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fixyurdivot
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I'm currently reading Tom's book "The Search for the Perfect Golf Club" - a really good read thus far, particularly if your a technical detail geek like myself.  I've heard of him over the years and very early in my time with the forum, one of our members suggested his irons when I was searching for my PE2 replacements.  I can honestly say that I've never run across anyone playing his sticks. His website shows a pretty large population of club fitters around the globe that fit for his products.  Anyone on the forum currently or previously playing his products?  

Initially I saw that Wishon Golf was located in Durango, CO and that got me excited as it's not too far out of the way to travel in route to AZ.  But I see that Wishon sold his business to Diamond Golf in West Sussex in 2016.... bummer.  Does anyone know where the Wishon products are made?

 

 

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:ping-small: G410 Plus, 9 Degree Driver 

:ping-small: G400 SFT, 16 Degree 3w

:ping-small: G400 SFT, 19 Degree 5w

:srixon-small:  ZX5 Irons 4-AW 

:ping-small: Glide 2.0 56 Degree SW   (removed from double secret probation 😍)

:ping-small: B61 Putter  (Currently Testing Evnroll ER5v)

 

 

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My personal opinion, he's always had a cult type following of fans.  I read the book many years ago before I started learning about clubs.  It was interesting to me at the time.   I reached out at that time to one of his fitters in our area, who was ranked among the best in the state.   I went for a fitting (at his home garage studio) he was a nice guy and spent a lot of time with me during the fitting, and built two clubs for me a 7 iron and wedge.  I didn't love either one and I didn't see the value in them compared to a set of PING's I was looking at at the same time.

I kind of turn a deaf ear to everyone who says he's the gospel when it comes to club tech and knowledge.  I have spoken to several other club builders and R&D guys who dispute a lot of his beliefs or maybe a better way of saying it is that, his thoughts haven't kept up with current and modern equipment. 

I have no idea where or what he's doing now, and not must interest in knowing personally. 

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:titelist-small: TSi2 16.5 FW with GD AD IZ 6 Shaft

:ping-small:  G410 FW 7 Alta CB R flex 

:ping-small: G410 Hybrid 26 degree Alta CB R Flex

:titelist-small: T100S/T200 Combo 5-7 T100S 8-P T200 TT Black Oynx R Flex

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Tom is basically retired and as you mentioned, has sold his business over to Diamond Golf in the UK.  He said he was going to continue to do consulting work on the designs but not handle the day to day business operations anymore.  Honestly, I hope he's not consulting with the design because the last few designs they have put out haven't been very good looking.  The putter line is absolutely cheap box set looking.  The new EQ1-NX irons are pretty decent and well designed but they haven't really come out with another major driver design since the 919thi.  The SHPR driver also looks decent but is a small, 435cc driver with a higher COG and more spin designed to work the ball more.  I can't imagine there being much demand for a product like that.

The shaft bend profile database program also died and hasn't been updated in close to a decade.  Tom posted a long time ago that they would be continuing to work on it but that never happened.

Tom definitely had a wealth of knowledge back in the day but overall I also believe he isn't keeping current with modern club design.  There really isn't anyone picking up the reigns either and I'm predicting the brand will all but vanish in another 5 years or so.

 

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I golfed with a few people using new Wishon sets this year and they really like them. It's really all about the fitting and trying them out. Wishon's hybrids and players irons seem to be the favorites among his lineup. I too have read his book and liked it. I would say keep your mind open about golf equipment. I wouldn't necessarily limit my search to strictly Wishon but they may be a good starting place. Wishon clubs are good and are probably cheaper now than what the big OEMs would get for a set of clubs. Regarding technology, I don't think a properly fit set of Wishon's would be inferior to any other popular clubs.

1 hour ago, Golfspy_CG2 said:

I have spoken to several other club builders and R&D guys who dispute a lot of his beliefs or maybe a better way of saying it is that, his thoughts haven't kept up with current and modern equipment. 

I have yet to hear or see anything that can specifically debunk his or Maltby's methods. Their methods are logical and simple and also rely on hard data like any other method. The only thing that has changed since he wrote his last book is iron lofts have gotten strong and iron faces continue to get hotter. However, none of the changes in golf equipment over the last decade have changed any of the fundamental characteristics of a proper fitting.

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I've been gaming them since I joined the forum. I love playing them and did a bit of a review of mine this year for my 3 year anniversary of joining the forum. I'm not the only one who games them either we have a few who do here on the forum. I think there are two other than me.

I enjoyed the fitting I went in knowing what I wanted because I had an idea of what I wanted but he fit me to the shafts and we picked out the two sets of irons that were what I wanted. They have held up phenomenally well for 3 years gaming them nearly weekly and sometimes more than once a week.

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I'm gonna follow this topic as I have just this week gone thru three separate fitting appointments with a local guy here in town (been around since the 90's).   I am pretty positive that I am going to be fitted with some Wishon heads, altho not entirely sure which model. I hit his personal set, which were pretty spot on to my fitting profile, and was adding 15-25+ yards per club. As I keep telling my fitter, "I don't know what I don't know, so enlighten me" as I've been out of the game for 20 years.  That said, I've never played "name" clubs, so I don't know any different, but from hitting my Adams Ideatech A40sr 7i 130y to his Wishon 575 7i 165yds I was sold on Tom's design. And yes, I know it's much more than just the head. 

Looking forward to future comments.

  

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Wishon Single Length 6-AW w/ Veylix Alpina shafts

Wishon 929 4w/Acer 7w / 11w w/ LAGP Reign Silver Shafts

Taylormade MG Hi-Toe 54d / Taylormade MG Hi-Toe 58d 

Ray Cook Silver Ray 595 / Sub70 Sycamore 004 (on order)

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On 10/8/2020 at 6:31 AM, fixyurdivot said:

I'm currently reading Tom's book "The Search for the Perfect Golf Club" - a really good read thus far, particularly if your a technical detail geek like myself.  I've heard of him over the years and very early in my time with the forum, one of our members suggested his irons when I was searching for my PE2 replacements.  I can honestly say that I've never run across anyone playing his sticks. His website shows a pretty large population of club fitters around the globe that fit for his products.  Anyone on the forum currently or previously playing his products?  

Initially I saw that Wishon Golf was located in Durango, CO and that got me excited as it's not too far out of the way to travel in route to AZ.  But I see that Wishon sold his business to Diamond Golf in West Sussex in 2016.... bummer.  Does anyone know where the Wishon products are made?

You don't have to go searching for the Perfect Golf Club.  Peter Kessler had one years ago...   🤣

1429907712_perfectclub.jpg.3276b3084516e3f8c3117f4044d97d91.jpg

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We don’t stop playing the game because we get old; we get old because we stop playing the game.”

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I had a 919 driver, 3 wood and Scor wedges made up for me about 7 years ago by a local fitter.  The driver worked as good or better at the time than any other I had tried.  My swing eventually grew out of the shaft.

When my kids started playing I went to the same fitter and had the driver head reshafted for my oldest daughter that was twelve.  Had both girls fitted for maltby irons and hybrids I had not heard of before.  Both girls still play the irons and hybrids.  My youngest daughter started playing the Wishon driver this year with great results.

The fitter I used would buy multiple sets of previous generation heads at a good deal (same with aftermarket shafts) and passed it along to me.  Was able to get both sets for the girls for less than cheap box sets would cost and they got very high quality equipment.  If budget was a concern I would go this route again for myself and the kids.

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Driver - Callaway Rogue Draw

Woods - Callaway Rogue 5 wood

Hybrid - Titleist TS2 21 degree

Irons - Taylormade P790 5-PW

Wedges - Ping Glide 2.0 52-56-60

Putter - Mizuno Black Carbon BC3

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  • 3 months later...
On 10/8/2020 at 9:59 AM, 03trdblack said:

Tom is basically retired and as you mentioned, has sold his business over to Diamond Golf in the UK.  He said he was going to continue to do consulting work on the designs but not handle the day to day business operations anymore.  Honestly, I hope he's not consulting with the design because the last few designs they have put out haven't been very good looking.  The putter line is absolutely cheap box set looking.  The new EQ1-NX irons are pretty decent and well designed but they haven't really come out with another major driver design since the 919thi.  The SHPR driver also looks decent but is a small, 435cc driver with a higher COG and more spin designed to work the ball more.  I can't imagine there being much demand for a product like that.

The shaft bend profile database program also died and hasn't been updated in close to a decade.  Tom posted a long time ago that they would be continuing to work on it but that never happened.

Tom definitely had a wealth of knowledge back in the day but overall I also believe he isn't keeping current with modern club design.  There really isn't anyone picking up the reigns either and I'm predicting the brand will all but vanish in another 5 years or so.

 

His driver hasn’t changed other than a paint stripe because tech HAS NOT changed. Same shafts same heads. The rules are there. Spec rules decide it. No change in rules. No change in clubs. No one can make a better driver head than is being made. Wishon has the foundry’s check the specs more often. Since he isn’t forging a million head I’m sure it’s easier to make his club head better. I just bought the eq1-Nx single length set to replace a 10year old set of irons. The 4 hybrid sells the set.
Also Clubfitters aren’t salesmen and Clubmakers aren’t there to help them. Although companies like wishon would do anything to help they don’t have the Titleist bank to advertise to get fitted (he did write 11 books 2 best sellers on the subject- but new players aren’t reading those) It also goes against the business model of the industry:  to buy another set of irons(your 5th)  Because you suck with this set(your 4th- but these are ping?!) 

For those that havent seen wishon have you seen muira at the local course? On the pga? I doubt you’ve seen either. Think on that one. 
Email Tom wishon he will help fit you. He is easy to contact. 
his clubs head aren’t great to look at. He designs them for golf. Not to look at. 
also on the fitting my new set is single length so you can tell which club is which from there weight. My other set is tip matched. You can hit  ball and it feels the same no matter the club. 9 iron and 4 iron exact same feel. Same swing weight same tip flex. Only a fitter can do that. 

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  • 2 weeks later...

I have a great deal of respect for Tom and his knowledge.  Problem is that much of the technology has changed since he has retired and the years before he retired he wasn't really doing a lot of research (or it didn't seem like it) other than the Sterling Single Length irons which were really designed by Jaacob Bowden and Tom helped out with.

 

His 919THI driver was excellent.  At one time it was about as great of a driver head as you could find.  High MOI head with a classic shape.  Kind of a better version to the Ping G400 Max as it didn't launch and spin as high as the G400 Max but was as forgiving (I own the 425Max and it's not as forgiving, but spins less and launches lower than the G400 Max). 

 

I did have problems with the face of the 919THI cracking after about 18 months of use.  I was hitting a lot of balls with the driver back then, but almost on cue, the face would crack on 18 months.  They would always replace the head free of charge and apologize.  However when they went to the longer hosel in the 919THI to help with flattening out the lie angle if you choose to do so, it completely changed the CoG of the head.  The head felt completely different to me.  Very tinny, sounded different and didn't perform nearly as well.  I had a friend measure the CoG on the GolfMechanix CoG machine and he said it had the CoG the highest up on the face and the closest to the heel of any driver they had measured.  I didn't have the old models of the 919THI to give my friend to measure, but I firmly believe that the long neck design altered the CoG and it changed the club's CoG.  And it went from being arguably the best driver head on the market to being a head more suited for hackers.

 

I had Tom's 555M blades.  Some of the best blades I had ever hit.  Unfortunately I hit so many balls with them the grooves were shot on a few of the irons and he discontinued making the model.  It's a shame because I think he really had a great design there.

 

His 929 fairway woods were excellent.  I just tend to have misses towards the toe and the 929 weren't as forgiving off the toe as I hoped.  But I could hit some bombs with the 929 fairway metals.

 

I had the 575MMC irons.  Some of the best feeling irons you'll find on the market, but the low bounce angles combined with the grind just didn't suit me.  Others could like it.

 

I did like his S2S steel iron shafts.  His graphite shafts just didn't work for me.

 

Tom was anti-'jacking up the lofts' with the irons.  He preferred to keep driver shafts under 45 inches long.  I am a believer that the MOI matching is something that is very much in the right direction and is far superior to swingweight and swingweight matching.  However, I think it needs to be researched further as to how much MOI matching alters launch and spin.  My gut tells me there is something better out there with regards to the heft of the club and fitting that for the golfer to improve performance.  Unfortunately Tom is the only one who had the cajones, brains and determination to help come out with MOI matching.  He's retired now and none of the other manufacturers are going to look into it anytime soon.

 

 

3JACK

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Author of Pro Golf Synopsis. The Moneyball approach to golf strategy and analysis.Driver: Wishon 919THI, 10° loft, UST Mamiya VTS Red 7x, 44-3/8” long, 2,825 kg/cm^2 MOIGONZO WOOD: confidential2-Hybrid: Mizuno Fli-HiCLK, 17° loft, 40-7/8" KBS Tour Hybrid shaft (stiff)3-Hybrid: Mizuno Fli-HiCLK, 20° loft, 40" KBS Tour Hybrid shaft (stiff)4-6 iron: Wishon 575MMC (CB)7-PW: Wishon 575MMC (MB)SW: Edel Golf driver grind, 52° loft, 16° bounce, Nippon WV 125 shaft.LW: Edel Golf Digger Grind, 60° loft, 27° bounce, Nippon WV 125 ShaftPutter: Edel Golf Columbia Custom Made, 35" long, 72° lie angle, 3° loft. Ball: Titleist Pro V1xGrips: PURE Grips P2 Wrap (red)Shoes: FootJoy Dry-Joy (black, size 14)3Jack's Golf Blog - http://3jack.blogspot.com

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  • 2 months later...

Well, I love my Wishon 555's, both blade and cavity (have two sets). Our course can get really wet so I use the cavities for the slightly wider sole otherwise back to the muscleback.  I have at least a dozen sets of irons that I can play but always come back to the 555's. Haven't found anything that feels better. The lofts are not jacked up which I prefer. I want my PW to be 48 (spec was 47 so bent it to 48). My wife up until this year used the 550C irons. Hers are pretty beat up looking now, and she just got the Srixon Z785 and they are a nice combo with the modus 3 120S shaft. I made a 4 and 7 wood for myself that were low profile and hi cor but my wife tried them and i didn't get them back.

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Driver Titleist 910 with KuroKage R or Cleveland Classic

3 wd Titleist 910 with Diamana

7 wd Snake eyes with Irod

23 and 28 Adams Idea Pro Gold Hybrids with nv protos

Irons either Adams Idea Pro Gold chrome or smoke, or wishon 555 with KK 70

TM wedges

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  • 4 weeks later...

I Played the 550M/C combo set split at the 6/7 for a long time.  Loved those clubs.  Sold them because I didn't think I'd ever want a blade again and regret it.

:taylormade-small:M5 9° w/ UST Mamiya PFv2 6F4 @ 45"

:callaway-small:Epic Flash SZ 3wd w/ HZRDUS Green 70g, 6.5 @ 42.75"

:callaway-small:Epic Flash SZ 5wd w/ PX HZRDUS Black 85g, 6.5 @ 42.25"

:callaway-small:Epic Flash 7wd & 9wd w/ PX HZRDUS Black 85g, 6.5 @ 41.75" & 41"

:srixon-small:Z585 6-7, Z785 8-GW w/ TT AMT White S300@ 37.75" (6i)

:cleveland-small:RTX4 54/10 & 58/3 w/ DGold S400 @ 36"

:odyssey-small:SL EXO Marxman w/ Superstroke Flatso 3.0 @ 33"

On Deck:

:cleveland-small:RTX4 58/9 w/ Nippon Tour 125 Stiff @ 35.75"

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  • 4 weeks later...

I love his 560mc irons, and I really appreciate Tom's knowledge, experience and perspective.

If you can, get a copy of Captain Clubmaker, which is essentially his memoir.

Awesome stories.

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