Biggest Effect on Handicap - Time

[deattle]

This may be a controversial post but I would like to pose the question - Is the greatest way to approve your handicap is taking your time?

I have been playing golf since I was an early teenager (I am 47 now), it seems like since the spike in the interest of golf which seems to have started with Covid, courses have been more aggressive with pace of play. This is understandable as golf courses now fill up tee times a lot faster and the demand for play has increased. 

For the last 4 years the push by courses and rangers, some with the expectation of a sub 4 hr round, has seemed to become a lot more prevalent. It could just be my experience so please let me know if you are experiencing the same.

Recently I was able to play a round on my own which allowed me the opportunity to take more time on my shots both on and off the green. I didn't rush any shot, took my time to read both putts and chips, thought about the best play. My handicap hovers between 5 and 6, with most my rounds landing somewhere in the high 70's and sometimes (more often than I would like) creeping into the 80's. This round took me about 4.5 hours with really no waiting on groups, and no groups behind me pushing me. I ended up shooting a +1 73 on a pretty difficult course. Both my greens in regulations and number of putts were really the key, scoring a career high in both (well as long as I have been tracking). 

Don't get a twisted, I am subject to frustration at slow play as much as the next person, and I understand the number of strokes does make a huge different, as if a 15+ handicap playing this way may have a much longer round. Also being a lower handicap gets you opportunity of playing with more time, especially if you are longer in general. 

However the question remains, is having more time for round, the biggest impact to your handicap especially if you already have clubs fitted to you?

[RickyBobby_PR]

I guess in some way it depends on what you consider taking your time means.

Each person is different. I am a fast player and have a low handicap. Most of the sub 10 caps I play with are fast players. We are assessing everything as we are driving to our balls and by time we get there we have an idea about what the lie/stance is, where the pin is, what’s in front of us and an idea about distance. Once at the ball it’s a final few checks, whatever ones preshot routine is and then hit the ball.

I used to play with a couple guys that I would consider as people who “take their time” and they never improved their game or played better as a result 

 

[Eltrain41]

Good question/topic here. I feel like I'm not slow but certainly not fast. On the greens I always read from the other end of the green and typically a quick look at the side, to gauge speed primarily. I try to do this while others are getting ready to putt to speed up my turn of course. But this is more than most average golfers do. And then on the fairways it just takes an extra 5-10 seconds to scope the flag and put back my scope so these things might add a little time but not much. I agree w/ you and do play better when I slow things down and really invest in each shot. But I try to be aware of pace of play both within my group and behind us too. 

[Nick_D]

I am definitely on the faster side of pace of play, but when I'm playing with a slower group and we have people waiting behind us I always feel rushed and make more mistakes. I'm sure the group behind doesn't mind as much as I think they do, but in that regard I would agree with your point. 

[deattle]

I am definitely on the faster side of pace of play, but when I'm playing with a slower group and we have people waiting behind us I always feel rushed and make more mistakes. I'm sure the group behind doesn't mind as much as I think they do, but in that regard I would agree with your point. 

I have that same problem, I don’t know why I think I’m holding up play or that the group behind me even notices. So I rush and make mistakes which probably ultimately takes longer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Rob Person]

I'm probably going to ruffle a few feathers here, but let me get to your original point. There is definitely an uptick on courses being packed out. This can make fast players feel slow, and slow players feel worse. If a recommended pace average of 4h per round, with 10 minute tee times, a group of 4 and a group of 2 are going to play at different paces. Especially when the foursome may be going to different locations for each person's ball. This doesn't take into account the fact that there is a chance that the foursome is may be newer golfers.

So as a newish golfer myself, I feel the urgency to keep from holding up others, but at the same time, I want to ensure that I play the best possible round I can. Im not out there dropping 2 balls, or spending 5 minutes looking for my ball. But I will take the extra few seconds to analyze what my shot entails for the best possible outcome.... for MY game!

And I can tell you in the last year alone I have improved enough where I can do all that faster than I could when I started a couple years ago. But I still want to enjoy my time out on the course.

For those playing sub 3 hour rounds, I bet it took alot of years, and alot of practice to get to that point. But I'm pretty sure everyone started out slow, nervous, and insecure about their game.

But just because you can do that,  it doesn't mean that the ones playing at a normal expected pace should feel hurried or rushed to play their game. Especially on packed out days.

Should a course deny players above a 25hcp the ability to enjoy playing and grow their game because you're a 10 or less hcp?

For me, when I feel rushed, or THINK I'm playing slow,  I make grave errors. I'm not saying you should take your sweet time, but everyone has been a beginner player at some point.

Maybe just blame it on youtube golf entertainment for not just growing the sport, but also creating the stigma that you can go play golf, drink excessively,  do silly stuff on the course.  But most of those guys pay to have a cleared course too. So time is no issue for them.

[RickyBobby_PR]

1 hour ago, Rob Person said:

For those playing sub 3 hour rounds, I bet it took alot of years, and alot of practice to get to that point. But I'm pretty sure everyone started out slow, nervous, and insecure about their game.

Nobody outside of the first few groups on a weekend are going to play sub 3 hour rounds unless the groups in front of them are and they themselves are playing fast. I can tell you as a beginner and playing in a group that had other beginners along with mid to high handicaps there was never an issue with keeping up with groups that were obviously better. 
 

Might just be me but I never felt rushed or hit bad shots because I felt like I was playing slow or needed to keep up. My bad shots were because my bad swing.

Also might be who I had the chance to play with but I learned very early on how to play ready golf and how to be prepared for a shot by time you get to your ball. With the expansion of the game since covid it’s likely a lack of learning etiquette about pace of play and ready golf. This is where the biggest slow down comes from or those who feel like they need to get their moneys worth and taking their sweet time is what backs up courses. I have always played courses that were challenging for both low and high caps and in groups filled mostly with mid to high cap short hitters. When the group has the mindset of being able to keep up with the group in front pace of isn’t an issue. I’m not a fan of high handicap or new beginners being an excuse for slower play.

1 hour ago, Rob Person said:

Should a course deny players above a 25hcp the ability to enjoy playing and grow their game because you're a 10 or less hcp?

I don’t think anyone is saying or promoting this idea. Just that it’s not a reason to be slow.

[Rob Person]

26 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Nobody outside of the first few groups on a weekend are going to play sub 3 hour rounds unless the groups in front of them are and they themselves are playing fast. I can tell you as a beginner and playing in a group that had other beginners along with mid to high handicaps there was never an issue with keeping up with groups that were obviously better. 
 

Might just be me but I never felt rushed or hit bad shots because I felt like I was playing slow or needed to keep up. My bad shots were because my bad swing.

Also might be who I had the chance to play with but I learned very early on how to play ready golf and how to be prepared for a shot by time you get to your ball. With the expansion of the game since covid it’s likely a lack of learning etiquette about pace of play and ready golf. This is where the biggest slow down comes from or those who feel like they need to get their moneys worth and taking their sweet time is what backs up courses. I have always played courses that were challenging for both low and high caps and in groups filled mostly with mid to high cap short hitters. When the group has the mindset of being able to keep up with the group in front pace of isn’t an issue. I’m not a fan of high handicap or new beginners being an excuse for slower play.

I don’t think anyone is saying or promoting this idea. Just that it’s not a reason to be slow.

So, I have mentioned this before in other topics,  but it's not an excuse, it's the reason, for 75% of slow play. Who is educating all the new golfers, when they are all playing together?  For some, golf is not a sport, it's just a recreation session for the boys. (and girls) 

And before MGS, I openly have admitted that I was one of those " hacks"  in fact, I did not know anything about ready golf. I based my learning of the game from watching golf on TV and playing with others who didnt know about or play ready golf, Aka "out to in golf".

So in fact, I can offer a different perception of what pace means beyond what others think it should be for me, and providing insights as to why pace may be affected,  instead of being the frustrated and angry person behind me that seemed to forgot they once were a newb.

[RickyBobby_PR]

2 hours ago, Rob Person said:

So, I have mentioned this before in other topics,  but it's not an excuse, it's the reason, for 75% of slow play.

No the reason for slow play is slow golfers of all skill levels. I know just as many low handicap players that are slow as I do high handicaps. Slow golfers regardless of skill level is the reason.

 

[Rob Person]

6 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

No the reason for slow play is slow golfers of all skill levels. I know just as many low handicap players that are slow as I do high handicaps. Slow golfers regardless of skill level is the reason.

 

Not trying to banter or cause friction, but as part of the discussion,  what would be acceptable pace to you for someone learning how to play, that may hit 4 or 5 shots from Tee to green? What about if they were all new in a foursome.  Just trying to provide some perspective is all.  Do you go up to them and tell them they need to just pick up and go to the next hole?  How do they gain knowledge and experience if nobody has given them any guidance?

[Preeway]

25 minutes ago, Rob Person said:

Not trying to banter or cause friction, but as part of the discussion,  what would be acceptable pace to you for someone learning how to play, that may hit 4 or 5 shots from Tee to green? What about if they were all new in a foursome.  Just trying to provide some perspective is all.  Do you go up to them and tell them they need to just pick up and go to the next hole?  How do they gain knowledge and experience if nobody has given them any guidance?

There is a way to play bad, fast, and still learn. If you have a new golfer then have them drop by everyone’s drive if they top their drive or shank it. Have them drop by the green if they can’t hit their second or third shot cleanly. It isn’t about their score anyway but about learning how to play the game anyway. Not perfect but it can be done. 

[Rob Person]

7 hours ago, Preeway said:

There is a way to play bad, fast, and still learn. If you have a new golfer then have them drop by everyone’s drive if they top their drive or shank it. Have them drop by the green if they can’t hit their second or third shot cleanly. It isn’t about their score anyway but about learning how to play the game anyway. Not perfect but it can be done. 

Thats a good solution,  and works sometimes. From experience,  a coworker who we always starts at scramble rules, eventually will insist he hit his ball separately from the rest of us by the 4th hole. He is one of those who believes he is paying the same money.  We cam educate people all we want, but they have to want to adhere to the guidelines.  We don't play very often together because of it.

[RickyBobby_PR]

8 hours ago, Rob Person said:

Not trying to banter or cause friction, but as part of the discussion,  what would be acceptable pace to you for someone learning how to play, that may hit 4 or 5 shots from Tee to green? What about if they were all new in a foursome.  Just trying to provide some perspective is all.  Do you go up to them and tell them they need to just pick up and go to the next hole?  How do they gain knowledge and experience if nobody has given them any guidance?

I’ve been there as the new guy. My buddy who got me into the game was also new having only played a few times as a kid with his dad. We topped shots, took 10s on a lot of holes. We played with guys every Saturday who wrangled from low handicaps to high handicaps like us.

So yes even taking 4-5 shots to get to the green, another 3-4 around the green can still be played fast and not cause a pace of play issue. Our group was never behind the group in front of us. 
 

Sure there are rounds where a bad hole happens for several people and you get behind the group in front. It’s happened playing with three other 10 and below handicaps where a lost ball or something caused a small delay. But even as a high handicap it’s not hard to catch back up.

And again I’ve seen guys shoot even par that played slower than the guy shooting high 90a in the same group.

Ive been around this game for nearly 30 years and have played with all types of golfers in random pairings to close friends. In scrambles with lots of alcohol consumed to no alcohol at all. Easy mini courses to hard courses that are used for high level competitions including US open qualifying. Its the attitude, approach, self awareness or whatever you want to call it of the golfer and not the skillset.

Read the tour threads and people complaining about slow play on the tour. Those guys are shooting low scores and are slow

[Preeway]

1 hour ago, Rob Person said:

Thats a good solution,  and works sometimes. From experience,  a coworker who we always starts at scramble rules, eventually will insist he hit his ball separately from the rest of us by the 4th hole. He is one of those who believes he is paying the same money.  We cam educate people all we want, but they have to want to adhere to the guidelines.  We don't play very often together because of it.

I get it. One of our regular group members still averages around 100-110 but his first year he couldn’t break 120 and it took him a while to get comfortable just dropping ahead after a couple bad shots. It also led to fewer lost balls as well, lol. 

[Haile]

So, I am one of the covid golfers that you speak of. I didn't pick up the game until then. But, to me, people waiting and things getting bunched up is a majority of a course problem. I have seen golfers who were crazy slow. And I think that's just kind of rude. In my opinion, for 4 average golfers to take 4 hours to complete a round, is standard pace. Just doing the math, that's just over 13 minutes a hole. Some holes will be faster and some slower, but the average is there. So, taking that into account, why would you book someone 10 minutes behind me? I've seen even less time between starts which is crazy to me. I've let more than my share of singles or doubles play through and I've had plenty of people let me go ahead if I'm by myself. I play much faster when it's just me. As far as having an effect on handicap, I think that comes down to the individual playing. How well do you deal with pressure during a round? It's any situation whether it's a tight shot or must carry or whatever. If you don't deal with that well, the chances of making a mistake go up. I'm either going to make the shot or I'm not. Anything more than about 30 seconds with it and I start going down mental rabbit holes and freeze. I understand wanting to take your time and that's fine. Especially if you're going at it with a decent pace. I play best when I'm relaxed and not thinking much about it. I could be way off, but I don't think you're talking about time in general. I think what you're talking about is relaxed play with a sprinkle of plenty of confidence because you've assessed the situation and made a definitive decision. I find when I can do that, I can pull off some great shots and ridiculous putts. I'd never make it as a pro though. If I'm feeling uneasy about something or pressure about things, there's about a 75% chance I'm going to screw it up. But I'm not good enough to rely on muscle memory or habits like them either. 

[PrismFlopper]

Too much time can start to frustrate me, granted not to the point I’m hitting into groups or starting fights but getting annoyed mostly. This weekend I played with two friends and they are newer but play quickly, I hit long and the frustrating part was I played a par 4 front 9 and if I really hit the driver almost all of the greens are in striking distance so we spent a lot of time where my two friends would hit their tee shots and then I’d have to sit around waiting for the group in front to putt and get off the green. They were taking 4-5 just to get to the green and then taking their time putting. This has become standard with times between groups dropping and more people playing. 
if I play by myself it’s usually during the week and I don’t run into much course traffic so I can just cruise through the course. 
I noticed that when I’m sitting around for too long I start to get frustrated and that can sometimes effect my game in that i play faster and maybe don’t take the extra second to make the correct club choice and try to just hit what I have in my hand. Or Ik I don’t have the ball in’s the best placement and I try to make up for it with my swing and that never works out correctly.

[sglj3]

Personally, I find pace of play and its affect on scoring to be an individual one. I am presently hold a 13.5 index but I think mainly due to overthinking and just simple mistakes.

For example, last summer I played 18 holes in 1 1/2 hours - empty course it was 105*, using a cart and shot an 81. Last week my son and I played 18 and the squeezed in an additional 9 holes. We played the last 9 in just 35 minutes, yes lots of running but I shot a 41.

So for me when I play quick I think I get less in my head and don't dwell on mistakes but am just thinking about the shot as I approach it and hit.

[Rob Person]

8 hours ago, sglj3 said:

Personally, I find pace of play and its affect on scoring to be an individual one. I am presently hold a 13.5 index but I think mainly due to overthinking and just simple mistakes.

For example, last summer I played 18 holes in 1 1/2 hours - empty course it was 105*, using a cart and shot an 81. Last week my son and I played 18 and the squeezed in an additional 9 holes. We played the last 9 in just 35 minutes, yes lots of running but I shot a 41.

So for me when I play quick I think I get less in my head and don't dwell on mistakes but am just thinking about the shot as I approach it and hit.

Whoa! That's fast!!!

[Subdiver1]

@deattle et al. I was looking for a spot to post this ... rant(?) with a subject along the lines of "biggest pet peeves" or "problematic trend" or something like that, and stumbled across your topic. It is a great discussion.

IMO, taking your time and slow play are mutually exclusive practices. Ther is an old saying in our community, "Slow is smooth, smooth is fast." I believe it applies here, subject and discussion. As @RickyBobby_PR noted, (paraphrase) players can be methodical and focused without being slow. When I can get into a rhythm is when I have my best rounds, and I hear similar feedback from others, low and higher handicap alike. Think about that rounsd that is going well, until you get stuck standing in a par 3, or par 5, tee for 15 minutes, and your day goes to . Probably one of the most poignant examples of poor, slow play I can give would be, the guy/gal who waits by everyone else on the left side of the fairway to hit their shots, then walks over to their ball on the right side, in the trees and starts deciding how to play the shot, or the group of clowns who all stand around waiting for every individual to assess and make thier putt before assessing thier own putt, and the guy who has to mark and adjust EVERY frickin putt outside 1/2".  

Finding a rhythm will help your game. Being able to stay in that rhythm also helps.

The other side of slow play, the example I experienced yesterday,  also includes poor etiquette.  E.g when a 2-some is walking off the tee and there are two additional 2-somes (not already a 4-some) waiting and more folks (me) finishing up on the last green; in a case like this, you (the piling up groups) NEED TO BE pairing up. Additionally, when play is THAT FRICKIN SLOW and we get to the green and find more ball marks the a Gore-Bush era punch ballot, that is not just slow play, that is people who do not understand golf and have no respect for the game or others. Unfortunately, no matter how methodical you might be, that slow play will hurt your game and everyone else's.

I read the comments about Rangers or Marshalls moving players along or rushing groups; I don't see it many places anymore. And I miss having Marshalls who would press the lead group that is slowing the rest of the course. Streamsong staff let our, 128 player group, know that we needed to speed up on day 2, after averaging 5.5 hours day one, or we would be required to skip holes (this was a stroke play tournament mind you); they wanted to see 4.5 hours (the caddy told us that was not going to happen because the course (Black)  average was 5 hours); our round took 5:08, we never heard anything from a Marshall or the pro because every group kept within sight of the group in front of them and the lead groups wasn't "slow" they just rolled along.  Dau 3 was the same, there were a few backups, and our round was just under 5 hours, but it (for as many times we had to search for balls) kept.moving and kept pace with the group in front of us.

I don't mean to hijack your thread/question, just trying to accentuate the point that players can be smooth and methodical, without being slow.  And that having Rangers or Marshals who A. Can make a good assessment of the spurce of the problem, B. Are present on the course, and C. Are willing to press those who are the problem; can help all of us have a better experience on the course.

Just my opinion and experience. Cheers.

[chisag]

On 6/2/2024 at 7:13 AM, Rob Person said:

'm probably going to ruffle a few feathers here, but let me get to your original point. There is definitely an uptick on courses being packed out. This can make fast players feel slow, and slow players feel worse. If a recommended pace average of 4h per round, with 10 minute tee times, a group of 4 and a group of 2 are going to play at different paces. Especially when the foursome may be going to different locations for each person's ball. This doesn't take into account the fact that there is a chance that the foursome is may be newer golfers.

 

... Rob, respectfully the golf course isn't where you work on your game. There are Executive courses, Ranges and Par 3 courses. You can play 9 or more late in the day. I see so many either beginners or just poor golfers take 3 or more practice swings, freeze over the ball forever, hit a poor shot and then stand there taking several more practice swings. Take look at your shot, line it up, take one practice swing and then hit your shot. This is the thing I see many beginners struggle with. How can they not take multiple practice swings if they just topped a ball 20 feet with a bad swing? Again, they are either not ready for a real golf course or they need to just pick up and move forward IF they are holding up play. 

... I certainly remember starting out and struggling, well aware of my slow play comparatively and yes it added tension as I didn't wanna hold anyone up. There is just so much to learn about the game and our selves. The thing some never understand is it isn't playing slow that can be a killer for the group behind you, it is how you play slow.  Bad tee shot, topped second shot, sliced 3rd shot into some bushes can slow things down but if you are getting to your ball and playing ready golf it is easy to deal with since it doesn't happen every hole. But 4 folks pushing their carts to the same ball instead of going to their own or riding in carts and not dropping one guy off and going to your ball but waiting for them to hit their shot can be frustrating to watch if they are behind the group in front of them. 

... And as always right brain left brain plays a role. As a 100% right brain individual, I am not a fan of methodical in anything and certainly not golf. Once I know the wind is a little left to right and it is 147 to clear the bunker and 161 to the pin I don't know what other information I need. 8 iron covers my carry while a 7 iron takes my just past the pin. Depending on how I am swinging that day the choice is almost instantaneous. Yet I see some stand there, toss up some grass and holding two clubs address with one, then address with the other (really?) stand their evidently being methodical and going over what in their heads? I honestly don't know. 

... I'll end with this. As an instructor and as someone that played 4 to 5 times a week and gets paired up with lots of strangers within reason the faster you play the better you play. I am not talking about rushing, just limiting your thoughts and playing golf, not golf swing. Golf is very difficult but it isn't very complicated, look at your yardage, pick a club and hit the ball with your best swing on that given day. 

[bens197]

I’ll begin by stating the obvious: The epidemic of slow play is a product of several factors:

• Tee times spaced too closely
• Too many new golfers who do not understand pace of play…moving in herds from ball to ball 
• Too many golfers who are ignorant to their own slow play 

If the course is open and you’re solo, play slow. Thats fine. Hit two balls. I really don’t mind. I do this when I have space. 

I do not disagree that the course is a great place to work on your game, however not at the expense of others playing behind you. 

Entitlement within golf is a real thing.  Anyone who’s ever worked in golf will tell you that confronting offenders is always painful.  “How dare you confront me with this…” I cannot begin to tell you how often I was blamed for stating the obvious.  

Anyone who works as a ranger and properly manages pace has my full respect  

 

[bens197]

On 5/31/2024 at 11:58 AM, deattle said:

However the question remains, is having more time for round, the biggest impact to your handicap especially if you already have clubs fitted to you?

If you’re practicing with purpose. Absolutely the answer is yes. 
 

 

[chisag]

10 minutes ago, bens197 said:

If the course is open and you’re solo, play slow. Thats fine. Hit two balls. I really don’t mind. I do this when I have space. 

I do not disagree that the course is a great place to work on your game, however not at the expense of others playing behind you. 

 

... Amen amigo. I love going out late or as a solo when struggling with my swing and hitting multiple shots. And you hit the nail on the head with "not at the expense of others playing behind you." which covers almost every slow play scenario. Sometimes when I go out late, a fast rider shows up in a cart behind me and I always immediately wave them through. I am working on things and not playing golf so a few extra minutes to let someone coming to the course after work or before picking their kids up and looking to get in a speedy round takes precedent over my practicing every time. 

[ctg44]

Slow play in front of me is ABSOLUTELY the biggest detriment to my handicap.  When I walk and have the course to myself, I shoot my lowest scores because I can get focused on only the task at hand - hitting good shots, and not get distracted by the a** hats in the 5-some the pro shouldn't have let on the course but probably took a handout to ignore taking 10 minutes standing around on every green gambling on which one of them is going to take 3 putts to get into the hole from inside of 10' out (spoiler alert:  IT WILL BE ALL OF THEM).  No, I'm not hostile about slow play or anything....

 

The problem at our club is that when a fast 2-some (i.e. my wife and I on foot or my son and I on a cart....he refuses to walk anymore after 5 years of JHS / HS golf) comes up behind these jackwagons in the 5-somes, these entitled brats are such snobs that they absolutely will not EVER let you play through, and they've got such easily bruised little tiny egos that if you ask to play through, they throw an absolute fit about it, even if there's an entire hole open in front of them.

So, yeah, it's probably just as much something I need to get over and make this an opportunity to practice when the idiot crews are out in force and won't let us play through, but it's hard when you're trying to fit in a whole round in a tight timeframe on a busy day and have to watch the guys who failed out of the clown college playing golf in front of you at the slowest pace possible.

[Rob Person]

13 hours ago, chisag said:

 

... Rob, respectfully the golf course isn't where you work on your game. There are Executive courses, Ranges and Par 3 courses. You can play 9 or more late in the day. I see so many either beginners or just poor golfers take 3 or more practice swings, freeze over the ball forever, hit a poor shot and then stand there taking several more practice swings. Take look at your shot, line it up, take one practice swing and then hit your shot. This is the thing I see many beginners struggle with. How can they not take multiple practice swings if they just topped a ball 20 feet with a bad swing? Again, they are either not ready for a real golf course or they need to just pick up and move forward IF they are holding up play. 

... I certainly remember starting out and struggling, well aware of my slow play comparatively and yes it added tension as I didn't wanna hold anyone up. There is just so much to learn about the game and our selves. The thing some never understand is it isn't playing slow that can be a killer for the group behind you, it is how you play slow.  Bad tee shot, topped second shot, sliced 3rd shot into some bushes can slow things down but if you are getting to your ball and playing ready golf it is easy to deal with since it doesn't happen every hole. But 4 folks pushing their carts to the same ball instead of going to their own or riding in carts and not dropping one guy off and going to your ball but waiting for them to hit their shot can be frustrating to watch if they are behind the group in front of them. 

... And as always right brain left brain plays a role. As a 100% right brain individual, I am not a fan of methodical in anything and certainly not golf. Once I know the wind is a little left to right and it is 147 to clear the bunker and 161 to the pin I don't know what other information I need. 8 iron covers my carry while a 7 iron takes my just past the pin. Depending on how I am swinging that day the choice is almost instantaneous. Yet I see some stand there, toss up some grass and holding two clubs address with one, then address with the other (really?) stand their evidently being methodical and going over what in their heads? I honestly don't know. 

... I'll end with this. As an instructor and as someone that played 4 to 5 times a week and gets paired up with lots of strangers within reason the faster you play the better you play. I am not talking about rushing, just limiting your thoughts and playing golf, not golf swing. Golf is very difficult but it isn't very complicated, look at your yardage, pick a club and hit the ball with your best swing on that given day. 

Not going to disagree with alternative options, when there are some available.  I am the ego death dealer many times during a Marshall shift at the GC.

My perspective is derived from someone who came from the old-school golf processes, because  A. I didn't know any different at the time, and B. I Had Noone to teach me any different. 

And to be honest,  I am the type of person who likes to succeed at whatever I try to do. So I seek out knowledge and don't wait for it to be handed to me.

If I never joined here, I would still probably be the jackhole that this thread is based on, until someone told or showed me differently. In fact, its when I posted the "Out to in,  or Ready golf" topic,  and read all the replies, that my game started to change,  because my mindset changed. 

[Hook DeLoft]

Some people play better at a, shall we say, deliberate pace.  Others play their best when playing quickly.  The OP found he scores better when playing deliberately.  I have sympathy for those who play best when playing quickly.  They so often have to try to change their natural pace to that of the deliberate golfer.  It is rarely the other way around.  You will hear fast players on tour complain about this. 

[vandyland]

Taking lessons and then working on those takeaways from the lessons and just, overall, investing time and $$$ in your game through instruction is why my high handicap friends remain high handicappers. Some of them practice, some don't. Some watch YouTube lesson, some don't. Some are slow and some are fast. Some have fitted clubs some don't. But to a man, none of them have gone to a teaching pro, consistently, and given themselves a 6-9 month timeframe to rework their swing/fundamentals/etc. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

2 hours ago, vandyland said:

But to a man, none of them have gone to a teaching pro, consistently, and given themselves a 6-9 month timeframe to rework their swing/fundamentals/etc. 

unfortunately that is something that plagues a large number of golfers. The slow boat to China. Chasing feels then having to chase new ones because the ones they were working on they can’t replicate or they change rather than working on improving the correct motor patterns found in good swings.

Incorrectly self diagnosing swing issues and working on the wrong moves and making things worse or engrain a different bad pattern.

See it all across the internet and at local ranges.