Byrnzee's Swing Change Thread

[RickyBobby_PR]

9 hours ago, cksurfdude said:

Ah ha, got it! Thx for that.

Just an FYI.. I'm working on a similar thing but in a little different way - I've been to Monte Scheinblum clinics and am working on drills he gave me .. and that also appear in his videos .. to get the arms moving way earlier to start the downswing.

Good luck on your continuing journey!!

 

PS: @RickyBobby_PR thx for posting those vid links; gonna check them out tomorrow.

 

The beginning of the swing is very important. The more out of position the club is the more compensations we have to make later on. Also with the swing being ~1 sec long from takeaway to impact and it being 1/2 over at lead arm parallel there isn’t much time to make the necessary compensations. This is why many feel their swing or think mid-high handicap swings are consistent. What’s consistent is their movement patterns and swings. What’s inconsistent is the ability to make the same compensation each swing and to time that up.

When it comes to the pressure shift it happens to late and most amateurs get to the lead side in the downswing rather than at the top of the swing or before it finishes, which is what the good players do.

Many of us including me aren’t using the ground to create the rotation in the hips. Jake Hutt a good video on how the feet move. I’ve been trying to find it but can’t at the moment. If i do I’ll post it

[RickyBobby_PR]

20 hours ago, Byrnzee said:

I appreciate the insight and the videos regarding pressure shifting. I will definitely use these this week while practicing. 

At the end of the day this is a very humbling learning experience for me. Hopefully I can look back at the progress I've made down the road and be proud of how far I've come.

Wanted to come back to this post. Taking on a swing change by oneself using YouTube videos or other video sources is a huge challenge and many ardent very successful. 

I’m going to live this comment from Monte in a thread on another forum about technical work that really gets into why going at it alone isn’t the best idea 

 

There are two kinds of practice.

 

Movement pattern practice 

Ball striking practice.

 

You shouldn’t mix them and ironically ams analyze the opposite way they should.

 

When doing movement pattern practice, they lament each non perfect shot.  “I toe’d that one, that one was a little chunky, ohhh, I sliced that.”

 

I then ask them if they were focusing on hitting a good shot, or moving better.  They say move better, then I ask why they are focusing on how they hit the ball.

 

Then doing ball striking practice or playing a round for score, the lament bad body movements.  “Didn’t keep my head down, didn’t clear my hips, came over the top. “
 

During ball striking practice, you try and hit a solid shot toward the target and if you hit a bad shot, do better on the next one.  You don’t worry what bad movement caused the bad shot, because:

 

A.  Analysis will likely be wrong.

B.  You won’t have the proper fix

C.  You won’t implement it on the next swing

 

Merry go round approach doesn’t work.
 

During movement pattern practice, you make the correct move you’re trying to change and pay no attention to the result. 

[Byrnzee]

Swing Thought of the Day: get to the top and let everything turn together

I went to the sim last night to work on the pressure shifting that @RickyBobby_PR mentioned. I definitely am starting to understand the importance of that move especially as it pertains to opening the hips.

However, with my only swing thought being "pressure shift," the rest of my swing fell by the wayside. I was reverting back to old habits of the top of my body spinning out, leading to over-the-top, steep downswing.

While contemplating whether to hide my sticks in my trunk forever, I decided to try to learn from that experience and determine the best path forward. 

My practice swings seem to follow the form that I'm trying to accomplish. Something comes over me when actually trying to hit the ball where I forget every drill and swing thought I've ever encountered.

While practicing at home in my apartment, I've thought back to another swing thought I used to have some success with in the past. Let everything turn together.

My head has been so full with "pressure shift to left side before top of the backswing," "drop the trail elbow," "let the arms fall," etc.... that I've started feeling less like a golfer and more like a contortionist. 

While watching a video of Sungjae Im on his Instagram, he was focusing on taking a good backswing to the top and then turning and hitting the ball.

https://www.instagram.com/reel/C1G5z-dvJ2K/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link&igsh=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

I decided to work in my apartment on having a smooth, slow takeaway, getting to the top of the backswing, then having the "feeling" of rotating through impact as one piece.

Although that isn't actually what will happen and many body parts will move in segments (pressure will shift as discussed above, trail elbow will fall as it should, etc.), the "feel" of everything moving at once helps me to avoid spinning out as I've historically done.

Hoping to practice this feel more this week and continue working on the good things I've learned lately instead of focusing on my shortcomings.

 

 

Edited February 7 by Byrnzee

[RickyBobby_PR]

6 minutes ago, Byrnzee said:

My practice swings seem to follow the form that I'm trying to accomplish. Something comes over me when actually trying to hit the ball where I forget every drill and swing thought I've ever encountered

This is because practice swings are pointless. They have the club in a bad position and there’s no repercussions for a bad swing. I’ve posted thoughts from Monte Scheinblum about this several times in the forum. When there is a ball there the mind reacts to where the club is and when it’s out of position the mind will get the body to move to get it back into position to hit the ball. If the club is out of position by lead arm parallel it’s going to taken a lot to try and get it right in the 1/2 second that’s left in the swing. 
 

10 minutes ago, Byrnzee said:

However, with my only swing thought being "pressure shift," the rest of my swing fell by the wayside. I was reverting back to old habits of the top of my body spinning out, leading to over-the-top, steep downswing.

 

As mentioned above it’s due to the club being out of position before the top of the swing. Poor or no wrist set, club rolled or pulled inside.

The fix has to come before the top of the swing which means the problem has to be identified at takeaway, club parallel or left arm parallel. Typically is at or before club parallel 

13 minutes ago, Byrnzee said:

While practicing at home in my apartment, I've thought back to another swing thought I used to have some success with in the past. Let everything turn together.

Nothing turns together. In the takeaway and backswing it’s club, hands, arms, shoulders and lastly hips.

in the downswing the hips/lower body move first then the upper body. Think of the long stated cue of back to target longer also seen in the Justin rose drill. While it’s only .02 seconds separation of lower and upper body in the downswing there is no turn together in good swings. And without proper pressure shift there’s going to be issues with the sequencing 

It’s why I posted videos to show how the takeaway and backswing are supposed to work. 

[Byrnzee]

1 minute ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Nothing turns together. In the takeaway and backswing it’s club, hands, arms, shoulders and lastly hips.

I deliberately said in my post that isn't what actually happens. I said it's the "feel" that is helping me in this moment.

I understand there are right and wrong ways to do things, but people also learn differently. I'm working extremely hard to try and find what works best for me in order to hit these correct positions.

I've watched every piece of golf instructional content you can imagine. Posting videos telling me "do this" isn't as easy as it might seem to you.

I'm trying to get time to work with an instructor in person but for now I'm going to continue working on things that make sense to me.

[Byrnzee]

Swing Thought of the Day - 2/8/24:

I found this video from an instructor I like on Instagram where he talks about Pushing, not Pulling, on the downswing. He goes on to explain that it is not actually a push as much as an extension, but just a simple way to remember the "feel" vs. pulling the chain, etc...

Video: Push, Don't Pull

He shows a helpful drill with an alignment stick that I'm hoping to use in my practice. This concept is very similar to what I've discussed before of letting the arms fall or dropping the hands in the downswing. However, I think this feeling of pushing the hands while maintaining that external rotation is more helpful for me to grasp.

Hoping this may be helpful for anyone else struggling with steepness in the downswing!

[cksurfdude]

3 hours ago, Byrnzee said:

..where he talks about Pushing, not Pulling, on the downswing. He goes on to explain that it is not actually a push as much as an extension, but just a simple way to remember the "feel"

Standard Disclaimer: I'm not a golf instructor and I don't play on TV. 

IMHO the push drill / feel is excellent (and something I work on). And IMHO the drill is applicable to something I believe I saw in a screen grab of you in an earlier post - the arms are not extended coming into / at impact (also someone I have trouble with).

So yes hopefully this is helpful to you in making better contact!! 

[tdroma98]

@Byrnzee you're making good progress since your first post back in August 2023.  Keep it up!  Just don't overload yourself & get frustrated.  I like your passion! Good luck! 

[Byrnzee]

12 hours ago, tdroma98 said:

@Byrnzee you're making good progress since your first post back in August 2023.  Keep it up!  Just don't overload yourself & get frustrated.  I like your passion! Good luck! 

I really appreciate it @tdroma98! Trying not to overload myself, but there are obviously a lot of complicated aspects of the golf swing. I definitely think I have improved since I've started this journey and I'm hoping to only continue to improve into the future. Thanks for following along!

[GolfSpy_KFT]

18 hours ago, Byrnzee said:

Swing Thought of the Day - 2/8/24:

I found this video from an instructor I like on Instagram where he talks about Pushing, not Pulling, on the downswing. He goes on to explain that it is not actually a push as much as an extension, but just a simple way to remember the "feel" vs. pulling the chain, etc...

Video: Push, Don't Pull

He shows a helpful drill with an alignment stick that I'm hoping to use in my practice. This concept is very similar to what I've discussed before of letting the arms fall or dropping the hands in the downswing. However, I think this feeling of pushing the hands while maintaining that external rotation is more helpful for me to grasp.

Hoping this may be helpful for anyone else struggling with steepness in the downswing!

This is great. I struggle with a steep downswing as well and have been working really hard on trying to get to a more shallow position. Made some good progress this week and a video I found on YouTube that for whatever reason clicked and I was able to implement some of what the guy was talking about. I didn't go through the whole thing because he uses a giant cone for a drill which I don't have  but early in the video I took what he was saying and worked on it which gave me some immediate results.

Biggest thing now is to be able to continue working on it. I have also been getting into the habit of filming all my practice sessions so I can go back and look swing to swing. Only fear is I am hitting blindly into a net, which stinks, but in theory getting to a more shallow position in the downswing shouldn't hurt me lol.

Keep up the great work @Byrnzee!

[Byrnzee]

14 minutes ago, GolfSpy_KFT said:

Biggest thing now is to be able to continue working on it. I have also been getting into the habit of filming all my practice sessions so I can go back and look swing to swing. Only fear is I am hitting blindly into a net, which stinks, but in theory getting to a more shallow position in the downswing shouldn't hurt me lol.

You're telling me you don't have a giant cone laying around?? 

Filming has definitely helped me to get some real-time feedback on my mistakes. I would agree with you that if you're working on the movements and getting more comfortable getting shallow and making good contact, it will only help you going forward.

The majority of golfers are steep in their downswing. If you're able to overcome it, you're on the right path

[GolfSpy_KFT]

5 minutes ago, Byrnzee said:

You're telling me you don't have a giant cone laying around?? 

Filming has definitely helped me to get some real-time feedback on my mistakes. I would agree with you that if you're working on the movements and getting more comfortable getting shallow and making good contact, it will only help you going forward.

The majority of golfers are steep in their downswing. If you're able to overcome it, you're on the right path

I've got some buddies that work for the city...maybe they can snag one for me 

In all seriousness, I was making some of the best contact I can remember to date with my driver the other night when working on the feel of getting more shallow. Way less toe-y misses, which is my normal miss due to issues with early extension and coming in too steep. I've got multiple areas to improve on, which we all do, but I'm going to focus most of it on that path in the downswing for now to get to a point where I don't have to think about it. Once I can accomplish that, it'll be doing a better job of turning all the way through the downswing instead of bailing on the turn a bit early. Also, like you, working on feeling the pressure shift to the back side and then transferring it to the lead side without too much of a hip slide, which I have been guilty of for a long time. Thank goodness I enjoy the grind lol.

[Byrnzee]

2 minutes ago, GolfSpy_KFT said:

I've got some buddies that work for the city...maybe they can snag one for me 

In all seriousness, I was making some of the best contact I can remember to date with my driver the other night when working on the feel of getting more shallow. Way less toe-y misses, which is my normal miss due to issues with early extension and coming in too steep. I've got multiple areas to improve on, which we all do, but I'm going to focus most of it on that path in the downswing for now to get to a point where I don't have to think about it. Once I can accomplish that, it'll be doing a better job of turning all the way through the downswing instead of bailing on the turn a bit early. Also, like you, working on feeling the pressure shift to the back side and then transferring it to the lead side without too much of a hip slide, which I have been guilty of for a long time. Thank goodness I enjoy the grind lol.

Seems like we have some similar tendencies! Feel free to continue sharing here as you're working on your own journey. Easier to accomplish a goal when you don't feel alone lol

[Byrnzee]

Hello Spies!

Sorry for the (once again) long break in posts on this thread. It's not that I haven't been working on my swing changes, I just haven't been documenting them nearly as much.

Looking back on a year or so ago when I began this swing change journey, I am very proud of the progress I've made and how far I've come. I'm not nearly as steep and over-the-top on the downswing, which was always a big fault of mine. 

Some of the main swing thoughts I've been focusing on lately:

1. Hip bump & Staying Centered - I've talked about this before, but starting my routine by setting up with a hip bump has really helped reduce the amount of sway in the golf swing. Adam Porzak on YouTube has been one of the instructors I've enjoyed learning from and he swears by this move.

2. Upper Body Takeaway - I've implemented a similar move to Nelly Korda on my pre-shot routine, where I take the club back using my left shoulder as the driver. I've tried to keep my lower body still until my club reaches this point a foot or two behind the ball. Then I rotate into my trail hip and feel a big stretch at the top of the backswing.

3. Abbreviated Backswing - I've noticed that whenever I try to hit the ball really hard, I end up lifting my arms more, which results in separation from my body. This typically results in less consistent ball-striking and rarely actually leads to further distance. I've tried to feel like I'm only swinging 3/4 of the way and maintaining that connection with my trail arm (think headcover under the trail armpit). Nelly also talks about having a feeling of "Shoulder to Chin" which lets her know it's time to begin the downswing.

4. Give Yourself Time at the top of the Backswing - I have a tendency to rush in transition, which typically leads to coming over the top because you're so focused on getting that clubhead to the ball as quickly as possible. By taking a fraction of a second to gather at the top of your backswing, it has helped me a lot in transition and has lead to more consistent ball striking. Bryson did a video with Garret Clark from Good Good where he talked about this concept and it's been a great thought for me ever since (starts at 3:56).

 

These four swing thoughts have been great for me recently and I'm hoping to keep converting them to muscle memory in order to think less on the golf course. If you've made it this far, I appreciate you taking the time to follow along!

[GolfSpy AFG]

6 minutes ago, Byrnzee said:

These four swing thoughts have been great for me recently and I'm hoping to keep converting them to muscle memory in order to think less on the golf course. If you've made it this far, I appreciate you taking the time to follow along!

Way to keep after it.  How often are you practicing on a range?  Is some of your practice "dry"...in other words away from the range, not hitting balls, just working on repeating the movements you're describing?

And have you played lately?  Wondering how things are translating to your scores.

[Byrnzee]

9 minutes ago, GolfSpy AFG said:

Way to keep after it.  How often are you practicing on a range?  Is some of your practice "dry"...in other words away from the range, not hitting balls, just working on repeating the movements you're describing?

And have you played lately?  Wondering how things are translating to your scores.

I typically go to either a driving range or simulator 2-3 times a week. I try to golf every weekend when the weather is cooperating and we don't have prior commitments.

I do "dry" practice in my apartment on a daily basis. I work extensively on repeating those movements and trying to convert them to muscle memory. Obviously practice swings and drills don't always translate to the range/course, but I'm definitely working hard to make that transition easier.

I played this past weekend and shot 86 with four doubles. Few bad holes, but otherwise was pretty happy with my performance. Had a stretch on the back nine with 5 straight pars where everything felt in sync. My last round before that was a randomly nice weekend at the beginning of March where I shot 79 on a course with newly aerated greens and some generous gimmes.  

Supposed to play this weekend if weather cooperates, so I'm looking forward to seeing how things are translating to the course. Hoping as the season goes on, I can see more consistent results and lower scores.

[cksurfdude]

On 4/24/2024 at 12:12 PM, Byrnzee said:

I do "dry" practice in my apartment on a daily basis. I work extensively on repeating those movements and trying to convert them to muscle memory. Obviously practice swings and drills don't always translate to the range/course, but I'm definitely working hard to make that transition easier

Yes - that has really helped me out, too! Easy to put in a few reps and the constant reinforcement is beneficial. Of course I still suck .. but nice the read of your progress!!

[Byrnzee]

Swing Thought of the Day - 4/26/24: Keep Your Back to the Target Longer

I saw this great TikTok Video from Monte that has been helping me a lot to avoid coming over the top to start the downswing. By having the "feel" of keeping my back to the target longer, it allows my hips to start the downswing and my arms to fall into a better position.

There's another video I saw the other day from Chris McClatchie that talked about how you're going to be wide on one side of the ball and narrow on the other. I had never heard this concept before, but it really resonated with me. 

Going to try and take these two swing thoughts with me into my practice and see how they translate.

[GolfSpy_KFT]

1 minute ago, Byrnzee said:

Swing Thought of the Day - 4/26/24: Keep Your Back to the Target Longer

I saw this great TikTok Video from Monte that has been helping me a lot to avoid coming over the top to start the downswing. By having the "feel" of keeping my back to the target longer, it allows my hips to start the downswing and my arms to fall into a better position.

There's another video I saw the other day from Chris McClatchie that talked about how you're going to be wide on one side of the ball and narrow on the other. I had never heard this concept before, but it really resonated with me. 

Going to try and take these two swing thoughts with me into my practice and see how they translate.

These are awesome, and I love the "back to the target longer" feel thought. That, paired with feeling keeping my hands inside on my takeaway, has helped me start to work out of my case of the shanks. 

Don't know if I've said it yet or not either, @Byrnzee, but the swing looks like it is coming along great man!

[Byrnzee]

23 minutes ago, GolfSpy_KFT said:

Don't know if I've said it yet or not either, @Byrnzee, but the swing looks like it is coming along great man!

I really appreciate it! Always a work-in-progress, but really happy with how far I've come in just over a year. It's good to put that into perspective sometimes when I feel like I have hit a plateau.