Wedges 52.56.60 or 50.54.58?

[Beakbryce]

Gamed 50.54.58 for the last 12 years or so. Various Vokeys. The gap between my PW and 50, I just choke up on the PW. I am with several others here in that yardage gaps and how one copes with in between yardages determines the setup. This also depends on the ball you game. I have set yardages for chipping my wedges with a Pro V1. Lately, I have found more Pro V1X and they go 10 more yards than my set chipping stroke allows for. Screwing with my head. My point is you have to match your ball and the wedge set.

[10Hockey]

Definitely agree on getting rid of the 60 degree.  I play a 58 and my home course that  has super fast greens and you can open up a 58 and manage the shots just fine, along with the fact that you can get more distance to play less than 90 yards shots with the 58.  Yes tour players use a 60 but they also hit 100 shots a day practicing and when they are short sided on tour they need the 60 and more.  My gapping process starts with my pitching wedge and then moves to the higher lofted wedges to determine what I want in full to half swing yardages. 

 

[ChuckZ]

Have a 48 that matches my T300 set, then SM9 52.08, 56.10......have an extra SM7 58.12D custom......might swap it out with the 56, carry it when playing fluffy deep bunkers.....wedges are something that are very personal and not everyone plays the same.....four degrees is the normal gaps recommended by Titleist/Vokey......60 degree wedges are just not practical for most amateurs....requires a special touch to him them well....... 56.10 is an ideal sandwedge for most amateurs.....

 

[KC Golf]

I have 52/56/60. While I agree some people may find 60 a hard club to use. 

I used to mostly use a 56 around green side bunkers but now I have moved to a 60 and I seem to have better distance control and spin with it. 
The club I actual have problems with is a full swing 52. Which from my Arccos is a losing me a lot of shots compared to my PW, 56 and 60. 
I keep hitting my 52 fat or thin. So I am wondering if I should get re fit and see if my current swing needs a difference grind and bounce.  Another is whether I should go from a wedge flex shaft to a shaft matching my PW which is lighter. 

These replies are starting to get me thinking. This could be costly!

7 hours ago, Oudefart said:

IMO and experience as a fitter for the last 10 years, along with spending an inordinate amount of time with PGA Class-A pros, a 60* wedge is probably the most wasted wedge/purchase of amateur golfers.

They don’t know how to play them, they’re typically too low a bounce.   Put a club in your bag that actually helps.

 

[TR1PTIK]

For the longest time I was a 52, 56, 60 player and then I went to 50, 54, 58 to fix a gapping issue. Now, I go straight from my PW (47*) to a 54 and then 58 (wanted 60 but it wasn't available). Yes, it leaves a big gap between my set PW and my specialized 54, but I've learned how to dial back the PW and can also juice the 54 in situations if I really need to. Most of the time, I'm hitting less than full with my 54 and 58 and can cover a variety of distances and trajectories with both clubs. It's allowed me to carry an additional club at the top end of my bag and I've never been happier with my setup even though I still have never been fit for clubs.

Don't get too hung up on the "correct" lofts. Take the time to experiment and find what works best for your individual game.

[Javs]

3 hours ago, ChuckZ said:

Have a 48 that matches my T300 set, then SM9 52.08, 56.10......have an extra SM7 58.12D custom......might swap it out with the 56, carry it when playing fluffy deep bunkers.....wedges are something that are very personal and not everyone plays the same.....four degrees is the normal gaps recommended by Titleist/Vokey......60 degree wedges are just not practical for most amateurs....requires a special touch to him them well....... 56.10 is an ideal sandwedge for most amateurs.....

 

Interesting thought on the 60 degree wedge. There are many different takes on wedge setups. When you say most amateurs, I believe that is too wide a range. Example zero to five handicaps surely can handle 60 degree wedges. Dave Pelz would also disagree with your assessment on the 60 degree wedge. His thought is most golfers need more loft in their wedges. My experience is that I don’t need to do anything special to hit a full 60 degree wedge. Now if you are speaking of shots around the green like flop, bump and run or open face shots. Then I believe the bounce and sole relief matter more than the loft of the club. Also this starts to enter into setup and execution. There is no magic if one knows the basics in setup and execution for the pitch and chips. I always address it as what do you want the ball to do and then setup and execute the shot. Example you don’t setup for a flop with the ball back and forward shaft lean. You will dig in and hit behind it. However, ball forward face open shaft straight to slightly back and swing through the shot. A 60 will come out higher and land softer. Same with chipping. It depends on what you want the ball to do and distance it has to travel and how much fringe. Lots of variables that could dictate the shot. At the end of the day, I believe your wedge setup comes down to what you are trying to achieve. What do you need your wedges to provide couple with the conditions you play.

[brogies]

I have PW and GWs of my JPX 921 Forged at 44º and 48º and then play 52º and 56º wedges. I don't have a desire at this point to play any wedges higher than 56º. But as others have mentioned, the degree isn't as crucial as the necessary yardages. Here are mine:

PW: 135 yards

GW: 125 yards

52º: 110-115 yards

56º: 95-100 yards

[Willie T]

Current irons have a 46* PW - so I can go 52* and 58* or 50-54-58 (all are Cleveland CBX).  What tend to do is center on either the 52 or 54 for my utility do about everything wedge….the 58 for those pop up short sided moments.  It really depends on your personal skills and what works for you.  Shafts are Cleveland Wedge flex graphite.  

[cptnkirkdog]

52, 56, 60….My 9 iron is at 40, PW at 44, Gap at 48. Love having about 12 yard gaps from 150 yards in down to 90 yards with full shots.  Oh, and they’re all one length

[PapaRolex]

52, 56, 60 

[Wakit300]

Actually 50/55/60 for me.  My pw is 46

[ChuckZ]

18 hours ago, Javs said:

Interesting thought on the 60 degree wedge. There are many different takes on wedge setups. When you say most amateurs, I believe that is too wide a range. Example zero to five handicaps surely can handle 60 degree wedges. Dave Pelz would also disagree with your assessment on the 60 degree wedge. His thought is most golfers need more loft in their wedges. My experience is that I don’t need to do anything special to hit a full 60 degree wedge. Now if you are speaking of shots around the green like flop, bump and run or open face shots. Then I believe the bounce and sole relief matter more than the loft of the club. Also this starts to enter into setup and execution. There is no magic if one knows the basics in setup and execution for the pitch and chips. I always address it as what do you want the ball to do and then setup and execute the shot. Example you don’t setup for a flop with the ball back and forward shaft lean. You will dig in and hit behind it. However, ball forward face open shaft straight to slightly back and swing through the shot. A 60 will come out higher and land softer. Same with chipping. It depends on what you want the ball to do and distance it has to travel and how much fringe. Lots of variables that could dictate the shot. At the end of the day, I believe your wedge setup comes down to what you are trying to achieve. What do you need your wedges to provide couple with the conditions you play.

Those scratch level players can handle that wedge but that only represent about 14% ( 1.47 % 0 - + and 11.7% 1-5 handicaps) of the golfers that play in the US as amateurs.  My info is based on conversations with PGA instructors/teachers, certified fitters and sales reps.  My contacts have been in the business over 25 years.  It may have been seen as a wide range but felt it was rather accurate.  Most in my opinion would have been considered a larger number.  Play well.  When I was younger I carried a 64*, but no more.  My handicap was a 6 and now at 77 it is a 19.  The population is getting older, we boomers are living longer and the average handicap is 14.42.  Cheers.       

[Javs]

1 hour ago, ChuckZ said:

Those scratch level players can handle that wedge but that only represent about 14% ( 1.47 % 0 - + and 11.7% 1-5 handicaps) of the golfers that play in the US as amateurs.  My info is based on conversations with PGA instructors/teachers, certified fitters and sales reps.  My contacts have been in the business over 25 years.  It may have been seen as a wide range but felt it was rather accurate.  Most in my opinion would have been considered a larger number.  Play well.  When I was younger I carried a 64*, but no more.  My handicap was a 6 and now at 77 it is a 19.  The population is getting older, we boomers are living longer and the average handicap is 14.42.  Cheers.       

I understand where you were coming from on the statement. I just think it is dependent. I play with several double digits that their weakness is not the short game. I think this site had a great review /article on wedge fitting 101. I still believe that loft of the club is not what hinders shots as much as improper lie, bounce, leading and trail edge and shaft.  We all have contacts that have been in the business a long time. They also all have their opinions. Like I gave as an example, Pelz has his thoughts. He has made a living in the short game. Mostly with non- professional players. His thought is more bounce and loft is required. I also offered that really it comes down to what you are trying to achieve with the s*** and the conditions you play. Someone that only hits full shots and square face chips is different than someone that hits various distances and trajectories with a varying club face (square or open). My point was one size doesn’t fit most in the wedge game. 

[Charles Lechair]

I have a 52, 56, 60 right now, but kind of want to either bend or get new wedges at 50, 54, 58 (or 59-60)

Got my wedges when i had a jacked up 17* PW, but now i have a 46 so could use weaker wedges to gap a bit better. I hit a ton of punchy, knockdown PWs by necessity in the 120-140 range

[cksurfdude]

Guess I do things a little differently...

Current setup.. PW @ 42 and set GW @ 48 .. so haha 6 degrees of separation .. then 54° all around utility wedge and then the apparently widely despised 60° LW.

And yes I'm a high handicapper.

60 - didn't really start hitting this until last season, and have practiced with it a LOT since. Previously I carried a 58 and I find the extra loft helpful in some greenside situations, but it is not my most used wedge.

54 - this is the loft that I've been playing for a bunch of years .. across a few different wedges .. so I'm more comfortable sticking with this loft. Again, I spend a LOT of practice time with wedges - varying distances, targets, trajectories, etc.

48/GW - most common situations for me to grab this wedge are full-ish approach shots and short bump and runs from just off the green.

So, currently, this setup is what seems to be working well for me. 

Like anything else where you're working with your hands, use the right tool for the job

[mackdaddy]

Depends on the pitching wedges loft.  I like 4* between wedges.  My pitching wedge is 46* so 50* then 54* and 58*.  If I had 44* pitching wedge like many sets today come I would plat 48*, 52*, 56* and 60*.

[Kansas King]

On 5/15/2023 at 5:31 PM, Javs said:

Interesting thought on the 60 degree wedge. There are many different takes on wedge setups. When you say most amateurs, I believe that is too wide a range. Example zero to five handicaps surely can handle 60 degree wedges. Dave Pelz would also disagree with your assessment on the 60 degree wedge. His thought is most golfers need more loft in their wedges. My experience is that I don’t need to do anything special to hit a full 60 degree wedge. Now if you are speaking of shots around the green like flop, bump and run or open face shots. Then I believe the bounce and sole relief matter more than the loft of the club. Also this starts to enter into setup and execution. There is no magic if one knows the basics in setup and execution for the pitch and chips. I always address it as what do you want the ball to do and then setup and execute the shot. Example you don’t setup for a flop with the ball back and forward shaft lean. You will dig in and hit behind it. However, ball forward face open shaft straight to slightly back and swing through the shot. A 60 will come out higher and land softer. Same with chipping. It depends on what you want the ball to do and distance it has to travel and how much fringe. Lots of variables that could dictate the shot. At the end of the day, I believe your wedge setup comes down to what you are trying to achieve. What do you need your wedges to provide couple with the conditions you play.

I agree with this. If a golfer knows how to actually use a wedge, there is no reason they can't play a 60* regardless of handicap. I will say this until I die, if a golfer can properly learn to use the bounce on a wedge, their short game will improve 10-fold. Most golfers have never truly learned to use the bounce on a wedge. I will say that I think there are too many low bounce wedges on the racks at golf shops. High lofts (any loft really) and low bounce are a recipe for chunks and inconsistent wedge play unless you truly are playing courses with rock hard ground and tight lies. I also think there are too many higher lofted wedges with too narrow of soles on golf shop racks as well. I'm happy to see more forgiving wedge designs becoming available like the CBX. However, I don't think these chunky cavity back designs are really all that necessary if they would just make some of the soles on traditional wedges a little wider which will effectively increase bounce. They're not as sexy but they would perform. IMO, the majority of forgiveness and playability in a wedge comes down to the sole design. The MOI and CG in a wedge is far less important in relation to a wedges forgiveness as the ball has more of a glancing strike.

For me it's a tragedy that Callaway stopped making the PM grind wedge. Those wedges are a perfect combination of bounce, sole width, leading edge shape and sharpness, and relief grinds. I so rarely chunk that thing and I'm confident that I can slam the bounce of that wedge hard into the ground on any shot and know it won't dig. Alas, my PM grind wedges are starting to get worn and I'm looking for a replacement. 

[Javs]

6 hours ago, Kansas King said:

I agree with this. If a golfer knows how to actually use a wedge, there is no reason they can't play a 60* regardless of handicap. I will say this until I die, if a golfer can properly learn to use the bounce on a wedge, their short game will improve 10-fold. Most golfers have never truly learned to use the bounce on a wedge. I will say that I think there are too many low bounce wedges on the racks at golf shops. High lofts (any loft really) and low bounce are a recipe for chunks and inconsistent wedge play unless you truly are playing courses with rock hard ground and tight lies. I also think there are too many higher lofted wedges with too narrow of soles on golf shop racks as well. I'm happy to see more forgiving wedge designs becoming available like the CBX. However, I don't think these chunky cavity back designs are really all that necessary if they would just make some of the soles on traditional wedges a little wider which will effectively increase bounce. They're not as sexy but they would perform. IMO, the majority of forgiveness and playability in a wedge comes down to the sole design. The MOI and CG in a wedge is far less important in relation to a wedges forgiveness as the ball has more of a glancing strike.

For me it's a tragedy that Callaway stopped making the PM grind wedge. Those wedges are a perfect combination of bounce, sole width, leading edge shape and sharpness, and relief grinds. I so rarely chunk that thing and I'm confident that I can slam the bounce of that wedge hard into the ground on any shot and know it won't dig. Alas, my PM grind wedges are starting to get worn and I'm looking for a replacement. 

Perfectly stated!

[Beakbryce]

On 5/15/2023 at 4:30 PM, brogies said:

I have PW and GWs of my JPX 921 Forged at 44º and 48º and then play 52º and 56º wedges. I don't have a desire at this point to play any wedges higher than 56º. But as others have mentioned, the degree isn't as crucial as the necessary yardages. Here are mine:

PW: 135 yards

GW: 125 yards

52º: 110-115 yards

56º: 95-100 yards

What do you do to hit from less than 95? Choke up, clock code, feel it? Just curious.

[Javs]

3 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

What do you do to hit from less than 95? Choke up, clock code, feel it? Just curious.

Interesting question. From 120 and in I play a variety of shots. I will use different wedges and either hit fill, three quarters, half or one quarter based on the shot. I also grip up , midway and all the way down depending on shot and trajectory. My bread and butter wedge shot is the low driving shot that hits and stops. Love that shot! However, from 120 in, I believe it’s all feel and creativity!!!

[NM01]

11 minutes ago, Beakbryce said:

What do you do to hit from less than 95? Choke up, clock code, feel it? Just curious.

I can’t hit anywhere from a 9i to nearly full sw(rarely will do this).

Depends on where the pin is, lie and green conditions. Choke up is usually part of it, swing length and speed. Faster speed for more spin and lower flight, slower and longer for higher flight. Not really a clock but more feeling lead arm parallel of just past it

[barryschwartz56]

I recently had a similar situation.  My new TM P790s have a 45 degree PW, and my Hogan wedges were 52,56 and 60.  I found the 7 degree gap too large.  My solution was to purchase a 55 degree Edison wedge (that I absolutely love) and have my 52 degree Hogan bent to 50 degrees, so now I have 5 degree gaps with all my wedges and it seems to be working quite well.  

[brogies]

On 5/18/2023 at 4:32 PM, Beakbryce said:

What do you do to hit from less than 95? Choke up, clock code, feel it? Just curious.

It's all feel. I have a decent idea of how far back I need to go for various distances under 95-100.

[Swood1994]

Basically just reiterating what everyone else said at this point but it depends on current yardages and feel with you current wedges. If you like them but the gap is too bumig between the new PW and 52 you could always get a 48° wedge to fill it. 
 

my set wedge was a 46. I could hit it comfortably 140-145 and when needed really stretch it’s legs to 150. I swapped it for a 46° vokey and now hit it 135 on the money. So I changed out my 52.56.60 to a 46.50.54.58 setup. I will say I lost a little green side versatility and flop shots became a little tricky (also increased the bounce). I think the 58-60-62 degree wedges are pretty interchangeable as most of the time you aren’t hitting a full shot with it.  
 

all in all it just depends on the yardages you need to hit and your comfortable with and finding club(s) that fit those yardages. I know some people who have a set GW at 50° and a specialty 50° on the bag because they go a specific yardage and it works for their bag. 

[scubahoops]

This is a very interesting topic and I have some thoughts and a question.  I agree that for the most part 60* is a bit much but it isn't much different from 58* and I prefer a little added loft, the greens I play tend to be small and firm so I need help stopping the ball and I am not using the club for distance.  

I have always wondered where you should cut off your regular irons and switch to a true wedge and why?  In the clubs I am playing the PW is 45* and in my old set that was basically the 9. So I ordered an AW that came in at 50* which is basically what my old PW was and I only carry 2 true wedges, a 54 and 60. I use the AW mostly for full shots at 125 yds and then chipping and pitches around the green but nothing where I open the face at all.  The 54 is great for sand and shots around the green as well as some almost full shots around 110 yds.  Then the 60 is just for getting up and down and I rarely use it for full or almost full swings. Am I missing out by not having another 'wedge' in my bag at 50*?    Both my 54* and 60* are low bounce since I play in the desert and the courses are often quite firm but I do have some older wedges I will swap if I play in different conditions. 

[Javs]

9 minutes ago, scubahoops said:

This is a very interesting topic and I have some thoughts and a question.  I agree that for the most part 60* is a bit much but it isn't much different from 58* and I prefer a little added loft, the greens I play tend to be small and firm so I need help stopping the ball and I am not using the club for distance.  

I have always wondered where you should cut off your regular irons and switch to a true wedge and why?  In the clubs I am playing the PW is 45* and in my old set that was basically the 9. So I ordered an AW that came in at 50* which is basically what my old PW was and I only carry 2 true wedges, a 54 and 60. I use the AW mostly for full shots at 125 yds and then chipping and pitches around the green but nothing where I open the face at all.  The 54 is great for sand and shots around the green as well as some almost full shots around 110 yds.  Then the 60 is just for getting up and down and I rarely use it for full or almost full swings. Am I missing out by not having another 'wedge' in my bag at 50*?    Both my 54* and 60* are low bounce since I play in the desert and the courses are often quite firm but I do have some older wedges I will swap if I play in different conditions. 

I would recommend a wedge fitting. Test several types of wedges. Particularly different bounces and toe designs. You might be surprised at which wedge and bounce combos work for you.

[Preeway]

1 minute ago, Javs said:

I would recommend a wedge fitting. Test several types of wedges. Particularly different bounces and toe designs. You might be surprised at which wedge and bounce combos work for you.

100% agree

[Swood1994]

15 minutes ago, scubahoops said:

This is a very interesting topic and I have some thoughts and a question.  I agree that for the most part 60* is a bit much but it isn't much different from 58* and I prefer a little added loft, the greens I play tend to be small and firm so I need help stopping the ball and I am not using the club for distance.  

I have always wondered where you should cut off your regular irons and switch to a true wedge and why?  In the clubs I am playing the PW is 45* and in my old set that was basically the 9. So I ordered an AW that came in at 50* which is basically what my old PW was and I only carry 2 true wedges, a 54 and 60. I use the AW mostly for full shots at 125 yds and then chipping and pitches around the green but nothing where I open the face at all.  The 54 is great for sand and shots around the green as well as some almost full shots around 110 yds.  Then the 60 is just for getting up and down and I rarely use it for full or almost full swings. Am I missing out by not having another 'wedge' in my bag at 50*?    Both my 54* and 60* are low bounce since I play in the desert and the courses are often quite firm but I do have some older wedges I will swap if I play in different conditions. 

I would say it’s completely dependent on what you want out the clubs. You’re not necessarily “missing out” by not carrying an additional wedge so long as the PW and AW in your iron set are filling a gap/need.

Speaking from experience I used a 60 my whole golf career up until last season I switched to a 58. I saw a massive change in how I had to play shots around the green. Depending on the course I find myself throwing my old 60 in the bag for the exact reason you said that I need a little more loft to stop the ball. 
 

I will say the biggest improvement for me was adding a 46° specialty wedge and removing my PW from my set. It is way more versatile and I love the bump and run shot more now than ever. 
 

I feel like a broken record to my original response to this thread but it really is all about identifying a gap or need in your bag and filling it. Wether it’s with a set wedge or specialty wedge. There is no right answer here. 

Edited May 23, 2023 by Swood1994

[Golf2Much]

Because of various physical limitations, my game can be characterized as being short off the tee, short with fairway woods on my approach and relying on my short game to score.  Until fairly recently, I carried Ping G30's and Edison wedges.  My G30 pitching wedge was 45 degrees and the Edison wedges were 50, 55 and 60 degrees.  As mentioned by others, I control my backswing to yield a host of different yardages to the pin.  I have to agree with @RickyBobby_PR in that which club to use is situational based on how much green you have to work with, conditions, etc. 

I was curious on which clubs I used the most when approaching and around the green, so I went back to my Shot Scope data an pulled up last year's data.   I separated out both my approach shots (50-100 yards in) and short game (within 50 yards) to see which clubs I used and how often.  Here is a graph of the data:

Though PW through my 55 degree sand wedge account for 85% of those shots, there are still situations that dictate using other clubs in your bag.  

Most recently, I've added the Callaway Paradym X irons in my bag.  This created a slightly different dynamic given their stronger lofts.  The shorter Paradym X irons were four degrees stronger than the G30's.  So, I had to add the Callaway "A wedge" (at 46 degrees) between their pitching wedge (41 degrees) and my 50 degree Edison gap wedge to maintain some gapping consistency.  My battle was which club I had to drop to add the approach wedge.  Initially, I dropped my 3 wood to keep the 60 degree wedge in my bag.  After about a month, I swapped the 3 wood for the 60 degree wedge.  I found I had more opportunities to take advantage of the 3 wood's extra yardage than the tight pin situations where I relied on the 60 degree wedge.   As mentioned before, it's all personal preference.