The Distance Debate

[fixyurdivot]

I just read the latest Arccos Report on 2021 tracked data and the deep dive into driving distances.  Based on the key take-aways, I cannot understand why the USGA and R&A would issue a memo to the OEM's that effectively says "we (you) need to do something to address excessive distance".  Clearly at the amateur level, the data does not support a need to throttle club/shaft design.  The report last year that covered driving distance data at the professional level did show pretty significant increases and, depending which side of the how long is too long discussion, serves as basis for possible changes in equipment design.

I have Shotscope and frequently check my driving distance.  I found the charts in the article pretty spot on for my distance off the tee (~240 between play here in AZ and MT). I also found the suggested course (tee) length chart accurate and agree far too many players let machismo dictate proper tee decisions. I play a course here in Yuma in which we use wind speed to decide between the 5700 & 6300 tee. 

So what are your thoughts on this data (how it compares to your own data) and why in the heck the governing bodies would issue a memo to the OEM's based on these findings?

[revkev]

Their memo was not based on these findings, it was based on their own studies with data from elite players - top .01 percent of all golfers.

I will let others debate whether there is an issue at the top level of golf.

 

My greater concern is what they might do to limit people like us.  Based on my own observation of my game and that of others, there is no distance issue in golf other than we don’t hit it far enough to enjoy playing from the set of tees that we think we should play from. 

[Tom the Golf Nut]

According to an article in Golf Magazine in which the info was released from the USGA and R&A the average distance from all recreational male golfers is 215 yards. They have it broken down by handicap as well. Looks to me like no distance problem for us mere mortals. 

<6 =239.2.  +/-2.7

6-12 =219.8. +/-1.8

13 -20 =200.0  +/- 2.5

21+ =176.6. +/- 1.4

[PMookie]

For me it’s simple: leave the game alone for amateurs/recreational golfers.

[alfriday101]

6 minutes ago, PMookie said:

For me it’s simple: leave the game alone for amateurs/recreational golfers.

That seems to be what they are striving for, or at least minimizing the impact on regular players.  

 

https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/articles/2022/03/distance-golf-updated-areas-interest-research-topics-revealed.html

 

For those who don't want to or won't go to the source, the operative statement:

 

"The governing bodies believe that the changes being considered could:

• Address hitting distances for the longest hitters, whose impact on the game and golf courses has been the most significant
• Minimize the impact on shorter hitters with slower swing speeds at the recreational level
• Allow for continued innovation of balls and clubs for players at all levels."

[fixyurdivot]

2 hours ago, Tom the Golf Nut said:

According to an article in Golf Magazine in which the info was released from the USGA and R&A the average distance from all recreational male golfers is 215 yards. They have it broken down by handicap as well. Looks to me like no distance problem for us mere mortals. 

<6 =239.2.  +/-2.7

6-12 =219.8. +/-1.8

13 -20 =200.0  +/- 2.5

21+ =176.6. +/- 1.4

Umm, say's the guy who nearly holed out from 320 yards .  

 

6 hours ago, revkev said:

Their memo was not based on these findings, it was based on their own studies with data from elite players - top .01 percent of all golfers.

Perhaps I'm misinterpreting, but the data in the link comes from Arccos and amateur players.  And the first paragraph in Chris Nickels article says:

On Wednesday, March 16th golf’s governing bodies (USGA and R&A) sent an official notice to equipment manufacturers regarding “changes that address the long-term cycle of consistent hitting increases in hitting distances.”

This led me to believe it was not only the data from tour stats, and the HUGE report from the USGA and R&A last year based on the pro player data, but this Arccos data as well... which makes no sense to me.  

[Tom the Golf Nut]

11 minutes ago, fixyurdivot said:

Umm, say's the guy who nearly holed out from 320 yards .  

 

LOL, only due to a 20 mph wind at my back and a sky-high tee shot.

[alfriday101]

I'll add one more item form the report:

 

The governing bodies are considering these topics within the context of Model Local Rules that could be utilized for competitions involving the highest level of elite golfers. There is also interest in considering whether the adoption of these potential Model Local Rules could also allow the elimination of the MOI limit for recreational golfers, which could facilitate greater innovation and provide modest distance increases at this level of the game.

 

[revkev]

2 hours ago, alfriday101 said:

That seems to be what they are striving for, or at least minimizing the impact on regular players.  

 

https://www.usga.org/content/usga/home-page/articles/2022/03/distance-golf-updated-areas-interest-research-topics-revealed.html

 

For those who don't want to or won't go to the source, the operative statement:

 

"The governing bodies believe that the changes being considered could:

• Address hitting distances for the longest hitters, whose impact on the game and golf courses has been the most significant
• Minimize the impact on shorter hitters with slower swing speeds at the recreational level
• Allow for continued innovation of balls and clubs for players at all levels."

Thanks for supplying this link.  It was very helpful.  Having read the report it seems the ruling bodies recognize that this is not a recreational player issue and they will leave us alone. 

[storm319]

13 hours ago, revkev said:

Thanks for supplying this link.  It was very helpful.  Having read the report it seems the ruling bodies recognize that this is not a recreational player issue and they will leave us alone. 

Don’t expect zero changes at the amateur level. Here is the quote that concerns me:

“Address the distance issue among the longest hitters while not substantially impacting hitting distances for shorter hitters at the recreational level”

The problem is with the subjective qualitative terms. If you look at the areas of interest proposals below, you will see that there is no mention of MLR for the ball test change so it appears that any change to the ODS will be global. While the potential removal of the velocity limit helps, it will be difficult for OEMs to design something that results in a substantial performance increase at low speeds while still falling below the ODS limit (seems like a bit of a red herring IMHO).

1 - Potential changes to the testing methods for golf balls

Evaluate the effect of increasing the clubhead speed used to determine conformance to the Overall Distance Standard (ODS) to at least 125 mph and to use optimized launch angle and spin parameters (that are specific to each ball tested). In conjunction with the potential new test conditions for the ODS, the Initial Velocity Test may be modified or eliminated to provide the opportunity for innovation for shorter hitters. These potential changes would apply to balls used at all levels of the game.

2 - Model Local Rules – Club performance

Investigate the impact of a reduction of the allowable spring-like effect and moment of inertia in drivers. The governing bodies are considering these topics within the context of Model Local Rules that could be utilized for competitions involving the highest level of elite golfers. There is also interest in considering whether the adoption of these potential Model Local Rules could also allow the elimination of the MOI limit for recreational golfers, which could facilitate greater innovation and provide modest distance increases at this level of the game.