edingc
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Posts posted by edingc
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45 minutes ago, yungkory said:
I had no idea they were milled, I thought I read somewhere that it was an insert. That makes me feel a lot better about blindly ordering one after never feeling it in the hands.
I'll try to grab a picture of the face tomorrow on the green. It's supposed to be partly sunny so good photo taking weather, hopefully.
I just rolled a handful with the Spider X and I'd say the insert on the Spider X much be just a touch bit more "soft" feeling. The sound is definitely more consistent and muted from heel-to-toe than the DF 2.1. As I mentioned earlier, the further from center you get with the L.A.B. you get a louder, more ping-y sound.
@dlow206 - You have a much more extensive collection of putters than I do. Anything to add regarding sound and feel vs. an insert or other milled putter?
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1 hour ago, yungkory said:
The face insert is probably the thing I am most hesitant about when it comes to forking over the cash for one of these. Is it any firmer/softer than the Spider X @edingc?
No insert on the L.A.B., just horizontally milled lines on the aluminum face.
I've noticed the feel changes a bit if not struck out of the middle. With the BGT Stability Tour a nicely centered hit is very muted, and I perceive that to be soft as well. If you get a little more heel or toe side, you get more of a clang noise and to me the feel is firmer.
Let me roll a few with both putters tonight and get back to you with more thoughts.
- JohnSmalls and yungkory
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1 hour ago, dlow206 said:
Ok, figured out the pulls issue i was having. (Sorry @edingc, i know this is your thread, but didn't want to leave my comment about pulling the ball with this putter out there now that I figured out why).
So the key is (at least for me), is letting the putter do what it wants to do. The misnomer I have had is about what it means to "stay square". The putter wants to "stay square", but they key here is stay square to what. Its not square to the target, its square to the arc of your stroke.
I can decently putt (maybe not optimally) with all different types of putters, from face balanced to putters with a lot of toe hang. With a face balanced putter, my stroke is more straight back straight through with just a bit of arc to it. With a putter with more toe hang, my stroke adapts and has more arc to it.
Now, with the DF 2.1, my brain for some reason has some sort of preconception stuck in it that the DF 2.1 movement will be more like a face balanced putter than a putter with more toe hang. Because of that, my brain is causing my arms to move the DF 2.1 like it expects a face balanced putter to move, with minimal arc.
If i take a more relaxed grip with the DF 2.1, and truly let the club move how it wants to move, with my stroke, it actually wants to have more arc than a face balanced putter. For me, the arc looks more like the arc that i have with a toe hang putter, and then it squares back up at impact.
So for me, i need to train my brain not to look at this gigantic mallet-shape and think that it will move like a face balanced mallet. As long as i setup to the ball correctly, i need to let the putter move how it wants to move and trust that it will square up at impact.
This is an open thread for anyone. No need to apologize. I just wanted somewhere to write an actual review (of which more will be coming as I clean up my thoughts and then obviously next season I'll have a lot more use).
I do tend to pull putts if I don't get the face flat. My "comfortable" position isn't optimal with the hands way too low at address, so I have to be really conscious about setup. If I stand nice and tall with nice hand height, I get great results.
Is it possible you're pulling the club inside a bit? From my experimenting on the EXPUTT, I found I deliver the club with an open face and very inside-out if I don't feel like my shoulders are turned left at address. That, combined with dropping my left (forward) foot a bit back, gets my pendulum swinging along the line much more consistently.
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I know @B.Boston was not a huge fan of the SpeedZone hybrid's tendency to go left, but I will say I do enjoy its "anti-right" properties on days like today. The course I played setup really well to that kind of shot shape (lots of bad stuff right, water and roads, namely), and there's a lot to be said about having confidence on the tee box that you can aim a little right and let the natural shot shape work. I played a very windy 27 holes and only pulled driver a few times because I didn't want to risk losing balls right. I gave up some distance, but not a lot.
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7 minutes ago, rbsiedsc said:
@edingc Man, you make me really want to drop a solid on one of these! Great to hear it is working out for you!
Yeah, so that's the line I'm trying to toe a little bit. I understand these things are pricey. I'm sure my improvement isn't just the putter, it's a result of both the putter and practicing. So I'm trying to be mindful when writing these posts because I'd hate for someone to go out and drop the cash on a L.A.B. and be disappointed.
My recommendation if you are interested in purchasing would be to do a remote fitting, and if you have a local dealer, an in-person fitting. See how the specs compare. If you can roll one beforehand that's obviously huge, too. And then you can search eBay or reach out to L.A.B. directly for a factory second for a lot cheaper, unless of course you're ready to drop the full price on a new one.
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I ended up getting out for 27 more "real" holes of golf today before the cold weather sets back in here in Michigan. Unfortunately, my streak of zero three putts is no longer intact, but I still putted out of my mind again today. The last four rounds (the only four with the L.A.B.) have been the best I've putted all season:
(Today's rounds were 31 and 15 total putts, respectively.)
I had two three putts today (opening hole when I left my approach on the bottom tier of the three-tiered green, and a par 3 where I went long of pin but had to putt around a huge punchbowl in the green). I do not think I left myself more than three feet with any other first putt that did not go in. Many putts finished with inches of the hole for gentle tap-ins.
Obviously, getting a new putter has meant I've practiced putting more than usual. However, there is something to the L.A.B. that just seems to make me a better putter? I've never been one to miss "good" with the putter. I used to either hit the putt or miss it by several feet. That all has gone out the window with my drastically improved distance control.
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I lied a few weeks ago when I said I was done playing for the year. Cold weather moves back in tonight, so I thought I'd take advantage of the break to get another 27 holes in. Nice playing in shorts on Nov. 10!
I went back to one of the "new-to-me" courses I played for the Cobra Connect Arccos Caddie challenge. I really enjoyed the course when I went for the first time, and they were on late fall rates at $25 for 18 with cart. They did just recently punch and sand the greens (most others in the area did it over two months ago now), but they rolled pretty true so it wasn't a big issue.
Battled a 15-25 MPH southwest wind all day and am ecstatic with how the season finished up.
Opening 18
- 41/40 = 81 (+10)
- 7/14 FIR
- 6/18 GIR (1 birdie)
- 31 Putts (2 3-putts, 9 2-putts, 7 1-putts)Second 9 (Front)
- 38 (+2)
- 4/7 FIR
- 4/9 GIR
- 15 Putts (6 2-putts, 3 1-putts)Putter was on fire all day, as was the short game. Lots of chip and downs. Took three holes to get going (started bogey-bogey-bogey) without having any range balls beforehand as I haven't hit a ton of balls lately.
Played only one really bad hole all day. Sitting 115 out on No. 6 during my first round, I tried to hit a flighted gap wedge under the wind and ended up pulling it left into the green side bunker, from which I just couldn't get out. Three shots later, I two-putted for a disappointing double. Couple other bad shots here and there, but thankfully recovered pretty well from all of them.
I was able to sneak in another nine and played really well, leaving a couple birdie and par putts literally less than four inches short. A little more gas and I'd have flirted with par or even perhaps one-under.
I mentioned the wind. I hit an absolutely crazy 9 iron from the fairway on one of the par 5s that rode a nice breeze
. Almost hit the layup too far into the pond guarding the green.
- Rickp, sirchunksalot, Kenny B and 6 others
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14 hours ago, ncwoz said:
Played Thornapple Pointe in GR for the first time. With no previous course experience, and a ton of leaves on the course I took it as a practice round. And a beautiful one at that!
I shot a net -1, although it's with a grain of salt because I wasn't holding strict rules with some leaf drops, etc. I lipped out easily the most putts in one round ever, but I made a few solid putts as well. Really happy with my short game progress the last few months. Earlier in the summer I was leaving a ton of makeable putts short, so as frustrating as a ton of lip outs can be I'm happy that I was giving the hole a run.
And thrilled to be golfing in a short sleeve shirt on November 7th!!!
That's a course I have yet to venture out to. Always looks great from the highway.
Any planes flying overhead while you played? I've heard the jets get pretty low since they are landing right next door.
- sirchunksalot, Rickp and GolfSpy_SHARK
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70 degree weather in November. Unreal. I assumed I was finished two weeks ago when it turned rainy and cold, but I couldn't resist the opportunity to get out one more time. A lot of the local courses have already closed for the year, but the "goat track" near me still had their flags in. Called and they said they were closed because their carts had been picked up for the year, but that the course was free to walk.
I also had already cleaned my primary bag, so I grabbed my backup iron set and driving iron and away I went. Way too many leaves, greens hadn't been mowed in a long time, so I immediately just started playing a practice round throwing down a lot of balls. Must have hit 15-20 balls into some greens from various distances, driving iron practice from the tee, etc. Was a nice way to spend 90 minutes on a beautiful afternoon. Lost a good handful of balls in leaves but really don't care (and they were all shag bag quality anyway).
Not sure if my winter workouts are already paying off, but I was a good 1/2-1 club longer than I remember with these irons (Maltby PTMs). I also opened up a can of worms by playing my backup set - they felt really nice and the distance control from the short irons was money. Over the winter I'm going to need to make a decision about what irons to play next year.
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16 hours ago, yungkory said:
I was reading that because of the placement of the shaft, where it's more in the middle than the heel, that you will play your ball further forward because the shaft should be at center
Correct. Once you hold the Press grip it just naturally feels right with ball placement in the middle.
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4 hours ago, yungkory said:
I might be tempted to throw some of my Christmas bonus at one of these, just have some reservations about the online fitting, and leaving the islands isn't going to happen because I don't want to spend 12 hours round-trip in a tin can with other people during the pandemic.
How satisfied are you guys with the online fitting process? I've read everyone's feedback about them but I still don't know if I could ever trick my brain into fully committing to one.
Thanks to some nice weather I've had a lot more time to practice this fall than I originally anticipated. I'd say the remote fitting is pretty good. What it won't do, however, is find your ideal length as they leave it up to you to find something that is of "comfortable length."
Knowing that I have your old Spider at 33", are you planning to stick to that length? I went from 33" to 36", but still grip down a little. I need to be mindful of my setup because I still find myself hunching a lot, but the results are better if I stand a bit more upright.
The in person fitting I did had the adjustable length shaft and that was nice to find out what length was comfortable for me. But you could do the same by rolling a bunch of conventional putters of different lengths.
I'd have obviously been more concerned if the remote fitting had strayed 3-4+ degrees from the in person fitting, but my in person fitting was only ~1 degree different than my remote fitting.
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20 minutes ago, dlow206 said:
I don't feel good about uploading the swing, but will do so, need something to hold myself accountable
Here's the bad iron swing. The turf maintenance folks probably hate me because my swing destroys the turf.
Did you ever end up getting another PlaneMate (or using the one you have)?
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On 10/31/2020 at 1:14 PM, dlow206 said:
After that came the life changing conclusion. He said that my body is aimed way right of the target. He said that the balls that I am hitting right are basically go straight where my body is lined up. He then put an alignment stick down and when I looked at the alignment stick, i was like wow, that looks so far left of the target, but he said it is lined up towards the target and to trust it. After that, I started to hit my irons much more online towards the target.
I have the same issue, especially with the driver. What feels way left of target is actually on target or even still a bit right. I've really had to be more aware of this when setting up my shots.
Sounds like a great lesson!
- sirchunksalot and dlow206
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The weather at lunch has been good enough to at least get out and putt/chip at the practice green for a few minutes over the past couple of days. My golf season is over and the range is closed, but I'm going to continue lunchtime putting practice as long as my hands can take the temperatures.
I've been focusing my time on speed/distance control accounting for uphill/downhill putts. I'm still blown away at how much better my speed/distance control is with the L.A.B. Of course, this is anecdotal since I can't effectively measure speed/distance in an uncontrolled environment, but I've seen similar results both indoors on my EXPUTT and outdoors on the practice green and on course.
That got me thinking today exactly why this might be the case. Some thoughts I've had:
- As I've mentioned before, the lie-angle balancing makes the DF 2.1 extremely easy to swing. There is no need to have much, if any, grip pressure to maintain the face angle throughout the swing. Taking a nice, relaxed grip with no thumb pressure helps me be smooth throughout the backstroke and forward swing. When my grip tenses up I tend to "hit" at the ball.
- The DF 2.1 head is massive. That allows me to putt with a lot of confidence because the face is so large and the roll is consistent from heel-to-toe. The size also transfers a lot of energy to the ball with little effort. Even though the balance makes the head feel light, they are pretty heavy heads. Sometimes with my two Spiders I'd feel like I really needed to hit the ball hard to get it to go. That is not the case with the L.A.B. I can lengthen the same smooth stroke and add distance.
- The design of the head combined with the grip makes for a very repeatable setup. I make sure the head is flat both side-to-side and front-to-back since the Press II grip adds the right loft to the club. From there I can focus on the stroke and not worry whether the right amount of loft is being applied to the ball. A major variable in the putt is eliminated as as a result.
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I know I asked this before earlier this summer, but any new data on the correlation of SuperSpeed-C speeds with swing speed?
On that note, what would you recommend I do? I have regular set and C club, when I restart should I start with both or just one? I've done regular clubs through to phase 3 two times now and made it mostly through the C club routine last spring.
And on a general note, I went out last night to see what I could hit after not doing the protocols for some time. Warmed up a bit and was happy to see 138-141 with the green stick and 145 with the C club once or twice. Now that I'm more confident in my swing, I started to see big transfers to the course my last few rounds. Namely I can think of a 9 iron that totaled nearly 170 and a 6 iron that totaled somewhere around 210. Jacked lofts or not, I was stoked to see those numbers in Arccos.
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15 hours ago, BMart519 said:
Does anyone know approximate ranges for the head weight for the 2.1? I believe their info says it varies based on lie angle during the fitting.
15 hours ago, dlow206 said:370 to 415 grams
To add to this, I believe they vary the weights with differing amounts of tungsten powder and plugs while maintaining the same base aluminum head. I saw on their social media that they were able to get a head up to over 500 grams for one of their broomstick customers.
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1 hour ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:
As the student i shoulder most of the blame, ultimately it comes down to me putting in the work and being able to grasp the concept of what the instructor is showing you.
You touch on it in the next paragraph, but your instructor should have been able to offer a different feel to help you along. No two people feel the same things.
Sounds like you did the right thing to suggest a different trigger or swing thought. At the end of the day it cost him business being unable to adapt.
And even better that you've found another coach that you like already.
- Golfspy_CG2, cnosil, Kenny B and 2 others
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20 minutes ago, Josh Ross said:
Putting with this literally feels like cheating!
It really does. Obviously speed control is still a skill, but it's so easy to put a great roll on the ball. Effortless feeling.
Thanks for adding your thoughts, @Josh Ross. Glad to hear you were happy with the remote fitting, too. What specs were you fit into?
I wish they made custom headcovers. Or at least a few different designs. I'd love one with just their martini glass logo made a little larger and/or a different color.
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I played my last round of the season last night, a quick nine hole walk. My home course has closed already for the season, I'm guessing many others won't be far behind.
Aided somewhat by the #CobraConnect Challenge and the coronavirus pandemic ruining other summer plans, my 2020 season eclipsed 2019 in every way. I played:
- 51 18-hole rounds
- 16 9-hole rounds
- 1 9-hole practice round
- 1 18-hole alternate shot round with @ncwoz
- 1 18-hole two-person scramble
That's a total of 70 rounds of golf. With my four-over 40 last night, I'm ending the year with an estimated WHS handicap of 10.9. It's not quite where I wanted to be, but my game is in much better shape than when I ended last season thanks to lessons.
I wrote down some specific goals for the 2020 offseason and the 2021 season:
1) Long Iron Mastery
My home course takes driver out of your hand on several holes because the fairways are just too narrow. However, even with an iron in my hand, I am very unreliable off the tee. I lose over three strokes a round to a scratch golfer because of inaccuracy and penalties off the tee according to Arccos. My driver needs a lot of help, unfortunately the heated range bays are not wide enough to swing it comfortably. So, since I use irons/hybrids so often, one of my goals for the winter is to master tee shots with my 2 hybrid, 19 degree driving iron and 5/6 irons. Those clubs all get plenty of use from the tee throughout a typical round.
My goal is to see my Arccos driving handicap falling to less than 10 next season.
2) Putting
Same goal as last season. I still three putt way too often - nearly 16 percent of the time this season. I recently was fit for and purchased a L.A.B. Golf DF 2.1 putter, and I also acquired an EXPUTT putting simulator. We'll see if the additional practice translates to being a better putter.
Obviously, first putt distance plays a big role in number of putts, but I miss a lot of putts inside of 10 feet and would love to be much better in this area.
My goal is to see my Arccos putting handicap under 1 next season.
3) Speed / Fitness
I put on a little too much weight this summer from being neglectful of my diet. I'd love to shave about 15 pounds this offseason and continue my weightlifting work.
I plan on restarting the SuperSpeed C protocols sometime in January. I've set an goal of seeing 160 MPH+ driver ball speeds with my FlightScope Mevo on the range next summer.
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34 minutes ago, Berg Ryman said:
@edingc that's super impressive improvement! Making me really want to scratch that itch, at the very least.
Thanks! I will say the greens at both courses are smaller than my home course. Could be something to that, as well.
I attribute a lot of the distance control to the Press grip. I'd be curious to see how I'd do with that grip on a regular putter. However, I'm really liking the feel of the DF. It takes very little grip pressure to hold and square, and so I end up taking a very nice, smooth stroke.
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I put my last round of the season in the books last night, walking a quick nine on a cloudy and chilly afternoon at probably the worst-conditioned course in the area. They've had a lot of issues with their greens, about half of each green is dead and bumpy, which made putting and chipping an adventure.
Still, I didn't three putt and recorded a wonderful birdie on No. 3 with an uphill 15 footer with some left-to-right break. I found the L.A.B. continued to help me put a consistent roll and distance on the ball despite the greens. There was only one green where I completely misread the speed/distance and left myself a 10ish-footer to save par, which I confidently rolled in center cup. Otherwise, holes 1, 2, 4, 5, 8 and 9 were all two-putt holes from 8-25 feet with nothing more than about 18 inches to tap-in the second putt. Stoked.
The initial 27 holes with the L.A.B. were pretty much the best putting efforts of the season for me, especially in terms of three-putt avoidance. Twenty-seven holes without a three-putt is rare for me, especially since I had not played either of these two courses this season until now.
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- 40 (+4)
- 3/6 FIR
- 4/9 GIR (1 birdie)
- 16 Putts (7 2-putts, 2 1-putts)I can safely say this will be the last round of the season for me. If my math is correct, this was round No. 70 on the year, which has been my unofficial goal since crossing 60 at the beginning of September. So much tougher to get rounds in with extra yard work, school work and just general busy time in the fall.
I can walk away from the 2020 season happy. I hit one bad tee shot that turned into a double bogey on the first par 5, but otherwise played pretty well. The course I played has had a rough year, the greens are awful, but I knew that going in. Regardless, I hit a great 15 footer for birdie on No. 3 and putted really well again with the L.A.B. DF 2.1. I'm so excited to have a full season with it.
I hope this course can turn itself around - it's actually a fun layout, fair with small pushup greens that make approach shots tough. But just about every green is half dead...
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- GolfSpy_SHARK, CarlH, cksurfdude and 9 others
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47 minutes ago, yungkory said:
To my knowledge, LMs use the ball speed to estimate smash, with GCQuad being an exception because it can actually track clubhead speed? So ball speed is the input, smash is estimated or assumed based on the club you tell the LM you're hitting, and therefore it can calculate what your SS "should be". So for example, this guy hit his driver and ball speed was 150, smash is preset at 1.45, therefore swing speed was calculated at 103ish. It's one of the issues I have with my local pro shops because they use a fixed smash on their GC4 (I don't even know if they pay for the extra cameras to make it a quad) and trick people into distance gains.
Maybe trackman can also measure CHS because it's further behind the player, and also a more advanced radar? Not sure how that doppler tech works
Trackman should have no issue tracking club speed, but if if I recall correctly there is a calculation done to estimate the true club speed at center of face.
Ball speed is king, regardless.
- cksurfdude, JohnSmalls, Rickp and 1 other
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I will continue to sing the praises for the Exputt. I went out yesterday with my brand new L.A.B. DF 2.1 and walked away with 28 putts. Since I started tracking and playing seriously last season (about 75 18 hole rounds now), this was the fewest number of total putts I've ever recorded (previously recorded 30 a few times).
I had a good day chipping, and I didn't hit a lot of greens, but still, there's something to be said about 28 total putts. Especially because my brother-in-law registered 38 total putts while he only hit one more green. Generally, he is a much better putter than me.
Anyway, I had never played this course before so I had to "calibrate" my swing on the practice green. I have the Exputt set to 10 speed, and I've rolled enough putts now to know what a 10-12 foot putt feels like at that speed. I simply set out three balls on a flat spot and paced out 10-12 feet and hit them to gauge the speed adjustments I would need (in this case, slower as the greens were wet, bumpy and sandy from aeration). I then hit a few 20-25 footers to check my "calibration" and was happy to see it worked out pretty well.
I'm really looking forward to my practice this offseason. Feeling like the new putter combo'ed with this could be a 2-3 stroke game changer for me come next spring!
- gavinski91, cksurfdude, Golfspy_CG2 and 1 other
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Maltby TS1 Irons
in Golf Clubs
Posted
I was watching that as well. I get where they are coming from, but yes, it would be interesting to see them throw the TS1 and TS2 into their testing. But ultimately that is probably reliant on Golfworks/Maltby sending them heads to review, and so far I haven't seen much of an effort from them to get out into the "influencer" space.