don’t buy footjoy hyperflex w/ traditional laces

[ryan.mzzz]

i wore this exact shoe 13 times over 4 months before this happened:what you are looking at is the laces ripping through the top eyelet of the main structural support of the top of the shoe in normal use. after this failed, I could see that all 4 top eyelets across both shoes had started to wear this way. which is totally absurd. if you look at the lace hole you can see grey, metal looking grommets. turns out they appear to be a rather soft plastic. to footjoys credit the shoes perform well otherwise, except for the fabric portion not being able to be kept clean, and they got me a warranty replacement in a week. which means i have 13 rounds to find a new pair of shoes. as I have problems getting shoes to fit well, this has been a big disappointment. when i think about the fraction of a penny it would have cost them to use metal rings instead of plastic, I get pretty angry. Additionally, if you look at the top photo, the grey material at the very top of the shoe that has the two topmost lace holes has almost failed on my pair as well. I’ve had many pairs of shoes over the years and have never experienced anything like this. So, in conclusion, until this failure I had a great experience in these shoes, but at only lasting 13 rounds, that works out to $16 dollars a round after tax. 

Edited February 18 by ryan.mzzz

[RickyBobby_PR]

So a manufacturer defect. Happens all the time and one occurrence doesn’t equal a problem. FJ will replace them under warranty 

[ryan.mzzz]

2 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

So a manufacturer defect. Happens all the time and one occurrence doesn’t equal a problem. FJ will replace them under warranty 

it’s not a one off defect though, since they are all built with rubber o-rings for grommets, which fail while the shoe is in good shape otherwise. it’s defective by design.

the funny thing is that those rubber grommets are grey so they appear to be metal, which in my opinion is absolute bait and switch trash. I can’t believe footjoy put this out. i have to really question their quality going forward. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

22 minutes ago, ryan.mzzz said:

it’s not a one off defect though, since they are all built with rubber o-rings for grommets, which fail while the shoe is in good shape otherwise. it’s defective by design.

the funny thing is that those rubber grommets are grey so they appear to be metal, which in my opinion is absolute bait and switch trash. I can’t believe footjoy put this out. i have to really question their quality going forward. 

Prove that everyone will fail or provide proof that there are others out there that have failed. Until that it’s a one off defect for the pair you bought. 

[ryan.mzzz]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Prove that everyone will fail or provide proof that there are others out there that have failed. Until that it’s a one off defect for the pair you bought. 

i already have. if my reasoning is not to your satisfaction you’re under no obligation to learn from my mistakes. 

[Golf2Much]

As a plastics engineer, looking at the design of that molded part of the shoe I can tell you that it's easy to predict that that point could be an issue.   Depending on where that part is gated (where the material flows into the cavity to create the shape), the molten material will flow around the mold's metal pin that creates the shoelace hole and meet on the other side.  Since the material is colder when they join, it creates what's called a weld line that is inherently weaker and prone to failure when stressed.  There's a whole host of other manufacturing factors that could yield a weakening of that particular spot.

I hope you get a satisfactory outcome here!

As a side note, that felt good!  I got my Plastics Engineering degrees over 40 years ago and my career path took me away from my technical specialty 25 years ago.   It's been a while since I had to pull those lessons out! 

[RickyBobby_PR]

11 hours ago, ryan.mzzz said:

i already have. if my reasoning is not to your satisfaction you’re under no obligation to learn from my mistakes. 

All you provided was your experience. You haven’t shown anyone else having the issue, any statement from FJ with a recall for a faulty shoe or any other evidence that isn’t from your shoe.

 

[ryan.mzzz]

1 hour ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

All you provided was your experience. You haven’t shown anyone else having the issue, any statement from FJ with a recall for a faulty shoe or any other evidence that isn’t from your shoe.

 

all 4 top plastic grommets in the process of failure with minimal normal use. all the shoes use the same materials. i understand you want to believe. have at it hoss.

[ChuckZ]

On 2/18/2024 at 2:01 PM, ryan.mzzz said:

i wore this exact shoe 13 times over 4 months before this happened:what you are looking at is the laces ripping through the top eyelet of the main structural support of the top of the shoe in normal use. after this failed, I could see that all 4 top eyelets across both shoes had started to wear this way. which is totally absurd. if you look at the lace hole you can see grey, metal looking grommets. turns out they appear to be a rather soft plastic. to footjoys credit the shoes perform well otherwise, except for the fabric portion not being able to be kept clean, and they got me a warranty replacement in a week. which means i have 13 rounds to find a new pair of shoes. as I have problems getting shoes to fit well, this has been a big disappointment. when i think about the fraction of a penny it would have cost them to use metal rings instead of plastic, I get pretty angry. Additionally, if you look at the top photo, the grey material at the very top of the shoe that has the two topmost lace holes has almost failed on my pair as well. I’ve had many pairs of shoes over the years and have never experienced anything like this. So, in conclusion, until this failure I had a great experience in these shoes, but at only lasting 13 rounds, that works out to $16 dollars a round after tax. 

Personally did not see any indication of any wear on the other eyelet.  Regarding your comment of the fabric being difficult to clean.  Any white shoe is more difficult to keep clean that other colors and fabric is even harder.  Mr Clean magic erasers help that situation as most of us use.  I do not see deception by the color of the eyelets.  Sometimes tying laces to tightly puts extra strain on those plastic eyelets,  But, as you know the saying goes there is a bad apply in every barrel and this is the first complaint I have heard about regarding this issue.  FootJoy is know for it's quality and customer service.  I have worn their shoes since I started playing golf in 1985 and wear nothing but their shoes because of that.  They have a large array of quality shoes to choose from and I hope you can find one that meets your expectations.  This maybe one that slipped thru.  It happens in manufacturing of shoes by any and all brands.  Sorry yours happened to be the one.  

[RayP]

What did Footjoy say? 

[ryan.mzzz]

On 2/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, ChuckZ said:

Personally did not see any indication of any wear on the other eyelet. 

i could have stated it more clearly, so let me take another shot:

the ripped eyelet is the top eyelet on that side of that shoe. There are 4 such eyelets that have all started to wear through, and they are that same top eyelet of that main structural support on both shoes. so,

1-right shoe right side, top eyelet

2-right shoe left side, top eyelet 

3-left shoe right side, top eyelet

4-left shoe left side, top eyelet.

all of those eyelets were compromised after 13 rounds, and none of the bottom eyelets of the main structural plastic piece had an issue.  so we both agree that the eyelet that’s not ripped through on the photos is still fine.

On 2/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, ChuckZ said:

I do not see deception by the color of the eyelets. 

I wouldn’t have a problem with it if the design hadn’t failed on me in such a spectacular fashion. It’s possible that the designers didn’t mean that grey circle to look like a traditional metal eyelet, but that is what I as the customer thought until the shoe failed, and that’s why I was so shocked at what happened. So, i definitely felt deceived.

On 2/20/2024 at 8:50 AM, ChuckZ said:

Sometimes tying laces to tightly puts extra strain on those plastic eyelets,  But, as you know the saying goes there is a bad apply in every barrel and this is the first complaint I have heard about regarding this issue.  FootJoy is know for it's quality and customer service.  I have worn their shoes since I started playing golf in 1985 and wear nothing but their shoes because of that.  They have a large array of quality shoes to choose from and I hope you can find one that meets your expectations.  This maybe one that slipped thru.  It happens in manufacturing of shoes by any and all brands.  Sorry yours happened to be the one.  

I totally get what you’re saying. In my opinion, in this case, it’s a case of footjoy having a short sighted, defective design that ruined my ability to enjoy a pair of shoes that worked really well for me before the failure. To fix the problem their engineers left me, i bought a pair of white waxed boot laces that fill the hole better that don’t deform much under stress, with the idea being that more of the lace would out pressure on more of the plastic/rubber eyelet and hopefully lengthen the life of the shoes. so far it’s worked really well. the new laces make it easier for me to get a good fit, and after a few more rounds, i’m not seeing any issues. which is what i want. i like these shoes and want them to work out. 

I also got a pair of these for backup.I’ve only worn them in the house but they molded to me feet pretty quickly, and i’m a lot more confident in the build quality of these up against the hyperflex.

Also, thanks for the thoughtful response, even if you largely disagree with me. 

Edited March 15 by ryan.mzzz
clarity

[ryan.mzzz]

On 2/18/2024 at 10:18 PM, Golf2Much said:

As a plastics engineer, looking at the design of that molded part of the shoe I can tell you that it's easy to predict that that point could be an issue.   Depending on where that part is gated (where the material flows into the cavity to create the shape), the molten material will flow around the mold's metal pin that creates the shoelace hole and meet on the other side.  Since the material is colder when they join, it creates what's called a weld line that is inherently weaker and prone to failure when stressed.  There's a whole host of other manufacturing factors that could yield a weakening of that particular spot.

I hope you get a satisfactory outcome here!

As a side note, that felt good!  I got my Plastics Engineering degrees over 40 years ago and my career path took me away from my technical specialty 25 years ago.   It's been a while since I had to pull those lessons out! 

thanks for this response. your point about liquid? plastic being slightly cooler when rejoining on the other side of the pin, and that being responsible for a point of weakness makes sense. given that, i am even more mystified as to why they wouldn’t have used a more robust material for the eyelet, especially as eyelets are traditionally metal in the first place. i’m not a materials engineer so i have no idea what difficulties they may or may not have been dealing with when choosing the eyelet piece, but given my experience the combination of materials and type of laces to ship with those shoes seems to have been a poor choice. for the warranty replacement i got a pair of $4 waxed white hard boot laces that don’t bunch up to a point under pressure like the ones that come with the shoes, and i’ve been been using as little force as possible while lacing up, and so far so good. the shoes are very comfortable otherwise so it’s unfortunate I can’t recommend them overall. thanks for dusting off your expertise. i definitely learned something today.

[ryan.mzzz]

On 2/20/2024 at 10:26 AM, RayP said:

What did Footjoy say? 

the rep I talked to didn’t have any information on the problem, but they did get me a warranty replacement that arrived within a week of my warranty claim so I have to commend them for that. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

11 hours ago, ryan.mzzz said:

the rep I talked to didn’t have any information on the problem, but they did get me a warranty replacement that arrived within a week of my warranty claim so I have to commend them for that. 

The probably didnt have any info because as has been said it’s not the major issue with the shoe that you initially claimed and your is a rare occurrence 

Edited March 15 by RickyBobby_PR

[ryan.mzzz]

6 hours ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

The probably didnt have any info because as has been said it’s not the major issue with the shoe that you initially claimed and your is a rare occurrence 

he didn’t have any info because that’s not his job. his job was to direct me to the warranty form on the website, which he did admirably, unlike the designers of this shoe who designed it to fail.

I’m not ascribing intentionality to the people at footjoy who put this defective design out into the public, but I am calling them on their BS, which @RickyBobby_PR keeps inviting me do over and over and over again. Keep living your best life man. I definitely appreciate you. 

[Swood1994]

I was actually considering the hyperflex for my next pair of spiked shoes based on MGS most wanted test in 2023. Im Curious how you like these vs the FJ premiers you bought as backups from a comfort standpoint