Does anyone use the “Tiger” Scorecard while playing their round?

[Samuel09152]

56 minutes ago, cnosil said:

If you are doing ShotScope,  you don't need to do the Haney or Tiger metrics;  it is covered in ShotScope performance details.  

You’re right, but I’m still trying to figure it all out. Thats why I used the Haney today. But honestly looking at it all again I can basically relive the whole round when looking at that. The more I think this through, the more I realize how much more useful ShotScope is/will be.

[Donn lost in San Diego]

36 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

That mantra has been debunked for awhile like many things golf. Strokes gained, launch monitor technology, fitters like Tom Wishon, Howard jones, others experts like tuttleman, 3d systems have all shown us how wrong many of the old school thinking was. 

I wonder about some stats, such as scoring from the fairway versus missing the fairway.  Officially, if you are 1 inch off, and you make par or birdie, it benefits scoring from the rough.  But nobody tracks scoring where you consider the first cut of rough as if it was a fairway.  I am sure that scoring from 1st cut is way better than scoring from the real wilds.  So, the tally for scoring from the rough is improved.  Which bolsters the idea that you can bomb away and not worry about accuracy.  Driving accuracy is underrated?  Or, am I just causing trouble for the hell of it? 

 

Anddddddd,,  I don't know that good fitting, using club makers and technology, has to do with improving one aspect of the game more than another aspect, Dough or Show.  Or has it?  Is putting the one part of scoring stats that has not benefitted from the last 20 , 30, yrs of tech & fitting? 

[Preeway]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

That mantra has been debunked for awhile like many things golf. Strokes gained, launch monitor technology, fitters like Tom Wishon, Howard jones, others experts like tuttleman, 3d systems have all shown us how wrong many of the old school thinking was. 

I’m not sure what you mean by debunking “drive for show and putt for dough”. There are plenty of stats out there showing driving stats aren’t as needle moving as approach and short game. Yes, we’ve proven the value of length off the tee but fairways hit just isn’t a key metric. This is why the Tiger 5 are so focused on short game. As long as you aren’t driving the ball into trouble, you can still score if you have a rock solid short game. 

Edited April 6 by Preeway

[RickyBobby_PR]

7 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Officially, if you are 1 inch off, and you make par or birdie, it benefits scoring from the rough.  But nobody tracks scoring where you consider the first cut of rough as if it was a fairway.  I am sure that scoring from 1st cut is way better than scoring from the real wilds. 

Strokes gained is why you want to go study. I don’t think they consider the difference between first cut of rough vs deeper rough but closer to the hole in the rough is better than further away in the fairway.

7 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Driving accuracy is underrated?  Or, am I just causing trouble for the hell of it? 

Driving accuracy isn’t underrated and to an extent maybe overrated when it comes to hitting more fairways and be shorter for the purpose of just finding the fairway. The accuracy aspect goes into the strokes gained off the tee but that strokes gained stat isn’t as good as strokes gained approach which iirc is the more important strokes gained stat.

7 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Anddddddd,,  I don't know that good fitting, using club makers and technology, has to do with improving one aspect of the game more than another aspect, Dough or Show.  Or has it?  Is putting the one part of scoring stats that has not benefitted from the last 20 , 30, yrs of tech & fitting? 

Fittings in of themselves don’t improve one’s game, they give the golfer the equipment that makes it easier for them to execute the shot they are attempting but the golfer still has to actually execute the shot and to do so on each shot. Launch monitors have allowed for golfers to better optimize their clubs and bag rather than the old eye test and a guess about spin, etc. they have also helped create the new ball flight laws.

With strokes gained we have learns that ball striking and short game are far mor important than the drive for show putt for dough stuff.

Putting is influenced by other things, proximity to the hole, one’s ability to control speed and read greens. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

7 hours ago, Preeway said:

I’m not sure what you mean by debunking “drive for show and putt for dough”. There are plenty of stats out there showing driving stats aren’t as needle moving as approach and short game. Yes, we’ve proven the value of length off the tee but fairways hit just isn’t a key metric. This is why the Tiger 5 are so focused on short game. As long as you aren’t driving the ball into trouble, you can still score if you have a rock solid short game. 

Exactly it’s not the putting for dough thats important it’s then ball striking and short game. 
 

its a cliche that needs to die. Along with hold the lag which has been shown to not be what pros do. The slow backswing and slow tempo also is a something that needs to die in golf swing discussion. Theres a lot of older school thoughts and cliches that just don’t hold true 

Edited April 6 by RickyBobby_PR

[OgDan]

I try,

No penalties off the tee,

No 3 putts,

No doubles

[cnosil]

10 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

  Is putting the one part of scoring stats that has not benefitted from the last 20 , 30, yrs of tech & fitting? 

Putting has, but measurements take longer to assess.   People want benefits to show up in one round, but with putting the measurement needs to occur over a season.  If you read the book Lowest Score Wins,  they categorize areas of the game that help separate players (https://lowestscorewins.com/separation-value) and putting falls near the bottom.   Think about a 3 foot putt;  you can practice them all day every day but you probably won't make significantly more than someone that never practices them.  As for tech and fitting,  they have shown improvement in putting.   There is better understanding of launch angle, that the face is the influence for ball direction and path has minimal influence,  that there are stroke categorizations and they have specific putter configurations that benefit the player,  you can measure how different putter configurations influence ball direction.    Unfortunately most people dismiss anything putter tech with the response that it is a small slow stroke and it doesn't matter or that they are a "feel" player.    I believe this response goes back to my first statement.   

10 hours ago, Samuel09152 said:

You’re right, but I’m still trying to figure it all out. Thats why I used the Haney today. But honestly looking at it all again I can basically relive the whole round when looking at that. The more I think this through, the more I realize how much more useful ShotScope is/will be.

ShotScope metrics get very deep; which is why I stopped using them....way too much detail than I needed at my game level.   If you haven't already,  start reading the shotscope user group on the forum and ask questions,  lots of people that can help you understand the stats being displayed.  

[Samuel09152]

46 minutes ago, cnosil said:

ShotScope metrics get very deep; which is why I stopped using them....way too much detail than I needed at my game level.   If you haven't already,  start reading the shotscope user group on the forum and ask questions,  lots of people that can help you understand the stats being displayed.  

Definitely will!! Thanks for the heads up and guidance. I have a feeling it’ll be too deep for me but we shall see! 

[Donn lost in San Diego]

4 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Exactly it’s not the putting for dough thats important it’s then ball striking and short game. 
 

its a cliche that needs to die. Along with hold the lag which has been shown to not be what pros do. The slow backswing and slow tempo also is a something that needs to die in golf swing discussion. Theres a lot of older school thoughts and cliches that just don’t hold true 

Oh NO!  You addd another topic to argue about!!!  Slow swing!!!! AAaaaggghhh!!!. (Someone forgot to tell Hideki )

[Donn lost in San Diego]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

Putting has, but measurements take longer to assess.   People want benefits to show up in one round, but with putting the measurement needs to occur over a season.  If you read the book Lowest Score Wins,  they categorize areas of the game that help separate players (https://lowestscorewins.com/separation-value) and putting falls near the bottom.   Think about a 3 foot putt;  you can practice them all day every day but you probably won't make significantly more than someone that never practices them.  As for tech and fitting,  they have shown improvement in putting.   There is better understanding of launch angle, that the face is the influence for ball direction and path has minimal influence,  that there are stroke categorizations and they have specific putter configurations that benefit the player,  you can measure how different putter configurations influence ball direction.    Unfortunately most people dismiss anything putter tech with the response that it is a small slow stroke and it doesn't matter or that they are a "feel" player.    I believe this response goes back to my first statement.   

ShotScope metrics get very deep; which is why I stopped using them....way too much detail than I needed at my game level.   If you haven't already,  start reading the shotscope user group on the forum and ask questions,  lots of people that can help you understand the stats being displayed.  

1st ? is Chuck, how you feeling?  Hope still getting better.  My foot is almost healed, the boot comes off Monday, and I think the doc will let me start putting some weight on the front of the foot in a regular shoe.

Next, can you or someone link me to the shotscope user group in forum/  I can't search right, I get hundreds of wrong mentions or nothing.

 

[Donn lost in San Diego]

I did see something in a different online bip that greens in regulation is a more important stat than fairways hit.  which makes sense.  Either way, my surgery boot comes off Monday     the 8th (April 2024) after 7 weeks and I can finally start hitting real balls instead of hitting the keyboard.

[Donn lost in San Diego]

Here's the title it was March 20 2024 in Golf . com  

What’s more important: Greens in regulation or fairways hit? Data tells us

BY: NICK DIMENGO MARCH 20, 2024

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Oh NO!  You addd another topic to argue about!!!  Slow swing!!!! AAaaaggghhh!!!. (Someone forgot to tell Hideki )

I said slow backswing not a slow swing and hideki doesnt have a slow swing or slow backswing. There’s not arguing, slow backswings lead to too far inside takeaways, bad pressure shifts and just a bunch of swing issues. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

51 minutes ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

I did see something in a different online bip that greens in regulation is a more important stat than fairways hit.  which makes sense.  Either way, my surgery boot comes off Monday     the 8th (April 2024) after 7 weeks and I can finally start hitting real balls instead of hitting the keyboard.

Far more important. More gir will help score. There’s no guarantee that from fairway one hits a green. Fairways hit just looks good on paper. Improving strokes gained off the tee is where one should look to improve over just trying to hit a fairway 

[cnosil]

3 hours ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

1st ? is Chuck, how you feeling?  Hope still getting better.  My foot is almost healed, the boot comes off Monday, and I think the doc will let me start putting some weight on the front of the foot in a regular shoe.

Next, can you or someone link me to the shotscope user group in forum/  I can't search right, I get hundreds of wrong mentions or nothing.

 

I'm Chris not Chuck    So far I seem to be doing okay; time will tell.   Glad to hear about the foot.

 

Here is the user group

 

 

 

[cnosil]

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

I said slow backswing not a slow swing and hideki doesnt have a slow swing or slow backswing. There’s not arguing, slow backswings lead to too far inside takeaways, bad pressure shifts and just a bunch of swing issues. 

Interesting that Porzak posted a video yesterday where he indicates that a slower back swing may be beneficial as people tend to swing to fast in the backswing since it keeps them sync'd up better.      

[Donn lost in San Diego]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

I'm Chris not Chuck    So far I seem to be doing okay; time will tell.   Glad to hear about the foot.

 

Here is the user group

 

 

 

Oooppps   Yes, mt mistake, Chris.  Well I found which forum category has shotscope.  there are a lot of forums and u have to search each one separately I think.  I broke doctors order today , put on a regular sneaker to move my car 1st time in 5 weeks.  foot feels promising.  

[cnosil]

2 minutes ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

 there are a lot of forums and u have to search each one separately I think. 

You can search the entire forum; or you can limit it to specific areas, with a single search.  If I know something is in a title,  I use the advanced search features to just look at the title.  Took 2 searches for ShotScope since the title for the user group considered ShotScope to be 2 words. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, cnosil said:

Interesting that Porzak posted a video yesterday where he indicates that a slower back swing may be beneficial as people tend to swing to fast in the backswing since it keeps them sync'd up better.      

I’ll have to watch it when I get a chance. I the slow especially low and slow is bad. 

[cnosil]

Just now, RickyBobby_PR said:

I’ll have to watch it when I get a chance. I the slow especially low and slow is bad. 

I would agree that low and slow is probably bad, but you know Porzak doesn't instruct that 

[RickyBobby_PR]

Just now, cnosil said:

I would agree that low and slow is probably bad, but you know Porzak doesn't instruct that 

Right but slow in general is bad as well, low and slow is just worse than slow

[cksurfdude]

2 hours ago, cnosil said:

Interesting that Porzak posted a video yesterday where he indicates that a slower back swing may be beneficial as people tend to swing to fast in the backswing since it keeps them sync'd up better.      

Drifting off-topic but fyi for everyone Monte Scheinblum advocates a slow METHODICAL swing for practice, especially with irons. I know myself .. and many ams .. will tend to lunge down at the ball after a sllooowww backswing, so yeah that is not good....

[RickyBobby_PR]

3 hours ago, cksurfdude said:

Drifting off-topic but fyi for everyone Monte Scheinblum advocates a slow METHODICAL swing for practice, especially with irons. I know myself .. and many ams .. will tend to lunge down at the ball after a sllooowww backswing, so yeah that is not good....

Monte isn’t the only one. Slow reps are how golfers learn a movement pattern. It’s something that’s used in corrective exercise as well for clients trying to overcome an injury or bad movement pattern in a lift. Same with some like Monte who has to learn to walk again after surgery.

This is very much different than the slow backswing or slow tempo that is bad for the swing 

[tdroma98]

On 4/3/2024 at 8:49 PM, Samuel09152 said:

Does anyone use the Tiger scorecard as well as the normal? Or have you altered it to help yourself make steps to improving? If you did alter it what did you change? 

Never heard of the Tiger scorecard @Samuel09152. 

Back when I was a 12-18 handicap, I'd practice a method from a golf school instructor based in Longmeadow, MA. (Cannot remember his name) You'd hit 1, 2, 3 or 4 balls, Based on your handicap range, take the best shot of the shots & do the same for the second shot.  Do this for the 18 holes. It was to train your mind you could hit good shots and play good shots. As a 12-18 handicap I'd hit 3 shots 

The Tiger Scorecard is a new one for me. 

[Samuel09152]

12 minutes ago, tdroma98 said:

Never heard of the Tiger scorecard @Samuel09152. 

Back when I was a 12-18 handicap, I'd practice a method from a golf school instructor based in Longmeadow, MA. (Cannot remember his name) You'd hit 1, 2, 3 or 4 balls, Based on your handicap range, take the best shot of the shots & do the same for the second shot.  Do this for the 18 holes. It was to train your mind you could hit good shots and play good shots. As a 12-18 handicap I'd hit 3 shots 

The Tiger Scorecard is a new one for me. 

So basically you are hitting two of your “best” shots in a row? 

[tdroma98]

4 minutes ago, Samuel09152 said:

So basically you are hitting two of your “best” shots in a row? 

Correct or 3 shots on a par 5 if you don't lay up.  
The idea, if I remember correctly, you train your mind hitting good shots, plus it suddenly caused me to relax knowing you can hit "a" good shot.  Sometimes, iI'd take the 1st or 2nd shot, I wouldn't hit another and just play off the good drive.  

[Donn lost in San Diego]

On 4/6/2024 at 7:12 PM, tdroma98 said:

Never heard of the Tiger scorecard @Samuel09152. 

Back when I was a 12-18 handicap, I'd practice a method from a golf school instructor based in Longmeadow, MA. (Cannot remember his name) You'd hit 1, 2, 3 or 4 balls, Based on your handicap range, take the best shot of the shots & do the same for the second shot.  Do this for the 18 holes. It was to train your mind you could hit good shots and play good shots. As a 12-18 handicap I'd hit 3 shots 

The Tiger Scorecard is a new one for me. 

I like it .  Positive reinforcement.  As long as there are not players waiting behind me.

[tdroma98]

1 hour ago, Donn lost in San Diego said:

Positive reinforcement.  As long as there are not players waiting behind me.

As a Golf Course Ranger, I like & appreciate your thought process!