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jlukes

2019 PGA Tour Equipment Changes (Rumors)

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31 minutes ago, Shankster said:

 

 


Terrible.

But... if they make the “Tiger” irons I see a lot of old Nike staffers playing them, like Tommy... you’d have to pry them out of his hands I think.

Wish the best for Mr. Rose if it does come down to it, please don’t go to Callaway.

 

 

Mike Taylor, Nate Radcliff, Tom Stites and the others at The Oven really knew something about making golf clubs after all.  It's fun seeing those clubs still in the hands of guys that are winning. With that, I hope JRose ends up going with a mixed bag.

P.S.  If anyone has VR Pro blades lying around, please send them to Tommy Fleetwood.  

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I mean, here's the thing. We're coming of the heels of the "year of the free agent" right? All the major winners did so without a major equipment contract and only apparel, ironically all Nike. Players are more likely to sign an apparel contract and play what they want then go into full bag deals, because those have dried up for all but the biggest stars and it makes sense from a marketing standpoint as well. If I'm watching a telecast, I can see Tiger wearing the Swoosh, or Sergio in the three stripes, of Rickie with the P or Jordan with the UA logo. What I might not see is the TM stamping on a wedge or an iron. The visibility of the brand on the apparel side is more valuable that the club side and with only 1 major clothing brand locked into equipment ownership (Puma/Cobra) I think it's more likely to see more of these deals going forward.

It'll be more interesting from the club side of things because that means more and different brands might get a boost from a player if they can make it work, even if they can't exactly use that person in advertising. Still though, people are smart enough to figure out who Mizuno was talking about when they said the JPX 900 Tours were played by the 2017 and 2018 US Open Champion. 

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12 minutes ago, bergtaur said:

If I'm watching a telecast, I can see Tiger wearing the Swoosh, or Sergio in the three stripes, of Rickie with the P or Jordan with the UA logo. What I might not see is the TM stamping on a wedge or an iron.

There have certainly been some designs of clubs that would be identifiable on TV. TaylorMade has done this well with their woods: first the all-white, then the white-and-black. Nike had this going on with their blue woods. And TaylorMade also nailed this with the red Spiders (with Odyssey scrambling to match). But you're absolutely correct on your point, especially with irons and wedges. Almost anything that would be noticeable on TV that would look awful in person. Possible exceptions: Rickie's black Cobra irons (but they don't scream Cobra). Did any tour pro ever game Mizuno's blue wedges?

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30 minutes ago, mpatrickriley said:

There have certainly been some designs of clubs that would be identifiable on TV. TaylorMade has done this well with their woods: first the all-white, then the white-and-black. Nike had this going on with their blue woods. And TaylorMade also nailed this with the red Spiders (with Odyssey scrambling to match). But you're absolutely correct on your point, especially with irons and wedges. Almost anything that would be noticeable on TV that would look awful in person. Possible exceptions: Rickie's black Cobra irons (but they don't scream Cobra). Did any tour pro ever game Mizuno's blue wedges?

Plus, another thought in this space. With the rise of social media influencers like Shiels/Crossfield/TXG/Finch/MAMG/RG who club test, the rise of information through sites like this informing people of clubs that produce results from brands they may not realize, the continued and now accepted importance of fitting and word of mouth reviews from folks, the era of the pro staffer having influence over the core golfer is over.

Sadly for most companies, the number of recreational golfers who is just looking to play the clubs the pros play is shrinking every year and knowing that they may not move the needle as much in hardgoods, where margins are tighter compared to softgoods where margins rise, means the apparel contract is more valuable.

Lastly, as mentioned on this site, golfers are creatures of habit. I don't think seeing a pro switching brands is going to move so many people over to that brand, so why splash the cash for a negative return on investment.

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1 hour ago, bergtaur said:

I mean, here's the thing. We're coming of the heels of the "year of the free agent" right? All the major winners did so without a major equipment contract and only apparel, ironically all Nike. Players are more likely to sign an apparel contract and play what they want then go into full bag deals, because those have dried up for all but the biggest stars and it makes sense from a marketing standpoint as well. If I'm watching a telecast, I can see Tiger wearing the Swoosh, or Sergio in the three stripes, of Rickie with the P or Jordan with the UA logo. What I might not see is the TM stamping on a wedge or an iron. The visibility of the brand on the apparel side is more valuable that the club side and with only 1 major clothing brand locked into equipment ownership (Puma/Cobra) I think it's more likely to see more of these deals going forward.

It'll be more interesting from the club side of things because that means more and different brands might get a boost from a player if they can make it work, even if they can't exactly use that person in advertising. Still though, people are smart enough to figure out who Mizuno was talking about when they said the JPX 900 Tours were played by the 2017 and 2018 US Open Champion. 

All the Nine guys are still playing under their Nime equipment contracts. Nike allowed them to play whatever they wanted til their contract ran out. If they signed a deal before that thine then there was a reduction on the money Nike was paying so from a money standpoint it was better to not sign a deal for most.

it will be interesting to see where they eventually go

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After listening to the MyGolfSpy Insider podcast today with Chris Voshall.
I can't wait to hear what happens in the coming months with Mizuno.


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

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24 minutes ago, bergtaur said:

Plus, another thought in this space. With the rise of social media influencers like Shiels/Crossfield/TXG/Finch/MAMG/RG who club test, the rise of information through sites like this informing people of clubs that produce results from brands they may not realize, the continued and now accepted importance of fitting and word of mouth reviews from folks, the era of the pro staffer having influence over the core golfer is over.

Sadly for most companies, the number of recreational golfers who is just looking to play the clubs the pros play is shrinking every year and knowing that they may not move the needle as much in hardgoods, where margins are tighter compared to softgoods where margins rise, means the apparel contract is more valuable.

Lastly, as mentioned on this site, golfers are creatures of habit. I don't think seeing a pro switching brands is going to move so many people over to that brand, so why splash the cash for a negative return on investment.

Well put!

Maybe if the manufacturers spent less money on pros and diverted that money to development with the end goal of getting good (independent) ratings from the popular online places, they would be better off.

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Well put!
Maybe if the manufacturers spent less money on pros and diverted that money to development with the end goal of getting good (independent) ratings from the popular online places, they would be better off.
They spheres of influence shifted. Callaway was the first golf company to realize that and they rode their new marketing strategy to the top
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Plus, another thought in this space. With the rise of social media influencers like Shiels/Crossfield/TXG/Finch/MAMG/RG who club test, the rise of information through sites like this informing people of clubs that produce results from brands they may not realize, the continued and now accepted importance of fitting and word of mouth reviews from folks, the era of the pro staffer having influence over the core golfer is over.
Sadly for most companies, the number of recreational golfers who is just looking to play the clubs the pros play is shrinking every year and knowing that they may not move the needle as much in hardgoods, where margins are tighter compared to softgoods where margins rise, means the apparel contract is more valuable.
Lastly, as mentioned on this site, golfers are creatures of habit. I don't think seeing a pro switching brands is going to move so many people over to that brand, so why splash the cash for a negative return on investment.


Personally, I think you are overestimating the number of “knowledgeable” golfers that use the various review sites and forums. Most golfers still walk into shops uneducated and wanting to play the equipment they saw in TV. The Payment to tee player is so the company can use their name instead of the generic out product was used by someone that finished in x position during the tournament. Also, they are hoping for the right camera angle in TV to show their product logo. The payment to players is probably a small part of the various advertising outlets that each company uses.
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2 hours ago, jlukes said:
2 hours ago, MaxEntropy said:
Well put!
Maybe if the manufacturers spent less money on pros and diverted that money to development with the end goal of getting good (independent) ratings from the popular online places, they would be better off.

They spheres of influence shifted. Callaway was the first golf company to realize that and they rode their new marketing strategy to the top

Have you seen the number of players across all tours with a Callaway logo somewhere on them to include long drive competitors. They may not be paying all of them a lot but they have an astronomically huge marketing budget.  Might be why their gear keeps losing out in various mgs testing

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30 minutes ago, cnosil said:

 


Personally, I think you are overestimating the number of “knowledgeable” golfers that use the various review sites and forums. Most golfers still walk into shops uneducated and wanting to play the equipment they saw in TV. The Payment to tee player is so the company can use their name instead of the generic out product was used by someone that finished in x position during the tournament. Also, they are hoping for the right camera angle in TV to show their product logo. The payment to players is probably a small part of the various advertising outlets that each company uses.

 

Well Cnosil, I can speak only from the experience I had in working at Dick's for nearly 4 years. In my experiences, people were more interested in the newer stuff not because of tour validation, but because of slick advertising, which is in my mind a completely different issue. I did also notice that players did become more aware of outside brands as my time worn on at Dick's asking about Edel, Wilson, Evnroll, Mizuno, Tour Edge and others while the company went to a minimized approach that featured in lower tier stores like mine only TM, Callaway, and some sparce Ping plus store branded clubs from Top Flite and Tommy Armour. So I did see a change, maybe not a widespread across the industry type change, but a slight shift toward more independent validation through fittings and testings and research. Sadly, with our limited options we could only do so much.

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19 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Have you seen the number of players across all tours with a Callaway logo somewhere on them to include long drive competitors. They may not be paying all of them a lot but they have an astronomically huge marketing budget.  Might be why their gear keeps losing out in various mgs testing

Large marketing budget, yes, but it's different. 

It's not about big name deals.  It is about exposure.  Lots of "mid card" guys playing their gear and wearing their logo.  The Links at Petco Park.  Part ownership of Top Golf.  Callaway Talks. Fitting Room show on Siriux XM PGA Tour Radio.

The traditional marketing model of just paying big names on tour is dead and Callaway adapted to that and they are absolutely killing it right now.  And I say that as someone that has no Callaway gear and no desire to game any callaway gear

 

Oh and according to MGS testing Callaway has the 

#1 Driver for SS from 90-105 MPH

#1 Driver for SS from 105+ MPH

#2 Hybrid
#2 Fairway Wood

#2 Blade Putter

So your comment about losing out in various MGS testing is incorrect

 

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4 hours ago, jlukes said:

Large marketing budget, yes, but it's different. 

It's not about big name deals.  It is about exposure.  Lots of "mid card" guys playing their gear and wearing their logo.  The Links at Petco Park.  Part ownership of Top Golf.  Callaway Talks. Fitting Room show on Siriux XM PGA Tour Radio.

The traditional marketing model of just paying big names on tour is dead and Callaway adapted to that and they are absolutely killing it right now.  And I say that as someone that has no Callaway gear and no desire to game any callaway gear

 

Oh and according to MGS testing Callaway has the 

#1 Driver for SS from 90-105 MPH

#1 Driver for SS from 105+ MPH

#2 Hybrid
#2 Fairway Wood

#2 Blade Putter

So your comment about losing out in various MGS testing is incorrect

 

As I said they aren’t probably paying them a lot. Yes it’s a different strategy and they are effective at it as they should be.

i didn’t say they lost every testing and it’s funny  you post #2 results which isn’t winning last time I checked.

you may not have any Callaway or want to play it but you have been a recipient of free full bag of clubs from as well as an all expenses paid trip where you were fitted for that full bag and had the opportunity to play an exclusive private club. 

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As I said they aren’t probably paying them a lot. Yes it’s a different strategy and they are effective at it as they should be.
i didn’t say they lost every testing and it’s funny  you post #2 results which isn’t winning last time I checked.
you may not have any Callaway or want to play it but you have been a recipient of free full bag of clubs from as well as an all expenses paid trip where you were fitted for that full bag and had the opportunity to play an exclusive private club. 
I don't even understand what your argument is?

My entire point was the way marketing is done has changed and callaway was ahead of the curve.

And having most of their equipment finish 1st or 2nd is pretty darn good.

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Justin Thomas's contract with Titleist was set to expire at the end of this year, but Thomas came out on twitter yesterday and announced that he would be staying with Titleist

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2 hours ago, jlukes said:

Justin Thomas's contract with Titleist was set to expire at the end of this year, but Thomas came out on twitter yesterday and announced that he would be staying with Titleist

Yeah, I don't see that changing anytime soon.  With his dad I think on staff with them as a teaching pro and he has pretty much been the poster boy of success for the brand the past couple years. 

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49 minutes ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

Yeah, I don't see that changing anytime soon.  With his dad I think on staff with them as a teaching pro and he has pretty much been the poster boy of success for the brand the past couple years. 

Very similar to Bill Haas and Spieth 

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What should we expect to see from our 2018 Major winners?

Koepka doesn’t have the baggage that Reed carries but each are solid golfers without a major sponsor.


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

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7 minutes ago, bens197 said:

What should we expect to see from our 2018 Major winners?

Koepka doesn’t have the baggage that Reed carries but each are solid golfers without a major sponsor.


Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

Unless Brooks’ Nike deal is up I doubt he signs anywhere. He’s getting paid to play what he likes. I would expect him to stay with Mizuno irons if he did sign somewhere 

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Unless Brooks’ Nike deal is up I doubt he signs anywhere. He’s getting paid to play what he likes. I would expect him to stay with Mizuno irons if he did sign somewhere 

 

Clothing and shoe deals are different from the club deals. Nike isn’t paying him to play their hybrid. I agree with the Mizuno comment, those JPX’s were what guys who weren’t paid to play clubs were choosing, they’re that good.

 

He was just getting a weekly baggage fee for playing the M3, it wasn’t a contract.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy

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