Are Marshals An Endangered Species?

[Preeway]

I know a lot of courses monitor carts via GPS to ensure they stay on the path when it’s cart path only. If they really wanted, they could also track who is falling behind. In the end it comes down to whether the courses really want to enforce the expectation. 

[Ryan M]

While the original post was about the presence (or lack thereof) of marshals, what the OP (and most of the thread) is really talking about is pace of play.

I do think this needs to be broken out into a couple of different groups.

Private Courses: Most private courses in my experience don't have marshals roving the course. They expect the members to police themselves, and if there is a problem, they call the pro shop to send someone out. Generally pace isn't an issue because if you are going to get a membership you are probably not a "2-3 times a year golfer" and even a 20 handicap player can play "fast".

Resort Courses: Pace of play is a problem here mainly because it attracts so many players who play a few times a year. They have no problem hitting multiple drives (even though driver isn't really a "scoring" club), and are usually playing several penalty strokes (often without counting them...). I can somewhat get on board with this (emphasis on the "somewhat") because it is a resort course, I am probably on vacation, and taking a little extra time isn't so bad if the scenery is gorgeous.

Bucket-List Courses: Like Torrey Pines, Pebble Beach, etc. While I don't necessarily like it, if I am paying $300 for Torrey or $700(+?) for Pebble, I am taking my time. You should just expect it. And while in general I am frustrated by people feeling they need to take 15 pictures on every hole, I get it on one of these courses. Just expect the round to take 5-6 hours and enjoy yourself. Notable exceptions to this imo are Bethpage and Bandon Dunes primarily because they are walking only. As such, you are typically only going to get people that are better players (and thus faster players), but I would still expect a 5hr round on Bethpage as the rough is absolutely ridiculous.

Public/Muni Courses: I think this is where the real issue is. You have a mix of better players, and those that are learning. Often they do not have the budget for a full-time marshal, and even if they do, a marshal is going to be reluctant to ask people to skip a hole. Like many things, there is no single solution to this problem. A ranger/marshal might help, but so would people playing a forward tee, taking "gimme" putts, and capping their hole at +3 over par. Peoples attitudes are part of the problem as well and you are not going to be able to change their entitled and argumentative attitude. Best advice I can give you is to try and play early as it is typically better in the morning, and even if pace "feels" slow, sometimes it isn't. A few weeks ago I was playing with a foursome and we were relatively quick. We waited on almost every hole and shot. In the end tho, we finished just under 4:30, so not terribly slow, just slow for us.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Ryan M

[KJC]

I have marshaled in the past.  There is schizophrenic direction from the pro shop.  "Keep the pace of play but do not offend the golfers" as they do not want negative reviews on yelp.  "Get the carts in by sunset, not 'dark' " as there are no lights on the course or carts and people would be driving in the dark.  Friday's are the worst because of the people drinking during the round and they are "paid for 18 holes" even though they paid the twilight rate.  Marshal's can remind people, but the power to effect change is to suspend privileges for offending foursomes. That is in the pro shop.  The marshals get the grief for the course's lack of enforcement. So fewer people volunteer for the thankless job.  Also, the compensation for marshalling is usually comp golf.  That only is granted if the course has vacancies as marshals cannot reserve time.  With the growth of the game, tee times are full. So again, why marshal?

[jolter1]

I really appreciate having a fair marshall on the course. Just please don't tell me to play faster when the fivesome in front of me are playing like they have thousands bet on every stroke.

[golfinnut]

34 minutes ago, jolter1 said:

I really appreciate having a fair marshall on the course. Just please don't tell me to play faster when the fivesome in front of me are playing like they have thousands bet on every stroke.

This is your first problem right here.  A 5-some??  Should never be allowed anyway.  

[cksurfdude]

8 hours ago, Ryan M said:

Notable exceptions to this imo are Bethpage

Don't know about the Black, but I can tell you the other courses there can often play v-e-r-y s.l.o.w.l.y.

Anyway lots of thoughtful comments in your post!

And the bottom line for marshals is just as say....

8 hours ago, Ryan M said:

Peoples attitudes are part of the problem as well and you are not going to be able to change their entitled and argumentative attitude.

 

[Ryan M]

16 hours ago, cksurfdude said:

Don't know about the Black, but I can tell you the other courses there can often play v-e-r-y s.l.o.w.l.y.

Fair point, and I should have added, that it took us 5hrs to play the black course. But it is a very long walk and the rough is absolutely ridiculous. That said, we were never waiting on anyone that I recall, and we never had anyone waiting on us. I think this is just a course where rounds take longer because of the conditions and it is walking-only.

Funny story (sort of, not really to the wife). I was in NY for work, and took the day off to play Bethpage. Got an Uber out there, walked up, and got a walk-on time for the black course about 45min out. Awesome. Hit some warmup balls then went to the tee and met my caddy. Round took longer than I expected, and I think it was a Friday, so traffic was horrific. I got an uber to the train station and took train into the city, walked 2 blocks to hotel, showered, grabbed bags, and got an uber to Newark. Missed my flight. Oops. Problem is my anniversary is the next day!

Delta took care of my though, booked me for a 6am flight the next morning, and I stayed at the airport Marriott in the parking lot. All worked out.

Edited December 19, 2023 by Ryan M