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Drivers for slow swings seniors


oldbutnotdead

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Looking forward to what everyone has to say on this topic.  I play a G400 Max with a regular shaft.  Will be looking for a new/better driver for next year. Thinking about the G430 Max.  What ever I end up with, I will be fit for it. 

Edited by CrazyGolfNut
  • Driver _ Ping G400 Max
  • Woods _ Ping G410 3 & 5 | Cleveland Launcher XL HALO 7
  • Hybrid _ Titleist 818 H1 5 
  • Irons _ Titleist T300 6-GW
  • Wedges _ Titleist SM9 52F & 56S
  • Putter _ Odyssey Dual Force Rossie 2 or Rife Two Bar Hybrid
  • Distance _ Bushnell Phantom 2 GPS | Precision Pro NX7 Pro
  • Ball _ Titleist Pro V1 yellow
  • GHIN _ HCP floats between 8 & 12

:ping-small:  :cleveland-small: :titelist-small:  :vokey-small:   :odyssey-small:  :rife-putters-1:  :918457628_PrecisionPro:  :sunmountain: :Clicgear:   :footjoy-small:  

"Never bet against an old man with old clubs that have new grips"

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Until the first of this year, my driver was a 12 degree Ping G400 SFT with a prototype Matrix shaft made as a Korean promotion (don't ask me why, I just picked it up on eBay and it worked).  Unfortunately, it developed a crack in the hostel right near where the triangle for setting the loft is.  Thanks to the great Ping customer service I was able to get a replacement.  I first tried the G425 SFT with the 40 gram Alta Distanza shaft.  I found that for me, there was too much draw bias in the design, and I had a hard time keeping it from the left hand rough.  Ping wanted me to get fitted, so I drove 165 miles up US1 to America.   We ended up with a 10.5 degree Ping G430 Max HL which has the lighter grip and movable rear weight (set to draw) and the 45 gram Alta Quick shaft.   As a reference point, I have an anemic 75 mph driver swing speed (too many operations, new body parts, broken neck and I could go on).   Let's just say that the fact I'm even playing golf is testament to my doctors not my golf skills!

I've had the G430 Max HL in play for a while.  I like the G430 Max HL better than the G425 SFT.  I find I keep it in the fairway (roughly 75% fairways hit which is about the same as my previous G400 SFT) with about the same distance.  With the lighter weight components, it's suppose to give me a little more distance.  For me, I'm not sure that it's a noticeable difference.  I think I may end up seeing about getting a heavier moveable weight and swap out the grip to a standard weight grip as it may be just a little too light for me.  

Ping G430 Max driver 10.5 degrees with an Alta Quick45 gram senior shaft
Callaway Epic 3 wood, Project X Evenflow Green 45 gram senior shaft  
Callaway GBB Epic Heavenwood, with a Mitsubishi Diamana 50 gram senior shaft
Ping G 20.5 degree 7 wood, with a stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Ping G 26 degree hybrid, stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Callaway Paradym X irons, 7-AW with Aldila Ascent Blue 50 graphite shafts
Edison wedges:  50, 55 and 60 degree, KBS Tour Graphite A flex shafts
Putters:  L.A.B. Direct Force 2.1 putter, 34.5" long, 67 degrees lie
 
2022 MGS Tester:  Shot Scope Pro XL+ with H4  
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11 hours ago, CrazyGolfNut said:

Looking forward to what everyone has to say on this topic.  I play a G400 Max with a regular shaft.  Will be looking for a new/better driver for next year. Thinking about the G430 Max.  What ever I end up with, I will be fit for it. 

Almost impossible to say which drivers will be best for a slower swing player.   General answer is always more loft, lighter weight, CG back type designs.    XXIO is one that comes to the top of my mind.
 

 It will be interesting to see if you can beat out the G400max; I hit most every driver every year and haven’t found anything that  makes me want to drop the club from my bag.   

Driver:  :ping-small: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven
Fairway: :titelist-small: TS3 15*  w/Project X Hzardous Smoke
Hybrids:  :titelist-small: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype
                :titelist-small: 915H  24*  w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype        
Irons:      :honma:TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite
Wedge:  :titleist-small: 54/12D, 60/8M w/:Accra iWedge 90 Graphite
Putter:   :taylormade-small:TM-180

Testing:   SPGC_logo.jpg

Backups:  :odyssey-small: Milled Collection RSX 2, :seemore-small: mFGP2, :cameron-small: Futura 5W

Member:  MGS Hitsquad since 2017697979773_DSCN2368(Custom).JPG.a1a25f5e430d9eebae93c5d652cbd4b9.JPG

 

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So many options and choices. Companies like Callaway, Cobra, Honma and others make specific light weight drivers aimed at slower swing speed players to help increase swing speed, however that doesn't also translate to more distance. 

Getting fit or at the very least testing and trying different options in critical to helping make the proper decision. 

⛳🛄 as of Nov 6, 2023 (Past WITB
Driver:  :callaway-small: Paradym TD w/ GD ADDI 6X Driver Shootout! 

Wood:    :cobra-small: F7 3 wood 14.5* w/ Motore F1 Shaft

Irons:   :titleist-small: T Series - T200 5 Iron
                                          T150 6-9 Iron
                                          T100 PW/GW

Wedge:  Toura Golf - A Spec 53,37,61 degree 

Putter:  Screenshot 2023-06-02 13.10.30.png Mezz Max!

Balls:     Vice Pro Plus Drip (Blue/Orange)

 

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I go back and forth between a Titleist Tsi1 and a Callaway Paradym X, both 12 degree.  I was fitted for both.  I get more draw from the Titleist and end up in more fairways.  I get more distance with the Callaway (about 10 yards) but occasionally hit it dead right about 30 degrees, not a slice.  My swing speed is only 72 mph and my distance is normally around 180 yards.

Callaway Paradym X driver

Callaway Paradym 5 and 7 fairways, + 1/2 inch shafts

Ping 20, 24, 27, and 31 degree hybrids, +2 inch shafts

Ping 6-9 G10 irons, +2 inch shaft on 6, then constant shaft length 7-9

Callaway 46 deg. wedge, same length as 6 iron

Ping 54 deg. wedge, same length as 6 iron

Callaway ERC soft yellow

I’m 6 feet, 8 inches tall so need the extra length shafts

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I'm an old guy--71, to be precise.  With much work earlier in the year, I got my swing speed up to the low 90s from 87 or so.  But while I'm an old hacker with a slow swing, I can't use lightweight shafts---I don't have a smooth swing and I need a heavier shaft to make sure I have more stability in the swing and the face ends somewhat close to its intended position.   Just telling this story to reinforce the need for testing and fitting.  I ended up with a Ping G430 Max and went to 12 degrees for the first time, and it has worked well.  

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I bought a Tour Edge Driver and have been very happy with them. (C721, 722 and 723 - more on that lower down) THey are designed for seniors and have a lot of forgiveness. The Real dividing line here is money. Cerrtainly the Calloway, Taylor Made, Ping and Titlist drivers are great and you will be happy with them, but can you afford to spend $500+ on a golf club?! IF you can, then definately stick with the Ping. TE comes in around $350 and can be found for less.  Now why did I go through three different models? They are a little fragile. One cracked at the back, the other took a nick when on the driving range, Both times Tour Edge backed up their Lifetime warranty by sending me a replacement- what ever the current model was! Beleive me , They are a much easier company to deal with then Ping is! If you think you can get a timely response from TM or Callaway if you have a problem- then stick with them. (I do love the Paradym line, just bought a 5 wood and will soon get a hybrid)

😧 TOUR EDGE C721

FW:Callaway Rogue, Callay Epic 7W (love this club!!)

HY:TM M2 (old reliable)

I: PING G410

SW: Tour Edge HL4 Ironwood 54

LW: Mizuno T20 60/9

 

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4 hours ago, Golf2Much said:

Until the first of this year, my driver was a 12 degree Ping G400 SFT with a prototype Matrix shaft made as a Korean promotion (don't ask me why, I just picked it up on eBay and it worked).  Unfortunately, it developed a crack in the hostel right near where the triangle for setting the loft is.  Thanks to the great Ping customer service I was able to get a replacement.  I first tried the G425 SFT with the 40 gram Alta Distanza shaft.  I found that for me, there was too much draw bias in the design, and I had a hard time keeping it from the left hand rough.  Ping wanted me to get fitted, so I drove 165 miles up US1 to America.   We ended up with a 10.5 degree Ping G430 Max HL which has the lighter grip and movable rear weight (set to draw) and the 45 gram Alta Quick shaft.   As a reference point, I have an anemic 75 mph driver swing speed (too many operations, new body parts, broken neck and I could go on).   Let's just say that the fact I'm even playing golf is testament to my doctors not my golf skills!

I've had the G430 Max HL in play for a while.  I like the G430 Max HL better than the G425 SFT.  I find I keep it in the fairway (roughly 75% fairways hit which is about the same as my previous G400 SFT) with about the same distance.  With the lighter weight components, it's suppose to give me a little more distance.  For me, I'm not sure that it's a noticeable difference.  I think I may end up seeing about getting a heavier moveable weight and swap out the grip to a standard weight grip as it may be just a little too light for me.  

I have the 430 Max H/L as well and ended up with several different weights to compensate for shortening the shaft and to experiment on what my swing preference is. I just got a few aftermarket weights from Amazon/Ebay

 Ping 430 Max H/L 10 Degree Geezer Flex

 Ping 425 7 wood Geezer Flex

Ping 425 5H [Not in bag]

TM DHY 4/5

Titlist 5-Gap T300's Geezer Flex

Wedges Cleveland RTX Fullface Zipcore 52 degree and TM Hi Toe 4 56 degree

Putter Scotty Cameron Golo S Center Shafted

Ball Bridgestone BXS , Trying The Maxfli Tour S also

Bag Titlist 15 Cart Bag

 

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2 hours ago, sotall said:

I go back and forth between a Titleist Tsi1 and a Callaway Paradym X, both 12 degree.  I was fitted for both.  I get more draw from the Titleist and end up in more fairways.  I get more distance with the Callaway (about 10 yards) but occasionally hit it dead right about 30 degrees, not a slice.  My swing speed is only 72 mph and my distance is normally around 180 yards.

If available maybe try a few different gram club head weights for the Paradym to see if it will dial it in as more consistent, I had to shorten the shaft down to 44.5-44.75 from stock to get my driver dialed in.

 Ping 430 Max H/L 10 Degree Geezer Flex

 Ping 425 7 wood Geezer Flex

Ping 425 5H [Not in bag]

TM DHY 4/5

Titlist 5-Gap T300's Geezer Flex

Wedges Cleveland RTX Fullface Zipcore 52 degree and TM Hi Toe 4 56 degree

Putter Scotty Cameron Golo S Center Shafted

Ball Bridgestone BXS , Trying The Maxfli Tour S also

Bag Titlist 15 Cart Bag

 

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One clear point is the seniors with rare exception are at one end of the bell curve. Rack models are for the majority in the center. The lightweight options can work for some, but for others, the greatest mass of a heavier head can increase ball speed more. I found the Titleist-1 drivers generated too much spin (~4000 rpms) and a lower smash value. The -2 driver was more stable with more ball speed. In the low 80’s I can get 195 and into the 210’s for distance. 
As a LH, XXIO was an interest but without a fitting option hardly worth the premium to guess at the best fit. As for draw biased drivers, this is more of a swing rather than age issue, IMHO. So long as I maintain tempo and take the driver straight back and swing from the inside, my drives are fairly straight. When I try to get to 110%, then I take it back inside and come down over the top. Started that way when I took up golf in my late 50’s. So, with perseverance to fight old habits ( only mortally wounded it, not killed it…) I don’t need a draw biased driver. 

Titleist TSR 11 degree, HZRDS Red R 44.75 LH

Titleist TSR-1 5/7 Woods LH

Titleist TSR-1 23 Hybrid LH

Titleist T200  7-48 - T350 6 Tensai AMT Red LH

 Titleist SM9 50-54-58 TT AMT Red LH

Scotty Phantom X 7.5 RH

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23 minutes ago, WiTerp50 said:

One clear point is the seniors with rare exception are at one end of the bell curve. Rack models are for the majority in the center. The lightweight options can work for some, but for others, the greatest mass of a heavier head can increase ball speed more. I found the Titleist-1 drivers generated too much spin (~4000 rpms) and a lower smash value. The -2 driver was more stable with more ball speed. In the low 80’s I can get 195 and into the 210’s for distance. 
As a LH, XXIO was an interest but without a fitting option hardly worth the premium to guess at the best fit. As for draw biased drivers, this is more of a swing rather than age issue, IMHO. So long as I maintain tempo and take the driver straight back and swing from the inside, my drives are fairly straight. When I try to get to 110%, then I take it back inside and come down over the top. Started that way when I took up golf in my late 50’s. So, with perseverance to fight old habits ( only mortally wounded it, not killed it…) I don’t need a draw biased driver. 

Lumping all seniors in as being at the end of the bell curve is just not a good generalization which in golf generalizing anyone whether by age, handicap, swing speed just isn’t a good thing to do because everything is based on the individual.

and off the rack believe it or not is actually designed more for the slower golfer than the middle or higher end range of swing speeds. This is directly from Tom O who works at cobra and was at TM before that as well as from guys that are or used to be at Bridgestone. It’s why most higher swing speed players 110+ move away from the no upcharge offerings in shafts from the various manufacturers. 
 

Everything off the rack is designed for the average golfer and the average golf swings slow and has trouble getting and keeping the ball in the air. How the golfer swings will play a role in what works for them based on where weight and CG is in the head

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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2 hours ago, Fred Mitchell said:

If available maybe try a few different gram club head weights for the Paradym to see if it will dial it in as more consistent, I had to shorten the shaft down to 44.5-44.75 from stock to get my driver dialed in.

I'll be interested in finding out how you do with the higher weights.  I actually emailed Ping customer service this weekend asking about the impact of the different weights.   I actually have two Ping Alta Quick shafts for my G430 Max.  When I first had it ordered, the fitter mistakenly specified 45" playing length not the standard 46'" HL shaft.  I asked Ping customer service about it and they sent me a standard 46" (again, great customer service). 

I've have played with both but I'd be interested in seeing what impact the heavier weights had on the feel, trajectory, etc.

Ping G430 Max driver 10.5 degrees with an Alta Quick45 gram senior shaft
Callaway Epic 3 wood, Project X Evenflow Green 45 gram senior shaft  
Callaway GBB Epic Heavenwood, with a Mitsubishi Diamana 50 gram senior shaft
Ping G 20.5 degree 7 wood, with a stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Ping G 26 degree hybrid, stock Alta 65 gram senior shaft
Callaway Paradym X irons, 7-AW with Aldila Ascent Blue 50 graphite shafts
Edison wedges:  50, 55 and 60 degree, KBS Tour Graphite A flex shafts
Putters:  L.A.B. Direct Force 2.1 putter, 34.5" long, 67 degrees lie
 
2022 MGS Tester:  Shot Scope Pro XL+ with H4  
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1 hour ago, Golf2Much said:

I'll be interested in finding out how you do with the higher weights.  I actually emailed Ping customer service this weekend asking about the impact of the different weights.   I actually have two Ping Alta Quick shafts for my G430 Max.  When I first had it ordered, the fitter mistakenly specified 45" playing length not the standard 46'" HL shaft.  I asked Ping customer service about it and they sent me a standard 46" (again, great customer service). 

I've have played with both but I'd be interested in seeing what impact the heavier weights had on the feel, trajectory, etc.

My distance went up when I shortened the shaft and yes I know it shouldnt. I am getting the sweet spot so much at impact which adds distance and my missed sweet spot hits are closer = playable so I can swing away instead of trying to make sure I am in play. might make a decent experiment for you in the future to shorten 1 of those a bit to test, only cost a new grip if you can do it yourself and even if it doesnt work as a daily gamer the shorter shaft might be the ticket when you play a tight course that penalizes you for missing fairways. I am actually thinking about a Ebay special shaft in a similar weight and flex to try at 44 inches.

 Ping 430 Max H/L 10 Degree Geezer Flex

 Ping 425 7 wood Geezer Flex

Ping 425 5H [Not in bag]

TM DHY 4/5

Titlist 5-Gap T300's Geezer Flex

Wedges Cleveland RTX Fullface Zipcore 52 degree and TM Hi Toe 4 56 degree

Putter Scotty Cameron Golo S Center Shafted

Ball Bridgestone BXS , Trying The Maxfli Tour S also

Bag Titlist 15 Cart Bag

 

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1 hour ago, Fred Mitchell said:

My distance went up when I shortened the shaft and yes I know it shouldnt.

If all things are equal then correct it shouldn’t. But if someone isn’t making consistent contact on the sweet spot then there’s a good chance distance goes if a shorter shaft delivers the club better and more consistently.

no different than lighter or heavier shafts. It’s all on how the feel is for the golfer and how that translates into the swing. 
 

Driver: PXG 0811 X+ Proto w/UST Helium 5F4

Wood: TaylorMade M5 5W w/Accra TZ5 +1/2”, TaylorMade Sim 3W w/Aldila rogue white

Hybrid: PXG Gen2 22* w/AD hybrid

Irons: PXG Gen3 0311T w/Nippon modus 120

Wedges: TaylorMade MG2 50*, Tiger grind 56/60

Putter: Scotty Caemeron Super Rat1

Ball: Titleist Prov1

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Here is what I can offer from my perspective, and then you need to do some exploration... go to a fitting, or at least hit a few different clubs.  I am 65 years old.   I play off an 8/9 index.   My driver speed is 88 mph to 93 mph with occasional swings up to 95 or 96.   That give me a carry distance of 210 to 215 and total of 220 - 245 depending on conditions.   My flight is maybe a little lower than optimum.   I have a Skytrak, so I can give you all my numbers.   

I know I hit a 9 or 9.5 (edit:  Reg flex Alta CB slate, 55 gram shaft, standard ).  loft farther than 10 or 10.5 on a normal, dry, Summer day.   Probably 10 to 15 yards difference.   My flight is straight-ish-- a soft fade or a soft draw.  I *can* hit a fade when I want to, and I have been working on hitting a draw more consistently when that drive is called for or advantageous.  

My current driver is a Ping G425 SFT.   I was hitting a Mizuno ST200 and a Srixon ZX7 before that.  Both of those produced a more left-to-right bias than I wanted.  The SFT has been straight or left-of-center  pretty much from the first swing I took with it.   Straight or a small draw unless I make adjustments to hit a fade (or do something wrong). 

Having worked on my driver (distance)  for more than a year now, I can confidently say it's way more about the archer than the arrow.   All the new drivers have forgiveness-- and they all max out at 1.5 allowable smash factor.    Your distance is all about evening out the (upward) angle of attack and presented dynamic loft to minimize spin.   This last week on my launch monitor, I hit these numbers:  234 carry / 260 total distance;  16 degree launch, 2256 backspin, 93 mph swing speed, 137 ball speed, 2 degrees right launch with no sidespin.   Peak height was 81 feet.   It ended 2 yards right of center.    I hit one 258 the next day when I played (55 degrees) (a little downhill landing), and another 252 (essentially flat).   So those numbers from the Sim correlate with outdoor numbers.   

I generally struggle to keep my spin below 3000 -- understanding that at 90 mph, you need *some* spin to keep the ball in the air and maximize carry/distance.   My jump from 225/230 up to 250+ is my closing the clubface (bowing the left wrist... lagging the COG... doing the "motor cycle rev" move with my left hand as some instructors suggest.   The 500-600 less rpms  equates to more distance and more roll.   Note the Skytrak is set to firm fairways at the moment -- although the courses in Ohio are nowhere near firm this time of year.   But, I was doing all my testing with that setting since August (when I broke the $300 shaft on my Srixon ZX7 and had to find a new driver--sigh). 

Good luck in your quest.  

Edited by saz0418
Included Shaft details

----------

PIng G410, 10.5 set at 9.5/  Cleveland 3+ Hy-wood (18*) / Titleist 915 7w / Callaway XR 4h / Tour Edge HL-4 5h / Mizuno JPX-921 Hot Metal 7i - GW / Tommy Armour 845 CB wedges (52, 56*).   Ping Sigma 2 Fetch Putter.   SkyTrak in the Garage.  

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 Age sixty seven and have lost some distance over the years as most senior golfers have.

August 2, 2023 bought a TaylorMade Stealth 2 HD 10.5 degree regular-flex driver.

Thirty one rounds later can tell you it's the best driver I've ever owned and been playing since a teenager.

I keep a golf diary and this is my entry after the first round with the new driver: First day with my new TaylorMade driver; think I’m going to like this new club. With the lighter weight of the club, it's easier to get the ball airborne, and am already finding more fairways with more distance.

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