Silver Fawkes Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? fredsharky, Byrnzee, Josh Parker and 1 other 4 Quote Carter the Silver Fox Ping g400 - Driver, 3w, 7w, 4h Mizuno CLK 5H/MP-18 irons Edel wedges and putter Link to comment
DaveP043 Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 Just now, Silver Fawkes said: I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? Simple, I'd hit more greens. To hit 3/4 of the greens from 150-200 requires really solid ball-striking, so the skills involved would impact every other full-swing shot. Better ball-striking means better tee shots, better short irons, everything. Byrnzee, Silver Fawkes, Tom the Golf Nut and 5 others 8 Quote Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment
GolfSpy_APH Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 3 minutes ago, Silver Fawkes said: I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? Give me the 75% ... I can still miss a lot of 6 footers Silver Fawkes, Rob Person, vandyland and 2 others 4 1 Quote as of Oct 5, 2024 (Past WITB) Driver: GT2 with Graphite Design AD CQ - check out the Driver Shootout! Wood: GT2 with Graphite Design AD CQ shaft (still love my Cobra F7's) Irons: T Series - T200 5 Iron T150 6-9 Iron Wedge: Toura Golf - A Spec 53,57 or SM10 45,49,53,57 degree wedges Putter: LINK! Full putter shootout incoming Balls: Vice Pro Plus Drip (Blue/Orange) Golf Bag: Ghost Anyday 5.0 Golf bag - Maverick colorway with MGS Logo Other: Vortex Anarch Rangefinder, searching for electric cart, Red Rooster The Root Glove and more Link to comment
Josh Parker Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 36 minutes ago, Silver Fawkes said: I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? GIR 100% I love my short game and feel confident in just about every shot. But... if I hit more greens I wouldn't have to worry about that as much. Silver Fawkes and TJ Hall 2 Quote Titleist GT3 11* Tensei 1k blue Titleist TSR2 4w 16* Titleist TSR2 5w 18.75* MKII ZX 5's (4-6) w/ KBS Tour V MKII ZX 7's (7-PW) w/ KBS Tour V Vokey SM9 Wedges 50* 54* 58* DF2.1 Putter Link to comment
Silver Fawkes Posted December 15, 2023 Author Share Posted December 15, 2023 Agreed with both of you guys. I mean look at where Scotty is getting strokes gained... It ain't around the green. Billy Bob and Tom the Golf Nut 2 Quote Carter the Silver Fox Ping g400 - Driver, 3w, 7w, 4h Mizuno CLK 5H/MP-18 irons Edel wedges and putter Link to comment
Middler Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 (edited) I'd love to be 75% GIR (instead of 50% for 5 years running...). That would definitely lower my scoring. Edited December 15, 2023 by Middler Silver Fawkes and TJ Hall 2 Quote Titleist TSR2 11° HZRDUS Red CB 50 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Titleist TSR2 16.5º HZRDUS Red 60 CB 6.0 & TSR2 21º HZRDUS Black 4G 70 6.0 w Lamkin UTx Midsize Mizuno JPX923 HMP 4-GW, T22 54.12WS, T22 58.04DC w Lamkin ST+2 Hybrid Midsize LAB DF3 w Accra Maxfli Tour & ProV1 Ping Pioneer - MGI Zip Navigator AT Payntr X 001 F (mesh), Payntr X 005 F, Ecco Biom C4 Link to comment
aguybadatgolf Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 (edited) One of my favorite podcasts to listen to is The Sweet Spot. They’ve had a few data guys on and if I’m remembering right GIR is one of the most important stats for strokes gained. I’m an ok putter (2 putts a hole was my average this year) so that’s essentially a par 75% of the time which I’d take every day of the week. Edited December 15, 2023 by aguybadatgolf Dweed, ZJeb67 and Silver Fawkes 3 Quote Tester Opportunities 2024 Ping S159 Wedges 2023 Zebra AIT3 Putter The Bag Driver - Paradym Ai Smoke MAX Driver with Project X Denali - 6.5 3W - Paradym 15° with Kai'li™ White - X 3H - Gen5 0311 19° with Ventus Blue Velocore - X Driving Iron - 699 Pro 20° with UST PROFORCE V2 Hybrid White/Yellow - X Irons - 6-PW 699 Pro in black with Dynamic Gold X100 Wedges - S159 50, 54, 58 Dynamic Gold X100 (TESTER) Putter - KING 3D Printed Agera Armlock Putter , Zebra AIT 3 (On time out) Ball - Z-Star XV or Pro Plus Tester for 2024 Ping S159 Wedges 2023 Zebra AIT3 Putter Link to comment
LinksgolfFever Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 My personal challenge for next year is to hit at least 50% on the GIR stat. I've got 100 rounds in this year and this is where/how I can most improve my overall score. Par 4 GIR and ultimately scoring average(4.61) is where I am getting penalized the most. The majority of the courses I play have between 9-12 par 4's (50-60%), improving that I should be able to shave 3-4 strokes a round. I have averaged 1.7 putts per hole this year and a decent up and down rate but getting my GIR to at least 9/18 will/should get me in the 70's more consistently. I LOVE DATA.... Silver Fawkes 1 Quote B_LinksGolf "Any day golfing is better than a day in the office" What's in the Bag: Driver: Callaway Rogue ST 3diamond LS: Tensei raw blue 65g stiff 3w/5w: Callaway Rogue ST LS: Tensei raw blue 65g stiff 4i-6i: Callaway '24 Apex CB/Modus 3 130 X-stiff 7i-10i: Callaway '24 Apex MB/Modus 3 130 X-stiff Wedges: Callaway Jaws Raw (matte black) 50ºs-grind/54ºs-grind/58ºz-grind Putter: Callaway AI-one Jailbird mini DB 35" Link to comment
Parshooter36 Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 I was going to try and play devil's advocate and say that the increased greens in regulation would lead to more 3 putts, then I looked at my Garmin data. At my home course my lowest GIR % hole was 9% with 1.4 putts, while my highest GIR % hole was 70% with 1.7 putts. I don't know if that means I'm a good putter or a bad chipper. Either way, I will have to take the 75% GIR as I'm only averaging 44% right now. Silver Fawkes 1 Quote Driver: QI10 Max Fairway: Sim2 Max 3HL Fairway: G425 Max 9 Wood Hybrid: 2020 CLK 5 Hybrid Irons: Zipcore XL 6-PW Wedges: CBX Zipcore 46° 50° 54° & 58° Putter: Mustang Battle Ready Ball: Q-Star Tour Yellow Link to comment
DaveP043 Posted December 15, 2023 Share Posted December 15, 2023 35 minutes ago, Parshooter36 said: I was going to try and play devil's advocate and say that the increased greens in regulation would lead to more 3 putts, then I looked at my Garmin data. At my home course my lowest GIR % hole was 9% with 1.4 putts, while my highest GIR % hole was 70% with 1.7 putts. I don't know if that means I'm a good putter or a bad chipper. Either way, I will have to take the 75% GIR as I'm only averaging 44% right now. Oh, I think that increasing GIR probably WOJULD lead to more 3 -putts. A simple way of thinking is to say you turn some number of chip shots into putts from a slightly closer distance. And sure, you'll 3-putt occasionally from 40 or 50 feet. But you'll 2-putt a LOT more often than you'd be successful getting up and down from off the green. 50-foot putt versus 55-foot chip? I'll take the putt every time. cnosil and sirchunksalot 2 Quote Irons Titleist T200, AMT Red stiff Rogue SubZero, GD YS-Six X T22 54 and 58 wedges 7-wood 5-wood B60 G5i putter Right handed Reston, Virginia Link to comment
cnosil Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 I concur with most everyone else. give me the GIR. Dweed, sirchunksalot and Silver Fawkes 3 Quote Driver: G400 Max 9* w/ KBS Tour Driven Fairway: Paradym AI Smoke Max HL 16.5* w/MCA TENSEI AV Series Blue Hybrids: 915H 21* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype 915H 24* w/KBS Tour Graphite Hybrid Prototype Irons: TR20V 6-11 w/Vizard TR20-85 Graphite Wedge: 54/12D, 60/8M w/Accra iWedge 90 Graphite Putter: Render w/VA Composites Baddazz Backup Putters: Sacks Parente MC 3 Stripe, Milled Collection RSX 2 Member: MGS Hitsquad since 2017 Link to comment
ParFore74x Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 I’m also on board with the GIR. Rounds where I am hitting more greens are the ones that I enjoy the most. sirchunksalot 1 Quote TSi3 10° w/ Mitsubishi Tensei 1K Black 65g TS2 15° 3W w/ Project X HZRDUS Smoke Black 6.0 70g 818 H1 21° Hybrid w/ Mitsubishi Tensei CK Blue 70g MP-18 MMC 2 iron w/ KBS Tour C-Taper S 120g JPX 921 HM 5-GW w/ Project X LZ 5.5 115g JB Forged 54° & 58° w/ Project X LZ 6.0 120g EV5.3 Black Official Tester Review Nitron push cart Unofficial review Link to comment
RoverRick Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 (edited) Speaking from personal experience, a weak long game and a strong short game will have me hovering in the low 80’s score-wise. A weak short game and a strong long game will get me in the high 70’s. It takes both to shoot in the low 70’s. And I’m sure we all know what happens when both are weak. We buy new clubs. Edited December 16, 2023 by RoverRick Girldad18, Dweed, fredsharky and 3 others 4 1 1 Quote A.I. Smoke TD 9° on T P T POWER 18 Hi Driver G430 Max 15° on T P T POWER 18 Hi Fairway iCrossover 3i on T P T POWER 18 Hi Hybrid iCrossover 4i on Graphite Design ADDI 7S i525 5-U on TGI 90 S SM9 54° & 58° on Wedge DF2.1 on White LINK1on T P T Putter (on order) ProV1 Precision Pro NX7 Pro All Iron grips are BestGrips Micro-Perforated Mid Link to comment
Tom the Golf Nut Posted December 16, 2023 Share Posted December 16, 2023 I’ll take the GIR any day. Especially when you are hitting into greens like mine. They are all on the (very) small side. Bunker in the front and in the back with 12 yards of green to land on. sirchunksalot and Silver Fawkes 2 Quote Driver, TSi 1 S Flex 3 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 7 Wood, Aerojet Max UST Helium Nanocore R Flex 5 Hybrid King Tec MMT R Flex Irons, Vice VGI01 Mitsubishi Wiz 60-gram regular flex (6 - PW) VGW01, 50 Degree. Mitsubishi Wiz 60-gram regular flex, Wedges, Snakebite KBS Hi- Rev2.0 54* & 60* Putter, Sacks Parente Drac Center Shafted 35" Ultralight 14-way Cart Bag Link to comment
BMart519 Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 I have 8 approach shots from 150-200 per round with 30% GIR according to Shot Scope. So option #1 takes me from 2.4 GIR to 6 GIR for an increase of 3.6 GIR/round from 150-200. My up/down overall average was 24%, 3 putt% was 14% ... Applying both of those would have me saving about 2.3 shots per round. 7.7 shots/round under 25 yards with average proximity of 15ft and 35% up/down rate. Assuming 6ft proximity results in 50% up and down, that is only saving 1 shot/round. Actual savings would be less as the 7.7 shots under 25 yards would shrink to around 5.7 with the higher GIR. BONUS: I could also justify playing longer tees to have more approaches from 150-200. Which would reduce my index over time on top of saving the 2.3 shots/round above. Quote G425 MAX Driver & 5W Baffler Rail-H 3H-4H 699 Pro Utility V2 - 4i APEX CF19 6-AW INDI Wedges 52, 56, 60 EAS 2.0 Link to comment
Girldad18 Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 On 12/15/2023 at 10:28 AM, Silver Fawkes said: I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? From 150-200 yards I would definitely take the 75% of GIR. That is an awesome stat to carry. To get technical though, if you were to hit more greens, putting stats would probably rise. Of course we are not guaranteed all 6 footers either. I can tell you this though. In college, I was not a very good ball striker. If I hit 9 greens a round that was a solid day for me. But I would shoot around par or better. Because I could get up and down from anywhere. And it wasn't just pitching/chipping but also putting. We did putting drills for hours and I would chip and pitch shots for hours. It was freeing to know you could pretty much hit it anywhere and salvage a good score. I do agree with Daly though, working on your short game definitely helps with scoring. How many strokes do you take from 25yards and in vs approach shots? But I would love to hit 75% of all of my GIR. That would make all of us better. Quote Matt Dura Francis Marion University Hall of Fame 2018 TS4 9.5*, HZRDUS Smoke 60g Low spin driver; PRO V1X M3 17*HL turned down to 15*, Mitsubishi TENSEI CK Series 65 Stiff Ben Hogan 17* & 21* EDGE CFT Hybrids i200 blue dot, KBS Tour 120 S 4i-PW; Glide 58*/10 50* RTX 588; 54* CG10 APA Model 1 X1 Link to comment
vandyland Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) Caveat: From the tees I play, I don't have that many shots from 150-200 except on the par 3s. Most par 4s I have 70-135 yds for GIR and the Par 5s I always have 200+. There are maybe 1-2 par 4s where this comes in handy unless I hit an atrocious tee shot. I will be the odd man out and think about this differently. If I look at my last round I had 150-200 yds left into a green on the following holes: Hole 2 Par 3 193 yds: I hit the green and had a 10 foot putt. Hole 5 Par 3 161 yds: I missed the green right. Hole 11 Par 3 153 yds: Hit the green and had a 14 foot putt. Hole 16 Par 3 158 yds: Hit the green and had a 30 footer Hole 18 Par 4 157 yds: Hit the green and had a 25 footer. So I was 83% on my own ball from 150-200 on GIR so this 75% thing would not have helped me. As for the scrambling, if that includes bunkers I am taking the 25 yds to 6 ft (assuming that is the MAX I could be out by, I assume I could hit it closer on some occasions?). This is where I lose so many shots. Hole 1 - missed the green right, into a greenside bunker from 141 yds. Went bunker to other greenside bunker. Finally got out of second bunker and missed putt from 8 ft. Double bogey 6 from the middle of the fwy. Hole 3 - missed the green right from 224 yds, had a 20 yd pitch, put it to 5 feet and made the putt. (Par 5) Hole 4 - missed the green into greenside bunker from 133 yds, put bunker shot to 8 ft, missed the putt. Bogey Hole 9 - missed the green long, had 12 yd pitch shot put it to 7 ft and did not make the putt. Bogey. Hole 12 - missed the green into greenside bunker from 220 yds. Hit bunker shot to 20 ft, missed the putt. Par (Par 5) Hole 17 - missed the green long and had 20 yd pitch shot, put pitch shot to 11 ft, missed the putt. Par (Par 5) So, for me and my game, we have incredibly deep and soft bunkers with fast greens so getting up and down out of greenside bunkers has been very challenging for me. The greens are on the large-ish side so hitting them from 150-200 seems to be about the same level of difficulty, for me, as hitting them from 120-130 yds. And just being on the green could still be a 45-60 ft putt which I would be lucky sometimes to get down in 2 from there. Edited January 5 by vandyland fredsharky 1 Quote STZ 230 9.5* / Pro Fli-Hi 21* MALTBY TS1-IM 5-GW Equalizer II 54* / Carnoustie 60* L.A.B. Directed Force 2.1 HackMotion Official Review -- Link to comment
fredsharky Posted January 5 Share Posted January 5 (edited) On 12/15/2023 at 10:28 AM, Silver Fawkes said: I saw a tweet today with an interview from ol' John Daly talking about how everyone needs to concentrate on short game, etc. This cracks me up because it's always great ball strikers giving this advice. So it made me really think about whether I would have an elite short game or an elite approach game. And so I ask.... Would you rather hit 75% of GIR from between 150-200 yards or hit every shot inside of 25 yards within 6ft? Well I want to say GIR because I have a really good short game - not every 25 yd shot and in at 6ft good though My GIR right now is at 43% (pretty much the same yardage 190-145) So to me I need more data points really for the GIR one, like how big are the greens - if super large then that is something to consider as well as speed of greens. Or is this just every course all the time no matter what what. I know my 20-40yd distance to pin on average is12.6ft and far from the hole I am 1.68 putts but if I am just on the green and 25ft away every time my putts go up to 2.21 My 5ft putting is 1.23 x 18 = 22.14 putts per round so 6ft may be a just a smidge higher - after going back and looking at my numbers it is not 1.23 but 1.43 x 18 = 25.74, but I am still in the 25yd and 6ft camp My normal putts per round right now is 30, equals out to 1.66 per hole now So for me getting 6ft and in every time from 25 yds out would be huge - I mean I could layup on almost every hole to 25yds and in and make par or better most of the time So I guess I would have to take the 6ft and in putts every - Although I do reserve the right to change my answer once I calculate more data Very interesting thought here though - I love data stuff like this, gives me something else to track now Edited January 5 by fredsharky I had some wrong information and calculations vandyland 1 Quote Driver 1: Stealth 12 degree-Ventus Red 5-S Driver 2: 300 Mini-Hzrdus Smoke Yellow 60G Stiff (tipped to 44.5inch) 3 Wood 2: Sim2 Max-Fujikura Pro 65-S (higher ball flight) 5 Wood: Stealth-Ventus Black 6-S 9 Wood: Stealth-Ventus Red 5-R Irons: King Tour 2023-Fujikura Pro 95 Stiff - 6-9 - Fitted Wedges: SM9-45-10F Wedges: RTX 6 Tour Rack-48-Mid/10 Wedges: RTX 6-52-Mid/10, 58-Mid/10 Putter: HB SOFT Milled 10.5S-Fitted Balls - X1 Link to comment
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