Loft Jacking - Who Cares?

[Sschaffer24]

So I was professionally fit for my driver by my instructor and have seen the numbers comparing that loft and spin model to the loft and spin model of a 12 degree SLDR head and TP shaft that I used to game. The G30 with the Paderson shaft is a really good combo for me. My accuracy is fantastic with this club.

 

I do have a generally very positive AoA on my driver. As Rev mentions in his comment, it's all based on my swing, and the driver went from a weakness to a strength when I moved to the G30. I still don't have the distance I need though because my spin numbers are too high. Which from my understanding is due to my strike. (Tend to hit towards the heel/center of the club. Gear effect adds spin to that location)

 

My irons are a different story. 37 and down my distances line up with most golfers. Although the 37 is a traditional 8 iron and I'm only carrying that club around 140 or so.

 

The problem is as many have mentioned when I get into my 33/29/25/hybrid/woods. I just DONT hit any of those clubs consistently and to a decent distance. I can play those irons from 150-160 with pretty decent results, but anything beyond that mentally I'm screaming to lay up because that is where my strengths lie.

 

The problem is I'm going to run into a brick wall with my handicap by doing that. I have to be able to hit GIR's to get to single digits. My short game, wedges, short irons putting and driving accuracy (Not distance) are honestly probably low single digit golfer skill level.

 

But my distance in my mid/long irons and long lofts in general are high handicapper. That averages me to the 15 that I carry haha.

 

But I am not brand loyal at all and am willing to try a combo set or any style of club that will give me my yardages. I don't care if they're hogan or not.

 

Why I asked this question in this thread is to get the perspective of the forum on how my situation plays into the typical golfer (who honestly probably struggles with a similar problem to me with distances) and their interest in the GI irons and the benefits that the jacked lofts offer to me and that golfer.

 

So I guess the question is this, after reading the plugged in golf article on the difference in distances, is this really all about lofts? Or is there more to it?

[Sschaffer24]

So I was professionally fit for my driver by my instructor and have seen the numbers comparing that loft and spin model to the loft and spin model of a 12 degree SLDR head and TP shaft that I used to game. The G30 with the Paderson shaft is a really good combo for me. My accuracy is fantastic with this club.

 

I do have a generally very positive AoA on my driver. As Rev mentions in his comment, it's all based on my swing, and the driver went from a weakness to a strength when I moved to the G30. I still don't have the distance I need though because my spin numbers are too high. Which from my understanding is due to my strike. (Tend to hit towards the heel/center of the club. Gear effect adds spin to that location)

 

My irons are a different story. 37 and down my distances line up with most golfers. Although the 37 is a traditional 8 iron and I'm only carrying that club around 140 or so.

 

The problem is as many have mentioned when I get into my 33/29/25/hybrid/woods. I just DONT hit any of those clubs consistently and to a decent distance. I can play those irons from 150-160 with pretty decent results, but anything beyond that mentally I'm screaming to lay up because that is where my strengths lie.

 

The problem is I'm going to run into a brick wall with my handicap by doing that. I have to be able to hit GIR's to get to single digits. My short game, wedges, short irons putting and driving accuracy (Not distance) are honestly probably low single digit golfer skill level.

 

But my distance in my mid/long irons and long lofts in general are high handicapper. That averages me to the 15 that I carry haha.

 

But I am not brand loyal at all and am willing to try a combo set or any style of club that will give me my yardages. I don't care if they're hogan or not.

 

Why I asked this question in this thread is to get the perspective of the forum on how my situation plays into the typical golfer (who honestly probably struggles with a similar problem to me with distances) and their interest in the GI irons and the benefits that the jacked lofts offer to me and that golfer.

 

So I guess the question is this, after reading the plugged in golf article on the difference in distances, is this really all about lofts? Or is there more to it?

 

Edit: sorry for double post.

[wbealsd]

I don't think your situation is unusual at all, and that's why those lofts are found on irons, hybrids and woods.

 

While most companies carry hybrid sets, that doesn't mean the entire "matched" set will necessarily meet the needs of a specific golfer.

 

You obviously don't need "Super GI" irons in the higher lofts, but some type of GI iron might help in the lower ones.  Maybe incremental change between GI iron, SGI and hybrid moving between 33/29/25 might work.  Might not even be the same brand of club for each loft.  My setup (right now ) makes sense for me, and I've got 6 different brands of clubs in my bag!  Driver - Fairway - Hybrid - Irons - Wedges - Putter are all different brands but "match" as a set, for me.

 

I've also swapped out iron/hybrid/wood between the 18* to 35* lofts, and may do it again.  I actually pulled out my 25* hybrid today to consider replacing an iron I use in one of my two sets.

 

I just think you should experiment with different clubs in those "tweener" lofts, until you decide what will work best for you.

[Sschaffer24]

Man that couldn't be more spot in with what I want to do, and what i think as well. Gotta play with different lofts and clubs and see what works.

 

Something I'm really excited about though is some developments with my swing instructor...

 

He got the Edel cart as well as the Hogan cart. If anyone here has seen my posts before, they know how hard it is going to be for me to not end up with an entire Edel set of clubs besides woods. I am just head over heels with that company.

 

And what is amazing is not only can I compare them to the Fort Worth, but also the new Hogans, the Hybrids AND the Edels. He was so excited about it he was texting me all throughout the show to tell me!

 

The bastard even sent me a picture of him and David Edel to mess with me! Haha.

[NiftyNiblick]

Yes I do, Dhuck, and of course you're right. The mini-driver is no more than the new 2-wood, and people who struggled with driver accuracy were going "brassie" or two wood long before I ever wandered onto a golf course.

 

Now I'm having second thoughts about the hybrid.

 

[ Let me interrupt myself here and say that I'm going onto another boring set composition musing.  This is a subject that has always fascinated me, so please tune out here if you're not in the mood for more blather about it. ]

 

There is only one reason that I never really gave hybrids a chance. By the time they were introduced, I had already replaced my long irons with high loft fairway woods.  But despite my favoring little fairway woods, I always stuck with one long iron to use exclusively as a driving iron. 

 

With hybrids, I wouldn't have to do that. The hybrid is short enough to use as an accurate driving iron, I would imagine. I'd just have to learn to knock it down if I wanted to duplicate the driving iron shot. Is there such a thing as a hybrid "stinger?"

 

That would remove a one trick pony club, the driving iron, from the bag. It would also make room for a different one trick pony, the dedicated sand iron.

 

Modern wedges are great, but nothing is easier in the sand than an old fashioned, oval-faced, long-hoseled sand iron.  The very curved leading edge parts the sand the way the pointy front of a boat parts the water.  I love finding room in my bag for one of those, because even if it doesn't lead to more sand saves, it at least all but eliminates the soul-sucking humiliation of leaving that first sand shot in the sand.

 

If I could get enough clout out of a 22 and 26º hybrid pair, I could envision a set like this:

 

14º mini driver

18º fairway metal

22, 26º hybrids

30, 34, 38, 42, 46º irons

50, 54, 58º wedges

dedicated sand iron

putter

 

Sorry to jack a jacked loft thread, but we've pretty much got the latter covered by this point.

[Chris O.]

I might fall over dead....Nifty is considering a hybrid!!!

[GolfSpy Barbajo]

I might fall over dead....Nifty is considering a hybrid!!!

 

 

This is the big one!

 

Seriously, this might be my favorite thread of the year so far. Like how we all respectfully disagreed and acted like, well, big boys.  Good on y'all....

[hckymeyer]

Careful Nifty, a hybrid is just the first step on a slippery slope that ends with you and a 460cc driver

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[NiftyNiblick]

I guess that the main thing that I never described properly when it comes to jacked lofts is this. Club heads are weighted to work in a certain length range. A five irons is weighted, just for the sake of argument, for a 37½-38" shaft. The actual number doesn't matter, just so you get the idea.

 

Strengthening the lofts does much more than change the number stamped on the sole. It changes the length / loft correlation of the entire set. If, over four decades, you gradually change the loft of a five-iron from 32 to 25º, and at the same time you don't lengthen the five-iron shaft by two clubs, you've done more than just change the number stamped on the sole. You've changed the whole length-loft correlation.

 

Stronger lofts on short shafts hit the ball differently than weaker lofts on longer shafts used to hit it. Changes in club head geometry and shaft engineering are in my view very insufficient to make up the difference. I guess it's on this point that we may disagree.

 

The older player has the advantage of having tried it both ways. This can be tricky, however, because he/she is not the same person that he/she was thirty or forty years ago.

However, if one is still in physical possession of the old standard clubs, one may compare directly. I am and have. It's just my opinion that weaker and longer work better than stronger and shorter.

 

It doesn't make a difference until one can no longer access from the marketplace the combination that one prefers. One can't get the newer technology with the older metrics, so one must prioritize fit versus technology.

[hckymeyer]

I think the length range may be a little longer than 1/2" but I get what you're saying.  A good club maker can more than make up for that though and that's why you see so many different set configurations.  Just because a club came stock with a 38" shaft doesn't mean I can't play it at whatever length I get the best results with.

 

Nifty what do you think about a guy like Bryson DeChambeau then?  He uses a single length for his entire iron set. (37.5" I think) which would be 6 or 7iron length in most setups.  Does that mean when he puts a "jacked loft" 4i head on that length shaft the geometry of his ball flight is all out of whack?  I would say no and also that it's been working extremely well for him.

 

Just because a certain loft was played at a certain length in the past doesn't mean it's the best way to play it.  Or that the ball flight is going to get all screwy if it's not within the parameters of clubs built 20-30 years ago.

[NiftyNiblick]

I don't disagree with any of that in general terms, 'meyer. I do think that one length irons are specifically weighted for that format, but nevertheless, the length/loft correlation is probably not inviolate.

 

I've never said the new way of doing things is invalid. I'm just saying that it's definitely more different than just a number stamped on the sole, that's all.

[hckymeyer]

I was just thinking of my "loft jacking" story from junior high/early high school and realized that was over 20 years ago.  Jacked lofts have been around for a while then

 

My best friend and I played golf together all summer long.  I had a set of Titleist DCI black irons that had the iron number and loft stamped on the sole.  I don't remember what clubs he had but we hit them the same length.  Always played the same club on par 3's etc.  Well he went and built a new set of clubs.  Ordered them from some catalog and put them together himself.  All of the sudden he is hitting one less than me on every shot.

 

I'd hit 8iron in to a green, then he'd hit and put it right next to me and look back and smile and say "I hit 9"  After a couple rounds we looked up the specs of his clubs and the lofts were exactly one club stronger than mine.  So from then on we didn't say what number we were hitting any more, we just said what loft we were hitting.

 

I guess there's no real point to the story, just something I was thinking about and realized loft jacking has been around a lot longer than most people realize.

[NiftyNiblick]

I remember those Titleists.  Then they stamped the DCI 962s differently, without the lofts.

 

My DCI 962s are exactly one club strong of the 1950s/1960s standard and at least one club weak of the present standard. That was 1996/97--only twenty-years ago. The DCI 981s in 1999  were already one more degree stronger.

 

The GI clubs crept up faster than the blades and player's CBs, but they all crept up. 

 

It occurs to me that 20 years ago would seem more considerably more recent to me than to you!