and heard Marcus Bell before , and being from a physics background (he uses various physics terms),  I haven't a clue what he's talking about most of the time.  Your better off checking out Dr Kwon and Dr Scott Lynn who are the experts in GRF patterns.  

For example , check out 35:18 of this video below and look at the graphs for Gary Woodland , who hits the ball a mile but whose vertical ground reaction forces are quite small.  He uses 'Torque' as his major power source in the swing , so would changing him to use larger 'Vertical GRF's '  improve his swing ?  Apparently , golfers are 'messy' and can create different grf patterns . 

Remember that GRF's are what they mean ' Ground Reaction Forces' . You are contracting your various muscles to swing a golf club in a manner you perceive is correct (whether right or wrong) . To help facilitate the movements you are planning to perform when you contract your muscles , you might need to brace/push against the ground. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-12QXRPgrzs

Edited January 25 by Wildthing

[Goober]

One thing I like is how he keeps the swing athletic.Or moving and not micro managing.Always felt that was the secret to a proper swing

But one issue I have with ground forces.Is when do you squat? When do you shoot up off the ground? And how to you add in the turn to all of this? 
 

I can see so many of us jacking this up without proper one on one work with a good pro 

Edited January 25 by Goober

[Josh Parker]

I have seen this concept a few times and agree with @Goober.  I could see this being something to learn with a pro.

[cnosil]

8 hours ago, Goober said:

One thing I like is how he keeps the swing athletic.Or moving and not micro managing.Always felt that was the secret to a proper swing

But one issue I have with ground forces.Is when do you squat? When do you shoot up off the ground? And how to you add in the turn to all of this? 
 

I can see so many of us jacking this up without proper one on one work with a good pro 

F you look at Mike Adam/Terry Rowles work, they talk about three forces. Vertical, rotational, and lateral and how different golfers do better with each of those based on biomechanics.   
 

I agree, to do this right, you need someone that knows what they are doing and force plates so you can see when the pressures rate applied. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

8 hours ago, Goober said:

One thing I like is how he keeps the swing athletic.Or moving and not micro managing.Always felt that was the secret to a proper swing

But one issue I have with ground forces.Is when do you squat? When do you shoot up off the ground? And how to you add in the turn to all of this? 
 

I can see so many of us jacking this up without proper one on one work with a good pro 

The squat isn’t really a squat as most people thing about the movement. You can just squat and then shoot up. Pressure has to be moving along with these actions. When you combine gears and pressure plates (amg has some videos on it) pressure moves to the trail foot early in the swing and is over early two. For most good golfers it’s shifted and stops at p2(shaft parallel to the ground) and no later than p3(lead arm parallel). Pressure is also more in the heel of trail foot or moving towards it while pressure is more in the toes of the lead foot.

as the club gets to the top of the swing pressure is getting back to 50/50 (aka recentring) pressure will be moving toward the trail toes and to the inside of the trail foot(think the banking of the foot you see from pros) and it’s not into heel if the lead foot yet. Before the swing ends and moves into transition pressure is moving off the trail side and into the lead side (70/30 lead side) there is added lead side bend and increase in lead knee flexion, the squat is this move with added flexion of the waist and an increase in trail knee flexion (the squat). The trail foot is pulling back while the lead foot is pushing forward (using the ground to help with rotation).

Some people have to feel the pressure forward sooner. 
 

But as cnosil pointed out having someone who knows what they are doing to show the golfer what they are doing and how to fix it is important. Amg has several videos about pressure shifts, Monte’s broom force and especially power shift get into this.

I’ve posted this before but it’s a good drill to learn the sequence for sniffing and turning

 

[Goober]

I think every motion of the swing that we take needs to be watched and analyzed by a teaching pro.As simple as the process of moving a ball from Pt A to Pt B.The process of doing it is as complex as making missiles. It’s quite amazing how multi faceted this game can be 

[cnosil]

35 minutes ago, Goober said:

I think every motion of the swing that we take needs to be watched and analyzed by a teaching pro.

That is probably the easiest path.   Player can and do learn on their own.  The human body is an amazing thing and we teach ourselves and improve our skills all the time.   The flaws in peoples swings are compensations to accomplish the objective of hitting the ball.   You create a task and the body does what it needs to do’s.   
 

for example I work on my putting all the time.  I try to understand what movements I need to make to roll the ball on my intended line with the desired pace.  I then work to repeat those movement patterns.   The golf swing is just another skill you are trying to learn.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

44 minutes ago, Goober said:

I think every motion of the swing that we take needs to be watched and analyzed by a teaching pro.As simple as the process of moving a ball from Pt A to Pt B.The process of doing it is as complex as making missiles. It’s quite amazing how multi faceted this game can be 

Agree. Reading several forums and Facebook groups it’s easy to see that many don’t understand the swing, causes and effects of movements. When these people go off on their own to fix something like a flat inside takeaway they create other issues by changing the wrong thing or overdoing something.

Some people can play pretty good golf doing self taught swings (see bubba and Finau) but there are some scratch or plus golfers who have worked hard and got their game to the level but their swings still have some faults that hold them back from better golf.

Using a good instructor will save time and frustration. Also noted from the forums and Facebook groups online coaching isn’t ideal for a lot of people for some of the same reasons that going at it alone doesn’t work. Having an instructor right there who can show the golfer what they want them to do or move them how they want them to move so the golfer gets the feel and understanding better.

[Josh Parker]

3 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The squat isn’t really a squat as most people thing about the movement. You can just squat and then shoot up. Pressure has to be moving along with these actions. When you combine gears and pressure plates (amg has some videos on it) pressure moves to the trail foot early in the swing and is over early two. For most good golfers it’s shifted and stops at p2(shaft parallel to the ground) and no later than p3(lead arm parallel). Pressure is also more in the heel of trail foot or moving towards it while pressure is more in the toes of the lead foot.

as the club gets to the top of the swing pressure is getting back to 50/50 (aka recentring) pressure will be moving toward the trail toes and to the inside of the trail foot(think the banking of the foot you see from pros) and it’s not into heel if the lead foot yet. Before the swing ends and moves into transition pressure is moving off the trail side and into the lead side (70/30 lead side) there is added lead side bend and increase in lead knee flexion, the squat is this move with added flexion of the waist and an increase in trail knee flexion (the squat). The trail foot is pulling back while the lead foot is pushing forward (using the ground to help with rotation).

Some people have to feel the pressure forward sooner. 
 

But as cnosil pointed out having someone who knows what they are doing to show the golfer what they are doing and how to fix it is important. Amg has several videos about pressure shifts, Monte’s broom force and especially power shift get into this.

I’ve posted this before but it’s a good drill to learn the sequence for sniffing and turning

 

Haven't ever seen this one before.  

[RickyBobby_PR]

18 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

Haven't ever seen this one before.  

It’s a pretty popular one for learning how sequencing. I’ve used it myself on and off the last 6 months or so.

One I like from amg is to get a squeaky toy for pets and cut the squeaky part out. Place it under the heels and make it squeak on the lead foot during then takeaway and early part of the backswing and then the one on the trail foot in the transition/downswing