LeftyHawk Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 I've been told that a draw will have a better roll out than a fade. With this crap for weather here in Michigan I've been doing some thinking on the draw vs Fade. If my thinking is right it has to do with spin. The ball needs to have a particular spin to move right to left and vice versa. So for a right handed person a draw moves right to left, how is that ball spin different if me as a lefty hits a fade, will that not have the same roll out as a right hitting a draw? What am I missing? Chris Far and Sure...... GBB Epic 11* GBB Epic 7W (Heavenwood) : G410 4 thru GW MD3 54*,60* Huntington Beach Soft #4 Tour B RX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 DJ hits 400 yard fades. Bubba hits 360 yard fades. They both run in the right conditions. Someone can explain it better I am sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSauer Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 "Provided the ball speed, launch angle and spin rate are the same, a draw and fade will carry and roll the same distance. However, from a practical perspective, most club golfers will hit a draw further than a fade, because when they hit a draw they reduce the loft, leading to lower spin rates. Most of the time, shots with lower spin travel further.""Because balls that go from left-to-right tend to have a higher spin rate, they come down at a steeper angle, meaning the ball will bounce and roll less." Driver: Aerojet 9* | Hzrdus Black Gen 4 Fairway: G410 3W 13* | Alta CB 65 Hybrid: TS2 18* | Tensei AV Blue 70 S Hybrid: iCrossover 20* | Kai'li White 80 Irons: P790 5-PW | DG S300 Wedges: Vokey SM9 | 52, 56, 60 | DG S200 Putter: Link.1 | Accra x LAB --- LAB Golf Link.1 Review --- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeftyHawk Posted February 11, 2019 Author Share Posted February 11, 2019 Well, that makes sense, thanks.... I just couldn't figure why it would make a difference. Far and Sure...... GBB Epic 11* GBB Epic 7W (Heavenwood) : G410 4 thru GW MD3 54*,60* Huntington Beach Soft #4 Tour B RX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP043 Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 I agree that @TSauer is right , essentially a ball that lands at a "flatter" angle will roll more than one that comes down steeper. But in real life, most of us hit our "standard" shape further and more consistently that we do with the "other" shape. Soggy fairways aren't a good enough reason for me to try to use a shape I can't depend on just to gain a few yards of roll. Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Draws are hit with an inside out face to path (and face closed to path) and normally with a more upwards angle of attack. Fades are hit with an outside in club path (and face open to path) and normally a more downwards angle of attack. Therefore, draws usually mean less relative spinloft than a fade, and therefore a draw will have less spin and more roll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Where do the pull faders fit in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 9 minutes ago, Shankster said: Where do the pull faders fit in? Direction doesn't matter. Ball only cares about spin. It's all about spin loft https://blog.trackmangolf.com/spin-loft/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Direction doesn't matter. Ball only cares about spin. It's all about spin loft https://blog.trackmangolf.com/spin-loft/ Right. But I’m talking like JB Holmes type swing. Fade swing with a closed face. Could you present the same loft as a draw(Er) of the ball would? Just be the path that changed?I hate math. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 31 minutes ago, Shankster said: Right. But I’m talking like JB Holmes type swing. Fade swing with a closed face. Could you present the same loft as a draw(Er) of the ball would? Just be the path that changed? I hate math. So you are talking about a path that is left of the target, but a face that is closed to the target but open to the path? If the path is outside in and the face is close to the path, then it will be a pull draw. There is no way to hit a fade with a club face that is closed to the path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 I’m saying C on this diagram. Is that a closed face to path? Not trying to argue, just figure this out. Nvm... I see now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Just now, Shankster said: I’m saying C on this diagram. Is that a closed face to path? Not trying to argue, just figure this out. Nope - club face is open to path (and closed to target) in C. Notice hoe the black line (face angle) sits in between target line and club path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickyBobby_PR Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Fades will run out but no controlled than a draw. A draw can turn into a hook or pull and the end result will be worse than a push or slice. Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4 Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120 Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60 Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1 Ball: Titleist Prov1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
null Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shankster Posted February 11, 2019 Share Posted February 11, 2019 Nope - club face is open to path (and closed to target) in C. Notice hoe the black line (face angle) sits in between target line and club path.Yeah, I saw that right after I posted it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCSAA Supt Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 What is a fade? I had a Pro I used to work with tell me I had 3 shots. A draw, a hook., and FORE ON THE LEFT!! Jim, the retired GC Super. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chemclub Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 you can talk to fade but a hook won't listen Bag: Bennington Quiet Organizer 9-Lite (link) Cart: 3.5+ Driver: F9 speedback, Accra iWood Woods: Sonartec GS Tour 14*, Fujikura Six S DI: T-MB 2 iron, KBS Tour-V 120 X, Irons: PP-9003SN 4-GW, Nippon 1150GH Stiff Wedges: 1957 K-grind SW, LW, Nippon 1150GH Stiff Putter: EXO Indianapolis (link) Ball: MTB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. 82 Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 A hook is what I use to catch fish with. A fade is what is happening to my distance the older I get. G400 Driver XR 4 Fairway 16.5° Fli-Hi Utility Iron - 21° G Series 5-9 irons SM7 46°, 50°, 54° & 58° Ghost Spider S putter Nexus Laser Rangefinder Garmin Approach S20 GPS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bens197 Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Fades and cuts listen better than a draw or hook when they’re finding their landing spot. Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy Titleist TSi3 Fujikura Speeder NX Blue 60X TaylorMade SIM2 3 wood Fujilkura Ventus Blue 7-X Titleist U505 2 Tensei 1K Black 85 X Titleist T100 4-P Nippon Modus 3 120X PING S159 50-S 55-H 59-T DG X100 Vokey SM8 50, SM9 54 & 60 Nippon Modus 3 120s L.A.B. MEZZ Max Broom Accra 47" 79.5* Srixon Z-Star XV Currently testing the 2024 PING S159 wedges… https://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/63483-testers-announced-ping-s159-wedges/ Was testing, still loving the 2023 Titleist T100 Irons 4-P https://forum.mygolfspy.com/topic/60456-titleist-t-series-irons-2023-forum-review/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
revkev Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 Wow we’ve wandered far afield.None of us is a touring pro so let’s take that off the table and get back to the fact that generally speaking a draw will go farther than a fade and a controlled draw is the preferred ball flight for most amateur golfers. Touring pros generally start out as people who draw the ball and then learn how to hit fades.If in doubt Dave P’s advice is best to follow - just play the shot you’re comfortable with. Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy Taylor Made Stealth 2 10.5 Diamana S plus 60 Aldila R flex - 42.25 inches SMT 4 wood bassara R flex, four wood head, 3 wood shaft Ping G410 7, 9 wood Alta 65 R flex Srixon ZX5 MK II 5-GW - UST recoil Dart 65 R flex India 52,56 (60 pending) UST recoil 75's R flex Evon roll ER 5 32 inches It's our offseason so auditioning candidates - looking for that right mix of low spin long, more spin around the greens - TBD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickyBobby_PR Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, revkev said: Wow we’ve wandered far afield. None of us is a touring pro so let’s take that off the table and get back to the fact that generally speaking a draw will go farther than a fade and a controlled draw is the preferred ball flight for most amateur golfers. Touring pros generally start out as people who draw the ball and then learn how to hit fades. If in doubt Dave P’s advice is best to follow - just play the shot you’re comfortable with. Sent from my iPhone using MyGolfSpy This is the problem though. Most amateurs and to an extent pros can’t control the draw. Pros will be more consistent at playing the draw and not losing it left. For amateurs the draw really becomes more of a hook and the pull comes into play more when trying to play the draw. It also brings the two way miss more into play as well I agree one should play what they are comfortable with but imo and after talking with a few instructors the reliability and consistency for many amateurs would come from playing a fade. with the design of clubs and balls today to go a lot straighter it’s not as easy to play move the ball from side to side. Imo most amateurs should decide on what side of the course they want to eliminate and play a shot/develop a swing that does that. Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4 Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120 Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60 Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1 Ball: Titleist Prov1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveP043 Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said: This is the problem though. Most amateurs and to an extent pros can’t control the draw. Pros will be more consistent at playing the draw and not losing it left. For amateurs the draw really becomes more of a hook and the pull comes into play more when trying to play the draw. It also brings the two way miss more into play as well I agree one should play what they are comfortable with but imo and after talking with a few instructors the reliability and consistency for many amateurs would come from playing a fade. with the design of clubs and balls today to go a lot straighter it’s not as easy to play move the ball from side to side. Imo most amateurs should decide on what side of the course they want to eliminate and play a shot/develop a swing that does that. In my experience, many more amateurs have a problem with a big slice than with a big draw. Its when any of us try to go against our tendency that the two-way miss comes in. I'm not sure I'd agree that ams are better hitting a fade, I think most ams would be best if they were to tame the big curve and make it a small curve. Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickyBobby_PR Posted February 12, 2019 Share Posted February 12, 2019 16 minutes ago, DaveP043 said: In my experience, many more amateurs have a problem with a big slice than with a big draw. Its when any of us try to go against our tendency that the two-way miss comes in. I'm not sure I'd agree that ams are better hitting a fade, I think most ams would be best if they were to tame the big curve and make it a small curve. Yes the tendency from ams is the slice compared to a hook. Also agree that going against tendency will be a big reason for two way miss because of timing/sequencing and getting club face and path to match up. its a lot easier to reach an am to reduce the slice to a fade. Granted getting them to try and hook/draw the ball in a lesson will go along way to reducing the curve, learning to play a small fade Imo it also gives them more consistency. If playing a fade it will move slightly to the right and be in play. If they push it the ball it will die out towards the end of the flight and ends up in the rough but in play. The slice still stays in play and will be better off than the pull. Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4 Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120 Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60 Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1 Ball: Titleist Prov1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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