[When do you ‘throw in the towel’ on an instructor]

For me, I look for someone who can explain things to me in terms I understand. Then, we have a chance. I generally have good eye hand coordination, decent body awareness, and will put the work in. I just have to understand why I am making said changes. 

I had a friend who had ultra fast tempo, one of the wickedest over the top moves i have ever seen, and really struggled to change it. He got what he needed to do, and i believe the instructor (same one i was using at the time) gave him good advice. He just really struggled to ingrain it at all.

The reason i moved on from that instructor was:

1. He told me he was going to put some pictures and videos from our last lesson up on Coachnow and never did.

2. I texted him to ask for help with a driver fitting and he never responded to my texts. He had already helped me with a 3w fitting, so I thought a driver fitting would be good also. Guess not.

3. My friend above had also texted him to set up more lessons and was never responded to.

So, I moved on. He is fairly new to the teaching game, and I felt like he was missing some fundamental flaws I have always had and just didn't have the tools to help me further, but I liked him and was going to talk with him next lesson about some of those specifics,  but again, he didn't respond. What made it worse for me is I had sent several people to him, had always tipped him well, and we had played together several times. So, we had started developing a bit of a friendship. But, I dont have much tolerance for lack of response. There were times in the past that he hadn't responded and we had even talked about it, so this wasn't the 1st time. I just had to move on.

New coach almost gave me too much to think about and I told him toward the end of the lesson, we needed to break it down as I couldn't have 5 thoughts in my head. So, at the end of the lesson, and in the video breakdown on coachnow, we developed a plan. We have had several exchanges since on coachnow so that I am moving in the right direction. I will see him again after I get these first few changes done. These are ingrained habits and will take me a bit to fix. I also think these backswing changes will put me in a better position and maybe we wont have to do as much on the downswing issues.

I do admit that 30 minutes into my lesson with him, that he was giving me too much, and I can process a lot of info and have been a good player for a long time and know a decent amount about the swing in general, and my swing. That was at least a yellow flag for me, but I also felt it was my responsibility to tell him my boundaries also. It is a two way street. I told my last coach in our 1st lesson that what he was saying wasnt clicking. He gave me a different thought and explained everything differently and it clicked. To me, we have a responsibility to communicate back so that the instructor knows we are or are not getting what they are teaching. They should be able to re-explain what they are trying to get us to do or give us a different drill to do that clicks with us.

Lots of words here, but to me, it is all about communication. That simple. 

[What Have You Bought Lately? (CHA - Club Ho's Anonymous)]

59 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... I was considering ordering set for fun and to see how they compare to P790's but I have seen several pictures that seem to show more offset than I am comfortable looking down and seeing, especially the scoring irons. How is the offset now that they are in your bag? 

Probably way less than your 790s. These are certainly players clubs. I have always preferred smaller heads, either blades, or cavities. I love these irons. Feel, looks, everything is good. 

[What Have You Bought Lately? (CHA - Club Ho's Anonymous)]

Not really a club ho (maybe?) But everything in my bag has changed in the last 18 months. 

First, Maltby TS1s to replace my Snake Eyes 675B's. Then the TSW wedges to replace my snake eyes wedges. Then, fought 3w a bit until I put a G425LST in the bag. Been struggling with driver (Maltby STW, 2017 TM M2, OG TM SIM), so got fitted for the TSI3. 

I rotate some hybrids in and out but am now playing the 2i that I reshafted a few months ago.

Got tired of 2 chips on holes because I was going under the ball with the TSW wedges, especially in soft conditions. Got the zipcores within the last few weeks. Feel really good about everything now. 

[Alignment Marks on Balls]

Yeah, not using an alignment aid is a no go for me. My alignment would be awful if I didn't. I also try to do as much as I can while others are putting. 

[CONCERNING WITB SIGNATURES]

I have everything that is a candidate to be in my bag. I rotate a few clubs between long irons and hybrids. They are all listed. 

[Maltby TSW Wedge (56/12)]

Has anyone had issues with these wedges on soft/wet turf? Here in Florida, we have a season where we play primarily wet courses (late spring through about now) and then more firm courses in the winter through spring. 

I am struggling a bit with the turf interaction on the 50 and 58 degree wedges. I dont feel like there is a lot of forgiveness there. I am struggling with that leading edge digging around the greens and on less than full shots. I am not a digger either. But, I have been dumping my fair share short and trying to play a more open face and use the bounce more, but I dumped two partial wedges well short from 38 and 67 yards with my 58 yesterday. Did the same on a 3/4 50 degree from 90 yards or so.

I also remember a friend of mine who is a digger REALLY STRUGGLING to not hit these wedges fat on any shots. He pulled out his gamers and didn't struggle nearly as much. 

I really wish I could get a 50/08 and a 58/10 or 58/12 with this grind. I can take a 56/12 and bend it, but then I have either a 58/6 or 58/14 wedge. One is too much bounce and the other is not enough. 

Anyone else struggling with this issue?

[Heath and Gav]

Thanks guys.

I did get out and play today. Worst round of the year. Quad on a 150 yard par 3. Bladed a wedge over the next green and made double. Two doubles on the back. Hit 11 fairways and never missed into a penalty area off the tee on par 4 or 5 (usually why I take double or worse). 2nd straight day I had a massive blow up hole.

Guess I need a break. Got out and had dinner with the wife and youngest son tonight, so that made up for any bad day on the course. 

[How'd you play?]

11 hours ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

Today was supposed to be the nicest day compared to Saturday and Sunday so I headed over to the club at noon. The weather was in the 60's and sunny, but there was a little wind. Knowing it was leaf season I took two balls out of the "found on the course" box. I always try to pick something that I don't normally play during leaf season. I never got to try the second ball because I was playing so well with the first one.

I played a Bridgestone Tour B RX. It performed very well. Drives were straight and long. Approach shots were good on distance and stopping, and the putting was great. It felt a little soft while playing but it just felt really good off the club face. I shot an even 36 on the front nine with one birdie and one bogey. Then shot a 33 on the back with two more birdies for a 69.

Pretty happy day today. I snuck another round in the 60's in for the season. This was the best season ever. I had 10 rounds in the 60's. Mind = Blown! 

Historically I have only managed 2 rounds in the 60's a season over the past few years. I am treating myself to some cocktails tonight and I don't normally drink. 

I did look the ball up when I got home and it was a low compression ball. Sounds like I found my winter ball. 31 Putts, 12 of 14 fairways. I didn't keep track of the greens in regulation. But I didn't find any of the 36 bunkers.  I think that's a first for me. 

Nice round and season!

[Small/Mid Size SUV]

We have been a Toyota family for years. Recently bought a 2018 Honda CRV. Love it. Gave our 2010 RAV4 to our son.

[CNosil - Journey to a better golf game]

Dang, that sucks...

[CNosil - Journey to a better golf game]

17 hours ago, cnosil said:

Been a while since I posted in this thread.  Partially because I haven’t done much with my game and partially because I am frustrated with my game.   The golf season is basically winding down  even though I will continue to play most of the winter.  Not sure how I will practice since it gets dark early.  I recently got a net; haven’t put it up yesterday, which I will use for short game shots and probably working on my low point with practice balls.  I am honestly afraid a ball will get beyond the net and break a window or hit someone so probably won’t hit full shots with a real ball.  
 

over the course of the season my short game has really improved still some terrible shots but overall I am avoiding doubles that resulted from poor short game shots.   Was starting to work on full swing shots but due to circumstances beyond control I was unable to continue the detailed full swing work and started finding “tips” which has sent my swing into a downward spiral.  I can work it out on the range, but it is the result of block hitting where I get my timing down.  It doesn’t carry over to the course which results in wayward tee and approach shots.   This past weekend was basically pull hook the tee shot, pitch out to the fairway, hit an iron that was good, a push, or pull hook, pitch on and depending on distance 1 or 2 putt.   If I could get my full swing a bit more under control I really feel like my game would be pretty good and I could get myself back to a mid single digit handicapper.  Learning DECADE really helped with strategy and expectation management now, I just need to be able to hit some shots with reasonable results.  
 

I think some full swing lessons are definitely needed.  Trying to decide if I should wait for spring or start sooner.  Probably going to do in-person as I think it would be more productive.  Just need to figure out who I can find locally that Is on the same page that I am and not require me to drive too far.  Unfortunately, don’t know a lot of players that have taken lessons and could provide recommendations.   Guess it is time to start the interview process.  

Based on your shot pattern description,  you probably need to get your swing path and/or ball position fixed. There was a time in my career where I had the same misses. Went to a pro at my course. She watched one swing outside then told me to come inside so she could video something. She had me diagnose the issue after one swing. My ball position was off the back foot with a 7 iron, therefore, middle to back of my stance with driver. She brought me inside so I could see it because she knew I wouldn't believe her if she told me my ball position was off.

Another time, I was trying to swing like Garcia or Furyk and loop it back inside. Well, I was getting stuck big time. 3 video lessons from a pro fixed that. 

In both cases, a good pro was key to fixing it rather quickly. It took me a while to get it right, but knowing what I needed to do was quick and I saw improvement come quickly. In both cases I missed off the planet right or left when I missed. Block fades and big hooks were the norm. I was probably averaging 4 or 5 of 14 fairways.

I have a friend right now who was trying to shallow his downswing on his own and with some YouTube tips. I told him when he started that he was going to end up playing army golf. Sure enough, he did. Dropped from about a 5 handicap to closer to 10 now. Crept into his once good short game too. He is about to go see my pro. 

Biggest reason I tell you this is that the right pro will see the issue and get you fixed fairly quickly. I have been there multiple times. 

I would definitely try to work on this in the off season if you can. You will thank yourself come spring. 

[Should I be looking for an x-stiff driver shaft?]

What shaft did you get?

[Putter offset in relation to eye dominance]

Right/right here. I play a PING Anser TR5, which is face balanced (only Anser model that is). I also play the ball off my left instep and tend to like to set up a bit open to target. 

[Should Fittings be Free?]

28 minutes ago, bens197 said:

We are a country that expects a deal or a discount on everything we buy.

"Where's my discount, my senior discount, my military discount, my coupon expired yesterday but I want to buy it today." Hard pass for me.

I paid for two fittings this summer and it was money well spent.  The shop space, launch monitor, inventory and most importantly, the PEOPLE spending their time and expertise with me was worth every penny.  If I choose to not purchase a club, the shop is still being reimbursed for THEIR time.  

 

 

I agree and though Adam came across like a jerk. 

Like Ryan said, they spend $75k a year for the demo wall alone. Big box stores give you what is on the fitting cart. TXG has rented a space (or two), bought equipment, and put everything on the line to open a business. They deserve to get paid. 

The prices for the equipment would likely need to go up to cover "fitting fees" in Adam's world view.

Another point i have is that there are only so many people out there who are even interested in becoming a competent fitter and there are only so many hours in the day to fit people. You will only sell so much more. 

The fact that TXG is booked solid and has an extensive wait list tells you everything. There is a market for what they do and I assure you it isn't all people like me - demanding low handicappers.  People want to feel like they tried everything and have something that will allow them to enjoy their hobby more and are willing to pay experts to help.

I just bought a new driver from a local fitter who TXG has given a shout out to. He is the one who spent the money and took the risk. His time is worth money. I have built clubs for myself for 19 years, but no way could I have done the evaluation for a driver his investment allowed me to do. I gladly paid for the fitting and the club.

I think that both a free fitting like PGA SS and others is fine for what you get. I think that should be targeted at beginners like what Adam was saying.. 2nd swing also makes money on trades so they can likely afford to give you the fitting as they aren't just selling new clubs. Plus, they have a large online presence. They have other revenue streams.

There is no way my local fitter could afford what he offers without charging for his services. As a business owner myself, I applaud the risk he took and would never take money out of his pocket. 

MyGolfSpy took a hit in my eyes today. I was hoping for an actual discussion and not an "I am right and you aren't" diatribe. There are lots of shades of gray on this and it is not as black and white as what Adam tried to make it sound like. Also, let others speak. You invited them to be there. Quit cutting them off just because you disagree. 

[SOLD Taylormade SIM2 9° RH new, head only $375 shipped]

Sold

[How low can I expect to reduce my handicap over next 6 months? I'm trying to reduce it at least another 10 strokes.]

1 hour ago, Riverboat said:

Barriers like this come in two kinds. The ones that are mental/ emotional can be broken with just one or two scores. You break the barrier, now you know you can, and so it happens far more often. 

Other barriers are physical. The goal you are striving for really is at the extreme limits of your physical capabilities. Like you, I once thought the 60s would become commonplace for me. But years after doing it the first time, I've still only managed it a handful of times. It's not mental, I'm no longer "afraid" of going that low. It's just really hard to do. For me, I have to keep every drive in play, hit way more greens than usual, make virtually every putt inside 10 feet, and get up and down nearly every time on the greens I miss. Like you said, the margins are razor thin. 

So what's my point? If there is a barrier we are shooting for, we need to be honest about which type it is. If it's the former, working a little harder on weaknesses and the mental game should help you get where you want to be. If it's the latter, we need to accept it and really celebrate the rare occasions when we accomplish that goal. Unrealistic expectations that it will lead to regular repeat performances can ruin the satisfaction of otherwise great rounds that barely miss the mark and can make the game in general a lot less fun. 

For me, it is all mental. People were shocked that I hadn't done it. I certainly dont expect to shoot in the 60s every time out (well, I did expect another one by now, as I am hitting it well). 

Sometimes,  the limits are mental, and other times physical and we have to be realistic. If you watch me play, you would likely be surprised that I don't shoot lower more often.

So, the round after the 69. I am cruising along at 3 under with a short birdie miss on 8. I get to the 10th tee. Easy hole, wide fairway. 3 wood in hand. Pick a target, step into the ball. Know I am too close to it and dont back off. Fan it far right into water that shouldn't even be in play from where I was playing. No problem.  Drop from 160 out. Slice lie. Light rough. Yank it left of the green and into an area that is just dead. Take triple. Next hole, par 5, easily reachable. Hit my drive pissed off. Drop kick it and hit a big hook left. Get it back in play. Catch a wedge a hair fat and end up short on a front pin. Chip on and miss for bogey. I am now mentally toast. Shot 41 on the back. THAT is what has always held me back. That one shot that spirals my round out of control. Working on that hard. Being more committed more often helps.

Last 2 rounds have been 75-75. Had doubles in both rounds but didnt let them derail me. If I carry that mentality of one shot at a time, I should shoot some  nice scores.

 

The point of all of that is 10 to 15 handicap golfers do the above more often and often it is multiple double and triple bogeys that lead to 90s plus rounds. Often, there is a way to manage it, but they are even less equipped than me usually to manage it. Sometimes,  when they are a few over after 9 and one or 2 bad swings leads to a 50 on 9 and then many bad rounds follow. To me, the mental game is even more of a mastery to a higher handicap player and expectations are tougher on them after a good round.

[How low can I expect to reduce my handicap over next 6 months? I'm trying to reduce it at least another 10 strokes.]

What Tom said. For me:

Reliable tee ball

Good course management 

Good with wedges - 130 yards and in, especially around the green

Deadly from 10 feet and in, with great speed control from 30 feet plus putting 

A good mentality 95% of the time you play.

 

I, like Tom, am better now than ever (about to be 51). Just bought DECADE. Decision making and one or two bad tee shots a round are what kills me. Shot 75 the other day. Birdied 3 of the 4 par 5s, just missed eagle on 2 of them from 15 to 20 feet. Two water balls on the back nine off the tee, two 3 putts, one double. Hit 14 greens and had a very abnormal 38 putts (average around 30 putts a round). Hit 9 fairways. My decision making was good. Struck it great except those 2 shots off the tee. I was on both of those greens after the water balls, so I only missed two greens and those were small misses. Bogeyed both.

That round was above my handicap and I felt like I played well. The margins for error get smaller and smaller the lower you go. Your expectations have to change with it and sometimes, that is the hardest thing to manage.

I shot 69, my career low round at the beginning of this month. Was 3 under (should have been 4 under) on my next 9. Shot 76. Have shot 76-76-79-79-78-75-75 since the 69. I literally thought as you did. Barrier broken, will shoot in the 60s a lot now. I found those first few rounds I got frustrated earlier and my scores got away from me. So be careful of expecations.

[How's your WHS handicap graph looking?]

between 0.2 and 1 - pretty steadily.

[SOLD Taylormade SIM2 9° RH new, head only $375 shipped]

My OG SIM cracked and this was sent to me as a warranty replacement. Not knowing how well this would fit me, if at all, I did a driver fitting and came away with an 8° TSI3.

Again, this is brand new. $375 shipped to the lower 48. 

[Bag for Florida Trip]

18 hours ago, AyyConn said:

Heading to St. Augustine. Playing both courses at WGV & St. John's Golf Club over the 4 night trip!

You will be within 5 minutes of my house. You will pass my neighborhood going to King and Bear. St John's greens are by far the quickest. So, be aware. 

[Should I be looking for an x-stiff driver shaft?]

I used to have all my wood shafts PURED from Golfsmith back in the day. My old iron shafts (DG Sensicore x100) are pured. Nothing in my bag today has been pured. I honestly cannot tell the difference, and ball striking has been my strength my entire career. I dont believe I am good enough to know the difference. Given that not all the guys who play the game for a living do it, and we all know they want every advantage, not sure most of them can tell a difference either.

On another note, i have played around a lot with driver settings over the years and am still doing so in my TSI3. Right now, in the current setting, it is logo up, which means spine aligned from the factory. I had the cog set differently on Saturday so it was logo down essentially. Hit 9 of 11 fairways Saturday,  9 of 13 yesterday in the two settings. So pureing or floing a shaft on an adjustable hosel is almost useless in my opinion, since a fair amount of people play with the settings.

I have been building my own sticks for 19 years, had shafts pured and not pured. My conclusion,  along with almost all human testing I have seen: inconclusive at best. 

If it is something you do to give more confidence,  have at it. It certainly doesn't hurt. 

[Advice on ordering custom clubs]

Just price gouging my friend. These will be EXACTLY the same shafts you order anywhere else. On Pureing, I am on the fence. I used to get everything pured. Now, I don't. I am not sure I am good enough to tell the difference (scratch golfer). If it was really worth it, wouldn't you think all pros would do it? Some do and some don't.

The Modus 120's are made pretty darn well. And, they can be had for way less than that (can PURE them for $19.50):

https://www.golfworks.com/nippon-ns-pro-modus-3-tour-120-355-tip-iron-shafts/p/np0001/  

The crosslines are 8 bucks also:

https://www.golfworks.com/lamkin-crossline-360-golf-grip/p/lk0197v/

 

[Should I be looking for an x-stiff driver shaft?]

It also depends on how you load the shaft. If you are very smooth, then S may be fine. If you have a quick tempo or transition, X may be the better call. As has been said, a fitter can help.

No offense, but I almost ever believe GC2 numbers. I would believe ball speed near 160, which would put your swing speed closer to 108-110. 160/106 = 1.509 smash factor. 1.5 is pretty much absolute best. I don't usually see over 1.45 or 1.46 on GC Quad and see closer to 1.49 on Trackman, and that I believe is because of how they measure clubhead speed.

My gut tells me X would give you tighter dispersion, likely a bit lower spin, and potentially some more distance through better launch conditions.

Not all are equal though. I am in the 110-116mph range on GC Quad and 108 to 114 on Trackman. Pretty smooth transition. I couldn't hit a Ventus Black, but hit the Accra TZ RPG, LA Golf Blue, and Hzrdous IM10 well last week in a fitting. There were other shafts that I just couldn't hit also - all X flex. We are all different.

[GolfTEC vs. True Spec]

On 10/20/2021 at 5:21 PM, cwbart said:

If you haven't been fitted yet give Jim McCleery a call. He's a clubfitter/builder in Waverly, OH.  I think that you would enjoy the experience.  He knows his stuff. His site is McGolf on roadrunner.net.  Look him up.  It will be worth your time.

If I lived anywhere near Ohio, I would go to Jim. Great guy, knowledgeable,  and helpful.

[Finally broke 70!]

1 hour ago, juspoole said:

Great job.  I've done it a couple times, but have not been able to this year just yet.  Hoping it can come together late in the year.  

My best is a 67, but was playing from middle tees.  Or if you count the round I played from the red tees (Breast Cancer Outing) where I played my own ball and shot a 63.  Usually I tell people my best is a 67 since it was at least 6100 yards.

One of the things I was doing to try to break through was to play from ~6,000 yards. I figured if I could shoot a good number from there, it would inspire me to do so from more normal tees.