Deacon Blues

Avoid the 8ft tall bunkers in several of the par 3’s at Talamore.  You get up against the lip or anywhere in one of those and it’s game over. 

I can vouch for Club Champion in Charlotte and especially Bruce. I think weather a fitting is good or bad depends mostly on the fitter, not necessarily the company they work for, and you knowing what you want out of it. To me it’s worth it just for the use of the launch monitor and the expertise of the fitter is a big plus. You’re paying for the experience so all you need to do is be honest up front on what you do/don’t want out of it. I will say that it may be tough to get an appointment on short notice, sometimes they’re booked out a few weeks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Quick rundown of my experience -- some of it is repetitive with what others said. I've had a good-but-not-great experience with them, but I continue to go back. I've been to two locations and am about to go again in a couple weeks (if COVID doesn't cancel it). I'm happy with the equipment that they fit me into, and their fittings gave me a lot more confidence than others fitters. Some highlights: 
Expect to spend $$$. Fitting Fee: Unlike many other fitters, they don't waive the fitting fee with a purchase. However, if you make any purchase, they waive the fitting fee in the future (at least that's true with the Full Bag fitting), so you can go back and tweak things as needed (that's why I'm about to go for a third time). Shafts: you're most likely buying a shaft on top of your current club setup, and depending on the shaft, it could be a lot of money. Expect another $200+, upwards of $1000 depending on the shaft. I went with Accra wood shafts -- my driver shaft was $450 after everything ($365 shaft plus new OEM adapter plus installation), and the 3-wood shaft was closer to $275 -- there are cheaper options out there, but there are also more expensive options (e.g. my buddy that did a fitting alongside me walked away with a $650 driver shaft).  Heads: May not be applicable to you, but a full club direct from the OEM is the same price as the head only, so if you swap out the entire club and choose an after-market shaft, you'll be paying a steep price. If you choose a head/shaft combo that's a standard offering from the OEM, you pay retail plus add-ons if desired (see next); if you choose an after-market (like my Accra), a $400 retail driver can balloon up to $700+ very quickly.  Add-ons: They will push PUREing the shafts, which does make some difference but may not be noticeable to the typical amateur (I've hit my clubs well, but can't say that it would be different if I skipped PUREing...). They have different prices if you buy the shaft through them vs. needing to pull the shaft to PURE it (the latter is quite a bit more expensive, almost matching the retail price of certain shafts).  Mid-season form? This is more general fitting advice, but make sure you're swinging the club well. If you haven't played much over the winter or you're planning to take lessons early this year, go get your swing in shape first - a few MPH or a slightly different swing path could mean big differences in what you get fit into vs. what you actually need.  Using your own clubhead: You can definitely get fit for a shaft with the intention of keeping your own head -- for woods, I've only bought shafts from them, no heads. CarlH summarized this well, although one thing that was slightly different for me -- last time, I was able to use my own driver head with their shafts. It depends what the location has on hand -- they do have a proprietary adapter on all of their shafts, but my location had a Callaway-to-proprietary adapter that they stuck into my head, allowing them to use their shafts with my head. I'm not sure if they'll have the same thing for Ping, but it's possible. Measurements: TENBUCK noted that they didn't take measurements. That was true for me too, which is one of my biggest criticisms of the process (but to be fair, I'm 0/3 on fitters taking measurements). They started with swing speed, ball flight, etc., and once they narrowed the head/shaft combos down to 2-3, they started tweaking based on lie angle and other factors. It didn't feel like guesswork (if I were a few inches taller, I think they would have adapted), but it also didn't feel all that precise. They did have varied length shaft options, so they could test with other lengths, but my frame is pretty close to standard specs.  Wedge fitting is...a joke. My first guy told me "wedge fitting is more of a conversation"; my second guy didn't even touch on it.  Putter fitting is worth it - they'll tweak your putter on the spot (adjust loft/lie). They'll also tell you the type of putter you should be using and won't push a new one unless you're using the "wrong" model. They use SAM technology, so you likely don't need to go to Club Champion to get this feedback, but it's a nice add-on if you do a full bag fitting.  Ultimately, it depends what you want to get out of it. I've done a quick fitting at Golf Galaxy, a couple at GolfTEC, and a couple at Club Champion -- I'd say skip the retail fitting unless they have actual trusted fitters on staff (our location did not). For GolfTEC vs. Club Champion, my GolfTEC location only had a subset of the equipment offered through the club manufacturers, and it felt like they used guesswork to pick the best one of the lot -- it felt more like "I'm going to order clubs online, what specs should I order?". Club Champion was a more comprehensive fitting that gave me more confidence in the outcome, but that came at a price. 

OK...yes, I've done a Club Champion fitting and yes, I did it with the intent of keeping my driver head.
First off, I did an entire bag fitting.  I had a wonderful experience and learned a massive amount of information regarding my swing characteristics.  I walked away feeling the cost of the fitting was well worth the price paid, but I did go into the experience with the knowledge that I was looking at the fitting process as part of a long term investment and not just the prelude to purchase.  Everyone's financial situation is different and what is worth it to one person is simply an added expense to another.  If money is an issue, then it will likely have more impact on your satisfaction than it would if the cost were less of an overriding factor.
Now, they will not have a Ping G400 head available and you'll need to utilize the latest Ping head for the fitting session.  Their shafts have a custom fitting so that each shaft can fit every head that they have in the shop and will not fit the standard manufacturer's fittings.  You will start with your club head and shaft and determine your baseline numbers.  From there, you would hit a similar head with a variety of shafts and work through the numbers looking for a shaft that optimizes your swing and club characteristics to obtain the best distances with the least dispersion.  If you're the person that's hung up on seeing actual ball flight outdoors, then you're likely going to be less than satisfied because everything is done by the numbers and what you see on the screen.
For me, it was a great experience. 
 
Edit:  Be prepared for sticker shock to get your club upgraded through them, but recognize that you are NOT committed to purchase the shaft and work through them and can take the recommendations to any fitter to have the work done. 

I may be nearing retirement age, 66, but I am not slowing down.  My occupation, Pastor, is pretty much an on call 24/7 one.  My observation is that people have become more and more needy, not a complaint just an observation, and far less respectful of other's time, that is a complaint but also an observation.  I get texts, phone calls and facebook messages every day of the week, many well outside of regular business hours.  I'm constantly forced to triage whether these need an immediate response and they are extremely disruptive.
 
What this means is that I have had far less time to play golf than in years past.  While I always knew that I could be called out in the middle of the night or a round for a death those occurances were few and far between.  One occurred on thanksgiving evening, just as my company was leaving, thankfully.  Ultimately it cost me a round that I had scheduled with MGSPer Larry D on Friday morning.  I did finish what I needed to do around 1 and so called another friend and headed to the club around 2.  They worked us in at 3.  Since it was probably too late to play 18 - the course was still pretty crowed and its dark around 5:50 we decided to walk 9.  It was a great decision.  Bayou is a big course, I got 10K plus steps in for that 9 hole when most places walking 18 is 15-17K for me.  We were done before 5 which meant under 2 hours for the nine.  Had we ridden we would have been waiting on every shot.  Instead we only needed to wait a few times (on the par 5's because one of the guys ahead of us could clearly reach them in 2 - no big deal.  
 
What I'm getting at is that it was a great time.  I enjoyed playing an interrupted round, enjoyed the company, enjoyed the walk.  Didn't play great but it was very hard to focus after losing a parishioner whom I've served for 16 years.  I shall miss her.  Additionally we have another one who is touch and go.  
 
I'm thinking that I am about to become a 9 hole walking golfer twice a week for the foreseable future - any one else fall into that category?

... As always, every golfer is different. I have a regular group of 3 other guys and I have convinced the 80yr old in our group to play a combo of gold (sr) and red (ladies) and he is enjoying his rounds much more after moving up. One of the others in my group is 67 and he should be playing a combo of silver (mens) and gold (sr) but for some reason he refuses to move to the Sr tees until he reaches the age of 70. The 3rd member is 62 and longer than I am so we both play silver. As long as I can shoot under par from the silvers I won't be moving up. There are 4 holes that are long for me not only by yardage but 3 of them play uphill and only my best drives reach the flat area, and you can't see the green unless you reach it. I will hit anything from a 7 iron to a 3 hybrid depending on wind, so usually a 4 or 5 iron. the 67 yr old very rarely reaches these par 4's in 2 and would move up to the golds but is just stubborn and to be fair he rides in a cart due to a bad hip and plays fast so that is never a problem. 

... I do think a lot depends on your ability and for the most part, the higher your index the shorter you need to play within your playable range. It's one thing to be very accurate and consistent with a 4 hy but quite another if your 4 hy can go left-right, hook-slice and short of the target more often than not and you have to play it or a fairway wood on al the longer par 4's. Like everyone else, I think renaming tees is essential to appeasing the male ego and agree a numbered system would be ideal. That said, I will have no problems playing the ladies tees when they become the appropriate length for my game. 

We are in the process of renaming our tees from "colors" to 1,2,3,4,5,6....6 were played by Nationwide Tour years ago and nobody is playing them now.  1 is the forward most tees.  I play 4 mainly.  I like the number system rather than color.  There is no gender distinction (although many still refer to the tees as ladies (1,2) seniors (3,4) and mens (4,5).  And since we are still in the process, calling the tees by their color is still quite common.  
The guys playing the #5 tees tend to be a bit egotistic and really don't want to associate with anyone not playing gross games and from their tees.  Many of them won't play in our Thursday MGA game because they don't want to give strokes to the higher handicap players in a net game.  Silly, but .... The group that I am part of plays the #4 tees and we accrue points throughout the year to determine positions for the Ryder cup style tournaments, so on Thursday and Saturdays I always play #4.  On other days, I'm free to play whatever tees I desire and in our Wed and Fri groups, we have players playing both the #3 and #4 tees.  Some flip back and forth between the tees, but nobody really cares which tees you decide to play (adjust handicap as needed), although most of the guys I play with will likely give you the business if you decide to move up to the #3 tees.  
I'm at an age and my game has me at that point where I'm finding the #4 tees playable, but an issue because of the need to hit woods or hybrids into many of the par 4s.  For now, I'm sticking with #4, but toying with the idea of when I'll make the move forward.  It's a frequent discussion with many of my peers as to when we'll make the final call to do it.

This is really the problem.  If we keep assigning gender to tees the male ego won’t let them play the correct tees.   For the LPGA ladies and other low handicap ladies they typically play a little farther back than the red tees so are they still playing the Ladies tees and we should play even further back?  Men are just idiots and have way to many biases when it comes to golf.  

I feel your pain.
Our course has 5 boxes, Black, Blue, Combo, Silver and Green.  I play with guys who insist on playing blue tees when they should be playing silver at best and some should stick with green. This became a huge problem in money games as some guys egos got in the way.  We agreed to resolve this issue using the following option which we do annually and stick to for the year.  

 GHIN.  Our course is par 71.
  At the beginning of the year we all play round 1 from Green 5054 slope 120.  If you can’t play to within +4 of your course handicap from those tees, you don’t move back until you do. You must move back once you score within Course Handicap +4 or better.  Round 2 is from Silver 5554 slope 128 for those who were GHIN +4 or better from Green.  Round 3 is Combo 5981 slope 133 for those who were +4 or better from Silver.  Round 4 is Blue 6330 slope 137 using same criteria.  You don’t move back until you play to course Handicap +4 for the tees you started on that round.  We play Black 6718 slope 140 once a quarter to prove we still can.  
 
My index is 8.8 right now and My current course handicap ranges from 5 for Green and 13 for Black.  So I have to shoot 80 or better from Green to move back to Silver, etc. Our course isn’t long but is very tight, tricky small and very fast greens.  
It’s not all about how far you can hit it, but about how you can score from the box you are playing from.  This alternative takes a lot of the moaning and groaning out of the mix, especially when a guy can’t get off the forward tees for a few rounds.  One of my weekend partners has decided he is only playing silver as he has more fun from there, so we adjust everything based on the course handicap for the tee boxes he plays vs. the rest of us playing either Combo or Blue.

Like it or not... guys need a place to move up to that is not the forward tees.  Every course should have a teeing ground between the Regular Men's tees and the Forward tees, or a mixed set of tees where players move up on the longer holes.  We do have a couple of groups of older guys at my club that play from our red (Forward) tees exclusively.
For 7 years I played from the Blue tees (6100y) at my new course; last year I played a few rounds at the White (senior) tees (5400y) at my course and I always shot the same scores at either tee (low 80's).  The difference was from the Blues I hit a lot of FW/Hybrids for 2nd and 3rd shots, and from the Whites I hit more iron shots.  This spring on my birthday when I turned 75, I told my wife that I was moving up to the Whites.  Overall, my index hasn't changed much, but I'm a much better iron player than I was, and I regularly score in the 70's instead of an occasional round in the 70's that happened only if I saved a lot of pars with my short game.  It's more fun playing iron shots!!  The people I play with have gotten used to me playing up at the Whites; I just tell them that I'm old.  My wife keeps complaining that the Ladies don't have a tee to move up to; her Ladies group has players from age 40-80.
Funny... maybe sad story...8 years ago I used to play at a 9-hole exec course; one par 5, six par 4's, two par 3's totaling just under 5200y from the back  Blue tees.  There were also White, Gold and Red tees.  Our gangsome always played from the Blues.  When I left, the oldest player had turned 70 and was the shortest hitter... moved up to the whites.  I saw him a year later, and he told me that everyone moved up to the Whites!!  Some of them could drive the par 4's!  When he turned 75, he moved up to the Gold tees, and shortly after that they all moved up to the Golds... even guys in their 40's!!  He was really frustrated because he moved up to compete better with the younger guys, and everyone followed him.  
 

Have you considered talking to the head pro or GM of your home course and seeing if they would put together a combo tee setup for you?  If they make it official it can be rated and actually added to the scorecard.  If the combo setup is "official" you might get less push back from the other players.
Here is a link to my home course.  We have 4 tee's (green longest, silver shortest), then the pro put together a black/silver combo setup and added it to the scorecard.  It's been slope rated so you can enter scores towards an official handicap from that setup.
https://www.golfthelinks.com/course/scorecard/

Would the course consider adding in senior tees?  
My club has 4 sets,
Blue 6763, White 6254, Gold 5331, and Red 5265
But even though you are shortening up by 900 yards going from white to gold, the elevation changes still challenge you as well as where they place the tee boxes. On many holes you are still playing position golf. Meaning from the white you hit driver and from the gold you hit a 3 or 5 wood because you have to be in position on a dog leg to go for the green. Your second shot can sometimes be the same distance to the green.  On a few other holes the distance is exactly the same from the tee box, but the angle is different as the tee boxes are on different sides of the fairway so to speak. 
I can understand the reluctancy from some members of your group hitting from the reds. A set of gold tees would make them feel better.  

This is a topic I feel passionately about. I was listening the to the "No Putts Given" podcast with Lou Stagner (data analyst at Arccos among other titles) and at the 31:00 mark he mentions a very simple formula for what courses to play:
Your 5 iron carry * 33 or 34 is the total course distance. 
I love this idea. Mostly because I bet many people (mainly men) are playing courses longer than that. For me, I carry a 5 iron about 180 yds. So that is 180 * 33 = 5940 yds. I carry a driver 260 yds. I have no problem playing sub 6,000 yds. It is more fun and, guess what, I still don't shoot below par very often. 
I would say if the majority of your golfing group is breaking 80 from the whites then they should stay there. If not, what are they afraid of? They might make more birdies? They might have more fun? The average second shot distance for a middle of the pack PGA tour player (distance-wise) is 140 yds on a par 4. That's probably a PW or soft 9 iron. If that is how we challenge a TOUR PRO then why should weekly golfers be subjecting themselves to stiffer test than that? Pride?

I'm the oldest and shortest hitter in any group I play with.  I got fed up to the point where I thought about quitting the game.  I simply announced, and continue to announce when playing with anyone for the first time that I play a forward tee.  I then select whatever is closest to (without going over, sort of like "The Price Is Right") 5500 yards.
No one has ever objected, no one has ever called me names in  a serious way.  When/if I get ribbed I simply say, "you're more than welcome to join me, come on up."
On some courses that have black/white/yellow/red I'll be using the yellow tees.  On a three tee box course I'm happily at the forward tee.
Once I accepted "who I am" as a golfer the game became fun again.
Except for those damned three putts...

I'm the coordinator of a golf group that plays once a week.  We have 18 guys in the group.  Most, including me, are retired and 65+.  Week play a local course three weeks in a row, then take field trip to other courses in the area on the fourth week.  
At our home course, there are three tee boxes - blue (6565 yards), white (6026 yards), and red (5286 yards). We play the white tees.  You know what's coming...  Some of the guys can hit drives in the 230 - 245 range (I'm fortunate to still being that group).  Some struggle to get 200 yards on their drives - let's call them limited hitters.  Golf can be frustrating, but it's especially hard when you have no chance of getting a green in regulation.  It also leads higher scores and to slower play.
Last winter, I broached the subject of changing tee boxes to make the game more enjoyable.  That conversation didn't get very far.  One week, on a windy day when the fairways were damp and soft, I said, "Let's play the red tees today."  So we did.  At the end of the round, the torches and pitchforks came out.  Some thought it was OK to play the red tees when the weather was bad, especially hitting into the wind on a long par 3, but several made it clear that they were not happy, including some of the limited hitters.  Over time, I kept chipping away at the issue and was able to convince the group that, at least, we should shorten two holes - a 402 yard par 4 and a 541 yard par 5.  So, now we play the red tees on those two holes. No complaints! So, I suggested playing a modified red/white tee box combo, but they said that would too confusing to keep track of on the course. 
So, here's my analysis - male ego.  The red tees are the "ladies tees".  So, do I continue on the quest to make golf fun again, or close my eyes when I see a 192 yard drive on a 395 yard par 4.  I have a few ideas to try, but maybe some of you have better suggestions.  
 

I only have 11 clubs in the bag: driver, 2 hybrids, 4 irons, 3 wedges and putter. No fairway woods, and 6 degree gaps between my wedges. I have a tendency to overthink, and this simplifies decision-making and helps avoid analysis paralysis.

I only have 11 clubs in the bag: driver, 2 hybrids, 4 irons, 3 wedges and putter. No fairway woods, and 6 degree gaps between my wedges. I have a tendency to overthink, and this simplifies decision-making and helps avoid analysis paralysis.

I only have 11 clubs in the bag: driver, 2 hybrids, 4 irons, 3 wedges and putter. No fairway woods, and 6 degree gaps between my wedges. I have a tendency to overthink, and this simplifies decision-making and helps avoid analysis paralysis.

You are of the same school of thought as I am because I only carry 12 clubs too. For me it eliminates second guessing myself. And trust me around the green if the shot and lie dictates I will go to bump and run in the drop of a hat with anything from a PW to a 5 iron. And if I am around a green and overall conditions dictate I will get that putter in hand quickly. 
See from your profile you are from Charlotte---- I was born and raised in North Charlotte back when it was rough not Yuppieville as it is now.

I actually prefer 6-degree gaps: I carry a 40-degree 9-iron, followed by 46-, 52-, and 58-degree wedges.
I have an “analysis paralysis” tendency, and the larger gaps (and fewer clubs: I only have 12 in my bag) make club selection much easier. And practicing with larger gaps strengthens my touch and feel when I’m between clubs. Partial shots are a fact of life the closer you get to the green; might as well be prepared for it!

Mine are even more extreme at 44* PW, 54* GW/SW, and 60* LW.  I had a 56* SW but change it to the 54* because I wanted less bounce (change fro 12* to 10*).  It works from almost all bunkers plus fits a gap in my game from a tight lie where the 12* bounce doesn't work.  Her there is a 10* gap and a 6* gap but if the shots are there how many more wedges do I need?  I do have a SW with a lot of bounce I can add for those courses that have that kind of sand.  My set only has 12 clubs so adding when needed does not mean sacrifice something else.

I am.....46/52/58 Cleveland CBX wedges with excellent results.
 

I have played 6* gap in my wedges for the past 5 years or more. As my swing speed has slowed, I'm 68, this created better yardage gapping. I play two different sets of irons, one with a 50* GW and a 56* SW and a seconds set at 46*PW, 52* GW and 58* LW. I'd really like to find an iron set with 6* gapping that isn't a game improvement iron with jacked up lofts. I may just have order them bent that way.

I play 4 degree gap:  46, 50, 54, 58.  Works out great.  Not sure about 6 degrees.  However, 46, 54, 60 sounds pretty nice.   Maybe the thing about 6 degrees is less confusion over which wedge to play.

Just heard that on December 3rd, Byron Morgan passed away. He owned and operated Byron putters from his shop in Huntington Beach.
‘I met Mr. Morgan when I picked up my first custom putter at his shop in Huntington Beach CA
Seven years ago I wrote to him and requested a putter to celebrate the upcoming birth of my first grandkid, on my birthday a beautiful mini Scottsdale Anser , with pink head cover, pink grip and pink paint fill showed up at my door, I called the number on his web site and I asked the person on the phone for Byron, the voice said “That me, how can I help you?” .
I identified myself , told him how much I loved the putter and asked him how much I owed him, his response? “ Congratulations Grandpa, it’s on me” 
 
RIP Byron