PGA tour driving distance and course length

[Bags]

Tiger came out on a pod cast this week and said we needed to limit golf ball distance for the pros LOL.

 

Really - Honestly for 8 yrs Ive been saying limiting golf ball distance and making courses long is NOT the answer.

 

Not rocket science Narrow the fairways and grow the rough up it s that simple. Im not saying hit ball in rough then you cant find ball or get hurt hitting ball out of rough. Im saying bring some strategy back into the pro game. When you make courses 7,400 plus that eliminates about 65-75% of the field. Narrow fairways and grow rough so big hitters have to find their way around the course plus this will give the complete field an opportunity to win not 25% of the field.

 

Curious to everyone s thoughts

 

 

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[hckymeyer]

I agree, that's always been the answer.  Letting the rough grow a little bit is easy though, narrowing a fairway is harder.  These courses might hold one event a year and the rest of the year it has to be playable for the rest of us.  I would guess it's a delicate balance between making it hard enough for the pro's but playable enough to keep the members happy.

 

I still completely agree though that the answer is in course design, not dialing back equipment again.

[dhartmann34]

I like the idea of growing the rough up and narrowing the fairways a bit. Adding additional distance is hard to do, and as was said, it eliminates a lot of good players. I hate to see guys only winning because they can bomb it to where they may not be in the fairway, but they can hit wedge or 9 iron in every time. Maybe firm the greens up a bit. I love watching the British Open and how those greens usually play. I'd rather see great putters and creative shot makers win.

 

 

 

 

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[tommc23]

I like the idea of growing the rough up and narrowing the fairways a bit. Adding additional distance is hard to do, and as was said, it eliminates a lot of good players. I hate to see guys only winning because they can bomb it to where they may not be in the fairway, but they can hit wedge or 9 iron in every time. Maybe firm the greens up a bit. I love watching the British Open and how those greens usually play. I'd rather see great putters and creative shot makers win.

 

 

 

 

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I think that has a lot to do with Zach Johnson not winning recently. Great putter and not long but he is hurt by the length of courses.

 

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[revkev]

I agree other than the fact that it eliminates 75 percent of the field. Filthy long extends very deep on pro tours these days. Narrowing the course and firming up the greens is a great way to insure that the guys hitting it best win but frankly that's generally the case.

 

It's just not the issue these guys are making it out to be. As he got older Jack called for rolling back the ball. He didn't do it when he was bashing it 30 yards past everyone. No surprise that Tiger would want the same thing.

 

 

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[Canucklehead]

I agree, but as Meyer mentioned about keeping regulars happy is walking a fine line. Firming up greens is another way I believe could cause some evening out of the field

 

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[Bags]

I agree, that's always been the answer. Letting the rough grow a little bit is easy though, narrowing a fairway is harder. These courses might hold one event a year and the rest of the year it has to be playable for the rest of us. I would guess it's a delicate balance between making it hard enough for the pro's but playable enough to keep the members happy.

 

I still completely agree though that the answer is in course design, not dialing back equipment again.

Great point wasnt thinking about after pro event and tournament is over. All I know longer courses and limited distance golf balls is not the answer in my opinion

 

 

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[silver & black]

There needs to be a change in mentality about course lay out. I love watching these guys stripe the ball 300 yds.+. But I really don't like watching the bomb drives and wedge/9 iron into the green on almost every hole.

 

If they can hit their drive 300 yds., put some trouble in the way at 295 - 310. Maybe they need to think about 3 wood instead, or, if they are feeling it.... go for it. There needs to be some risk/reward involved.

 

This wouldn't affect the average weekend golfer playing the course, as he would rarely ever approach those distances even with a driver.

[PMookie]

I agree! In addition to the narrowing, I agree with what one of the former pros said some years back: vary the length of the grass on the greens. One week have it roll 12, next week have it roll 8 or 9. Really screw with them so speeds of the green become a defense as well.

 

 

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[revkev]

I agree! In addition to the narrowing, I grew with what one of the former pros said some years back: vary the length of the grass on the greens. One week have it roll 12, next week have it roll 8 or 9. Really screw with them so speeds of the green become a defense as well.

 

 

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This is something that I'd like to see. At times it looks as if they are players nag the same course every week. It would be interesting to see how they handle course differences like this each week.

 

I get Meyer's point but frankly the Tour gets Florida courses at the easiest time of the year. Our rough is much tougher in July-September than in February-March even on ordinary courses.

 

You can actually make the courses a bit tighter for the pros. Since we don't hit it as far we miss far fewer fairways than they do. Ultimately I prefer light rough where they guy has to guess about his lie. Will it or won't it fly?

 

 

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[Bags]

I agree! In addition to the narrowing, I grew with what one of the former pros said some years back: vary the length of the grass on the greens. One week have it roll 12, next week have it roll 8 or 9. Really screw with them so speeds of the green become a defense as well.

 

 

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Id love to see that happen but prob never will

 

 

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[Kor.A.Door]

I agree, that's always been the answer. Letting the rough grow a little bit is easy though, narrowing a fairway is harder. These courses might hold one event a year and the rest of the year it has to be playable for the rest of us. I would guess it's a delicate balance between making it hard enough for the pro's but playable enough to keep the members happy.

 

I still completely agree though that the answer is in course design, not dialing back equipment again.

I think that narrowing the fairways and longer rough is the way to go, the way to combat this for the year round member play is to keep the rough short until the pros are coming. Then grow it out, and maybe leave it for a week or so to let the members play it that way to see how difficult it really is, but for day to day play just keep the rough short.

[STUDque]

OK so here's my take on this issue: No matter what you do to the course, you're benefiting one style of player and hurting another.

 

Q: Lengthen the course or dial back the ball?

A: Bombers still have advantage

 

 

Q: Narrow fairways? Deep Rough?

A: Straight player advantage

 

 

Q: Harden Greens?

A: Strong wedge/putter advantage

 

 

 

On any given tournament weekend, you'll see holes that possess each and every one of these characteristics. I'd say the powers that be already do an excellent job setting up the courses to ensure the most level playing field possible. This is evidenced by the variety in winners over the past X years. If the courses were slanted towards a particular style, you'd have one style of player winning week in and week out.

 

 

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[Kor.A.Door]

It's not that longer clubs and balls are bad in and of themselves, but it's kinda sad that some traditional old courses have been rendered too easy for pros (if they haven't been lengthened considerably) or they've had to move a lot of earth to stay challenging for pros (at considerable, unnecessary expense?). If the trend continues, will pros need 8,000-9,000 yd courses - exaggerating to make a point. What will that cost courses to accomodate?

 

Reminds of the aggressive iron de-lofting clubmakers have implemented and those who argue there's nothing wrong with it, I disagree and wish clubmakers had stayed with the classic club number/loft standards that used to be adhered to. That you can buy a 7 iron with 28.5 def loft, 34 deg loft or anything in between is horrible IMO. Again exaggerating to make the point, for those who argue de-lofting is fine, where do you stop? Would it be OK if one day your 9-iron was 21 degrees and you carried 9 wedges?

I would argue that the loft of each club doesn't matter, since we are only allowed 14 clubs, does it really matter what the bottom of the club says? Most people use 4-PW with 2-3 wedges, that's no different than the old system of 3-PW and using 1-2 wedges. It's just a numbering system. The quantity of clubs is the same. We dropped a “3 iron”, and added a wedge, but the lofts didn't change, just the number on the club changed. I guess I dont see why it bothers people so much.

[Kor.A.Door]

OK so here's my take on this issue: No matter what you do to the course, you're benefiting one style of player and hurting another.

 

Q: Lengthen the course or dial back the ball?

A: Bombers still have advantage

 

 

Q: Narrow fairways? Deep Rough?

A: Straight player advantage

 

 

Q: Harden Greens?

A: Strong wedge/putter advantage

 

 

 

On any given tournament weekend, you'll see holes that possess each and every one of these characteristics. I'd say the powers that be already do an excellent job setting up the courses to ensure the most level playing field possible. This is evidenced by the variety in winners over the past X years. If the courses were slanted towards a particular style, you'd have one style of player winning week in and week out.

 

 

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Being Professional golfer, wouldn't it make sense that you should be accurate, no matter how far you hit it. Not everyone can hit it far, but as professionals, they should be able to hit it straight, there has to be risk when you hit he ball 340. Some of these courses right now, there is minimal risk. Erin Hills was a perfect example, the course was set up so the wind would play a factor, no wind came, the course was wide open, and the bombers just hit bombs with little to no risk. Make that rough a little tougher, and then you bring some risk, as Pros, accuracy should be he most important aspect of their game.

[AH1980MN]

I don't think that should be the only measuring stick, though. Yes, they should be accurate- they are. Yes, they should be good putters- they are. They are also athletes, and skilled practitioners of golf- distance is a competitive advantage that comes with practice, conditioning, and talent. Any and all of these attributes should be rewarded- if this means different courses are set up differently throughout the season, great, but I tend to think they kind of are. I really think most tournament courses (with some exceptions, of course) have a good variety of holes, requiring pros to use all of their skills. The tournament committees and superintendents do a fine job, imo. Maybe they could tweak course setups week to week, but I don't think we should have a tour full of events that are designed to negate the hard work and talents of one group over another.

[Trout Bum]

I do t know what should be done but driver wedge golf is very boring to watch anymore, I loved it when they turned the ball on purpose and were rewarded with great iron play.

[Peanut05]

Being Professional golfer, wouldn't it make sense that you should be accurate, no matter how far you hit it. Not everyone can hit it far, but as professionals, they should be able to hit it straight, there has to be risk when you hit he ball 340. Some of these courses right now, there is minimal risk. Erin Hills was a perfect example, the course was set up so the wind would play a factor, no wind came, the course was wide open, and the bombers just hit bombs with little to no risk. Make that rough a little tougher, and then you bring some risk, as Pros, accuracy should be he most important aspect of their game.

I agree with this.  Of all the different styles of play to get the benefit, I would rather it be the ones that can hit the ball straight.  Some of the courses I play there isn't much difference between the fairway and rough, and sometimes the rough is an easier play.  Therefore, you just get up there and knock the heck out of it not caring where it goes since you'll still have a good lie.  That shouldn't be the case.  The rough is there to penalize you.  If there is no penalty, then why even have it at all. 

[Kor.A.Door]

I do t know what should be done but driver wedge golf is very boring to watch anymore, I loved it when they turned the ball on purpose and were rewarded with great iron play.

I also think that not every course every week should have crazy rough, all the majors should and few others, the other tournaments should have some penalty, but not break your wrist type penalties, that's reserved for US Open, and Augusta. If you miss the narrow fairway it should be difficult to play the next shot.

[revkev]

Actually Augusta didn't have rough until recently and even now it's light. That's actually brilliant because distance control is crucial there - it's hard to predict if the ball will fly or not out of the rough at Augusta.

 

Moderate rough and firm greens with tricky run offs works great for testing pros.

 

 

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[TBT]

Let the rough grow, narrow landing areas from 290-320 or so....honestly it's going to be hard to do much unless you built courses just for pros and that will never happen.

[revkev]

I was just reading USGAs Mike Davis' comments on the ball and trickle down costs. Nice Fantasy

 

The most expensive courses are private clubs many of which have no desire to host a tour event or major because of the disruption it causes. Upscale semi private clubs may wish to provide tour like conditions but that's their prerogative.

 

These guys need to get a grip and recognize that most people play golf to relax not t to be tortured into submission

 

 

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