Shaft Hack - The Otto Phlex Journey

[DukeStKing]

On 12/19/2022 at 7:58 PM, DukeStKing said:

I was able to give the PING DISTAZA a try today and it felt good- a little looser than the Grafalloy. I hit about 70 balls at the range- hit some real nice ones until my tennis elbow kicked in and I was in a lot of pain. The flight was nice and penetrating and whether it had a fade or draw it traveled in the cold- it was in the 30’s today, windy and I was hitting floating balls at a driving range with a lake. So I was happy with the DISTAZA (D0 swing weight in G425 Max with a 20 gram weight instead of the stock 26) Hoping my elbow heals and I can do a comparison between the Grafalloy and the DISTAZA. 

Hit the Grafalloy today on a mild day in NJ- tennis elbow felt ok. Hit a couple bombs when I swung easy. It feels much more stable than the Distanza. My miss with the Graffalloy was a mild slice, while with the Distanza. I had the dreaded 2 way miss. The distance on good hits seemed to be the same with both. I want to keep on comparing because so far the sample size with the Distanza is small - I played the end of the season with the Grafalloy. 

On another note- my son loved the Graffaloy “Otto Phlex” I made him with a Sim Max head for Christmas- he hit it really well today at the range. BTW- with the Sim Max I didn’t need to change the head weight like I did with my 425 Max. With the Sim Max I just added a layer of aluminum tape under the grip and a midsized grip and the Sim Max was at D1. 

 

Edited January 2, 2023 by DukeStKing

[azstu324]

Ok so if anybody was at all curious about the handheld tire inflator/air compressor and whether or not it works.. well IT WORKS! 

I have Ryobi power tools and a bunch of batteries that I can use interchangeably. I picked this up (without the battery) for $26 on sale at Home Depot. The one in the video by @The AJ from Mobile Clubmaker Golf runs about $50-$60 but comes with a battery and charger. 

 

I tried a couple of experiments. 1. Wanted to see how well I could remove a glued/taped grip. At first it didn't work too well.. but then I thought to warm it up with the heat gun and voila, it slid right off! So easy!! Did 3 in a row in about 3 minutes. Worked WAY easier than solvent and a removal tool. 2. Of course I just wanted to see if it works for installation. And yes it absolutely works! I even just used the plastic nozzle piece that came with it and it was magical. There's a little bit of a technique involved but it's not hard at all. I'M SOLD and just might never use tape and solvent again! 

 

[MattF]

17 hours ago, azstu324 said:

It really seems to do this on Pure or Star grips but those are my favorites.. hence why I'm so interested in the air method

Pure are made for air installation, not tape and solvent. That may be part of the problem.

[azstu324]

15 minutes ago, MattF said:

Pure are made for air installation, not tape and solvent. That may be part of the problem.

Quick story that I think I've told before.. but I'll tell again. According to the previous owner of Star who I spoke with a few years ago, they were around first. A couple of guys left the company with what they thought was the process and formula and started Pure 10 miles away in Mesa, AZ. According to the guy, they didn't quite get the formula right because the grips have a stronger rubber smell and aren't quite as durable. I actually prefer Star to Pures. They have no side branding and don't have a strong odor like the guy mentioned. 

We don't see as much of either company here, but they do sell very heavily in the Asian market where golf clubs and components are extremely expensive. The idea of durability and not having to change out grips every season is much more appealing. Again, these are just stories from a guy who claimed to be the owner of the company.

[Vernon]

I haven't used double sided tape and solvent for at least ten years so all the grips I've done for myself and others blow right off without issue.

However I tried to remove a couple of grips for a friend that had been installed with tape and solvent and encountered the same problem as others above.

The tape stuck to the insides of the grips (Multi compounds) and balled up to the point that the grips were rendered worthless.

Tried everything I could think of to get the stuff out of there but it just kept getting worse instead of better.

[Allen]

On 12/31/2022 at 7:45 AM, carter18 said:

Hey Bobbers, do you have a recommendation on how to work with swing weight adjustments? I find as I’m trying to measure weight without the grip installed I have a hard time. I have been sort of taping the grip and additional wraps, weights etc as I work on the balance point. Without a true swingweight scale I want to ensure this is giving me the most accurate reading as possible. Also if anyone has a good video on how to remove grips without cutting them off in order to save them, that would be very appreciated. 

Golfworks: Been using it for years. Very simple. Insert - pour grip solvent down - work it around and up and down. https://www.golfworks.com/search.aspx?ss=grip+remover+tool

[jslimerick]

Quick update… I spent a couple hours on the sim this morning hitting multiple heads on multiple shafts. (Btw if you guys haven’t gotten on to AllFit golf adapters yet, you are missing out. Universal adapters and you just switch out the collar for the head.)

Observations:

1. It is definitely sensitive to spin loft. Could not get a 10.5 head under 3k spin even at the lowest loft settings.

2. What I’m realizing is that I hit the same carry numbers with my gamer vs PLB, the difference is that I can swing much easier and hit my numbers with PLB. The odd thing is that my gamer hits 270 carry with higher smash factor, lower launch and higher spin. PLB launches higher with less spin, but lower smash factor… and again less effort. If I could somehow get the efficiency back, I’d gain about 10 yards carry. 

3. It took me multiple weeks messing with it to finally trust it. The feeling is hard to get used to, but once you do, it’s slightly addicting haha. I really struggle to transition to my iron shafts. They feel like rebar. Am I the only one?

I think I’m going to get the PLB 65 for my 3 wood. Anyone have a recommendation for something in the 75 range for my 5 wood?

[AzRoger]

12 hours ago, azstu324 said:

Ok so if anybody was at all curious about the handheld tire inflator/air compressor and whether or not it works.. well IT WORKS! 

I have Ryobi power tools and a bunch of batteries that I can use interchangeably. I picked this up (without the battery) for $26 on sale at Home Depot. The one in the video by @The AJ from Mobile Clubmaker Golf runs about $50-$60 but comes with a battery and charger. 

 

I tried a couple of experiments. 1. Wanted to see how well I could remove a glued/taped grip. At first it didn't work too well.. but then I thought to warm it up with the heat gun and voila, it slid right off! So easy!! Did 3 in a row in about 3 minutes. Worked WAY easier than solvent and a removal tool. 2. Of course I just wanted to see if it works for installation. And yes it absolutely works! I even just used the plastic nozzle piece that came with it and it was magical. There's a little bit of a technique involved but it's not hard at all. I'M SOLD and just might never use tape and solvent again! 

 

Thanks for the write up, I also have the Ryobi tire inflator but never would have thought it would work for that, not a strong output and seems to take a long time just to add a couple PSI to a tire, will have to give it a try.

[gmmiddle]

I'm looking at the PXG GEN5 0311 driver (7.5 degree) that is on sale, and curious which shafts most closely match the Otto goals.  I was initially going for the Riptide CB 50, but it looks like that isn't necessarily optimal.  Also, 46"? (I usually play +1.2").

[GolfSpy SAM]

16 hours ago, azstu324 said:

Ok so if anybody was at all curious about the handheld tire inflator/air compressor and whether or not it works.. well IT WORKS! 

I have Ryobi power tools and a bunch of batteries that I can use interchangeably. I picked this up (without the battery) for $26 on sale at Home Depot. The one in the video by @The AJ from Mobile Clubmaker Golf runs about $50-$60 but comes with a battery and charger. 

 

I tried a couple of experiments. 1. Wanted to see how well I could remove a glued/taped grip. At first it didn't work too well.. but then I thought to warm it up with the heat gun and voila, it slid right off! So easy!! Did 3 in a row in about 3 minutes. Worked WAY easier than solvent and a removal tool. 2. Of course I just wanted to see if it works for installation. And yes it absolutely works! I even just used the plastic nozzle piece that came with it and it was magical. There's a little bit of a technique involved but it's not hard at all. I'M SOLD and just might never use tape and solvent again! 

 

Genius - I’ve got some Ryobi batteries already, so this is a great idea!

 Question: when blowing them on, do you not need tape? Or just not solvent? 

[GolfSpy SAM]

52 minutes ago, gmmiddle said:

I'm looking at the PXG GEN5 0311 driver (7.5 degree) that is on sale, and curious which shafts most closely match the Otto goals.  I was initially going for the Riptide CB 50, but it looks like that isn't necessarily optimal.  Also, 46"? (I usually play +1.2").

I went from a stiff flex 60g to the CB Alta 40 4.0 (two flexes, two weights less), and while it hasn’t worked for everyone on this thread, I’m absolutely in love with the setup (I have the Gen 5 0311 XF, fwiw). Easy swing , easy distance, longest drives I’ve ever hit (to be fair, I’ve also been working a LOT on swing and with a coach, so…take that for what it’s worth). 

[azstu324]

2 hours ago, Samsonite said:

Genius - I’ve got some Ryobi batteries already, so this is a great idea!

 Question: when blowing them on, do you not need tape? Or just not solvent? 

So no double sided tape. I still used masking build up tape and blew the grips over the top. No solvent either.  

[GolfSpy SAM]

4 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

So no double sided tape. I still used masking build up tape and blew the grips over the top. No solvent either.  

Awesome. I bought new midsize grips, and while I LOVE them (gotta love SAS Golf- he reviewed them (Amazon knock off grips and he was blown away) so I took a chance, especially as my Kirkland wedges had (my only real complaint) terrible grips), I kind of hated the solvent getting everywhere (I realized afterwards I needed a catch-basin. Sorry, honey!). 

Love idea of blowing the rest onto my crappy-gripped fairway woods. 

thanks again!

[Bang60]

Played 16 holes today walking with some interesting results, I could of played the last 2 but didn't want to get to tired, on the 12th I hit the perfect drive 250 metres straightish down the middle with a little wind coming from 4/3 on the watch face. One problem I've developed after I lengthened my ladies shaft to 45.5inches is I'm hitting a strong fade not a slice. So I'm trying out a stronger grip with my right hand and change my ball position, if anyone had a similar problem how did you fix "easy or problematic" please shaft any help appreciated...

[gmmiddle]

16 hours ago, Samsonite said:

I went from a stiff flex 60g to the CB Alta 40 4.0 (two flexes, two weights less), and while it hasn’t worked for everyone on this thread, I’m absolutely in love with the setup (I have the Gen 5 0311 XF, fwiw). Easy swing , easy distance, longest drives I’ve ever hit (to be fair, I’ve also been working a LOT on swing and with a coach, so…take that for what it’s worth). 

Thanks Samson. I should say that I had selected a-shaft, am looking between 45-55g, but there are a pretty solid selection of shafts there, some uplift some standard. I was going to select the riptide and then read the CB might not be optimal. I’m wondering if any of you shaft ho’s can look and provide insight. 
 

weak tip is key?

[azstu324]

5 hours ago, Bang60 said:

Played 16 holes today walking with some interesting results, I could of played the last 2 but didn't want to get to tired, on the 12th I hit the perfect drive 250 metres straightish down the middle with a little wind coming from 4/3 on the watch face. One problem I've developed after I lengthened my ladies shaft to 45.5inches is I'm hitting a strong fade not a slice. So I'm trying out a stronger grip with my right hand and change my ball position, if anyone had a similar problem how did you fix "easy or problematic" please shaft any help appreciated...

The only thing that I can think of is what you already mentioned with a slightly stronger grip as to turn the club over sooner, or maybe a more draw-biased stance moving your back foot about 3-5" backward to create more in to out path. Keep us posted on on how that turns out. The trick is finding that setup and rhythm and once you do it's as consistent as anything. 

[KnoxvilleReb]

I was reading through was is essentially an Otto Phlex thread on a different forum, and they mentioned how at 46” they needed to take all the weights out of their driver to get it down to a D1 swing weight. The problem being with the weights removed the smash factor plummeted. Has anyone here experienced this? Are there any lightweight driver heads out there that could work at 46” with a PLB without having to remove the weights?

[azstu324]

17 hours ago, gmmiddle said:

I'm looking at the PXG GEN5 0311 driver (7.5 degree) that is on sale, and curious which shafts most closely match the Otto goals.  I was initially going for the Riptide CB 50, but it looks like that isn't necessarily optimal.  Also, 46"? (I usually play +1.2").

So when @Samsoniteand I first started bouncing ideas around in the 0311 thread, the riptide was what we started out with. It's no doubt a great option for a Segway into this concept. I've still got mine as a backup in the event that something happens to my Garafalloy PLB 45g.. or it starts to misbehave. That said, I don't anticipate the PLB going anywhere anytime soon. 

If you go back through the thread, I think it can be agreed that the Garafalloy Pro Launch Blue 45g in L and A flex has probably been the most popular and consistent shaft in this experiment. I think equal parts due to availability, cost, and performance. Also, I would say that it likely more closely resembles the Autoflex profile and feel than the Riptide. 

as for length, it's really a matter of what you're most comfortable with while maintaining the D0-D1 swing weight. For reference, I'm 6' 2.5" and play the shaft at 45". I've been playing a 45" shaft for a few years so it's really what I'm most comfortable with and I feel that my performance results have been more than adequate.

With the 0311 head, I just needed to add 2.5g so I picked up a 10g weight to swap out one of the 7.5g. and I'm right below D1 SW. 

 

[azstu324]

15 minutes ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

I was reading through was is essentially an Otto Phlex thread on a different forum, and they mentioned how at 46” they needed to take all the weights out of their driver to get it down to a D1 swing weight. The problem being with the weights removed the smash factor plummeted. Has anyone here experienced this? Are there any lightweight driver heads out there that could work at 46” with a PLB without having to remove the weights?

I know that a lot of the Ping heads naturally come in a bit heavier so those have been a little more tricky to deal with. For those, I'd say that sticking with the original Riptide might be the trick.

The head that I started the experiment with (PXG 0311) is really my only field sample. I do know that had I kept the original weight configuration of 7.5, 7.5, 2.5, and played it at 46", the SW would have been right at D1 with the Garafalloy PLB 45g.

Once again here's a total head weight with the 10g, 7.5g, and 2.5g setup that I have now. So just deduct 2g or so and that would be a good model weight for a 46" 45g non-HBP shaft. 

[carter18]

42 minutes ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

I was reading through was is essentially an Otto Phlex thread on a different forum, and they mentioned how at 46” they needed to take all the weights out of their driver to get it down to a D1 swing weight. The problem being with the weights removed the smash factor plummeted. Has anyone here experienced this? Are there any lightweight driver heads out there that could work at 46” with a PLB without having to remove the weights?

Hey Reb,

I experienced this to a tee when I first went out. To get to a D1 weight I had to remove the sliding weight from my Calaway head. I was not on a launch monitor but did not like the sound of the club at all and could feel the difference. What you will need to do is add weight to the butt end of the club until you reach the desired swing weight. This will inevitably increase the total weight of the driver by a few grams, but I find it to be a much more satisfactory result. @Bobbers is the guru in helping you determine how much weight to add to achieve desired results.

[KnoxvilleReb]

25 minutes ago, azstu324 said:

I know that a lot of the Ping heads naturally come in a bit heavier so those have been a little more tricky to deal with. For those, I'd say that sticking with the original Riptide might be the trick.

The head that I started the experiment with (PXG 0311) is really my only field sample. I do know that had I kept the original weight configuration of 7.5, 7.5, 2.5, and played it at 46", the SW would have been right at D1 with the Garafalloy PLB 45g.

Once again here's a total head weight with the 10g, 7.5g, and 2.5g setup that I have now. So just deduct 2g or so and that would be a good model weight for a 46" 45g non-HBP shaft. 

That is interesting as you play the Gen 5, and I play the Gen 4 which is supposedly 2g lighter per the PXG website. My head came in the standard 2.5g x2 plus a 10g. I'll have to weigh it when I get home, as the website shows the Gen 5 to be 203g and yours is 198g. Thank you!

[KnoxvilleReb]

7 minutes ago, carter18 said:

Hey Reb,

I experienced this to a tee when I first went out. To get to a D1 weight I had to remove the sliding weight from my Calaway head. I was not on a launch monitor but did not like the sound of the club at all and could feel the difference. What you will need to do is add weight to the butt end of the club until you reach the desired swing weight. This will inevitably increase the total weight of the driver by a few grams, but I find it to be a much more satisfactory result. @Bobbers is the guru in helping you determine how much weight to add to achieve desired results.

I had the same thought on the grip weight but was worried adding the weights there would end up weighing down the shaft and counteract one of the main principles of dropping the shaft weight. Thanks!

[carter18]

7 minutes ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

I had the same thought on the grip weight but was worried adding the weights there would end up weighing down the shaft and counteract one of the main principles of dropping the shaft weight. Thanks!

I have the PLB in R and A flex and had to add butt weight to both to get to the desired swing weight. The added weight is under the grip and doesn't negatively affect the lightness of the shaft. Initially I ordered the R flex when I thought I was ordering the A. I went out to the range yesterday with the newly built A flex at just under D1. Range was closed as was the course. Fortunately, Nashville Metro courses allow free walkers on New Year's Day holiday. I walked 9 with the new build and the A flex seems to have incredible potential. I can't wait to get it on a monitor to see how the speed and carry correlate.

[KnoxvilleReb]

1 minute ago, carter18 said:

I have the PLB in R and A flex and had to add butt weight to both to get to the desired swing weight. The added weight is under the grip and doesn't negatively affect the lightness of the shaft. Initially I ordered the R flex when I thought I was ordering the A. I went out to the range yesterday with the newly built A flex at just under D1. Range was closed as was the course. Fortunately, Nashville Metro courses allow free walkers on New Year's Day holiday. I walked 9 with the new build and the A flex seems to have incredible potential. I can't wait to get it on a monitor to see how the speed and carry correlate.

What is your swing speed if you don't mind me asking? I'm at 95mph right now with my current gamer (60g Riptide CB stiff). I did order TheStack System last week with hopes of upping that to 100-105mph. I'm planning to order an A flex as that is two flexes lighter than my current driver, but wondering if I should really be buying the L flex.

[Rickp]

Been following this thread and the responses.  A short time ago picked up PXG 2011 driver with Cypher 40 5 Senior shaft.  Took a while to get used to it but I’m fine with now.  With me me it seems to be a tempo thing.  The last few rounds it’s been a great driver with a slight fade.  
Keep up the good work guys!!

[carter18]

12 minutes ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

What is your swing speed if you don't mind me asking? I'm at 95mph right now with my current gamer (60g Riptide CB stiff). I did order TheStack System last week with hopes of upping that to 100-105mph. I'm planning to order an A flex as that is two flexes lighter than my current driver, but wondering if I should really be buying the L flex.

Not at all! My playing swing speed is around 108-112. I was in an X flex Mitsibishi shaft and thought the R might work best. After reading @azstu324 first post though I really tried to replicate his set up. I am also 6' 2.5 as he mentioned and have a similar swing speed to what he initially posted.  I haven't really focused on speed training in a bit and probably need to get back to it. I have been working a lot on fast twitch muscle movements in the gym the last several weeks. When swinging for just speed I can hit low 120s but those are not swings I should bring to the course.  The fun part about this project that many people have echoed is the ease of the distance. The light flex really makes me think about tempo before I step to the plate. Nothing better than a smooth BOMB! 

[azstu324]

51 minutes ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

That is interesting as you play the Gen 5, and I play the Gen 4 which is supposedly 2g lighter per the PXG website. My head came in the standard 2.5g x2 plus a 10g. I'll have to weigh it when I get home, as the website shows the Gen 5 to be 203g and yours is 198g. Thank you!

Almost has me wondering if the weight posted on the site includes the adapter? I just went out and re weighed and it's still the same. And that's with an extra 2.5g

[KnoxvilleReb]

21 hours ago, azstu324 said:

Almost has me wondering if the weight posted on the site includes the adapter? I just went out and re weighed and it's still the same. And that's with an extra 2.5g

I weighed my standard Gen4 head this morning and it was 193g. So given that the Gen5 is 2g heavier and you added 2.5g to it, the 5 gram difference seems to be spot on. I guess they must include the adapter as part of the weight online. 
 

As someone currently gaming the GLPB, would you have any recommendation on grip weight and driver length that would fit a setup with a head 5 grams lighter than yours to get the desired D0-D1 swingweight? I ordered a basic swing weight scale yesterday but have never worked on clubs in my life so would prefer to order the GLPB in as close to ideal specs as possible. 

[David Leighton Reid]

I have some extra Otto Phlex type slightly used shafts.  If anyone is interested, please PM me for details and pictures.  

Edited January 4, 2023 by David Leighton Reid

[azstu324]

4 hours ago, KnoxvilleReb said:

I weighed my standard Gen4 head this morning and it was 193g. So given that the Gen5 is 2g heavier and you added 2.5g to it, the 5 gram difference seems to be spot on. I guess they must include the adapter as part of the weight online. 
 

As someone currently gaming the GLPB, would you have any recommendation on grip weight and driver length that would fit a setup with a head 5 grams lighter than yours to get the desired D0-D1 swingweight? I ordered a basic swing weight scale yesterday but have never worked on clubs in my life so would prefer to order the GLPB in as close to ideal specs as possible. 

So you can go about this from either end. Or both depending on your grip preferences. My obstacle was to get my SW up after shortening the shaft to play at 45" and building up a 53g grip to a no-taper mid size totaling around 60g. 

A decent option when trying to reduce handle weight is to look at Winn grips. They're usually good for about 2 SW points give/take.  Personally I'm not madly in love with Winn grips so I chose to find my extra SW through adding more to the head and then fine tuning with tape wraps.

Here are some general rules for -/+ SW points

Cutting 1/2″ off grip end of shaft 3 SW decrease

Adding 2 grams to clubhead 1 SW increase

Adding 5 grams to grip end of shaft 1 SW decrease

3 layers of masking buildup tape under grip 1 SW (ex: 90 g shaft=1 SW more than 80 g shaft)

Flattening lie angle 4 degrees 1 SW increase

Shaft weight difference of 9 grams 1 SW decrease

4.5 inches of normal 1/2 inch wide lead tape 1 SW point or 2 grams

3.15 inches of “high density” 1/2 inch wide lead tape 1 SW point or 2 grams