Driver angle of attack - use driver loft or body?

[StrokerAce]

We all know that we should be hitting up on the driver.  Many, many, many studies have been done to show that a positive angle of attack produces a longer shot.  (I'll leave it up to your imagination what "longer" means...not the point of the question).

 

But... I was thinking about it... with adjustable drivers there seems to be 2 ways to get that positive AoA.

 

1. Use a lower lofted driver (i.e. 9.5 degree), adjust/tilt your spine and swing up at the ball.
    
2. Use a higher lofted driver (i.e. 11 degree), swing in a normal/squarish swing path with a fairly even/level spine.

 

It seems to me that both will achieve the same thing - getting the ball up in the air.  One way is done by adjusting your body and the other is done by making adjustments to the club.

 

Perhaps somebody smarter/more experienced than me can chime in.  Am I confused here?

(just as an aside, I'm someone who does #1 but I was thinking about trying #2)

 I really hate the fact that you have to remember to "change" your swing method for different clubs...another reason I use single length clubs. I think golfers should be machine-like and repeat the same motion as often as possible...but that's just me. =)

This video by Mark Crossfield got me thinking of it.  He and Lockey have 2 different lofts...

 

[null]

Stroker - Angle of attack has nothing to do with the loft of the driver.

AoA is which way the club, as a whole, is moving at impact.  You can add all of the loft in the world to a driver, but you won't be changing the angle of attack.  You'll increase the launch angle and spin, but not the angle of attack.

 

Angle of attack is purely a swing issue

 

Here is a great little article on it.

 

https://blog.trackmangolf.com/attack-angle/

[Shankster]

I use a 10.5° driver and keep some spine tilt. Hit the ball slightly after bottom, so just on he way up. If I read correctly your max swing speed is usually just after impact. Not sure what my AOA is but it works for me.

 

 

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[StrokerAce]

Stroker - Angle of attack has nothing to do with the loft of the driver.

AoA is which way the club, as a whole, is moving at impact.  You can add all of the loft in the world to a driver, but you won't be changing the angle of attack.  You'll increase the launch angle and spin, but not the angle of attack.

 

Angle of attack is purely a swing issue

 

Here is a great little article on it.

 

https://blog.trackmangolf.com/attack-angle/

 

Oh.  Thanks for the article.  Perhaps I'm not explaining it correctly.  One way you need to swing more up on the ball and the other you can swing more level.

 

I'm trying to understand why people have 11/12 degree drivers instead of having a different swing arc.

[Shankster]

Jlukes trackman data is great info. Up might not always be the ticket either.

 

 

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[StrokerAce]

Couldn't you swing the driver like the pic on the right but adjust the loft of the club so you still have that upwards ball flight?

 

[null]

Jlukes trackman data is great info. Up might not always be the ticket either.

 

 

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Yup, so many people think hitting up will maximize distance for them when in reality it is all about maximizing launch conditions.

[null]

Couldn't you swing the driver like the pic on the right but adjust the loft of the club so you still have that upwards ball flight?

 

aoa.jpg

 

Stroker - no, because you will be increasing spin by increasing loft, so it would cause ballooning.  

 

ie you can get the same launch with lower spin while hitting up on the ball than hitting even or down on the ball with with a higher lofted driver.  Hitting down with too much loft will increase launch, but spin will increase as well and there is a point where too much spin causes ballooning and a loss of carry distance

[null]

Stroker - this article is a lot to absorb, but was the single most influential article in getting me to understand driver launch conditions and fitting

 

https://www.tutelman.com/golf/ballflight/launchOptimize.php

 

 

"Loft

 

As we said, this story is good news, bad news:

 

First the good news: loft increases launch angle by almost a degree for every degree of loft. (Actually, it is not quite one-for-one, more like 80%-90%.)

 

Now the bad news: loft also increases the spin. For our 86mph golfer with typical driver lofts, the spin increases by 270rpm for each degree of increased launch angle.

 

That means that we can easily increase the launch angle, but now we not only have to reduce the spin to stay on the ridge, we have to reduce hundreds or even thousands of RPM of spin just to make up for the launch angle gain. That's a high price, considering we must accomplish both higher launch and lower spin; one without the other is distance lost, not gained."

[StrokerAce]

Stroker - no, because you will be increasing spin by increasing loft, so it would cause ballooning.  

 

ie you can get the same launch with lower spin while hitting up on the ball than hitting even or down on the ball with with a higher lofted driver.  Hitting down with too much loft will increase launch, but spin will increase as well and there is a point where too much spin causes ballooning and a loss of carry distance

 

Ah... see, I knew someone smarter than me would be able to answer!

 

Thanks jlukes.  

[StrokerAce]

Crap!  I meant launch angle...but doesn't an upward AoA achieve that higher launch angle??  Man this stuff can get confusing real quick.

[null]

No problem stroker. Golf club fitting can be overwhelming but once you understand the basics it makes you appreciate equipment and a good fitting club that much more!

[null]

Crap! I meant launch angle...but doesn't an upward AoA achieve that higher launch angle?? Man this stuff can get confusing real quick.

Yes, when static lofts and all other swing parameters are the same, the higher the angle of attack then higher the launch angle.

 

What you area talking about is dynamic loft, or the loft of the club presented too the ball at impact.

 

https://blog.trackmangolf.com/dynamic-loft/

[scooducks]

I think Rory tweeted about hitting up on the ball with the driver being a key to his length after Chamblee popped off about how ridiculous it was. 

[Eseay32]

I get my head behind the ball and lower my right shoulder. That helps you hit up on it. I use a 9 degree bc it reduced my spin about 800rpm from the 10. My angle attack is around 1-1.5 up

 

 

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