Liv Golf Central Thread: Events and News

[GolfSpy_APH]

30 minutes ago, Owengeorge13 said:

You need to watch out though.  When people think you like LIV they think you drink until you pass out, drive over tee boxes, wear tank tops all the time, and kick puppies.  I’ll make another thread soon.

Any new threads that are created will just be merged with this one. So just comment here please. 

There are many that like LIV and many that don't. To make the forum more tolerable for all any LIV centered discussion will remain here.

[OdinSnipes414]

2 minutes ago, Owengeorge13 said:

I may throw a joke out every once and awhile about it, but I enjoy watching LiV.  I would genuinely like to have a place to just talk about it.  I started doing a premiere league football (soccer) fantasy league this year and I have enjoyed every aspect of it.  If we could get something like that going here.  I think it would be great.

I’ve never seen a LIV event but wouldn’t mind! I hate the fact that there was so much arguing and bs and LIV gets its tv spot yet the Kornferry tour get no love or air play! That’s what I want to watch people fighting to get a card to play in the PGA or LIV or where they want to go! But to give no love to Kornferry is still the number one gripe I have with the whole golf world

[GolfSpy_APH]

4 minutes ago, Owengeorge13 said:

I may throw a joke out every once and awhile about it, but I enjoy watching LiV.  I would genuinely like to have a place to just talk about it.  I started doing a premiere league football (soccer) fantasy league this year and I have enjoyed every aspect of it.  If we could get something like that going here.  I think it would be great.

Feel free to post all the LIV content here. It's what this thread is for. 

As the topic is still very polarizing we have no need to inject the controversy into other areas of the forum.

[cnosil]

18 minutes ago, OdinSnipes414 said:

I’ve never seen a LIV event but wouldn’t mind! I hate the fact that there was so much arguing and bs and LIV gets its tv spot yet the Kornferry tour get no love or air play! That’s what I want to watch people fighting to get a card to play in the PGA or LIV or where they want to go! But to give no love to Kornferry is still the number one gripe I have with the whole golf world

As I recall, LIV paid to be on the CW.  Essentially anything that is broadcast on TV needs to generate revenue and generate an audience or the stations won’t broadcast.  how much viewership do you think the Korn Ferry Tour would generate on network television.  I have seen events on the Golf Channel schedule and have never watched one.   You can also watch the PGA tour events that don’t draw the big names since they include the lower tier and Korn Ferry players that as you said are fighting for their cards.   
 

when taking about TV golf people often comment that the majors are must watch events for them and they adjust schedules to watch.   If Korn Ferry is must watch for you, why haven’t you made time to see it?  

[Preeway]

34 minutes ago, aburtonky said:

Thanks for having a reasonable conversation. That does make sense. But the practice team players still get paid. I agree it’s better to compare them to tennis. I just think to my professional life and know that when I was in the Army, I was paid to exercise, to go to the range, to go to school…all to make me a better soldier when it came time to fight. I wouldn’t be surprised to see this model come to an end. 

I agree with your assertion about the politics. Am I ecstatic this league is financed by people connected to 9/11, no. But there is a lot of dark money already floating around the PGAT and it would be hypocritical to make that the sole reason for hate. 

TBH I think it’s just because they’re being disruptive to the industry and people hate change. I think we know by now that LIV never had real aspirations for taking over the tour, regardless of what Norman’s big mouth may have said. I guess for my standpoint, I’ve never woken up and thought, “Man, I wish there was less golf on TV.”
 

I get what you mean by practice team. I thought you mean the regular team getting paid to practice. The practice team is a small group of guys that got cut and get paid like 25k-30k a year. As for golf, I know the guys that get their card do get a base "salary" but I don't recall the amount and if it's the same from top to bottom. I want to say it's like 100k but don't quote me on that. I can say if LIV had all their events in the US, or would at least broadcast them at a more "normal time", I would likely try to watch. But their international approach makes it hard to gain viewership and by nature makes it hard to sell to sponsors in the US.

[OdinSnipes414]

5 minutes ago, cnosil said:

As I recall, LIV paid to be on the CW.  Essentially anything that is broadcast on TV needs to generate revenue and generate an audience or the stations won’t broadcast.  how much viewership do you think the Korn Ferry Tour would generate on network television.  I have seen events on the Golf Channel schedule and have never watched one.   You can also watch the PGA tour events that don’t draw the big names since they include the lower tier and Korn Ferry players that as you said are fighting for their cards.   
 

when taking about TV golf people often comment that the majors are must watch events for them and they adjust schedules to watch.   If Korn Ferry is must watch for you, why haven’t you made time to see it?  

I have gone to some events when they get to the Midwest! I think they would generate just as much watch time as the Asian tour and the lpga nothing against Thor talent but I think it would! And I follow the tour when I’m able! But with no coverage on tv it’s hard! 

[Owengeorge13]

https://www.golfdigest.com/story/jon-rahm-liv-golf-rumors-2023?utm_medium=email&utm_source=120523&utm_campaign=hitlist&utm_content=DM46867&uuid=a8de057b92d24be5a140cbb2757e6d9d
 

interesting read…

[Preeway]

It’s interesting how this has been a rumor for weeks. Seems like it should be a done deal by now. Figure they won’t make it official until he has a full team?

[fixyurdivot]

43 minutes ago, Preeway said:

It’s interesting how this has been a rumor for weeks. Seems like it should be a done deal by now. Figure they won’t make it official until he has a full team?

There is another popular rumor that he just punked the PGA for this years top PIP award .  Further scuttlebutt is that Tiger only chose to show up/play this past week because Rahm snubbed he and Rory's business venture... thus assuring Jon won't get that check.

[Preeway]

18 minutes ago, fixyurdivot said:

There is another popular rumor that he just punked the PGA for this years top PIP award .  Further scuttlebutt is that Tiger only chose to show up/play this past week because Rahm snubbed he and Rory's business venture... thus assuring Jon won't get that check.

Reading all the rumor mill reports is like reading a high school drama novel. 

[jolter1]

Whether it happens or not, any loss of a big name player by the PGATour is going to hurt. If the PGA and DP Tours were smart, they would come to some sort of agreement with PIF as it would most likely stop the bleeding of players to LIV (which may result in its ultmate demise) and have some kind of combined tournaments ( er-go, get rid of the signature events  and PIP) so the elite players of the world canbe highlighted.

[GolfSpy_APH]

1 minute ago, jolter1 said:

Whether it happens or not, any loss of a big name player by the PGATour is going to hurt. If the PGA and DP Tours were smart, they would come to some sort of agreement with PIF as it would most likely stop the bleeding of players to LIV (which may result in its ultmate demise) and have some kind of combined tournaments ( er-go, get rid of the signature events  and PIP) so the elite players of the world canbe highlighted.

I have no side proof or anything, but I can't help but think the whole pro tour is going to change and we will see mass difference in all but the majors.

[Preeway]

15 minutes ago, GolfSpy_APH said:

I have no side proof or anything, but I can't help but think the whole pro tour is going to change and we will see mass difference in all but the majors.

I too believe that is the direction this is all headed. There can only be some much fractioning of the current tours, and creation of new, before everything becomes too diluted. Also, there is only so much sponsorship money to go around before they eventually say enough is enough. It also sounds like the Saudi funds have a limit to just how much money they are willing to lose before they’ve had enough fun with their experiment. 

[RickyBobby_PR]

33 minutes ago, jolter1 said:

Whether it happens or not, any loss of a big name player by the PGATour is going to hurt. If the PGA and DP Tours were smart, they would come to some sort of agreement with PIF as it would most likely stop the bleeding of players to LIV (which may result in its ultmate demise) and have some kind of combined tournaments ( er-go, get rid of the signature events  and PIP) so the elite players of the world canbe highlighted.

Isn’t that what the proposed merger is for and monahan set a deadline for i believe the end of the year to have a framework in place

[Rob Person]

10 minutes ago, Preeway said:

I too believe that is the direction this is all headed. There can only be some much fractioning of the current tours, and creation of new, before everything becomes too diluted. Also, there is only so much sponsorship money to go around before they eventually say enough is enough. It also sounds like the Saudi funds have a limit to just how much money they are willing to lose before they’ve had enough fun with their experiment. 

They have already tried the who can or can't play in xyz events.  There was serious community backlash, sponsors were confused,  players rattled,  etc

Then there were the backroom secret meetings, leaked letters, inclined towards a mutual arrangement, and lastly the actual sit down agreement as to merging/managing bodies.

I foresee a series of future events where they are a mutual collaboration. Wonder if they could pull off and compete head to head (think top 10 v top 10 from each side) and maybe more mini events too!

Will LIV have to follow rollback guidelines too, since they are technically independent?

[jolter1]

8 minutes ago, RickyBobby_PR said:

Isn’t that what the proposed merger is for and monahan set a deadline for i believe the end of the year to have a framework in place

You are absolutely correct. The only caveat I can think of is what way will the rank and file of players on both tours react to any agreement. Faith in Monahan is at an all time low among the players and really there has been no indication how the DP World players are going to react. I really don't see Monahan and Keith Pelley brow beating their players into signing off any agreement.

[Preeway]

3 minutes ago, Rob Person said:

I foresee a series of future events where they are a mutual collaboration. Wonder if they could pull off and compete head to head (think top 10 v top 10 from each side) and maybe more mini events too!

Will LIV have to follow rollback guidelines too, since they are technically independent?

I don't think the tours want, or could survive, a true open concept as their ability to get sponsor money is dependent on the tour's ability to guarantee who will be in the field. If every week, except the four majors, were going to be unknown until a few weeks out then I don't think the prize money will be able to be near as rich as it currently is. Just a hunch but I think what you describe would have to be scheduled and committed to at least a year ahead in order to get the purse established and TV deals in place. The big sports (NFL, NBA, MLB, etc.) all benefit from having players under contract so they have the ability to guarantee, minus injuries (or LeBron wanting a day off), who will be playing on any given day. Golf and tennis can't do that the same way.

[Rob Person]

9 minutes ago, Preeway said:

I don't think the tours want, or could survive, a true open concept as their ability to get sponsor money is dependent on the tour's ability to guarantee who will be in the field. If every week, except the four majors, were going to be unknown until a few weeks out then I don't think the prize money will be able to be near as rich as it currently is. Just a hunch but I think what you describe would have to be scheduled and committed to at least a year ahead in order to get the purse established and TV deals in place. The big sports (NFL, NBA, MLB, etc.) all benefit from having players under contract so they have the ability to guarantee, minus injuries (or LeBron wanting a day off), who will be playing on any given day. Golf and tennis can't do that the same way.

What about a good old fashioned grudge match? 1 round, 18 holes, pairs from opposing leagues, and winning team score takes all, but make it for CHARITY!?

I know,  super pipe dreams, too many factors, but it would bring some unity I think. 

[FrogginBullfish]

WSJ reporting Jon Rahm set to join LIV on a $450M-$600M deal as early as next week.

If this is true, yikes. And people thought Brooks was hypocritical...

[Preeway]

1 hour ago, FrogginBullfish said:

WSJ reporting Jon Rahm set to join LIV on a $450M-$600M deal as early as next week.

If this is true, yikes. And people thought Brooks was hypocritical...

Considering how long these rumors have been floating around, there must be some serious snags with eaither getting his team put together or some other aspect of the LIV structure because the money can't be the hold up. Not at the amounts that keep getting tossed around.

[MattWillGolf]

Disappointed to see Jon Rahm going to LIV, if the the WSJ report is to be believed. Jon has vehemently denied this previously but his silence now seems to speak. I’m now less inclined to watch the professional game these days. I’ll stick to my game and golf chat on this fine forum. Oh and lusting at equipment of course.

[RickyBobby_PR]

Eventually money speaks for most people 

[ClarkWGriswoldIII]

Rahm was completely in the PGA camp and publicly said so last year.

“This is my official, my one and only time I’ll talk about this, where I am officially declaring my fealty to the PGA Tour,” Rahm said in early 2022. “I have a lot of belief in [PGA Tour commissioner] Jay Monahan and the product that they’re going to give us in the future. There has been a lot of talk and speculation about the Saudi league. It’s just not something I believe is the best for me and my future in golf, and I think the best legacy I can accomplish will be with the PGA Tour.”

I suspect that when Monahan went behind all of the loyal players' backs and worked the details of the deal with LIV earlier this year that Rahm's allegiance waned.  I think a lot of the players felt betrayed and backdoored.  It certainly represents a kick in the **** to the tour as the deadline to work out a deal quickly approaches.

 

[Josh Parker]

25 minutes ago, ClarkWGriswoldIII said:

Rahm was completely in the PGA camp and publicly said so last year.

“This is my official, my one and only time I’ll talk about this, where I am officially declaring my fealty to the PGA Tour,” Rahm said in early 2022. “I have a lot of belief in [PGA Tour commissioner] Jay Monahan and the product that they’re going to give us in the future. There has been a lot of talk and speculation about the Saudi league. It’s just not something I believe is the best for me and my future in golf, and I think the best legacy I can accomplish will be with the PGA Tour.”

I suspect that when Monahan went behind all of the loyal players' backs and worked the details of the deal with LIV earlier this year that Rahm's allegiance waned.  I think a lot of the players felt betrayed and backdoored.  It certainly represents a kick in the **** to the tour as the deadline to work out a deal quickly approaches.

 

I said this not long ago.  Honestly Jay needs to go. 

[ClarkWGriswoldIII]

1 hour ago, Josh Parker said:

I said this not long ago.  Honestly Jay needs to go. 

Rory bails on the players committee, Rahm heads to LIV.....  The tide is turning on old Jay. 

[PeterHenric]

As a fan of golf in general, it will be cool to see Rahm on LIV. @ClarkWGriswoldIII said it best. When you give your allegiance to someone and then that person turns around and double crosses you, there is no more allegiance. Rahm has never been judgemental to the players who left, not it seems as though he is one of them.

[Josh Parker]

28 minutes ago, ClarkWGriswoldIII said:

Rory bails on the players committee, Rahm heads to LIV.....  The tide is turning on old Jay. 

Those are just 2 of the many.  There are quite a few that have said he needs to go. 

[Middler]

7 hours ago, FrogginBullfish said:

WSJ reporting Jon Rahm set to join LIV on a $450M-$600M deal as early as next week.

If this is true, yikes. And people thought Brooks was hypocritical...

 

6 hours ago, Preeway said:

Considering how long these rumors have been floating around, there must be some serious snags with eaither getting his team put together or some other aspect of the LIV structure because the money can't be the hold up. Not at the amounts that keep getting tossed around.

I'm disappointed to see Rahm go, but I can't blame him after the PGA surprised the players with the PIF framework agreement out of nowhere, and then failed to produce anything concrete for 6 months! Rahm is in all the majors for at least 5 years, Masters for life, so what does he really have to lose? Grinding on the PGA tour, after they've left their players in the lurch for 2 years?

If the PGA ever does come to some agreement with PIF/LIV, Rahm is back in the unified mix along with everyone else - several hundreds of millions richer than he would have been otherwise. Rory should cash in too IMO and really force the issue once and for all.

It's disappointing this has lingered this long. I still don't have any interest in the LIV product/format and I was on the PGA bandwagon from the start, but it's starting to wear very thin. Maybe many other remaining PGA stars will cash in on LIV, which would force the PGA to actually do something? Has the PGA rewarded the loyalty of Rory and all the others who defended them?

 

Edited December 7, 2023 by Middler

[Owengeorge13]

This is great news.  When it gets closer to tournament time for LIV I’ll try and put together some sort of fantasy league for it.  Looking for suggestions.  We could either do teams draft, or players draft.

[Shapotomous]

7 hours ago, FrogginBullfish said:

.If this is true, yikes. And people thought Brooks was hypocritical...

The biggest hypocrite of all is Jay who set himself up as the ceo of whatever new entity there is.  And i bet he gets paid extremely well too.