Electric Car Purchase

[funkyjudge]

I own a plug-in hybrid (Volvo XC60 T8 Recharge), and three of my friends have Teslas. In this semi-frigid winter weather, we are all seeing a 30% or greater reduction in EV battery range due to the cold temperatures. I have also had issues with my battery not charging fully, even when left on the charger overnight (as much as 10-12 hours). My one buddy who owns a Tesla says that his normal range on a fully-charged battery is about 275 miles, but it’s only about 225 to 230 miles in the winter, whenever temp’s get below 35* to 40* F.  When the overnight temperatures get below freezing, my hybrid’s battery never charges to more than 75-80% of capacity.

I take MANY trips of 240 to 700 Miles, and there is no way that I could justify a fully-electric vehicle, due to the questionable range and unreliable charging infrastructure that currently exists in the USA.

[Middler]

41 minutes ago, funkyjudge said:

I take MANY trips of 240 to 700 Miles, and there is no way that I could justify a fully-electric vehicle, due to the questionable range and unreliable charging infrastructure that currently exists in the USA.

Thats simply not true for Tesla, though it may be for some other EV makes/charging networks. There are plenty of Tesla super chargers spaced close enough to easily accommodate even the reduced range winter weather brings for at least 90% of the USA. There are over 22,000 Tesla chargers in all 50 states, they are highly reliable. In a pinch there are tens of thousands of destination chargers all over plus the albeit less reliable Electrify America, EVGo, ChargePoint and other chargers - but you wouldn’t need them. 

And if you go someplace extremely remote, you’d know if charging would be a challenge before you ever left…

There are many examples of people driving Teslas thousands of miles without any issues, just a little added time to charge, around 10% of travel time vs a gas car. My 750 mile trip home takes 12 hours with stops in a gas car, 13 in an EV with stops.

Edited January 14 by Middler

[Middler]

2 hours ago, bens197 said:

I would love an EV but I'm just not ready quite yet.  My brother and his wife own a Tesla and a Rivian.  After driving the Rivian I wanted to buy one that day...then I saw the price.

Car prices are just too expensive to justify the total cost.  I hope that changes.

The Tesla Model 3 starts at $39K. The Model Y SUV ranges from $44K to $52.5K and qualifies for a $7500 point of sale Federal credit, so that’s $36.5K to $45K at time of purchase. There are many EVs cheaper than a Rivian…

 

 

 

Edited January 14 by Middler

[Josh Parker]

2 hours ago, funkyjudge said:

I own a plug-in hybrid (Volvo XC60 T8 Recharge), and three of my friends have Teslas. In this semi-frigid winter weather, we are all seeing a 30% or greater reduction in EV battery range due to the cold temperatures. I have also had issues with my battery not charging fully, even when left on the charger overnight (as much as 10-12 hours). My one buddy who owns a Tesla says that his normal range on a fully-charged battery is about 275 miles, but it’s only about 225 to 230 miles in the winter, whenever temp’s get below 35* to 40* F.  When the overnight temperatures get below freezing, my hybrid’s battery never charges to more than 75-80% of capacity.

I take MANY trips of 240 to 700 Miles, and there is no way that I could justify a fully-electric vehicle, due to the questionable range and unreliable charging infrastructure that currently exists in the USA.

Surprisingly Tesla has charging stations everywhere.  I have a friend that installs stations all over the country and we have looked in to it several times. The inlaws live about 300 miles away and even in the small towns they seem to have a quick charging station along the  several routes we normally take. 

I haven't seen the new cyber truck yet but the wife has seen a couple.  They are made not far from me and my cousin works up there. 

 

[Preeway]

How far can you get on a single charge and how long does it take to recharge?

[Josh Parker]

3 minutes ago, Preeway said:

How far can you get on a single charge and how long does it take to recharge?

Depends on the vehicle really. Some 200 miles some a little over 300.  The tesla supercharger is 200 miles in 15 min I believe. 

I really like the idea of the whole thing but haven't bought in fully. They still mine everything with diesel equipment for a reason. Plus salt water wouldn't be good for it and as much as I am at the coast and pulling a boat....  but for the real estate business it has been a heavy topic in my household with the amount of driving we do. 

[bens197]

1 hour ago, Middler said:

The Tesla Model 3 starts at $39K. The Model Y SUV ranges from $44K to $52.5K and qualifies for a $7500 point of sale Federal credit, so that’s $36.5K to $45K at time of purchase. There are many EVs cheaper than a Rivian…

 

 

 

No lies told.

With the size of my family we are better off with something larger then a sedan.  That's the price issue for us.

[Preeway]

17 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

Depends on the vehicle really. Some 200 miles some a little over 300.  The tesla supercharger is 200 miles in 15 min I believe. 

I really like the idea of the whole thing but haven't bought in fully. They still mine everything with diesel equipment for a reason. Plus salt water wouldn't be good for it and as much as I am at the coast and pulling a boat....  but for the real estate business it has been a heavy topic in my household with the amount of driving we do. 

Yeah, having to stop every three hours to charge would be super annoying. But for just everyday use around town I guess that can’t be beat. Once I have the ability to get at least 400 miles it will be a real decision worth considering. 

[Josh Parker]

3 minutes ago, Preeway said:

Yeah, having to stop every three hours to charge would be super annoying. But for just everyday use around town I guess that can’t be beat. Once I have the ability to get at least 400 miles it will be a real decision worth considering. 

I don't mind the 15 min charge if that's truly what it is.  Kids run in and potty and stretch the legs, 15 min goes pretty quick.  Toyota is supposed to be coming out with a hydrogen vehicle and I think it will be a game changer. 

I own a diesel truck and it would take alot for me to get away from it. Ha. 

[Preeway]

10 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

I don't mind the 15 min charge if that's truly what it is.  Kids run in and potty and stretch the legs, 15 min goes pretty quick.  Toyota is supposed to be coming out with a hydrogen vehicle and I think it will be a game changer. 

I own a diesel truck and it would take alot for me to get away from it. Ha. 

Yeah, 15 minute charge time is nothing, and probably the perfect amount of time to stretch legs. Most gas station pit stops are around 10 min so not much different. I just want to get further before I have to stop. 

[chisag]

1 minute ago, Preeway said:

Yeah, 15 minute charge time is nothing, and probably the perfect amount of time to stretch legs. Most gas station pit stops are around 10 min so not much different. I just want to get further before I have to stop. 

 

... Genesis battery architecture is as good as it gets currently. 10% to 80% in 20 minutes on a DC fast charger. After 2 back surgeries I can only drive for 2 hours max before getting out and walking around for 10 minutes and stretching with an ICE car. 

[Preeway]

I know it’s been stated before but the only thing slowing down the growth of the EV market is the addition of more charging stations. I’m surprised we don’t see more gas stations with more charging stations these days. Maybe it’s more widespread on the east and west coast but in these parts, it’s few and far between. 

[Middler]

8 minutes ago, Preeway said:

I know it’s been stated before but the only thing slowing down the growth of the EV market is the addition of more charging stations. I’m surprised we don’t see more gas stations with more charging stations these days. Maybe it’s more widespread on the east and west coast but in these parts, it’s few and far between. 

There’s some truth to that, but not entirely true. Most EV owners charge at home unless they’re going on a long trip, more than 200-300 miles. Charging at home is FAR cheaper and more convenient, like an iPhone. If you’re not a homeowner it is more challenging unless you’re lucky enough to have a charger at your condo/apartment and/or work. I’ll never charge anywhere but home unless I’m on a long trip, about a dozen times a year. My “fuel” costs are down 75%, home charging vs buying gas…

I know it’s not intentional, but there’s a lot of misinformation around.

Edited January 14 by Middler

[Josh Parker]

1 minute ago, Middler said:

There’s some truth to that, but the fact is most EV owners charge at home unless they’re going on a long trip. Charging at home is FAR cheaper and more convenient, like an iPhone. If you’re not a homeowner it is more challenging unless you’re lucky enough to have a charger at your condo/apartment and/or work. I’ll never charge anywhere but home unless I’m on a long trip, about a dozen times a year. My “fuel” costs are down 75%, home charging vs buying gas…

Yeah we priced chargers for home and I think we figured out it would take less than 1 year to pay for itself. 

[Preeway]

What’s the cost to full charge in the wild?

[chisag]

1 minute ago, Middler said:

There’s some truth to that, but not entirely true. Most EV owners charge at home unless they’re going on a long trip, more than 200-300 miles. Charging at home is FAR cheaper and more convenient, like an iPhone. If you’re not a homeowner it is more challenging unless you’re lucky enough to have a charger at your condo/apartment and/or work. I’ll never charge anywhere but home unless I’m on a long trip, about a dozen times a year. My “fuel” costs are down 75%, home charging vs buying gas…

 

... I got free 30 minute Electrify America DC charging for 3 years with my GV60 so I occasionally top mine off if I am in the area and running under 30%. My normal EA charger is at a Premium Outlet Mall so I just hook up and take a stroll then come back when it's 90% full. By like you the vast majority of time I just plug in overnight at home where I have an overnight discount EV program with my electric company. It is just silly inexpensive and convenient to charge over night in my garage. 

[CFreddie]

4 minutes ago, Middler said:

There’s some truth to that, but not entirely true. Most EV owners charge at home unless they’re going on a long trip, more than 200-300 miles. Charging at home is FAR cheaper and more convenient, like an iPhone. If you’re not a homeowner it is more challenging unless you’re lucky enough to have a charger at your condo/apartment and/or work. I’ll never charge anywhere but home unless I’m on a long trip, about a dozen times a year. My “fuel” costs are down 75%, home charging vs buying gas…

I know it’s not intentional, but there’s a lot of misinformation around.

Bingo - we bought our EV purely as a “commuter” car, along with a home charger (actual charger came with car, just needed an outlet).  I wouldn’t take it on a road trip (yet), but we have my wife’s car for that (larger SUV to fit the kiddos more comfortably).  
 

As far as electric costs, I only charge at home during the middle of the night, where the rate is super low, and I haven’t seen any increase in monthly costs (although we’ve seen a drastic decrease in gas costs). 

[Middler]

49 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

 Toyota is supposed to be coming out with a hydrogen vehicle and I think it will be a game changer. 

Toyota has been trying to convince people hydrogen is the way to go for about 10 years, going nowhere. If you think EV charging stations are an obstacle, do you think hydrogen refilling stations will be easier? And you’ll never have hydrogen charging at home like an EV.

Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles came out about the same time as the Tesla Model S. 

To date, about 2.5 million EVs have been sold in the U.S. By contrast, as of mid-2022, 15,000 or fewer hydrogen-powered vehicles can be found on U.S. roads. All of them will be in California, the sole state with a network of retail hydrogen fueling stations to make the cars usable.

Edited January 14 by Middler

[chisag]

4 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

Yeah we priced chargers for home and I think we figured out it would take less than 1 year to pay for itself. 

 

... My utility provider had chargers for sale at half price if you signed up for the overnight program. I also got a little lucky because my junction box is on the outside of my garage so it only cost me $425 to install it since he didn't have to route anything. I recouped my costs in less than 9 months compared to filling up with gas. 

[funkyjudge]

1 minute ago, chisag said:

 

... I got free 30 minute Electrify America DC charging for 3 years with my GV60 so I occasionally top mine off if I am in the area and running under 30%. My normal EA charger is at a Premium Outlet Mall so I just hook up and take a stroll then come back when it's 90% full. By like you the vast majority of time I just plug in overnight at home where I have an overnight discount EV program with my electric company. It is just silly inexpensive and convenient to charge over night in my garage. 

Our homeowners association does not allow charging of EVs or plug-in hybrid vehicles in the garage. You can have certain types of “approved” chargers installed in the garage, but the vehicle must be parked in the driveway away from the house and garage while it is being charged. I charge my plug-in hybrid at home overnight, running the charging cable under the garage door.

[Josh Parker]

2 minutes ago, Middler said:

Toyota has been trying to convince people hydrogen is the way to go for about 10 years, going nowhere. If you think EV charging stations are an obstacle, do you think hydrogen refilling stations will be easier? Nope.

Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles came out about the same time as the Tesla Model S. 

To date, about 2.5 million EVs have been sold in the U.S. By contrast, as of mid-2022, 15,000 or fewer hydrogen-powered vehicles can be found on U.S. roads. All of them will be in California, the sole state with a network of retail hydrogen fueling stations to make the cars usable.

Oh I'm not saying it will be easier or better. Again, I'm not a super fan of any.  They all have negatives when it comes to the earth just like gasoline vehicles. 

Advancement isn't a bad thing and I like seeing something else being worked on. 

[CFreddie]

1 minute ago, funkyjudge said:

Our homeowners association does not allow charging of EVs or plug-in hybrid vehicles in the garage. You can have certain types of “approved” chargers installed in the garage, but the vehicle must be parked in the driveway away from the house and garage while it is being charged. I charge my plug-in hybrid at home overnight, running the charging cable under the garage door.

I must ask…why??? 

[funkyjudge]

1 hour ago, Josh Parker said:

Surprisingly Tesla has charging stations everywhere.  I have a friend that installs stations all over the country and we have looked in to it several times. The inlaws live about 300 miles away and even in the small towns they seem to have a quick charging station along the  several routes we normally take. 

I haven't seen the new cyber truck yet but the wife has seen a couple.  They are made not far from me and my cousin works up there. 

 

I have stated this before: I love the looks of the Tesla Cybertruck, and someday hope to own one of them.

[Josh Parker]

4 minutes ago, funkyjudge said:

Our homeowners association does not allow charging of EVs or plug-in hybrid vehicles in the garage. You can have certain types of “approved” chargers installed in the garage, but the vehicle must be parked in the driveway away from the house and garage while it is being charged. I charge my plug-in hybrid at home overnight, running the charging cable under the garage door.

This is a new one to me... 

 

[funkyjudge]

2 minutes ago, CFreddie said:

I must ask…why??? 

Allegedly "fire risk".

[CFreddie]

That was my guess…but wow

[Josh Parker]

2 minutes ago, funkyjudge said:

I have stated this before: I love the looks of the Tesla Cybertruck, and someday hope to own one of them.

I don't know what I think about them yet. I haven't seen one in the wild yet but know it's just a matter of time. I need to drive by the factory and see what they have out.  

[Middler]

9 minutes ago, Josh Parker said:

Oh I'm not saying it will be easier or better. Again, I'm not a super fan of any.  They all have negatives when it comes to the earth just like gasoline vehicles. 

Advancement isn't a bad thing and I like seeing something else being worked on. 

You said “I think it will be a game changer.” After 10 years trying seems unlikely.

If you don’t want an EV that’s fine.

Edited January 14 by Middler

[Josh Parker]

11 minutes ago, chisag said:

 

... My utility provider had chargers for sale at half price if you signed up for the overnight program. I also got a little lucky because my junction box is on the outside of my garage so it only cost me $425 to install it since he didn't have to route anything. I recouped my costs in less than 9 months compared to filling up with gas. 

Yeah it pays for itself pretty quick. 

[chisag]

Just now, funkyjudge said:

Allegedly "fire risk".

 

...  I would install my charger and say "Sue me". 

“All the data shows that EVs are just much, much less likely to set on fire than their petrol equivalent,” Energy and Climate Intelligence Unit Head of Transport Colin Walker claimed in a prepared statement. “The many, many fires that you have for petrol or diesel cars just aren’t reported.”

When looking at vehicle fires in Norway – which boasts the largest percentage of EVs – it was found that there were four to five times more fires in ICE-powered vehicles as compared to their EV counterparts. More specifically, there were 3.8 fires per 100,000 electric or hybrid cars in 2022, with 68 fires per 100,000 cars of all fuel types.

One of the more notable instances of electric vehicle fires in the United States came in the form of the Chevy Bolt EV. Back in April 2021, General Motors recalled 69,000 examples of the 2017-2019 Bolt EV over concerns of the battery pack overheating and suddenly bursting into flames. GM even went as far as to advise owners to park their vehicle outside and away from covered structures."